Willdabeastalt1

This would at least be something!

All things can be fun, cause it's an incredibly fun game! All builds are viable. No one is disputing that. The issue being addressed in this thread though is that it does not fall in line with other sets balance-wise due to several outdated "features" being either irrelevant or actually now a detriment, and it has NO special features to compensate for that. We're just asking for a review of it, specifically the fact that a fairly typical repeatable attack chain will do less damage (in some cases MUCH less damage) than most other comparable power sets, and there are NO special effects to account for the difference since it is a 100% straight damage set.

That's good to know! I was under the impression from back in the OLD live days that anything that involved changin an animation was incredibly slow and tedious. If the paid developers couldn't afford to put in the time on animations, I certainly didn't want to ask it of unpaid volunteers.

Are they able to reduce the wind up without redoing the animation? I was hoping to keep any changes very simple and my limited understanding was that anything involving changing animations is a whole lot more complex.

Great ideas! I particularly like the -MaxHP because, as you said, apart from the Incarnates it's a completely unique effect, and also fits with the cumulative effect of having a bunch of arrows sticking out of you. I was thinking something along the lines of the Armor Piercing as well for exactly the reason you mentioned of arrows defeating many modern forms of armor. I'm not sure what that would look like unless there's an "ignore damage resistance" feature that can be built in. Another way to go would be a set of ammo swap toggles in place of the Aim ... it would honestly make more sense for arrows than Dual Pistols, especially for things like toxic since the hot explosive gases tend to sterilize bullets. Could get rid of blazing arrow and replace with a better attack, and then include fire arrows, poison arrows and maybe razor arrows or something (bleed damage). Poison arrows could add a general slow effect in addition to damage allowing all arrows to get some proc slotting like Dual Pistols has. As someone else mentioned, the cone attack could use some serious love ... it is a really limited range/area.

Great point! I'd forgotten that its T9 didn't crash like the rest. Which was great ... when it came out. As you so rightly pointed out, the standout features from back then in issue 2 or 3 or whatever aren't relevant in the current game environment.

For all those who love their Archers, I'm not trying to knock your character. I'm just asking for a little love for your character, a little extra something to give you more joy in your play! When my Ice Blaster shows up, he's tossing wicked fast attacks, they're holding, they're slowing, they're proccing right and left, things get debuffed, knocked down, stopped in their tracks and die FAST. When my Dark Blaster shows up, we got knock downs, to hit debuffs, holds, procs right and left, nukes, everything starts missing until it dies FAST. When my Energy Rifle shows up, bosses and AVs just melt from the debuffs, still some decent procs, chaining damage, dots right and left, and with a bit of set up whole groups of longer lasting enemies get melted. When my Archer shows up ... well, there are arrows. And more arrows. And oh wait now a slow flaming arrow. And things die eventually.

In short, yes, it has some bad damage per animation. Aimed Shot (Tier 2) is 49.45 DPA at 50. No secondaries. Blazing Arrow is 88.37 DPA, assuming all fire damage ticks. No secondaries aside from the damage ticks. Snipe is snipe, they're all decent DPA, but Archery has no secondaries and is pure lethal. Aside from Fast Shot (Tier 1), these are the only single target damage attacks aside from a piddling damage stun attack. For some comparison from the Ice set: Ice Blast (tier 2): 61.44 DPA. Slow secondaries. Freeze Ray: 137.64 (assuming all ticks). Hold secondaries which can take 3-4 extra procs. Bitter Ice Blast: 133.31 DPA. Slow and -to hit secondaries for many procs. For more of an apples-to-apples comparison from Fire Set which also has no secondaries: Fire Blast (tier 2): 50.73 DPA, assuming all ticks. Blaze: 170.49 DPA, assuming all ticks. Snipe has bonus damage as secondary.

I've played many, many sets. I've got a couple dozen 50s. As stated, I'm not referring to Trick Arrows or Tactical Arrow, those have unique and different effects. They're unique and have their own features. If the unique feature of Archery "is its simplicity," that it does nothing special and what it does it doesn't do particularly well, I guess that's a point you can make. I love that you all love your characters in your all archery SG! There may be the possibility of some confirmation bias if there are no major complaints. I do have one. Numbers wise, it's one of the worst damage sets, and it has nothing feature-wise to compensate for that.

For it to do something different. Poison tipped arrows (actually has a basis in history that can't be achieved with guns), some sort of debuff from having an arrow dangling out of you, heck, I don't know, I'm not a super creative guy, I just know that for all that archers are glorified in comics, super hero movies and other media, archery absolutely stinks as a playable set in this. Broadsword, Katana, Mace, Axe and Staff are also outdated weapon types, but each of them have effective niches. Archery ... not so much.

Fast recharge on primary attacks isn't a relevant feature like it was in the first few issues, because every set can attain a non-stop attack chain thanks to Global Recharge buffs. Edit: Also, the only knockdown power in Archery is Explosive Arrow. All fast recharge means is that the individual attacks do less base damage, meaning your overall attack chain is lower damage since, again, if you can achieve a non-stop attack chain with any set, the effectiveness comes down to either the damage or the secondaries. On top of that, several other sets have faster animations AND higher base damage in their primary attack chains, further contributing to the astronomical power gap. Plus the secondaries. All faster base recharge does is mean you have to do less damage and click more.

I'm referring specifically to the Archer offensive primary/secondary. Not Trick Arrow or Tactical Arrow. There is nothing it does that is unique. Everything it does, some if not most of the other blaster primaries do better. It has no secondary effects on most of its attacks. The attacks recharge SO fast that it can't even have decent proc rates on the few procs it can slot, and they pay a BIG price in being much lower base damage-per-attack due to the fast recharge rate. Yes, every build can contribute. Some just contribute less. At least some other sets can say they bring SOMETHING special and unique found nowhere else if they're otherwise "suboptimal." Archery cannot say that, except maybe that Rain of Arrows has a slightly shorter cooldown ... but that is mitigated by the fact that as a Pseudo-pet patch power it can't even have decent procs. I want to love Archery. I've tried over and over again. The struggle is real though, every time I run one I just feel like I'm playing with one hand tied behind my back, taking twice as many attacks to kill the same things, with nothing cool happening along the way.

They added significant mitigation in a couple places. From patch notes: Invincibility (Tanker/Brute/Scrapper) - This power now adds a 1.67% toxic and psionic defense for the first target, and 0.33% for additional targets (total 5% against 10 foes, Tanker values). Unyielding (all ATs) - This power now adds 5% psionic resistance (Tanker values) Resist Energies (Tanker/Brute/Scrapper) - This power now adds psionic resistance.

Electric Armor has NO power outside of its capstone that give any defense or resistance to Toxic damage. Was this left out intentionally? All Willpower has is the 7.5% resistance to all damage they get from their passive. Every other damage type is covered with toggles that give either defense or resistance to it. The end result is these are now the only two Tanker sets that have no significant mitigation for a specific damage type at ALL. Is this a design choice, or were they just overlooked?

Sorry if this has been answered already, my best googling has failed to find an answer that I'm satisfied is current, since a lot of proc posts are outdated following changes. So I know Whirlpool can be completely filled with Procs ... but do they actually proc? Each of them? How often? It's a patch pseudopet which I understand is an incredibly low rate, but some people were talking about a bonus proc on initial cast, is that based on the actual recharge time or the 10/10 patch proc rate? Short of actually building a Water Corruptor/defender/blaster it would be nice to know if it will actually work. Any true help would be appreciated!

Isn't Blizzard a Pseudopet? And all other patch powers that don't have an immediate attack like Burn does?

Irradiated Ground is a damage-dealing power located in a primary or secondary set. As such, it should accept Archetype enhancements as all other damage dealing powers located in primary or secondary sets do. It currently does not.

You beautiful, beautiful person, this was a perfect answer! Clear, concise, specific, not at all condescending and didn't refer me to read a link. Thank you so much! Edit: Would it be asking too much to get the same sort of numbers on how it would proc if I slotted it in an AoE toggle damage power like Death Shroud? Trying to plan out my Dark/Staff tank.

My best google-fu is failing to turn up CURRENT information on how well this proc works in an AoE attack. Most of the proc data I could find for AoEs was from circa 2019, and it sounds like they nerfed AoE procs big time since then. So this isn't a damage dealing proc, but it lasts 20 seconds and stacks up to 3 times, what I'd love to know is how reliable is it? If I'm using the power it's slotted in (such as Guarded Spin or Innocuous Strikes) as often as it's up, can I reliably count on at least 1 stack of it being up? 2? All 3? Do I *HAVE* to have it in a no-recharge enhanced power to have a prayer of keeping that resistance up, or am I good to 6 slot the set for all the sweet set bonuses from it? Specific answers would be appreciated, I've been through a half dozen guides, all sorts of forum posts, SO many of which it sounds like are woefully outdated, I just want to know before I invest like 90 million influence into a set if it will let me utilize that proc or not. Thanks so much!