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  1. Yep, my bad. It was an offhanded comment to try and limit the amount of folks that would (rightly or wrongly) then argue about ede-case loadouts, hyperspecific builds, and the like. I would like to think that there is some math out there describing basic expectations, but that doesn't seem to be the case, which is a shame. On the other hand, I was told that the scrapper pylon thread has folks posting non-scrapper AT times. I think that would be a relevant starting point to understand how to answer the question better.
  2. I understand where you're coming from, but i was not aware that the scrapper pylon thread had folks posting non-scrapper AT times. I think it stands to reason that the thread would probably give me the answers I need. It has a single target with limited death-dealing powers, doesn't move so folks can't argue ranges, can be solo'd, and so on. The next step would be asking folks if they'd want to repeat their times while on a non-involved team (to maximize the stalker crit chances) and see how different the times are.
  3. Okay... didn't realize that was for non-scrapper stuff. I'll probably get my answer there. Thanks so much. A pylon takedown would be just fine for most purposes. Again, i'm not looking for extremely specific loadouts or power picks. I'm just trying to find out 'which AT is supposed to be the ST king'. Gut instinct says that generally that would be Stalkers followed by scrappers. I'm just looking to 'prove' if that statement is true or false, again, speaking in generic terms.
  4. That's kind of what I'm trying to get information on to 'prove', because it's not exactly cut and dry after the crit changes/etc. Just running around with a much higher base crit chance, and the possibility of insta-recharging buildup? That doesn't sound like spike or burst, that sounds like sustain... unless we are saying 'well the stalker will die pretty quick so they will never get to do as much damage as a scrapper.
  5. What I'm pretty much looking for, realistically speaking, is exactly what you said in your first paragraph. So for example: "For general ST damage, Stalker > Scrapper > Brute > Tanker, for <reason>" The problem is that I don't know *why* that is, nor how to figure it out. I don't know what that 'reason' is other than some gut instinct, the feel of my different characters, and a bunch of numbers I can't quite figure out a formula for. Folks talk about burst damage, sustained damage, and so forth, but when I ask for the reasoning, there's a whole lot of confusion, wit
  6. Okay then what's the comparison between stalkers and scrappers?
  7. Again, how is it impossible? If I ask you which AT has the strongest buff/debuff values, which would that be? Would it suddenly be blaster just because they have a powerset that can slot a few extra procs? Or would it be defender, and you'd be able to back up your claim with "Here's the values for debuff scalars for these ATs, and you can see Defenders get the strongest magnitude/effect/bonus"? Or if you prefer... who does better single target ranged damage... Defenders, Corruptors, Sentinels, or Blasters? My gut instinct is Blasters because they have buildup and aim (o
  8. Please... either. Honest. I'm not picky at this point. My assumption from my playtime is "Scrappers are technically doing best sustained single target damage, especially with the combo of TW and Bio. Stalkers, however, are supposed to be doing the best sustained single target damage." From simple napkin math, it *looks* like this is the case, and is further exacerbated by larger teams. Stalkers get an increasing boost to crit chance the more folks that are on the team. Add in the ATOs, and it *looks* (again, i need to stress that it merely LOOKS) like Stalkers are supposed to
  9. That makes sense. I've got a TW/Bio that whoops serious booty. No bigs. But I also have a StJ/Bio that *feels* (and that's the operative word here) that it does comparable, or even *better* damage than my TW, at least with regards to single targets. It also feels like a moot point because we're trying to compare the whirlwind superpower of Titan AoE chains with 'lemme spam buildup during this sweet mostly singletarget chain'... but I never thought it would be this difficult to discuss. But is my math wrong, or my feelings wrong when comparing the two? Herostats seems to no longer w
  10. Considering how many wide ranging changes have been made since paragonwiki was 'active', that's not the case. Heck, even snipes have been changed more often in the last month than would ever reflect on paragonwiki, for example. And if you could explain to me the difference between the apples and oranges (in this context), I'd greatly appreciate it. all I mostly see is folks saying "Well they're just *different*" without any explanation or otherwise quantifying the difference. Again, I'm not trying to be an obtuse idiot here. Are they two sides of the same coin, or do th
  11. Okay, and that makes sense. No argument from me. Now lets say the boss stays the same, but the team disappears. Who has a better chance of taking it out faster? Your 'average' stalker, or your 'average' scrapper? What about an EB? AV? I mean, i realize there are a lot of variables here, from how things are slotted, to *what* exactly is being fought and with what kind of damage... I don't expect a cut and dry perfect answer, as this isn't that kind of game. But what I am trying to figure out is what, exactly, is supposed to be the difference between th
  12. While I honestly do not want to start any drama, i'm honestly feeling like what I was "told" on the old live forums was either made up, a lie, or worse. I figured I could get a quick explanation, but it definitely makes me feel like I pulled a major faux pas. Which, you know... fine. I get it. Nobody wants to step on toes. I just would like to chime in on how I feel the tanker buffs "should work" but then I realized that I have almost no frame of reference. I figured with all the various theorycrafters, minmaxers, pvp'ers, pve'ers, and such on this forum, folks would be able to sa
  13. Okay cool. thanks. Now how, and why? I mean, is there a 'timeframe' where they excel in, or is it a general average, or what? Again, i don't mean to come across as confrontational or a giant jerk. Honest. I'm just hoping someone can explain to me if they're supposed to be better (at ST damage) the same (again, in ST damage) or worse (again, just ST damage) than scrappers (for example). Looking at the powersets and the numbers, it *looks* like Stalkers excel at those single-target takedowns, and start to crumple a lot faster than scrappers in the same scenario once you s
  14. Okay, and that's fair. I expect certain powersets/combos to excel at in certain situations. But are stalkers supposed to be better, worse, or similar to scrappers? And if so, in which ways? I mean, it's easy to point and say "Hey, Scrappers get way better defenses/etc so they can survive some facetanking", but is that the scrapper's "role"? Or are they supposed to be deeps, or a mix, or whatever? Because in my head, my argument is that "If Stalkers are supposed to be kings of ST damage, with some of the lowest survival powers, then perhaps Tanks shoul
  15. Honestly? Yeah. because it seems like there's a lot of misinformation going around. I'm not trying to be a jerk, I'm just trying to figure out why it's so difficult to discuss this. I can look at a sheet/Pines/Paragonwiki and say "Oh hey, you know what, this Tanker has a huge HP cap. They also have some pretty solid resistances. Against stuff that doesn't pound away at my Psi-hole, I can definitely say that it will survive a lot more punishment than this Blaster I never picked any secondaries for, just because the Tanker straight has better HP and better resists/defenses."
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