Sentinel Suggestion/Update

[kiLLaBiyte]

I'm not sure how possible this is with the game in its current "private server" state...but if it is possible to update/tweak powersets, I have an amazing suggestion for the Sentinel.

 

My first suggestion is more of a quality of life suggestion, while the other suggestions would be for the performance of the AT as a whole but might not be as important.

 

Quality of Life Suggestion:

 

• Please, make the trigger for "Opportunity" be a clickable button that becomes active once your opportunity bar is built up high enough. Similar to "Domination" for Dominators, only we would have two separate Buttons: "Offensive" & "Defensive".

 

My issue with the way the current system works is several fold -

 

1.  Firstly, when you do have your opportunity bar built up, unless you are ready to use it, you are forced to forego your tier 1 and tier 2 attacks until you feel it's time to use your inherent power. This, quite frankly, sucks. It removes a lot of potential DPS from the Sentinel during those periods. Being that the Sentinel is already an AT that is trying to find its place on a team, this makes it even harder to (you're lacking even more damage now behind a Blaster/Scrapper/Stalker) simply because the inherent mechanic you have nearly forces you to stop using 2 powers in your attack chain.
2. Secondly, if you were to just "not care" that your Opportunity is up and keep blasting and you "use it" on, lets say, a minion mob or LT, you're NOT going to have it up and ready for the next boss that comes up. This effectively prevents you from carrying out one of your primary functions on a team - which is granting Offensive Opportunity on hard targets. Bad design. 
3. Thirdly, you are forced to take your Tier 1 attack if you want to carry out your primary function on a team. Literally, forced. This is kind of absurd for a primary powerset. While some primary powers are totally fine taking their first attack, others really shouldn't build around it. If you're a Sentinel, however, you are forced into it. The only other AT's that are forced into their Tier 1 attacks are Tankers, Dominators, and Defenders but that's because their tier 1 attacks are in their secondary powerset pools, so it makes sense. With a Sentinel, you are FORCED into both Tier 1 Powers from BOTH your primary and secondary powersets...and that just seems wrong.
4. Fourthly, with the way the current system works, you truly have "less" control over when you are able to utilize Opportunity, due to he reasons stated above. Having it trigger off of the Tier 1 and Tier 2 attacks limits this class in SO many ways.

 

By having Opportunity become a "clickable" power that worked more similarly to Domination, it would allow us to better utilize the strengths and power of this AT. We could find better "Opportunities" to utilize this power when it's needed, and not have to break our attack chains or alter our builds to do so. 

 

The suggestions below, are just overall suggestions, that I'm not sure could be or need to be implemented, but would help to give the Sentinel AT a little more ground in a team. Also, I'll list each suggestion as it's OWN separate suggestion, not combined. These would be "stand-alone changes."

 

First Idea:

1. Increase the -20% res from "Offensive Opportunity" to -25%. This is a small change, but would make a decent impact on a hard target, especially coupled with the AT's already inherent -5% res, for a total of -30% Res to a target. Not bad, and definitely noticeable by your teammates.

 

Another idea is:

1. Just combine both Offensive and Defensive Opportunity into ONE power. Besides the endurance return on Defensive Opportunity, it's really not all that much to write home about. Instead of the confusion, just go ahead an combine them into one singular power. Heck, even keep it tied to the Tier 1 Attack Power if you do this.

 

One other idea:

1. There is a glitch in the game, currently, that will sometimes allow you to keep chaining Opportunities. It's not common, and it's extremely hard to reproduce, but it DOES happen from time to time....where you can re-activate Opportunity just before it drops off....well, how about we allow this to happen ALL THE TIME?? As long as we are chaining attacks within the allotted time frame?? It's not guaranteed that you will keep your opportunity up since it requires you to continuously move and attack in order to do so, but the possibility is there. So, lets capitalize on this "glitch" as its already in the game and actually make it a more functioning mechanic. Whenever this glitch happens, I always feel soooooo much more useful to my team, and I feel like I waste a LOT less Opportunities when I accidentally use a Tier 1/2 attack on something I didn't intend to. The glitch, could become a feature. Let's just capitalize on it and make it happen more often.

 

 

Anyways...those are my suggestions. I absolutely LOVE this AT, one of my most fun toons so far. But, there are some QoL changes and adjustments that I would love to see in order to bring this AT into the fold more with groups/end-game content. Again, not sure if these kinds of AT/Powerset adjustments are possible on private servers, but if so, some of these options would definitely be helpful and warranted!!

 

 

Thanks!!!

 

 

[XaoGarrent]

There is already a Sentinel rework on the drawing board and part of it involves just scrapping opportunity altogether for something more thematically accurate to the idea of a 'sentinel.' It's still in the very, very early stages, so there's no telling how it could end up when it it actually happens, though.

[kiLLaBiyte]

9 hours ago, XaoGarrent said:

There is already a Sentinel rework on the drawing board and part of it involves just scrapping opportunity altogether for something more thematically accurate to the idea of a 'sentinel.' It's still in the very, very early stages, so there's no telling how it could end up when it it actually happens, though.

Yea, I saw that thread after I made this, however because it's still in the extremely early stages I think that adding my suggestions still applies.

 

For me, after reading that they were considering actually scrapping Opportunity altogether, I was worried. It's a power that definitely needs "refined" and "tuned" to be more effective and made better....but losing it altogether (even with the thought of being "buffed" in other areas) is alarming to me. That power is one of the key things that makes us stand out as Sentinels in groups and solo play. Right now, it's kind of clunky though, and I think it could be refined to be made much more effective and much more useful.

 

So, hopefully, as the Dev's gather to start coming up with solutions, they keep in mind some of my suggestions above.

[Ukase]

I've played a couple of Sentinels to 50 +3. 

There's just one thing that doesn't make sense to me about the AT. Scrappers have the same resist cap as a Sentinel, yet Scrappers get to dish out a LOT more damage. The damage output should be pretty much the same for both. One is primarily melee, the other ranged. Other than that, the damage output  should be the same. It really is that simple in my mind. 

May as well play a blaster. With IOs and the Epic pool, the two ATs are not that different, aside from mez protection, but with Clarion and Rune from sorcery pool, a blaster can work around that pretty simply. 

Something needs to change with this AT. 

[kiLLaBiyte]

16 minutes ago, Ukase said:

I've played a couple of Sentinels to 50 +3. 

There's just one thing that doesn't make sense to me about the AT. Scrappers have the same resist cap as a Sentinel, yet Scrappers get to dish out a LOT more damage. The damage output should be pretty much the same for both. One is primarily melee, the other ranged. Other than that, the damage output  should be the same. It really is that simple in my mind. 

May as well play a blaster. With IOs and the Epic pool, the two ATs are not that different, aside from mez protection, but with Clarion and Rune from sorcery pool, a blaster can work around that pretty simply. 

Something needs to change with this AT. 

I agree totally.

 

I'm hoping that the changes the devs are considering are helpful.

 

One definite change I'd like to see is the base damage modifier being brought up to at least 1.0 ....that would go a long way to help the AT's damage output.

 

I'm worried about what the dev's have in store for changes to this AT....as they said they want to focus on the name portion...."Sentinel"...I don't want this AT to become a Defender with an Armor Secondary....ugh....not at all.

[Coyotedancer]

27 minutes ago, kiLLaBiyte said:

I agree totally.

 

I'm hoping that the changes the devs are considering are helpful.

 

One definite change I'd like to see is the base damage modifier being brought up to at least 1.0 ....that would go a long way to help the AT's damage output.

 

I'm worried about what the dev's have in store for changes to this AT....as they said they want to focus on the name portion...."Sentinel"...I don't want this AT to become a Defender with an Armor Secondary....ugh....not at all.

Agreed.

 

I read that thread with pretty much equal parts dread and annoyance. My thoughts after those posts about the planned changes? "Damnit people. STOP trying to make Sentinels into something they aren't!" If you want an armored Defender pick up the 'Guardian' name and make a whole new AT. Stop trying so hard to 'fix' Sentinels that you end up ruining them. <_<

 

But I'm saying that as someone who plays them and likes them pretty much as they are. Yes, they need some tweaks. Yes, the damages sets are really uneven. 

But for the love of pete, cut it out with the "Let's make these guys .~*team players*~. who are only going to be useful in the context of 'guarding squishies' or something like that!"  To me, the real appeal of Sents is HOW WELL THEY SOLO as blasty types. The new powers guy seems determined to scrap that completely.

Edited October 15, 2019 by Coyotedancer

[Shazbotacus]

“Tough Blaster” suits my favorite theme: soldier in power armor with a gun. I really hope that doesn’t get scrapped.

[kiLLaBiyte]

45 minutes ago, Shazbotacus said:

“Tough Blaster” suits my favorite theme: soldier in power armor with a gun. I really hope that doesn’t get scrapped.

VERY VERY good point!!

 

In my HONEST opinion, I think that the devs should look at Iron Man, the Punisher, etc for inspiration on how they should re-design this AT!! Like, look at what else they bring to the table for a fight or for a team!! It's a lot of raw firepower, but its also so so SO much more!! Hopefully they can find a way to make this happen...within balance of course.

[oldskool]

If Opportunity were to be decoupled from the attacks, then I'd love to see the effects of both rolled into one thing.  I'm not opposed to having a button like Domination that when triggered gives me bonus unenhanceable energy damage, applies a resistance debuff to $Target, and fuels my blue/green bar for the duration. 

 

I feel a need to play a little bit of Devil's Advocate with your complaints about the current system though. 

 

I do not feel forced to use the T1, period.  I do not feel forced to use Opportunity, at all.  Hell, for several sets I have designed my attack chain to include Opportunity to the point that I do not even need to think about it.  For example, my Dual Pistol build fires off Pistols precisely at 94% Opportunity meter which can be built up predictably every 13 seconds like clockwork.  Sure, a missed attack can be a little disruptive, but I also have the T2 which I can substitute.  Did I feel forced to take the T2?  Hell no.  It mules a set.  It just happens to be that if Pistols misses I can still trigger the resistance debuff with the other attack.  The damage boost of Offensive Opportunity is so small as to not really be all that big of a deal if I don't maintain it every cycle.  The resistance debuff is what really matters for damage output not the other perks.  Dual Pistols is not unique in being able to do this either.  Dark Blast can also be built up to tack on Gloom or Dark Blast after its two hard hitters which will also trigger Opportunity in a completely predictable pattern.  Beam Rifle, Psychic Blast, and Archery can be built to have 0 use for the T1 or T2 in their attack chains.  The decision to use whatever Opportunity variant in those power sets can be completely flexible and not nearly as disruptive as stated. 

 

All that aside, everything I have learned about building attack routines to make Opportunity a thoughtless rotational feature is the selling point for decoupling it from the attacks.  The game doesn't teach you how to handle Opportunity making it feel clunky and not everyone is going to have the patience to experiment with it.  So if the mechanics changed for the better to appease the wider audience, then I am down for that. 

Edited October 16, 2019 by oldskool

[kiLLaBiyte]

On 10/16/2019 at 12:55 PM, oldskool said:

I feel a need to play a little bit of Devil's Advocate with your complaints about the current system though. 

 

I do not feel forced to use the T1, period.  I do not feel forced to use Opportunity, at all.  Hell, for several sets I have designed my attack chain to include Opportunity to the point that I do not even need to think about it.  For example, my Dual Pistol build fires off Pistols precisely at 94% Opportunity meter which can be built up predictably every 13 seconds like clockwork.  Sure, a missed attack can be a little disruptive, but I also have the T2 which I can substitute.  Did I feel forced to take the T2?  Hell no.  It mules a set.  It just happens to be that if Pistols misses I can still trigger the resistance debuff with the other attack.  The damage boost of Offensive Opportunity is so small as to not really be all that big of a deal if I don't maintain it every cycle.  The resistance debuff is what really matters for damage output not the other perks.  Dual Pistols is not unique in being able to do this either.  Dark Blast can also be built up to tack on Gloom or Dark Blast after its two hard hitters which will also trigger Opportunity in a completely predictable pattern.  Beam Rifle, Psychic Blast, and Archery can be built to have 0 use for the T1 or T2 in their attack chains.  The decision to use whatever Opportunity variant in those power sets can be completely flexible and not nearly as disruptive as stated. 

In a perfect world, all of this makes sense. However, that's not the vacuum that we play in.

 

There are often times when my opportunity is ready to go off, but that would mean wasting it on a minion that's almost dead. In which case, I have 1 of 4 decisions to make:

 

1.) I fire off Defensive Opportunity (if it's up) in order to not only finish off the minion but also not break attack chains (the "upside" I get more survivability/end management whether I need it or not).

 

2.) I waste Offensive Opportunity on the minion at which point he dies immediately and the benefit of Opportunity is entirely lost.

 

3.) I wait for one of my other harder hitting attacks to come back, and essentially "waste" those on deleting the minion as well...while at the same time wasting precious time for dps.

 

4.) I attack a completely different MOB  and ignore my initial target, until I'm ready to use Opportunity on a different harder target MOB, then switch back to the first minion to clean him up with a proper low damage attack, and then switch back to the harder target that I triggered Opportunity on and commence fighting him...

 

In none of these situations is this "ideal" in any way shape or form. There is far too much thought process for this. And yes, Number 4 is typically the route I would take, as to "not" lose out on Opportunity. 

 

This, is not Opportunistic in any sense. It's cumbersome.

 

We can't play this game in a vacuum or a perfect world sense...and as such, we can't expect attack chains to flow perfectly with Opportunity. Sometimes they do, often-times they do not.

 

And when they don't, it makes our one primary inherent utterly useless. No other class has to worry about that. Scrappers are the closest AT that does as their inherent is entirely "chance", but they have enough base damage output and survivability that it doesn't matter - the Critical's are just the "icing on top".

 

Without Opportunity, there truly is no reason to pick a Sentinel over a Blaster or Corruptor in team play. The only time being, that I can think of, is if you lack any healers/debuffers on your team, which is very rarely the case.

 

So, we are left as a more "solo" oriented class, which just doesn't seem right in an MMO. It's what killed Stalkers back on Live until they fixed/changed the way Assassination works - making them so much more team friendly and WAY more useful.

 

So, Opportunity, being our real "crutch" power to be included in a team, needs to function properly. We should be able to "pop" it when the "opportunity" arises, and grant the debuff/buff that we want (or maybe just make it do both). This would make the power oodles more useful for us.

 

Anyways....just my thoughts.

 

Edited October 18, 2019 by kiLLaBiyte

[nihilii]

3 hours ago, kiLLaBiyte said:

Without Opportunity, there truly is no reason to pick a Sentinel over a Blaster or Corruptor in team play.

Team usefulness is always a touchy argument, but I don't feel this problem at all.

 

A blaster cannot take +4/x8 alphas with the same level of comfort a sentinel can.

A corruptor cannot push the same level of effective DPS a sentinel can (by effective DPS, I mean while /storm corrs can deal 350+ DPS, they're not going to do that damage in a fast-paced team against changing targets).

Of course the two ATs bring other advantages. A blaster will deal significantly more damage. And a corruptor will be a significantly better force multiplier. Which is how it should be.

Re: Opportunity itself, for me it's simple. Aim+Nuke (which we have up every 25-30s on an endgame build) + our AOEs wipe out all minions and most if not all lieuts, leaving no reason to attack anything but a boss in most cases. Which makes my Opportunity trigger on bosses more often than not.

If Opportunity became a click, suddenly I'd have to spend time monitoring my bar and an extra click. Boo. Right now, I literally never pay attention to Opportunity, and run my attack chain as if it didn't exist. So I would lose DPS if I had to use a non-damaging click, not to mention the much greater cost in attention. Double boo.

Opportunity is bad for some players right now, so this could stand to improve. But it would suck if the "improvement" turned out to nerf others. I'd rather see a rework that made Opportunity an instant recharging toggle like the /bio forms. Like the current behavior? Keep the toggle on all the time. Want to pick and choose your target? Use the toggle like a click when your bar is up.

But admittedly, this would mean *2* clicks for players who prefer to click, one to toggle up and one to toggle down. That might be a problem.

[oldskool]

6 hours ago, kiLLaBiyte said:

We can't play this game in a vacuum or a perfect world sense...and as such, we can't expect attack chains to flow perfectly with Opportunity. Sometimes they do, often-times they do not.

I don't play my Sentinels in a vacuum.  However, I think you're missing some of my points and conflating them with something else.  I'll restate my point if that helps clear it up.  

 

Dual Pistols can run an attack chain of Executioner's Shot -> Suppressive Fire -> Pistols with enough recharge.  Opportunity highlights at 90%.  The aforementioned attack chain is over 4 seconds long.  The 3rd time you hit Suppressive Fire you will have built up 94 Opportunity making the third Pistols attack automatically trigger Offensive Opportunity.  That's not perfect world sorcery.  That's just math.  The attack sequence is over 13 seconds in length and every 3rd Pistols shot will be a use of your Opportunity.  Dark Blast can also do this by using Antumbral Beam -> Abyssal Gaze -> Gloom (or Dark Blast).  Every T1 attack generates 8 meter.  All of the other single-target attacks generate 13 to 14 meter.  You can make Opportunity predictable and you can adjust your attack chain to accommodate it.  Archery doesn't need its T1 or T2 in its attack chain.  Its best attack sequence has Stunning Shot, Perfect Shot, Blazing Arrow.  That means when Opportunity lights up, you can insert Aimed Shot or Snap Shot at your leisure.  Psychic Blast can built similarly and so can Beam Rifle.  

 

Again, none of that is perfect world day dreaming.  You can legitimately map this out and execute it in the game.  Furthermore, you gloss over the notion that I don't care enough about who is on the receiving end of my Opportunity in most content.  When Opportunity is just a part of my attack chain, it really doesn't matter if I nail a minion with it or an LT in most groups.  Everything gets arrested so fast it doesn't matter.  Besides, the side benefits of Opportunity (+damage or +resource) apply to every enemy hit for 15 seconds.  So it doesn't matter who had that resistance debuff because their buddies are still going to get smacked with bonus energy damage or return heal/endurance to me.  If I am going to fight a hard target like a Boss/EB/AV/GM they are going to be the focus of my attacks anyway and therefore they are getting tagged with Opportunity naturally. 

 

I realize that the effort I have put into learning Opportunity is not something that most players care to do or even has bothered with.  That's why I am all for seeing a change to something less frustrating for the broader player base.  

 

So my Devil's Advocacy wasn't just imagining something in a vacuum.  Its me describing how I play not just one Sentinel, but several of them.  There are 13 Primary Sets.  I've played 8 of them.  Half of those have 0 need for both the T1 and T2 to make a competitive attack chain.  Other sets where I do use both the T1 and T2 (e.g., Water Blast, Assault Rifle) I do not worry about which version of Opportunity goes off.  I don't delay my attack chain because the Opportunity side effects aren't so massive they make or break my damage when playing in mission maps or deleting trash targets.  Even against AV's which version of Opportunity doesn't make a big difference in my time-to-kill.  Its the resistance debuff that matters and that is provided from either version and resistance debuffs really only matter against hard targets. 

 

In other words, what you view as a problem is something I have learned to play around it.  It doesn't bother me that much, but I do empathize with others do feel it is a clunky inherent.  

 

Anyway, I'm on your side even if I disagree with the perception of what the problem is. 

Edited October 18, 2019 by oldskool

[Menelruin]

The "guarding squishies" bit gives me another idea.  What if their damage just goes up from standing near to allies, but that bonus is partially negated by standing CLOSE to enemies?  So they do more damage by hanging out with the blasters and defenders, but not if they just stand next to the mobs with the melees.

[earthaddy]

17 hours ago, Menelruin said:

The "guarding squishies" bit gives me another idea.  What if their damage just goes up from standing near to allies, but that bonus is partially negated by standing CLOSE to enemies?  So they do more damage by hanging out with the blasters and defenders, but not if they just stand next to the mobs with the melees.

That sounds like it would greatly favor some sets over other sets. On some sets the nuke is a pbaoe and others get a ranged nuke. Some secondaries have point blank attacks as well.

[Menelruin]

6 hours ago, earthaddy said:

That sounds like it would greatly favor some sets over other sets. On some sets the nuke is a pbaoe and others get a ranged nuke. Some secondaries have point blank attacks as well.

True, but if you only go by nukes, sets aren't balanced anyway:  Some do more damage, some have shorter cooldowns, etc.  Same for the secondaries.  And it wouldn't be reduced damage from baseline, it would just be LESS of a bonus from standing near melees than standing back with blasters.

[Menelruin]

Another idea I had:  Everyone seems to dislike being similar to other inherents, but Scrapper and Stalker already do that...so why not, with a twist?

 

Expose Weakness:  Every Primary attack by a Sentinel debuffs an enemy with the status "exposed" for 2 seconds.  Any attack by an ally on an Exposed target has a 3% chance to crit.  Scrappers and Stalkers will have their crit chance increased by 3%.  A Sentinel can not benefit from his own Exposed on an enemy, but another Sentinel can.

 

Now, while this doesn't help in solo play, there are 2 things to consider.  Firstly, Sentinels are already pretty good for solo, it's in teams they need a role.  Second, a Tanker's inherent is also totally useless in solo, isn't it?

Edited October 25, 2019 by Menelruin

[Zepp]

Rather than a button, I would prefer to have both opportunity effects merged and activated by any single target attack within the primary.