Duoing TFs with a friend

[TrishaTwilight]

19 hours ago, Coyote said:

 

As a note, Fluffy will usually have 2 stacks of Twilight Grasp on the AV, and you should be able to manage 3-4 stacks, and each stack is -50%. It's stackable and it lasts for 20 seconds, so you can manage about -300% Regen just from Twilight Grasp stacked.

 

Then, Howling Twilight has an uptime of about 50%, and when it's up you're at 667% -Regen (you're at higher, actually, but the AV is floored at 667% unless it's higher in level, in which case the higher values actually help more). So the AVERAGE -Regen, assuming 50% HT uptime, is just under 500%. This makes it about as strong at -Regen as the other good -Regen sets (Ice and Rad, but still not as good as Traps), and it puts out much higher -Dam and -ToHit (over 100% -ToHit, which even an AV will notice). IMO, the top 3 AV soloing debuff sets are Traps, Ice, and Dark, with Rad being in 4th place. Although I'd drop Ice to 4th unless paired with Earth or Illusion, since it's not as good with personal defense and it really wants to be paired with a good tanking pet or partner.

Good to know the heal provides meaningful -regen as well!

[Doomguide2005]

Dark has a -resist power in Tar Patch (and many other sets have their own -resist powers).  The more -resist you can put on a target, AV or otherwise, the more damage that will be done by both of you.  The more damage you do the less -regen you'll need to reach or exceed the point at which the target(s) health recovery is less than your damage output.  That's what makes RadEm, Traps and Cold so often mentioned (along with Dark) when discussing tackling AVs and GMs.  They provide both significant -regen as well as -resist within the set and why Sonic Blast is often paired with them. 

[Mercurias]

19 hours ago, oedipus_tex said:

By the way, an option you may not have thought of would be a Mastermind. A MM/Brute combo could probably solo most of the game. 

 

I'd personally go Something/Thermal Radiation as a MM. 

 

 

Ooh, a Thugs/Dark or Thugs/Storm would be really solid as a firing squad with added control and debuffs for sure. 

[Tahliah]

On 11/1/2019 at 8:29 AM, TrishaTwilight said:

With illusion, do you think I would be able to meaningfully contribute to AV fights? I suppose PA/Phantasm contribute well, I guess I'm thinking a bit too focused on what my character is doing. Which I suppose would be throwing out debuffs!

 

Is there enough -regen in dark or kin to help with AVs?

Absolutely, as someone else mentioned illusion controllers were among the first to solo pylons, AVs, GMs, you name it.  That's solo.  With a brute, you're golden. 

 

Yes.  Also, -regen isn't the only debuff to consider with AVs, there's all sorts of debuff effects that negate the need for massive -regen (though you get massive -regen with /dark).   Get their resistance down and their recharge slowed, and they die faster than they can regen. 

 

Also, since a lot of the more difficult TFs (and of course trials) are late game, you will also be incarnate.  That's going to change everything for you both.  Grab Banished Pantheon as your lore pet (or maybe Longbow for some trials, tfs), and you'll be unstoppable on ill/dark (or ill/cold, ill/kin).  You could solo most of your goal content.  Not kidding.

 

[edit to add:  I hope you update this thread once you decide and you guys get rolling.  I'd love to hear how things go as you tackle the various TFs and later trials!  You'll need more people for some, like when you have to hit four glowies simultaneously, etc., so keep that in mind.  I'm happy to hop on the team if you need me to glowie sit. LOL]

Edited November 2, 2019 by Tahliah
addendum

[TrishaTwilight]

21 hours ago, Tahliah said:

 

[edit to add:  I hope you update this thread once you decide and you guys get rolling.  I'd love to hear how things go as you tackle the various TFs and later trials!  You'll need more people for some, like when you have to hit four glowies simultaneously, etc., so keep that in mind.  I'm happy to hop on the team if you need me to glowie sit. LOL]

Do they still require simultaneous clicks? I know that in Yin for example the 'simultaneous' is either so lax it hardly matters, or is gone completely!

[Apparition]

17 minutes ago, TrishaTwilight said:

Do they still require simultaneous clicks? I know that in Yin for example the 'simultaneous' is either so lax it hardly matters, or is gone completely!

 

No, they don't.  SCoRE removed simultaneous clicks in Issue 25, but a lot of people don't know that still.  The text hasn't been changed so it'll still say that a mission requires simultaneous clicks, but they don't.

[Tahliah]

1 hour ago, Apparition said:

 

No, they don't.  SCoRE removed simultaneous clicks in Issue 25, but a lot of people don't know that still.  The text hasn't been changed so it'll still say that a mission requires simultaneous clicks, but they don't.

I didn't know that!  Glad I do now, though, thanks!

[TrishaTwilight]

On 11/2/2019 at 7:53 PM, Tahliah said:

[edit to add:  I hope you update this thread once you decide and you guys get rolling.  I'd love to hear how things go as you tackle the various TFs and later trials!  You'll need more people for some, like when you have to hit four glowies simultaneously, etc., so keep that in mind.  I'm happy to hop on the team if you need me to glowie sit. LOL]

I will do my best to update as we progress. He is still deciding between fire/elec and fire/dark. So I still haven't even made my character 😞 Given his choices, I think dark isn't a bad option for support, but for some reason nature has caught my eye as well.

[Tahliah]

2 hours ago, TrishaTwilight said:

I will do my best to update as we progress. He is still deciding between fire/elec and fire/dark. So I still haven't even made my character 😞 Given his choices, I think dark isn't a bad option for support, but for some reason nature has caught my eye as well.

It's also possible that you guys are overthinking this.  My BFF from live is also on HC and we rebuilt our mains: his is a wp/ax tank and mine is an ice/ice blaster.  We duo pretty much everything, including TFs, just fine.  It's as much about playstyle and compatibility (between powersets and the people behind the toons) as it is about powersets alone.  If that makes sense? 

 

Obviously, you wouldn't want to do that on two emp defenders, but pretty much any toon with a well-built brute will work.

[Doomguide2005]

Wouldn't on two Emps!  That would be by far the best way if one was to do it with Empathy.  Two Emps would totally destroy everything short of AV's and a pair of Emp/Sonics I'd be happy to try the AV's.  Nukes every 30 seconds or so, Screech stacking to high mag, high enough to potentially stun an AV through their PToD.  Pairing any set of Defenders is a strong synergy, but with Empathy that is especially true.  Grab an Immobilize to make them (the AV) to sit still regardless of your eventually pairing.  AVs in general have no exceptional status (PToD) resistance to Immobilize or Sleep.  Two Emps with IO builds is easily perma both RAs, perma AB, perma Fort etc. and we haven't even gotten to Incarnate power choices (I dare you to die 😀).

[Hedgefund]

Any duo, and I mean any, can crush an AV with Envenomed Daggers.  I offer firsthand testimony for this.  I wouldn't limit options to something with -regen just for AV fights if you're not drawn to such a set already.  Not saying don't choose it, just saying you don't HAVE to choose it.

[TrishaTwilight]

On 11/5/2019 at 12:00 PM, Tahliah said:

It's also possible that you guys are overthinking this.  My BFF from live is also on HC and we rebuilt our mains: his is a wp/ax tank and mine is an ice/ice blaster.  We duo pretty much everything, including TFs, just fine.  It's as much about playstyle and compatibility (between powersets and the people behind the toons) as it is about powersets alone.  If that makes sense? 

 

Obviously, you wouldn't want to do that on two emp defenders, but pretty much any toon with a well-built brute will work.

We are definitely overthinking it, but that's mostly not on my end. Number crunching is half the fun! We also now are in different time zones, so starting this up has gotten a bit delayed.

[TrishaTwilight]

On 11/5/2019 at 4:21 PM, Hedgefund said:

Any duo, and I mean any, can crush an AV with Envenomed Daggers.  I offer firsthand testimony for this.  I wouldn't limit options to something with -regen just for AV fights if you're not drawn to such a set already.  Not saying don't choose it, just saying you don't HAVE to choose it.

Yea, I have settled on a perhaps a non-ideal set pairing, but it has caught my interest, so I'm going in!

[warlockiii]

I was checking out this old thread, because I was thinking about doing a duo also (but with a MM). On the Controller side, I was curious how Plant/Dark compares to Fire/Dark. Having confusion seems pretty handy and damage should be good. I'm not a fan of illusion, because it doesn't feel controllery enough. Also considering Defender, but I'm not a fan of /Sonic, so I was looking at Rad or Dark/Rad or Dark. Not a fan of Time either (sadly), even though it's top tier. Thanks.

[VV]

So, I thought /traps was pretty OP when it comes to AV hunting. that -1000 regen is a killer. Also, on a friend-duo, the traps that take time to set would be better utilized than on a PuG. Set Trip Mine, have brute pull onto it and boom, no more baddies. I think you want a fast damage primary for when planting traps is overkill, so Fire/Traps would be good.

 

When thinking about Controller vs Defender, one thing to consider is that there is at least one time you need controls, the LGTF. At the end, you face a mini-hami, and just like on the regular Hami, you need holds for the Mending Mitos.

 

Another thing to consider is that a duo of buff/debuffers is going to be more powerful than one and a brute. Double rads would be ridiculous. You could do a Rad/ Defender + /Rad Controller and pretty much destroy everything with ease. Double Ill/rads are basically unbeatable. Or you could mix it up, each playing different sets. Like, pick a different combo from the above suggestions for each of, and just go to town.