New AT Idea: The Justicar

[AgentForest]

JUSTICAR

Passive: Scales of Justice - The Justicar has a meter (where Fury/Domination is) that fills as they deal damage.  This resource is expended when using support moves, increasing the effect of those moves.

 

Primary: Melee Damage - The Justicar is a front-line support.  Damage is comparable to a Scrapper, but without a crit chance.  Essentially, they can deal damage in order to fuel "critical support" moves instead.  The basic melee DPS sets would apply here.  Martial Arts, Dual Blades, Ice Melee, etc.  Instead of having Taunt or Challenge, the move shared by Justicar melee sets would instead be a "Dash" move.  This move holds 3 charges that restock instead of a standard cooldown timer.  Upon casting Dash, your next melee attack OR support move that targets another character will make you instantly dash into melee range of that target to apply the effect.  This mobility is to help with the lack of inherent durability, as well as to make them useful as supports despite their melee nature.  These could have different effects based on the set if someone really wanted to put in the work, like teleporting, or walking through a portal, or just leaping over really fast, but the goal should be the same: to close the gap when you are immediately needed.  All "Build Up" powers would instead be "Power Boost" style, allowing you to also boost your supporting effects, but boosting damage less than the Scrapper versions.

 

Secondary: Melee Support - Rather than getting durability for themselves, the Justicar gets melee-centric reimaginings of support power sets.  For example, the Radioactive Aura set would have a toggle like Radiation Infection that lowers enemy Def and ToHit, and is centered around the Justicar itself as a PBAoE toggle aura.  These sets CAN provide durability in some cases, when it's fitting, but that's not really your goal.  It's about helping the team.

 

Ideally, I'd like each to have some mechanic to make its offensive powers a little different.  For example, Dark Presence heals by dealing damage.  Runic Seals can build up stacks of seals by attacking a target, like combo points, and upon reaching 3 seals on one target, the enemy takes bonus damage and the lowest health teammate in range is healed.  Temporal Aura can add a weak -Speed, -Regen, -Recharge effect to all attacks.  Pain Aura can increase the damage of its attacks after healing, letting you weave between healing and damage a little more effectively than other Justicar sets.  The Chi set will let you drain stats from enemies on-hit, then add stats to allies based on the number of stacks you've drained from enemies the next time you heal or buff them, to have an almost Kinetics feel.  Commanding Presence let's your attacks "denounce" a target, causing allies who attack them to heal.  Bestial Presence lets your attacks mark targets as "prey" for allies to gain bonus damage against.

Example Melee Support Sets:

• Field Medic: Pain killers, bandaging, adrenaline injections, etc.
• Chi: Stun and debuff enemies while healing and buffing allies with pressure points
• Barrier Projection: Forcefields and knockback effects.  More durable than other sets here, but with no healing of its own.
• Shield Bearer: Block incoming attacks on allies with defense buffs and stun enemies with shield bashes and throws. More durable than other sets here, but no healing.
• Commanding Presence: Shouts, war cries, leadership buffs, and team utility. Can "Denounce" an enemy, causing allies who attack them to heal.
• Bestial Presence: Pack/Herd buffs to increase team damage and durability depending on the situation. Allies attacking your marked prey deal more damage.
• Fortune: Luck for your allies and misfortune for enemies.  Super Reflex style buffs to nearby allies, while also lowering enemy ToHit or making enemies trip when near you.
• Pain Aura: Melee version of Pain Domination.  Damage is boosted after helping friends.
• Radioactive Aura: Melee version of Radiation Emissions set, with some more melee-focused moves instead of ranged and cone.
• Dark Presence: A mix of Dark Armor debuff powers (like Cloak of Fear) but with melee versions of Dark Miasma mechanics.  Instead of Twilight Grasp, you gain a passive that just makes you heal nearby allies based on your damage dealt.  Instead of summoning a Dark Servant, you can summon 3 small Shadespawn that use Dark Melee attacks and heal nearby teammates as they deal damage.
• Temporal Aura: Melee support set with time manipulation style powers.  The heal is a single-target heal-over-time effect with a decent duration.
• Potions: Tossing vials at your feet that create area buffs/debuffs, using a vanishing potion to stealth an ally and grant them bonus damage upon ending the stealth effect, giving healing potions to allies, etc.
• Runic Seals: You place runic sigils on the ground, allies, and enemies, causing various useful effects.
• Gadget Deployment: Place turrets, beacons, and resupply stations across the battlefield, like a combination of Traps, Trick Arrow, and Device powers.

[honoroit]

[Leogunner]

Just some first impressions:

 

I've never been a fan of "scaling support" type inherents mainly because support is tactical and not always reactive. Sometimes you put out support before it's needed (like FF shields or something like tar patch) and others it's after (like a rez). Relying on a bar built up to increase them feels counter intuitive to support's tactical nature. 

 

Also, it gets a power boost type power... Just how weak is this AT's base support? It also doesn't feel intuitive to put  power meant to buff support into a powerset that is melee. It'd be like putting Build up into the armor power set. 

 

Lastly, why Justicar? The theme has touches of a speedster and 2 power boost effects. It also sounds like the support set would be radically different from normal support variants. Would like to see a full list of one of the sets to get a feel for the AT. 

[Alchemystic]

Seems like the secondary sets that were planned for Guardians, the prototype Archetype that uses Assault sets as a primary, and a mix of Defense/Support as a secondary.

[Haijinx]

New Melee Support proposal.

 

Must be Thursday.

[AgentForest]

On 1/23/2020 at 12:24 PM, Leogunner said:

Just some first impressions:

 

I've never been a fan of "scaling support" type inherents mainly because support is tactical and not always reactive. Sometimes you put out support before it's needed (like FF shields or something like tar patch) and others it's after (like a rez). Relying on a bar built up to increase them feels counter intuitive to support's tactical nature. 

 

Also, it gets a power boost type power... Just how weak is this AT's base support? It also doesn't feel intuitive to put  power meant to buff support into a powerset that is melee. It'd be like putting Build up into the armor power set. 

 

Lastly, why Justicar? The theme has touches of a speedster and 2 power boost effects. It also sounds like the support set would be radically different from normal support variants. Would like to see a full list of one of the sets to get a feel for the AT. 

Some support is tactical, and some is reactive.  That scaling effect is to reward them for helping when needed instead of JUST dealing damage.  I didn't spell out the exact changes I would give the power sets in this post yet (busy with work lately), but an example would be to put Absorption effects into the forcefield set.  I feel that with their more single-target, melee approach to supporting, they will need assistance in this department to keep up with Defenders and even Corruptors/Controllers.  Otherwise why bring one to a team instead of a Defender if they just sat there attacking instead of healing?  Why bring them instead of a Scrapper if they just spent their whole time running from teammate to teammate instead of attacking?  It's to create a flow of gameplay that we don't really have much of yet, short of the Corruptor's Scourge mechanic, which encourages weaving between the two roles.  Support at first, attacking when you can, then focus on damage as the enemies' HP gets lower.  This would be like a smaller version of that.  Built up your resource bar a bit?  Spend it on some barriers and go back to fighting.

Maybe not as strong as the ones Dominators can get, but I feel like, being a support, the Build Up power they have shouldn't JUST help their damage.  That wouldn't really match a support role as much, especially one that is already impeded by melee effects.  This would be more of a reactive effect, while the expendable supporting resource bar would be either reactive or preventative.  If you only have one dash left at the moment, and your tank needs you, this Power Boost move could really make you save the day.  Remember, this set generally won't have much in the realm of durability, short of some basic protection against AoEs built in somewhere, so it will need an edge over ranged supports.  The total potential healing and buffing of this class would be stronger than a Defender, but with a more limited scope (fewer AoE heals, more focused supporting on a particular area of the fight at a time).

As for Justicar, I needed a name for someone passing judgment.  This isn't just a support.  They fight on the front lines.  They both help people and punish people.  Vigilante is already taken as an alignment, and Zealot is a little too religious in theme.

[Pbuckley818]

On 1/23/2020 at 3:50 PM, Haijinx said:

New Melee Support proposal.

 

Must be Thursday.

I mean it is a bit of a meme. One for which I am guilty of participating.

 

Just face it they aren't going anywhere until either A. One get's implemented, or B. The heat death of the universe. My money is on B. 

 

I just hope this one stays civil that last one was a *&() show.

 

Anywho, as far as the purposal goes we may want the name to be a bit more morally grey sounding. I know, I know, this is hard to do with a melee support AT, and some of the villain AT's sound pretty overtly sinister (Looking at you Corruptor). But it it's just the nature of the beast.

 

I was partial to Exemplar but then I remembered that's what it's called whene you down level to play with lower levels. One I just recently thought up was Champion.

Edited January 28, 2020 by Pbuckley818

[Rathulfr]

I vote for B.

[Pbuckley818]

24 minutes ago, Rathulfr said:

I vote for B.

Oh, come on man, that's cold.

[Steampunkette]

More lukewarm than anything... 

 

I kind of hate myself for making that joke.

[Haijinx]

For names ..

 

Guardian isn't a bad name since Sentinel is now a thing.  That's what people are trying to resurrect anyhow.

 

Protector might work, kind of follows off defender.

 

Champion isn't bad but of course you have the CO issue. 

 

 

One problem in a lot of these proposals is the inherents.  They seem to either be OP or oddly tailored very specifically do something the proposer wants, rather than mesh well with existing AT inherents.  

 

This one seems like it will be great at low levels but at high levels, who needs a domination +support bonus?

[Pbuckley818]

12 minutes ago, Haijinx said:

For names ..

 

Guardian isn't a bad name since Sentinel is now a thing.  That's what people are trying to resurrect anyhow.

 

Protector might work, kind of follows off defender.

 

Champion isn't bad but of course you have the CO issue. 

 

 

One problem in a lot of these proposals is the inherents.  They seem to either be OP or oddly tailored very specifically do something the proposer wants, rather than mesh well with existing AT inherents.  

 

This one seems like it will be great at low levels but at high levels, who needs a domination +support bonus?

Yeah I feel like we need to stop trying to force an inherent and just let one natureally evolve. I do have this one from my current purposal.

 

Innate: Protector: When alone the Champion is better able to focus on their own needs, granting them a bonus to Damage, and Damage Resistance. However, Champions by nature feel compelled to look after their comrades as a result each additional ally reduces this bonus in exchange for increasing the Champions Energy Recovery, allowing them to better look after their companions needs.

Notes:

• The Idea is that the Damage/Damage Resistance buff is completely replaced by the Recovery buff in a group of 4 or more.

It's based both on the Defender Inherent, as well as trying to solve some of the issues that have been expressed about the Composition powerset from the Guardian. But even this comes with the following disclaimer.

• The current Inherent is purely theoretical and just as most of this suggestion is tentative, this goes double for the inherent. The Inherent will be whatever it needs to be.

Still if you will notice a bit TOO similar to the Defenders inherent.

Edited January 28, 2020 by Pbuckley818

[AgentForest]

An example secondary set:

Pain Aura

1. Sadistic Presence: (passive) Your attacks now cause a small AoE heal around you based on the damage of the attack.  It's not a large area or heal amount, but you can be healed by this too.  All first powers in the secondary sets of this AT are a passive that grants some unique effect for your attacks, as well as a passive boost to AoE defense since you have to be near tanks to help them and don't really have significant armor of your own.  For Pain Aura, this move would help replace the fact that you don't get Nullify Pain as a big AoE heal.
2. Soothing Touch: (melee, single-target) Heal an ally.  If your Judgment bar is over 35, then 35 points are consumed to also apply a heal-over-time effect to this power.
3. Suppress Pain: (toggle, PBAoE) Increases regeneration in an area around you.  Mostly unchanged from the Mastermind version.
4. Shared Agony: (melee, single-target) Heal a single ally for a large amount, but at the cost of some of your own HP.  Unlike Absorb Pain/Share Pain, you can still be healed after this, but for only slightly reduced amounts (% decrease would need to be tested, but not for as long as the no-healing debuff on the other versions).  You gain bonus damage after using this move as well.  If your Judgment bar is over 35, then an Absorb shield is also applied to the target, and your damage boost is slightly larger.
5. Conduit of Pain: (ally Rez) Largely unchanged.  Revive an ally, but also increase your own damage output, to-hit, recharge rate, and recovery rate for a minute, but after it wears off, your damage, recharge rate, and hit chance are reduced.  If your resource bar is over 50, you spend 50 points to eliminate the "crash" afterwards.
6. Aggressive Motivation: (melee, single-target) Cure an ally's status conditions, and grant them strong protection and resistance to those effects.  Largely unchanged from "Enforced Morale" except that it's melee, and you can expend 20 Judgment to also grant you the same effects when applying it to a teammate.  Casting this move on a teammate gives you a short burst of speed and slow resistance for 5 seconds, just to allow you to apply it quickly to those who may need it.
7. Realm of Pain: (Location AoE, toggle) You place an area on the ground at your feet that grants allies inside bonus Resist (all, placate), Damage, and To-Hit.  Essentially, the same buffs as "World of Pain", but applied in a localized area at your feet.  You can turn it off, and it will recharge really fast (like Lifegiving Spores for Nature Affinity).  The buffs won't be as strong as the clickable version "World of Pain", but in the hands of a good Justicar, you could have it up most of the time.
8. Anguishing Cry: (PBAoE) Largely unchanged.  You destroy enemy Resistance and Defense in an area around you.  Fitting enough move for the front lines already.
9. Painbringer: (melee, single-target) Largely unchanged from the standard version of the power, except applied in melee range.  However, you can expend 75 Judgment to also apply the effect to yourself as well as the target.

Edited January 30, 2020 by AgentForest

[AgentForest]

And just for the record, I wasn't entirely sold on the AT name, but I wanted to give it something I hadn't seen already in the forum suggestions.  I hadn't seen any proposals that really matched my concept for a melee support, so I didn't want to copy another poster's AT name just for consistency, or it could look like I was trying to steal the thunder from other people.

Champion, Guardian, and Protector all could work just fine.  I just worried that something like Champion might be too vague (and as you mentioned, issues with Champions Online), and Guardian/Protector almost sound too tanky or too dedicated to only supporting.  I was going for more of a hybrid class, much like how the Corruptor is both ranged damage and support.

I also didn't want anything TOO villainous or heroic, and went with something that's largely devoid of a real "side".  A Justicar is essentially someone who passes judgment on behalf of a leader.  They serve, but are also absolute authorities in the name of whoever gave them their position.  Essentially, lawful alignment, but not really linked to good or evil alignment.  And since they do their job on behalf of their king or whoever they answer to, in that person's place, it made me think of a more front-line role for someone who both protects those who have been wronged, but also passes sentencing on the perpetrators.  Supporting plus damage.

It also helps that there's a sub-class of Cleric in the MMO "Rift" called the Justicar, who heals by dealing melee damage (they can also tank by changing stances and losing most of their ally healing in exchange for self-healing, but that's beside the point, lol).  It was the closest thing I could think of to the type of class design I was shooting for.  The only other class I've seen similar to it was the "Warrior Priest" and "Disciple of Khaine" classes from the long-dead MMO Warhammer: Age of Reckoning, but those are way too lore specific to use for naming this class, lol.

Edited January 30, 2020 by AgentForest

[AgentForest]

Just wanted to bump the idea of more support classes.  Guardian, Protector, Justicar, Champion, whatever we call it, the game could use it.  Sentinel is fantastic, and it's been a while since we got another.