Power Sets

[00Troy00]

Where can I find some tutorials for the different power sets (I've looked, and I probably just looked over it). I 'd like to find out what's good / still good to take, and what can be skipped. I'm especially interested in the newer power sets, and how they may be best combined with the "classic," ones.

 

Thanks

 

Troy

[Oubliette_Red]

You can try starting here...

 

But you can also hit up the AT sections if you know which one you wish to play and look for builds and discussions.

[Herotu]

For me, it's more like what combinations feel crappy than what's good.

 

There are heaps of crappy-feeling stuff.

 

IMHO Generally Controllers feel worst/bad/boring especially solo. Sorry Controllers. BUT on the upside, nearly everything else feels good!

 

[Seigmoraig]

I would suggest you have a look at the Archtype forums, they are all rich with discussions and build examples about the various powerset combos available

 

https://forums.homecomingservers.com/forum/43-archetypes/

 

Also if you want to view the builds more in depth you need to get the Mids Reborn character planner

 

 

Edited April 13, 2020 by Seigmoraig

[Greycat]

Personally? Instead of going through others opinion of what's good or not (because, frankly, other than about 3-4 sets, pretty much anything you ask about seems to have 99% "that sucks, you're stupid for taking it" answers) - you've got 1000 slots. Sure, go with suggestions, but just make a few combos of your own that *you* think sound interesting and play them. They may stink on ice, sure, but you may just find you have fun with some "bad" sets.

[MTeague]

58 minutes ago, Herotu said:

For me, it's more like what combinations feel crappy than what's good.

 

There are heaps of crappy-feeling stuff.

 

IMHO Generally Controllers feel worst/bad/boring especially solo. Sorry Controllers. BUT on the upside, nearly everything else feels good!

 

Just shows you one man's trash is another man's treasure. 

 

Controller's feel perfectly in their element soloing to me.  Admittedly, the kill speed is slow, but a Mind Controller stepping out of the shadows and turning the entire warehouse of goons against each other, or holding them helpless with his mind while he telekinetically beats them into submission, feels far stronger to me than when my controller tags along with a group and just tosses out Speed Boost, Increase Density, and Fulcrum Shift.

[SeraphimKensai]

You can also go to the beta server insta 50, slot yourself out for free and try each power to see if there's ones that fit your play style and ones that don't, and use it to help you get an understanding of what each power does, what it looks like, and whether you see yourself using that for your own build.

 

But doing the same for any set you're confused about, allows you to understand how things work when you team with others.

[Oubliette_Red]

40 minutes ago, SeraphimKensai said:

You can also go to the beta server insta 50, slot yourself out for free and try each power to see if there's ones that fit your play style and ones that don't, and use it to help you get an understanding of what each power does, what it looks like, and whether you see yourself using that for your own build.

 

But doing the same for any set you're confused about, allows you to understand how things work when you team with others.

See, for me playing an insta-50 does not give me a "feel" for how a character plays. I have to level them up, even on Beta, though I can skip to 10's, 20's 30's.

[SeraphimKensai]

34 minutes ago, Oubliette_Red said:

See, for me playing an insta-50 does not give me a "feel" for how a character plays. I have to level them up, even on Beta, though I can skip to 10's, 20's 30's.

Ah. I plan most my characters to be able to be effective exemplaring down as I will run a lot of TF's, so I want my characters to be able to make a difference when being artificially lowered in level, just as I want them to be effective in Incarnate content.

 

How I suggested going to 50 on the test server really though allows someone to get an understanding of all the powers available in their Powersets...and then make a build.based on what works for them.

 

I guess I honestly don't focus too much on the ride to 50, but more so what you do after being there as it doesn't take near as long to level up in this game even without the xp booster or farming then it did on live back at launch.

[Doomguide2005]

Haven't been on the HC test server and currently my computer is deceased so I can't.  But on Live I'm fairly certain you could level up to what ever level you wished.  So level to 20 or 30 if desired.  Worst case you end up with several "clones" at levels 20 30 40 and 50 to try stuff out.

 

And as also said it is very easy to get to 30 or so on the HC servers and no worries about space on a server so just create and jump in, the water's great!  You'll either be leveling past "X" or not interested soon enough.

[SeraphimKensai]

On the live server you couldn't just level up to what you wanted, you had to use a character transfer tool to take your existing characters over to test. The fact that it was like that allowed us to have a robust PvP ladder league over on the Test server, and actually was the first time the yellow titles were ever awarded to players. Really fun times.

 

The Homecoming one unless they have the option shut off with a patch about to go live allows you to set your levels and get enhancements/influence fairly easily. They disable that functionality when testing a release candidate patch so that way they don't accidentally push those features to the love servers.

[Herotu]

2 hours ago, SeraphimKensai said:

Ah. I plan most my characters to be able to be effective exemplaring down as I will run a lot of TF's, so I want my characters to be able to make a difference when being artificially lowered in level, just as I want them to be effective in Incarnate content.

 

How I suggested going to 50 on the test server really though allows someone to get an understanding of all the powers available in their Powersets...and then make a build.based on what works for them.

 

I guess I honestly don't focus too much on the ride to 50, but more so what you do after being there as it doesn't take near as long to level up in this game even without the xp booster or farming then it did on live back at launch.

Yes, this levelling thing is really awkward for me. I like making costumes and I have a bunch of them that I have no characters for because the whole levelling / building / Mids process makes me ANXIOUS. I have a bunch of characters that I really got bored with the playstyles/powersets 

I spend more time in character creator than in the game and THAT MAKES ME SAD! I want to play with other people.

 

Also, I find your assessment of levelling to be very much what I experienced, too. I want to level up so that I can access interesting powers, but I don't want to outlevel the "natural" level of content of my level range - coming back via ouroboros is a weird and usually a very lonely process.

... and I don't want to be weak when I exemp down, so I open up mids then realise that I haven't a clue what is good and what is bad - look - you can put procs in powers but you miss out on the set bonuses, what's best? What's not? Am I going to be a gimp? Am I the weak link on the team?  It's mind-bendingly frustrating. 

 

 

All this complaining comes down to these facts;

 

1. I want the game to be a challenge at my level and not a speed-levelling exercise.

2. I want to access higher level powers because they do awesome things! e.g. AoE!

3. I want to be AND feel powerful.

4. I want to be viable when exemping - it's no good to just be useful in itrials.

5. I want powersets that work well together, but it seems there are secret tricks to making (particularly support) builds work and I am not privy to them.

6. Mids is a massive blocker. I hate having to try to use this. Even if I know what I'm doing, I can see people putting builds together that are 200IQ stuff - I feel inadequate.

Edited April 13, 2020 by Herotu

[Lines]

2 hours ago, Herotu said:

I spend more time in character creator than in the game and THAT MAKES ME SAD!

There's a game?!?

[Seigmoraig]

On 4/13/2020 at 2:08 PM, Herotu said:

Mids is a massive blocker. I hate having to try to use this. Even if I know what I'm doing, I can see people putting builds together that are 200IQ stuff - I feel inadequate.

If you don't know what you are doing in mids, it's not that big of a deal. Look around on the forums and on reddit and I'm pretty sure that there is a build out there for about every combination of powersets available. Once you have looked at a bunch of builds you start to get an idea as to what IO sets come up more often than others (Red Fortune, Luck of the Gambler, Reactive Defences, Aegis, Winter Sets, Ragnarok, Numina's, Panacea etc) it makes it a lot easier to build you own stuff.

I have been playing since July of last year and I have just made my first build 100% by myself last week, before that I would just find builds already made and switch out a power here and there to suit it to how I want to play the character

 

On 4/13/2020 at 2:08 PM, Herotu said:

I want powersets that work well together, but it seems there are secret tricks to making (particularly support) builds work and I am not privy to them.

This isn't really accurate at all, you can play whatever you want and it will likely work, some combos just need a bit more investment than others, like if you make a Titan Weapon character and choose a def set that doesn't give extra end regen you might be in for a tough time.

 

On 4/13/2020 at 2:08 PM, Herotu said:

I want to be viable when exemping - it's no good to just be useful in itrials.

To do this all you need to do really is choose your powers in the correct order, like if you choose Hover at level 49 you might find it rough exemping down. Next thing to do is to buy Attuned IOs for all your powers. Also slot your health and stamina ASAP so you don't miss out on them when exemp. Simple as that

 

On 4/13/2020 at 2:08 PM, Herotu said:

you can put procs in powers but you miss out on the set bonuses, what's best?

Many sets have pretty bad 6 piece bonuses, not ALL of them but many of them have toxic/psi/mez resist as 6pcs bonus which is very very skippable so it is easy to put a proc in those powers and not really feel any downside. It all boils down to if you need the set bonus or not. Is your fire def already as def cap ? If yes, then you don't need it.

There is a whole art of slotting procs to powers, lots of formulas with recharge timers, activation times and ppms that I can't be bothered to learn, but it's pretty easy to just have 1 or 2 procs in any given damage powers, 1 from the 5/6pcs set you are equipping in it and another from the frankenslot

Edited April 15, 2020 by Seigmoraig

[Herotu]

34 minutes ago, Seigmoraig said:

If you don't know what you are doing in mids, it's not that big of a deal. Look around on the forums and on reddit and I'm pretty sure that there is a build out there for about every combination of powersets available. Once you have looked at a bunch of builds you start to get an idea as to what IO sets come up more often than others (Red Fortune, Luck of the Gambler, Reactive Defences, Aegis, Winter Sets, Ragnarok, Numina's, Panacea etc) it makes it a lot easier to build you own stuff.

I have been playing since July of last year and I have just made my first build 100% by myself last week, before that I would just find builds already made and switch out a power here and there to suit it to how I want to play the character

 

This isn't really accurate at all, you can play whatever you want and it will likely work, some combos just need a bit more investment than others, like if you make a Titan Weapon character and choose a def set that doesn't give extra end regen you might be in for a tough time.

 

To do this all you need to do really is choose your powers in the correct order, like if you choose Hover at level 49 you might find it rough exemping down. Next thing to do is to buy Attuned IOs for all your powers. Also slot your health and stamina ASAP so you don't miss out on them when exemp. Simple as that

 

Many sets have pretty bad 6 piece bonuses, not ALL of them but many of them have toxic/psi/mez resist as 6pcs bonus which is very very skippable so it is easy to put a proc in those powers and not really feel any downside. It all boils down to if you need the set bonus or not. Is your fire def already as def cap ? If yes, then you don't need it.

There is a whole art of slotting procs to powers, lots of formulas with recharge timers, activation times and ppms that I can't be bothered to learn, but it's pretty easy to just have 1 or 2 procs in any given damage powers, 1 from the 5/6pcs set you are equipping in it and another from the frankenslot

Thank you very much for this post, it is reassuring.

 

I want to just say that the things that seem 200IQ are specifically Blapper-esque builds.

People seem to be making builds and playing in very personal styles.

Example: Blasters imho are all about shooting stuff from range, but other players do all manner of support, stealth and even melee damage with them  - so that's all mysterious stuff - and that's just the most simple archetype!

- I can only imagine how you're supposed to play the various weird controllery/dominatory builds with their incredibly diverse powersets.

And that's why I'm hesitant to copy other people's builds.

Here are a couple of other reasons:

• They don't explain why they're using non-Superior purple IOs instead of superior ones - I checked and there's no rule of five reason to do so.
• They're doing what you state above - dumping Hover into the build at level 49 or something - it's really weird - I'm supposed to trust this build? Am I supposed to replace Hover and move it to earlier in the build?

I really DO enjoy the game and I love the positive and wonderful community of great enthusiastic players. Many hearts to all fo you!

 

In summary my situation is this: I've played a lot... enough to know that although I know a lot, I know nothing!

[Seigmoraig]

13 minutes ago, Herotu said:

They're doing what you state above - dumping Hover into the build at level 49 or something - it's really weird - I'm supposed to trust this build? Am I supposed to replace Hover and move it to earlier in the build?

What I have noticed is that many people make builds that are not exemplar friendly. These people think that it's great to power level a character to 50 and start playing it from there. They are allowed to play however they will and there is no problem with seeing it that way.

For me, personally I like to play my characters in all sorts of level ranges, not only at level 50. So yes, if I see a build that has hover in it at level 49 it is perfectly reasonable to to switch around the powers to make it more exemplar friendly. In the end, once you are 50 it makes literally no difference in what order you chose your powers.

Do i need to take Hasten in this build ? Yes. Does it need to be at level 12 when it's not even perma and my endurance situation isn't sorted out ? NO.
Hasten, Stealth, Assault, Tough, Weave (if not melee at least, if you are melee you probably need tough and weave asap) and such are powers that are really easy to get a little later on in the build to make room for powers like Hover or Combat Jumping. Don't skip out on your primary and seconday powers, but it's pretty safe to play around with the power pools.

Edited April 15, 2020 by Seigmoraig

[Grouchybeast]

1 hour ago, Herotu said:

Example: Blasters imho are all about shooting stuff from range, but other players do all manner of support, stealth and even melee damage with them  - so that's all mysterious stuff - and that's just the most simple archetype!

 

Just a quick note about this point - blasters are all about damage, both ranged and melee.  They have plenty of PBAoE damage powers, and there are are a lot of high damage melee powers in blaster secondaries.

[MTeague]

22 minutes ago, Grouchybeast said:

Just a quick note about this point - blasters are all about damage, both ranged and melee.  They have plenty of PBAoE damage powers, and there are are a lot of high damage melee powers in blaster secondaries.

Exactly.  Now, there probably ARE some combinations that are more about being ranged more often than not.... Arch / Tactical Arrow comes to mind as "never need to be in melee".... but that's more the exception than the rule.  /Fire Manip, /Elec Manip, /Energy Manip, etc,... most of the "Classic" secondaries....  all have very strong melee powers. You don't HAVE to take them, but they're really handy when something does get in close (and that'll happen a lot as you level....).

 

Even /Devices, the Taser *used* to be Melee range, (it's still fairly short range), and of course Caltrops can be thrown only so far... and frequently, I'd toss it at my OWN feet to deal with mobs that had closed in. 

 

/Martial Kombat is probably the most extreme of this, given that you ahve a teleporting PBAE attack and 3 different melee kicks, as well as the melee Push.

[Without_Pause]

Data is a bit old, but you can search for powers and see what percentage of players take them.

 

https://forums.homecomingservers.com/fotm-powers/

[Grouchybeast]

5 hours ago, MTeague said:

/Martial Kombat is probably the most extreme of this, given that you ahve a teleporting PBAE attack and 3 different melee kicks, as well as the melee Push.

Martial Combat is fantastic.  Dual Pistols/Martial Combat is the most fun I have ever had with a CoX character.  I do not give two spinny kicks whether or not it's the most efficient or effective, or where either powerset falls on some hypothetical tier list.  It's top tier for me.

[Seigmoraig]

1 hour ago, Grouchybeast said:

I do not give two spinny kicks whether or not it's the most efficient or effective, or where either powerset falls on some hypothetical tier list.  It's top tier for me.

This is the correct way of viewing anything in CoH IMHO

[Generator]

1 hour ago, Grouchybeast said:

Martial Combat is fantastic.  Dual Pistols/Martial Combat is the most fun I have ever had with a CoX character.  I do not give two spinny kicks whether or not it's the most efficient or effective, or where either powerset falls on some hypothetical tier list.  It's top tier for me.

Plus that T1 Knockback attack always reminds me of Charlie Murphy kicking Rick James across the hotel room (literally every time), so that is a solid win in my book.

[Peacemoon]

On 4/13/2020 at 1:39 PM, Herotu said:

For me, it's more like what combinations feel crappy than what's good.

 

There are heaps of crappy-feeling stuff.

 

IMHO Generally Controllers feel worst/bad/boring especially solo. Sorry Controllers. BUT on the upside, nearly everything else feels good!

 

Controllers are very much like a stereotypical mage. They start off really weak, but their powers grow exponentially as they level!

Although I have to say with containment damage and control powers slotted/procced for damage, their damage isn't too shabby, especially at low levels actually. 🙂

It really depends on playstyle, if you have a logical/puzzle solving type of mind, Controllers and Dominators can be a fun playstyle. I would say Controllers are moderate, and Dominators more advanced in terms of difficulty. 

[Gremlin]

14 hours ago, Herotu said:

- I can only imagine how you're supposed to play the various weird controllery/dominatory builds with their incredibly diverse powersets.

And that's why I'm hesitant to copy other people's builds.

I don't think we can emphasise this enough. People tend to post highly optimised builds. Builds that are highly optimised for one thing are quite likely to be unsuitable for general content. This is clearly true with farm builds but a lot of other builds I've seen are just as odd.

 

I looked at a few builds for my brute and discovered that it was harder to find out what was wrong with them than it was to just do my own build. Now I just use other peoples' for inspiration. e.g. hey look, you can have high def on a blaster, or perma hasten is possible but rarely worth it etc

 

IMO If you pick the powers that you fancy then your build is good to go. Slapping just about any set on the powers you use most often will give 90% of the benefit from sets. Mini-maxing set bonuses gives you toon a little extra zing but if you team a lot it won't be noticeable and even solo it usually just means turning the difficulty up a notch.

 

If you want an optimised build but find it all a bit overwhelming then you can create a build with the powers you want, pick some reasonable looking sets and then ask the folks in the correct archetype forum to tune it for you. Be sure to tell them what's important to you. e.g. "I usually team and I like to exemp mid-level content."

[Coyote]

5 hours ago, Gremlin said:

IMO If you pick the powers that you fancy then your build is good to go. Slapping just about any set on the powers you use most often will give 90% of the benefit from sets. Mini-maxing set bonuses gives you toon a little extra zing but if you team a lot it won't be noticeable and even solo it usually just means turning the difficulty up a notch.

 

Excellent summary.

Making characters with basic sets of IOs is quite fine as long as you get the powers that interest you.

The highly tuned "perfect combination of set bonuses" is just the extra tweaks that take up 90% of the build time for the last 10-20% of the character's effectiveness... not the kind of tuning to worry too much about as a new character. For starters, make the right characters, use the right powers, and leave the most complicated aspect (IO sets) for the future.