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cohRock

Is mission bugged, or did they dumb it down?

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The second mission from Talos contact Andrea Mitchell is "Defeat Lead Cultist, His Coven" (banished pantheon).  The mission briefing tells you explicitly that you will need a team with at least 2 players.  There are 2 chests, in different rooms, that have to be clicked simultaneously.

 

Or at least, that was the design, and how it was on Live.  But when I just did the mission, a single person needed to click one chest, and that part of mission was complete.  I can understand if a few bugs have crept in, but I really don't like it if that mission was intentionally dumbed-down to be soloable.  We did this on the Torchbearer server, and there are plenty of players around with whom to form a team.

 

If it's a bug, I hope the staff will eventually fix it.  With unpaid volunteers, I can't really complain.  We have a LOT that works.  🙂


-- Rock

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I don't think it's bugged.

 

The Penelope Yin TF's last mission says all four computers need to be activated at the same time.  They don't actually. One character can activate all four computers.

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When this game was in testing, player numbers were too low to allow some of those missions to persist, giving rise to the decision to remove Simultaneous Clicks across the board entirely.

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"Science. Science, my friend, requires radical gambles and adventures in malpractice sometimes. Take solace in the fact that I tested the majority of these things on the dead, the re-dead, and the nearly departed before I went to live trials.

 

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I believe that any mission that used to require simultaneous clicks has been changed so that you can now solo it.  But they have not changed the mission text.


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Thank you for this thread. I've got a couple of missions on hold on my main soloer because of the simultaneous click requirement in the mission text. Now I'll go ahead and complete them.

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3 hours ago, Piecemeal said:

When this game was in testing, player numbers were too low to allow some of those missions to persist, giving rise to the decision to remove Simultaneous Clicks across the board entirely.

Thank you for the official reply.  I guess I get it, especially since you also made Task Forces soloable.  At some point if you decide the population numbers warrant it and developer time is available, please consider undoing this simplification for normal missions, and making it an option on TFs.  I like a design where occasionally some different mechanic has to be addressed.

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-- Rock

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57 minutes ago, cohRock said:

Thank you for the official reply.  I guess I get it, especially since you also made Task Forces soloable.  At some point if you decide the population numbers warrant it and developer time is available, please consider undoing this simplification for normal missions, and making it an option on TFs.  I like a design where occasionally some different mechanic has to be addressed.

I mean... I get the sentiment, but when reverting this change is tantamount to rescinding support for solo'ers... it's not cool.

 

I'd love more mechanics in missions as well! But not if me having access to more mechanics actively penalizes players who don't play the way I do. That goes directly against the spirit of what I like about this game.

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54 minutes ago, Crater Kate said:

I mean... I get the sentiment, but when reverting this change is tantamount to rescinding support for solo'ers... it's not cool.

 

I'd love more mechanics in missions as well! But not if me having access to more mechanics actively penalizes players who don't play the way I do. That goes directly against the spirit of what I like about this game.

Strongly agree with this. I'd really dislike seeing a return to the hard teammate requirements. Wouldn't mind mechanics that are really difficult to pull off solo, but simply making them outright impossible just seems unnecessary.

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As the duly recognized supervillain on the team, be careful what you wish for when it comes to out-of-the-box mechanics to increase challenge and subvert expectations. 😄 😄

 

But as a regular player as well, I'm open to your feedback.

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"Science. Science, my friend, requires radical gambles and adventures in malpractice sometimes. Take solace in the fact that I tested the majority of these things on the dead, the re-dead, and the nearly departed before I went to live trials.

 

Honestly, most of my "specimens" were several iterations past being considered a human being with their original fingerprints, teeth, or IDs. So it was rather a lot like experimenting on moaning clay putty."

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Forced teaming for regular mission content (Which is exactly what those multi-click missions were-) was a poor idea from the start. Seeing it kicked to the curb was a Good Thing in this mostly-soloist's opinion. I'd lobby hard against the return of mechanics of that sort. 

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Instead of removing the solo ability, perhaps there could be an extra reward for doing it simultaneously.

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11 hours ago, cohRock said:

Thank you for the official reply.  I guess I get it, especially since you also made Task Forces soloable.  At some point if you decide the population numbers warrant it and developer time is available, please consider undoing this simplification for normal missions, and making it an option on TFs.  I like a design where occasionally some different mechanic has to be addressed.

 

10 hours ago, Crater Kate said:

I mean... I get the sentiment, but when reverting this change is tantamount to rescinding support for solo'ers... it's not cool.

 

I'd love more mechanics in missions as well! But not if me having access to more mechanics actively penalizes players who don't play the way I do. That goes directly against the spirit of what I like about this game.

 

1 hour ago, Coyotedancer said:

Forced teaming for regular mission content (Which is exactly what those multi-click missions were-) was a poor idea from the start. Seeing it kicked to the curb was a Good Thing in this mostly-soloist's opinion. I'd lobby hard against the return of mechanics of that sort. 

I agree that the simultaneous clicky missions should not be re-instated.

It was a pain for me on live.

Wasn't as bad when I could auto-complete a mission that forced me to bring a teammate.

Otherwise, I tended to abandon those missions (and sometimes story arcs) when they interfered with my soloing.

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Perhaps, @Piecemeal can figure out if there's anything in the game that can flag a mission as In a group vs Not in a Group -- allowing single click when solo, and multi-click when in a group. 

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57 minutes ago, Bionic_Flea said:

You can multi-click . . . it's just not required.

Exactly. There's nothing stopping you from doing it the "old fashioned" way if you really want to... It's just not a requirement anymore. 

 

Heck, if you really like the idea, you could do it on ANY mission with number-in-your-team-or-less glowies. I could see that being a fun way to end a 'glowie hunt' mission. CLear the map, send everyone to their glowie, count it down and *cue music* Mission Complete! XD 

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It would be nice if there were two ways to complete those missions. The multi-person way done "this" way, or the slightly more troublesome single person way done "that" way.

 

Something like you can deactivate the missile from launching by simultaneously turning the keys on the launch control, OR you can fight down to the launch pad and take out the ignition control device. I know that doesn't do anything for existing missions, but it could allow different play style mechanics in the same mission -- I have no idea if the missions have multiple options for how to complete them. The closest I can think of is the 3 options in at the end of Burden of the Past arc, but even then once you chose the path, that's the way to accomplish it and only one way to succeed -- as far as I know.

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On 8/28/2020 at 12:33 AM, cohRock said:

Thank you for the official reply.  I guess I get it, especially since you also made Task Forces soloable.  At some point if you decide the population numbers warrant it and developer time is available, please consider undoing this simplification for normal missions, and making it an option on TFs.  I like a design where occasionally some different mechanic has to be addressed.

I am ...what's the word...well, maybe dismayed. This doing away with simul-clicks was a step in the right direction. There's nothing difficult or challenging about it, other than requiring a teammate - which can often be more difficult for some people than others. Sure, anyone can recruit, or ask for help on the lfg. But there's a number of us who can't always be fair to teammates, due to having to go afk with no notice, and be gone for a moment, or two hours or more.

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On 8/28/2020 at 6:47 AM, Piecemeal said:

As the duly recognized supervillain on the team, be careful what you wish for when it comes to out-of-the-box mechanics to increase challenge and subvert expectations. 😄 😄

 

But as a regular player as well, I'm open to your feedback.

 

I have a dim recollection of saying, "Okay everyone, get ready to click in 3..2..1.."

 

...though I have to admit that I forgot this requirement had been removed. 

 

I agree not a good idea to reintroduce. However, I can see three workable solutions:

 

A) For mission text, append "Note: The simultaneous click mechanic is no longer required."

 

B) Add an option to Null the Gull, whereby players can opt to set "Simultaneous mission click" = ON, which would apply when that player is the team lead (i.e., has the star). I suppose that passing the star to someone that has this OFF is fine, as a workaround for unforeseen issues.

 

C) Do (A), but if everyone does the simultaneous click without messing up the timing, they get a "Timing is everything" badge. Just give everyone on the team the badge, except for someone that clicks early (i.e., they were trying to screw things up, and/or were unable to follow instructions), who instead gets the "Early clicker" badge (or maybe that should be "Early clicker gets the worm" badge).

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19 hours ago, Ukase said:

I am ...what's the word...well, maybe dismayed. This doing away with simul-clicks was a step in the right direction. There's nothing difficult or challenging about it, other than requiring a teammate - which can often be more difficult for some people than others. Sure, anyone can recruit, or ask for help on the lfg. But there's a number of us who can't always be fair to teammates, due to having to go afk with no notice, and be gone for a moment, or two hours or more.

I'm not going to fight the issue.  Based on feedback here, I appear to be in a minority.  I do think you are incorrect in saying "There's nothing difficult or challenging about it", though.  Many a player died as they went to the second clicky. Yes this could be avoided if tam clears what it can first, but not all teams would do that.  You make a good point about players with special circumstances.


-- Rock

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26 minutes ago, cohRock said:

Many a player died as they went to the second clicky.

Just a note, you could activate the clicky while dead, if you were close enough.

 

Er, happened to a friend.

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Disclaimer: Not a medical doctor. Do not take medical advice from Doctor Ditko. Also, not a physicist. Do not take advice on consensus reality from Doctor Ditko.

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