Goldside Content and Primal/Praetoria crossover

[Panthonca7034]

This is a followup to my point on

Post-First Ward/Night Ward (level 32-39, then Level 40-49)

Problem 1: Once Lamashtu and Serene are out of the Picture to normality DOES NOT Praetoria return, this is at level 32 and over, and your focus is turned elsewhere (be it Rogue Isles if you decide to pursue the Patrons, or Paragon City) leaving you with nothing else to focus on or work on afterwards (and nothing to fill in the void between the events here and the eventual Underground trial later).

Proposition 1: There are Primal Earth contacts which currently have no equivalents in Praetoria, thus I was proposing some form of storyarc chains dealing with the Hamidon's onslaught developing in First Ward (a chain of events eventually leading to the underground incarnate trial) using the Praetorian counterparts of said Primal Earth contacts for these, and the appearance of Praetoria's devouring earth breaking through the sonic fences as things continue deteriorating between Cole's empire and Hamidon's patience. There is also a chance to link certain events here with ones in The Hollows. I have several ideas for the development of said goldside arcs  for implementation later on in development just as the recent "Second Chances" and the Vigilante/Rogue arcs that came out last year and later. Who would I need to talk to in order to help develop these?

Primal Earth Spies/Helpers in Praetoria? (level 7-20)

I'm well aware that it is possible to do most Praetorian Arcs from Ouroboros and that in itself could grant some badges. But WHAT IF?: There were some Primal Earth contacts present already in Praetoria (on the Heroic side) looking to do the right thing? This could be from stopping the emperor from making the mistake of invading Primal Earth while avoiding disrupting the current order of things and coming to a mutual understanding (Heroes pleading with the Loyalists to reconsider), Or: Try to convince Calvin Scott into reigning in the Crusader nutcases among his faction and find other ways of underminding Cole (Heroes trying to find ways to break Tyrant's hold on Praetoria without any single casualties whatsoever), Or: Feigning loyalty to Emperor Cole and helping Arachnos and other Villain groups sabotage the Empire in order to facilitate Lord Recluse's dominance in Praetoria (Rogues/Villains infiltrating the empire and taking over), Or: Use the Resistance as a means to help Arachnos or yourself gain the upper hand  in order to take arms against Cole (Rogues), Or: Help the Resistance bring down Cole by any means, because it's for the greater good (Vigilantes).

 

Primal Presence in Praetoria could help to further delve into either The Carnival of Light, and flesh out all the differences between dimensions.

 

Edited November 5, 2020 by Panthonca7034
Adding explanation for followup in another thread

[Darmian]

Interesting.  What about those of us who play Praetorians then?

[Panthonca7034]

6 minutes ago, Darmian said:

Interesting.  What about those of us who play Praetorians then?

Praetorian Incursions into Primal Earth (use Ricochet or some other loony Resistance to pay a visit to a like-level zone in Paragon City of your choice, or help Maelstrom conduct recon for the Empire on the side of the Loyalists) to find ways to convince the primals to help, similar to how the Shining Stars/Hearts of Darkness mechanic works, just as an example.

Edited October 29, 2020 by Panthonca7034
Adding further expansion on the topic

[Darmian]

Of course these would all be instanced missions in the same way that Mayhem/Safeguards are, because we simply cannot cross over without "naturalizing" as Primal characters. And as soon as we do we lose every access to contacts and arcs that we had Gold side.

 

Or possibly more like the Portal Corps missions?

Edited October 29, 2020 by Darmian

[Panthonca7034]

18 hours ago, Darmian said:

Of course these would all be instanced missions in the same way that Mayhem/Safeguards are, because we simply cannot cross over without "naturalizing" as Primal characters. And as soon as we do we lose every access to contacts and arcs that we had Gold side.

 

Yes, if you're between levels 7 - 20 they would have to be safe-guarded the same way as they were in Galaxy City when you help Twinshot against the clockwork as well as with the meteors, then when you fight the clockwork in Manticore's mansion and discover Twinshot's background in Ultimatum.

 

Obviously an incursion mission into Primal Earth would have to have the four split goldside alignments (Power Loyalist, Responsible Loyalist, Resistance Warden, Crusader Resistance Nutcase) and would have to include both Paragon City and The Rogue Isles.

 

18 hours ago, Darmian said:

Or possibly more like the Portal Corps missions?

 

More or less yes, in this case, for the Loyalists you would have the prototype Portal in Keyes Island, and Underground Neutropolis for the Resistance Portal from where you could launch these incursion missions.

[Darmian]

Well I'm liking this so far.  More Gold Content is good for me.

 

What about people like ME though?  Level 50 Goldsiders?

[Panthonca7034]

On 10/29/2020 at 5:36 PM, Darmian said:

Well I'm liking this so far.  More Gold Content is good for me.

 

What about people like ME though?  Level 50 Goldsiders?

Level 50 stuff is going to be tricky namely because it will require building new game components (assets) New maps, and new zones. One concept that I would like to see is missions focusing on rebuilding ALL of Praetorian Earth, and looking for survivors, and other-dimensional interlopers seeking to gain from the events of Hamidon's rampage, something which will require development.

 

Another tricky thing would be the concept of hybrid alignments for those from Praetoria, which will require more development and thought.

Edited November 1, 2020 by Panthonca7034
Additional points

[Darmian]

6 hours ago, Panthonca7034 said:

Level 50 stuff is going to be tricky namely because it will require building new game components (assets) New maps, and new zones. One concept that I would like to see is missions focusing on rebuilding ALL of Praetorian Earth, and looking for survivors, and other-dimensional interlopers seeking to gain from the events of Hamidon's rampage, something which will require development.

 

Another tricky thing would be the concept of hybrid alignments for those from Praetoria, which will require more development and thought.

Possibly Praetorians get the option of going down, and this is simplistically thinking on the hoof, the route of Vigilante/Rogue BEFORE having to make a Hero/Villain choice?

 

And the fact that there is an entire area (I know it's just an instanced map but even so) of Praetoria that no actual Praetorian can ever get to, Last Bastion, bugs me.

Edited November 2, 2020 by Darmian

[Panthonca7034]

On 11/1/2020 at 12:59 PM, Darmian said:

Possibly Praetorians get the option of going down, and this is simplistically thinking on the hoof, the route of Vigilante/Rogue BEFORE having to make a Hero/Villain choice?

 

That actually makes sense, as I'm sure there is a lesser unhinged (more frustrated) faction of resistance crusaders and potential unhinged loyalists as well, so I'd be down with that.

 

On 11/1/2020 at 12:59 PM, Darmian said:

And the fact that there is an entire area (I know it's just an instanced map but even so) of Praetoria that no actual Praetorian can ever get to, Last Bastion, bugs me.

 

That's a part that would require a major overhaul and also to turn Nova, Imperial, and Neutropolis into Echo zones or simply have updated destroyed city models for level 50's.

[CaptainLupis]

I've said it before, but for me the biggest issue gold side has is teaming, or more precisely lack thereof, at low levels. If you could team with anyone from redside/blueside I think it would make the zones a lot more popular and potentially make your ideas for new zones/arcs for later levels there more likely if people are actually playing there. 

 

I know it could create continuity issues with how primals are opperating there at those times and the like, but frankly I think it needs the poulation boost regardless.

 

Sorry I don't have any direct input to your ideas, although I would be happy with new gold side content and filling out the story/characters there. 

[MTeague]

On 10/28/2020 at 11:32 PM, Darmian said:

Of course these would all be instanced missions in the same way that Mayhem/Safeguards are, because we simply cannot cross over without "naturalizing" as Primal characters.

This right there is something I wish could be changed. 

I'm not really holding out any hope. I suspect changing that to remember you were a Praetorian Warden who has become a Primal Hero and still show BOTH alignment icons would be.... non-trivial.

But man oh man I wish it would remember these things.

 

And yes, I do say "Warden" and not "Resistance".  Not all resistance are heroic, and not all loyalists are villains.  I really wish it could capture which of the four you are at the end of the praetoria 1-20, even if it only does so by "you used the mission from Provost Marchand to go to primal earth, so that's Loyalist, but you chose to go to the Rogue Isles, so we're going to say you were POWER, whereas if you had gone to Paragon City we'd tag you as RESPONSIBILITY".

 

Another thing to add to my Endless Wish List Bucket.

[Panthonca7034]

There was ACTUALLY a Praetorian PvP zone that was never implemented (possibly got scrapped at the last minute) which could readily be integrated with the right maps and hazard zones built and put into place. Here's a snapshot from Paragon Chat:

 

 

Its likely that it would require some code tweaks, since it wasn't completed and it can only be accessed via Paragon Chat, I tried to get an image of the map, but its not available sadly 😞

 

But the unfinished stuff is there, just needs some form of implementation

 

Edited November 6, 2020 by Panthonca7034
Highlight and corrections

[Darmian]

It does just look like a regular Praetorian tech corridor though 🙂

 

But how much other stuff is just in the code?  I mean Kallisti Wharf wasn't live so outside of the AE we never see those nice offices, plus in the Arena there is the half built stadium from KW as another option, again never live.

 

What else is there?

[Panthonca7034]

Some more things to add to this thread given the renewed interest in goldside.

 

Primal Earth:

 

The Hollows Oranbega/Wincott/Troll/Igneous Connection.

 

When you go to the hollows you meet up with PPD Lieuteant Wincott, and you try to make forays against the Outcasts and other gangs until you ultimately come up to the Infamous Golappo (Minions of Igneous) and rescue Sam Wincott from the Cavern of Transcendence.

 

 

 

Praetorian Earth:

 

Imperial City Oranbega/Wincott/Destroyer/Devouring Earth/Syndicate Connection.

 

In Imperial City you meet with a gruff, tough, merciless but noble-minded Veteran of the Hamidon Wars, a former Imperial Defense Commander now turned Praetorian Police Commander, who traded his IDF uniform for a PPD one to serve Praetoria and vowed to wipe out both the Syndicate, Destroyers and The Devouring Earth so that Imperial City doesn't suffer the same fate that First Ward did (but sadly might either way).

 

On the edge of Imperial, you meet a young Resistance Commando, he had a disagreement with his dad over how to save Praetoria or how to make life better for the people. Despite his differing view, he too desires to save Praetoria from calamity, and seeking advice from the Carnival of Light.

 

 

This concept now seems appropriate:

 

 

The Cavern of transcendence should become a focus point later on in the late levels of the game (Around 36-50)

 

  

On 11/6/2020 at 4:44 PM, Darmian said:

What else is there?

 Paragon Chat and Senticon hold the answers to those questions

 

 

Edited November 17, 2020 by Panthonca7034
redundant text

[Darmian]

I'm doing a complete cut & paste from a post I made in the PEATs discussion, but I think it worth doing.  Here it is:

 

At the very least ... a possibility of the Refugee Praetorians eventually being dealt with (no, Marchand's New Praetorians do NOT count), with the option of Praetorians gaining perhaps a Praetorian Refugee badge perhaps at level 40+ if they haven't done the Rift Enclosure mission (locking them out of doing that mission even via Ouro, necessary I think, you can't have both!) (Though the Refugee badge SHOULD be an alternate to complete the Tempered Through Fire accolade instead of Escapist)  and being able to cross to Primal earth then without losing their distinct identity.

 

I'm going to emphasize this next bit!

 

Either that or Dark Watcher (who they do meet in Praetoria), gives them access to the same missions that Number Six has except entering via the Night Ward portals. 

 

It is a bugbear playing a solid gold toon when there is an entire section of missions dedicated to your place of origin that you can't access at all without becoming a Primal character. So plant Dark Watcher somewhere in Praetoria (could even be Nova, he's a time and dimension traveler after all, the same way that other high level contacts hang around in low level areas, like James Harvan in Atlas) and he'll speak to you when you're the right level and give you the exact same missions that Number Six does.  The exact same ones but you just enter via Night Ward.

 

Or hell, it COULD be Number Six talking to you via the Static! Again just enter via Night Ward or in Six's case the map for the Rift Enclosure mission could be used back to back, whereby you are simply shortcutting local space from one portal in Neutropolis to another in Last Bastion and so on, rather than crossing an alternate dimension.