Is it possible to knockdown AVs or at least large mobs like War Walkers?

[KaizenSoze]

First, I always want to credit my inspirations.

 

 

Now, to the topic. I looked through Mids to find the max possible knockback powers.

 

The two most obvious candidates are:

Force Field: Force bolt. Max KB is ~51

Energy Blast: Nova, Max KB is 57

 

Has anyone tried to max these or other powers I might have missed? Do they work on very knockback resistant mobs, like AVs or large mobs, War Walkers for instance?

[roleki]

Not going to say it's impossible, but usually when they give something -KB protection in the game, it's a crazy number, like -10000% or something like that.  

[oedipus_tex]

Just glanced though the War Walker files. They appear to have Mag 50 protection to knock up, knockback and Repel, but no resistance I can spot right away.

 

To overcome that you'd need to also deal with the Purple Patch. So if they're +3 to you at the end game, you'd need 50 = Val x 0.65, or Mag a little over 76 knockback to overcome them. Should be a lot more doable versus a low level War Walker. 

 

I didn't check to see if they have additional sources of knock resistance, which could render this moot.

 

FWIW it's only just now because I'm looking at these files that I realize War Walkers have a self heal. It's on a 30 Recharge. So overcoming their mezz may actually have some value. I confess since I usually encounter them while playing an Elec Dominator I haven't noticed them use the heal, since I guess I was always robbing them of being able to cast it... it costs 19 endurance so they can't use it while drained. So there's something I didn't know about the usefulness of one of my toons.

[KaizenSoze]

4 hours ago, oedipus_tex said:

Just glanced though the War Walker files. They appear to have Mag 50 protection to knock up, knockback and Repel, but no resistance I can spot right away.

 

To overcome that you'd need to also deal with the Purple Patch. So if they're +3 to you at the end game, you'd need 50 = Val x 0.65, or Mag a little over 76 knockback to overcome them. Should be a lot more doable versus a low level War Walker. 

 

I didn't check to see if they have additional sources of knock resistance, which could render this moot.

 

FWIW it's only just now because I'm looking at these files that I realize War Walkers have a self heal. It's on a 30 Recharge. So overcoming their mezz may actually have some value. I confess since I usually encounter them while playing an Elec Dominator I haven't noticed them use the heal, since I guess I was always robbing them of being able to cast it... it costs 19 endurance so they can't use it while drained. So there's something I didn't know about the usefulness of one of my toons.

Since, a maxed out force bolt probably won't knockdown an AV or kd resistant mob w/o help. I went looking for help.

 

There are two powers that debuff knockback resistance:

Poison: Weaken -37% 16 sec recharge

Cold Domination: -75% 120 recharge

 

I will have to see if combined with a kb maxed Power Push will work. Not sure how the debuff is applied to the kb value.

 

*evil mastermind laugh*

[oedipus_tex]

I think -Knockback Resist would be subject to Purple Patch first, then act on the raw KB protection. -KB resist would resist KB resist, but the bots didn't have any I could see. Keep in mind I just looked at the public DEF files, didnt actually look at them with an Analyzer, so there could be a nasty surprise in there.

 

 

I reserve the right to be wrong in my calcs below, quick math while dressing to go out tonight. 😄

 

 

 

Poison:

Against a +3, -37% becomes .37 * .65 = -24%.  

 

1 - .24 = 0.76, War Walker should have 38 KB protection remaining.

 

38 = Val x 0.65 = You need about 58 KB to knock the target back.

 

 

Cold:

Against a +3, -75% becomes .75 * .65 = -48%.  

 

1 - .48 = 0.52; War Walker should have 26 KB protection remaining.

 

26 = Val x 0.65, You need about 40 KB to knock the target back.

 

[KaizenSoze]

1 hour ago, oedipus_tex said:

I think -Knockback Resist would be subject to Purple Patch first, then act on the raw KB protection. -KB resist would resist KB resist, but the bots didn't have any I could see. Keep in mind I just looked at the public DEF files, didnt actually look at them with an Analyzer, so there could be a nasty surprise in there.

 

 

I reserve the right to be wrong in my calcs below, quick math while dressing to go out tonight. 😄

 

 

 

Poison:

Against a +3, -37% becomes .37 * .65 = -24%.  

 

1 - .24 = 0.76, War Walker should have 38 KB protection remaining.

 

38 = Val x 0.65 = You need about 58 KB to knock the target back.

 

 

Cold:

Against a +3, -75% becomes .75 * .65 = -48%.  

 

1 - .48 = 0.52; War Walker should have 26 KB protection remaining.

 

26 = Val x 0.65, You need about 40 KB to knock the target back.

 

 

  Now, we are talking. Energy Blaster: Power push, 45 KB maxed out.

 

 *evil laughter intensifies*

 

Paging Mad King! @Sir Myshkin  

 

I will come up with build for these two defenders:

Cold Domination/Energy Blast

Poison/Energy Blast

Edited July 10, 2021 by KaizenSoze

[KaizenSoze]

Sigh. Alas, this doesn't look like it's good to work well enough to be worth it.

 

Too many mobs have very high KD resists. Mino in the ITF have 100 mag KD protection. 😞

[Vanden]

I don't think the War Walker skeleton even has a knocked down animation.

[KaizenSoze]

7 minutes ago, Vanden said:

I don't think the War Walker skeleton even has a knocked down animation.

It's probable like BP Ravagers. They just turn the model 90 degree. Then it pops back up.

 

I could knockback Ravagers, which I do not think was expected by the animators.