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What's Your Opinion on Edgelords/Edgier Characters?


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"Edgelord"? Wow...hate these labels. Don't take offense, it doesn't mean people are wrong, it is simply my opinion. Once you put a label on a toon, then you are simply playing other people's concepts. None of my characters are precisely this or that, they are like people. Their moods change, their ideas can change, and their personalities grow. I feel like when people label their toons, they force the rp. Adults do not force themselves like that. Really good people can do really bad things, really bad people can be heroic at times, it is all situational. This may well be the reason I am finding rp characters to be more teenagery than adult. "Edgy" people in rl, to me, always just come off as fake. As if they are trying to be something, instead of just being. 
The best thing to do is decide what motivates and what drives the character. Don't label them. Let others label them, and you may find different people have different labels for the same toon.  
Just my opinion, as I said, and I do think it is a good discussion, even where we do not agree. I like seeing how people think on rp. Thanks for the thread! 🙂

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On 10/27/2021 at 1:25 AM, Optimum_Man said:

People think Elric is edgy? Man I always thought he was like a tragic figure but I never thought of him as edgy. Now his WoW copycat Arthas? Edgelord all the way.

 

I've never read the Elric stuff, only encountered him through copy-cats.  They were all much worse than Arthas, and my opinion of his story isn't very high.  If the source isn't edgy then it's just more evidence that it is all about presentation.

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Having read pretty much the entire lot, I'd say El is more of an angst-puppy than anything..,

 

That aside, I'm still trying to figure out exactly what being an edgelord character actually entails. Honestly? It sounds like a term that's fallen into the same category as the typical use of "Mary Sue". That is to say, short-hand for darn near any character that the reviewer doesn't like, doesn't approve or really wishes would be written out of a particular story in favor of something they like more.  

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On 10/30/2021 at 12:15 PM, Coyotedancer said:

Having read pretty much the entire lot, I'd say El is more of an angst-puppy than anything..,

 

That aside, I'm still trying to figure out exactly what being an edgelord character actually entails. Honestly? It sounds like a term that's fallen into the same category as the typical use of "Mary Sue". That is to say, short-hand for darn near any character that the reviewer doesn't like, doesn't approve or really wishes would be written out of a particular story in favor of something they like more.  


Both terms signify poor to non existent character development. Like the God Mode character archetype, all three are simply a matter of poor storytelling. While they may be overpowered like the other two, and Edgelord may also engage in acts that are morally dubious or even evil, but aren’t characterized as a villain. And unlike Villains who had a clear path from normal person to Villain, Edgelords were probably always intended to either be Heroes or antiheros. Think bad boy 9000. The key is in the details and depends on how they’re written. How did the character go to this point? Were they always like this? What are their weaknesses? Do they have any? Some characters that are most certainly Edgelords  just work because they’re well written and have had time to develop as characters. Spawn is an example of that.

Edited by Optimum_Man
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Pretty much what @Optimum_Man says in an RP context.

 

I first heard the term applied in Warframe in reference to a frame that was primarily black with red highlights, causing it to be evocative of a 90's anti-hero outfit.  Usually that was accompanied with talk of the use of a meta-build and weapons.  It wasn't necessarily a bad thing, but did have some slight negative connotations until we could see them in action.  But then my group also wasn't all that concerned if you even attempted to shoot the enemies, it was just a way to prepare ourselves to need to do a carry.

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If all it takes to be an Edgelord is a black and red color scheme and some capacity for stabbiness, every one of my Thorn Wielders instantly qualifies. And that's before we even get to the "Yeah. Technically dead, body-snatching ghosts"-bit. 😝

 

And that's really where my skepticism about the term comes in. The 'Edgelord Checklist' always seems to include details that are so general and so common to characters both good AND bad that they could apply to darn near anyone. I mean, is Kai an Edgelord character? She's an orphan, a Death Mage's apprentice and she nearly got sacrificed to a demon when she was four. (I'd call her more of a Nerd Girl, myself, BUT... by some of the definitions in play? Yep. She'd get pegged as Edgy. Even if she isn't prone to wearing black or talking about the gory details of soul magic and the howling oblivion of the Void in anything but very academic terms.)  

 

I just don't see a lot of use for a term that's potentially THAT broad...

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10 hours ago, Siouxsie said:

Pretty much what @Optimum_Man says in an RP context.

 

I first heard the term applied in Warframe in reference to a frame that was primarily black with red highlights, causing it to be evocative of a 90's anti-hero outfit.  Usually that was accompanied with talk of the use of a meta-build and weapons.  It wasn't necessarily a bad thing, but did have some slight negative connotations until we could see them in action.  But then my group also wasn't all that concerned if you even attempted to shoot the enemies, it was just a way to prepare ourselves to need to do a carry.


I mean outside the use of those particular colors idk if that would qualify. Since most Edgelords need that character development (or lack thereof) to qualify.

 

8 hours ago, Coyotedancer said:

If all it takes to be an Edgelord is a black and red color scheme and some capacity for stabbiness, every one of my Thorn Wielders instantly qualifies. And that's before we even get to the "Yeah. Technically dead, body-snatching ghosts"-bit. 😝

 

And that's really where my skepticism about the term comes in. The 'Edgelord Checklist' always seems to include details that are so general and so common to characters both good AND bad that they could apply to darn near anyone. I mean, is Kai an Edgelord character? She's an orphan, a Death Mage's apprentice and she nearly got sacrificed to a demon when she was four. (I'd call her more of a Nerd Girl, myself, BUT... by some of the definitions in play? Yep. She'd get pegged as Edgy. Even if she isn't prone to wearing black or talking about the gory details of soul magic and the howling oblivion of the Void in anything but very academic terms.)  

 

I just don't see a lot of use for a term that's potentially THAT broad...

 

I mean it’s not a technical term really, but idk if @Siouxsie example really applies in this particular case.

 

In reference to your character, I’d say probably probably not either. I’d say a perfect example is Shadow the Hedgehog from the Sonic series. Standard black and red design, fires guns for some reason, no character development and only sort of a villain but not really.

You pay to play, having fun is ok, kill Skuls or kill Crey, hunt at night or in the day, black or white or shades of gray, play it your way, we have no say.

 

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I think it's because there is no widely-agreed upon term as we've seen from this thread.  Personally I've only ever heard it really used in a context of a quick snap judgement prior to actually meeting, interacting, and getting to know someone.  (Note my own avatar totally qualifies, and saying this costume is an homage to her patron Ghost Widow doesn't help her case!)  It's an initial impression that is probably totally off the mark, especially, for roleplayers.

 

If that snap-judgement is all that there is to a character though, then perhaps it's fitting.

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On 10/30/2021 at 11:04 PM, Optimum_Man said:


Both terms signify poor to non existent character development. Like the God Mode character archetype, all three are simply a matter of poor storytelling. While they may be overpowered like the other two, and Edgelord may also engage in acts that are morally dubious or even evil, but aren’t characterized as a villain. And unlike Villains who had a clear path from normal person to Villain, Edgelords were probably always intended to either be Heroes or antiheros. Think bad boy 9000. The key is in the details and depends on how they’re written. How did the character go to this point? Were they always like this? What are their weaknesses? Do they have any? Some characters that are most certainly Edgelords  just work because they’re well written and have had time to develop as characters. Spawn is an example of that.

 

Agree with this.

 

This "edgelord" thing is just a subset of the larger group of shallow, or poorly designed characters.

 

Since RPrs are amatuers, character mistakes are more common to an extent than in published stories.

 

But they aren't hard to find in those either.

Edited by Haijinx
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On 10/31/2021 at 1:31 PM, Coyotedancer said:

If all it takes to be an Edgelord is a black and red color scheme and some capacity for stabbiness, every one of my Thorn Wielders instantly qualifies. And that's before we even get to the "Yeah. Technically dead, body-snatching ghosts"-bit. 😝

 

And that's really where my skepticism about the term comes in. The 'Edgelord Checklist' always seems to include details that are so general and so common to characters both good AND bad that they could apply to darn near anyone. I mean, is Kai an Edgelord character? She's an orphan, a Death Mage's apprentice and she nearly got sacrificed to a demon when she was four. (I'd call her more of a Nerd Girl, myself, BUT... by some of the definitions in play? Yep. She'd get pegged as Edgy. Even if she isn't prone to wearing black or talking about the gory details of soul magic and the howling oblivion of the Void in anything but very academic terms.)  

 

I just don't see a lot of use for a term that's potentially THAT broad...

 

"Edgelord" and "Mary-Sue" are practically identical in this regard.  If you just go down a trait checklist or litmus test, pretty much every character worth writing about registers as one or the other.

 

Unironically using either term to describe a character is usually a pretty good indicator that the person talking lacks any sort of argument and just wants to denigrate the target.

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  • 2 weeks later

My rule of thumb with any person's back story is that it has to make sense within the canon of the video game. Edgy, holy, goth, genre of the style does not matter so long as their character's back story makes sense as to why they are there in the game to begin with. 

 

This is primarily why I can't take characters who are Celestial tier seriously. 

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  • 2 weeks later
On 11/11/2021 at 1:22 PM, stegosaurus said:

My rule of thumb with any person's back story is that it has to make sense within the canon of the video game. Edgy, holy, goth, genre of the style does not matter so long as their character's back story makes sense as to why they are there in the game to begin with. 

 

This is primarily why I can't take characters who are Celestial tier seriously. 

I don't play any of those, but there's an in-game villain who was 'akin to to the angels' in his bio or however it was phrased, and there's angels and gods all over the game just willy nilly.

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Just a guess, but I suspect Steg was thinking of "celestial" more in Marvel-style power-level terms than spiritual ones... That is to say, not so much people playing angels or Classical-style divinities on the Osiris and Hera scale, but people trying to play Infinity and Eternity.

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One of the best things about COH/V is that you can create pretty much any type of character and get away with it. I think it's why this game always had and always will have a very dedicated Roleplaying community because creativity is allowed to flourish much more here than almost every other MMOG. Any attempt to quell that creativity into a more narrow scope should be argued against, the lore of this game offers such a broad scope that anyone (in my opinion) debating to narrow said scope wants the world to fit into a dogmatic view of how they perceive Heroes, Villains and inbetween. I still love lore and characters should fit into the constrains of the games universe, but there are practically unlimited ways any character can fit into the lore of the game.

I'd consider characters like The Punisher, The Comedian, even Wolverine to be pretty edgy. But they're still entertaining just like a Roleplayers take, you can be edgy and still create a character that's fun to play and collab with. I think problems occur when 'edgy' characters make their outlooks lack depth and reason, exploring these branches of character backstory, motivation and goals is how you flesh out an idea and make them a lot more interesting no matter how edgy and grimdark they are.

 

Edited by Latex
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4 hours ago, Coyotedancer said:

Just a guess, but I suspect Steg was thinking of "celestial" more in Marvel-style power-level terms than spiritual ones... That is to say, not so much people playing angels or Classical-style divinities on the Osiris and Hera scale, but people trying to play Infinity and Eternity.

ohhh. I failed that communication roll totally.

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2 hours ago, wjrasmussen said:

Elric, great choice.

The whole Multiversal tapestry drew me in. How everything is interconnected in one way or another. Even the Doctor Who novel Moorcock wrote a few years back (Coming of the Terraphiles) might as well have been a Second Ether novel with guest stars Doctor Eleven and Amy Pond. A good example of this is the Albino Trilogy (Dreamthief's Daughter, Skrayling Tree, White Wolf's Son) and how is crosses over with the Second Ether Trilogy (Blood, Fabulous Harbours, The War Amongst The Angels) and then with the help of Walt Simonson, ties the two trilogies with two Graphich Novels: Michael Moorcock's Multiverse and I think... Making of a Sorceror - the latter of which details Elric's 1000 year dream where he lived on Earth as Monsieur Zenith. 

 

You can't really exclude the other incarnations of the Eternal Champion. Corum, Hawkmoon, Erekose, Jerry Cornelius. They all have their tragic aspects, and bring this back on topic, those tragic aspects are what makes them "Edgy", even though Moorcock's take on fantasy was often inverting or deconstructing tropes. But then of course, the deconstructions get replicated without any sense of irony... The recurring theme does seem to be an extreme set of circumstances forcing the person to act, usually manipulated by either Chaos or Law. So basically, the protagonists are pawns, and Elric is the Ultimate Pawn, being played by both Arioch and of course his own Black Blade, Stormbringer. 

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I suppose that depends on what you mean by 'edgelord'. Personally I enjoy edge. It isn't for everyone but it is for me. As such, I tend to play an 'edgy' character; an assassin employed by Arachnos who is into all that supervillain stuff so long as there is a profit to be made. Does everyone like this? Presumably not. Is it something I enjoy? Yes. So I suppose my opinion would be that edge is like anything else; done right it's fun, done poorly it isn't.

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