Dark Dark Epic Not too sure. Help please fine toon for best effect!!

[Voltak]

3 minutes ago, oedipus_tex said:

 

 

Something I hope we can agree on is that what makes City of Heroes such an interesting game is that we can have these sorts of debates about best in slotting.

 

Your build is great. It's particularly optimized for the synergy between Dark Control and Dark Assault and that's fantastic.

 

In general, on most builds? That ATO proc probably needs to go in a 6 slot configuration in a control power to take advantage of +5 Ranged defense. I wish the ATOs were designed like other archetypes and fit into attack powers cleanly, but we're left with what we're given here. 

 

Keep in mind doing this doesn't mean you aren't getting the +Damage proc. It means you are getting the proc from the AoE control power you're spamming anyway. Against large groups you're guaranteed to trigger the proc, and depending on the power you put it in, can stack it. It's a different mindset than putting it in a single target melee attack for sure. But it's part of the same general principal that the proc should go into a power that you're likely to cycle. If that's an upclose melee attack and you can justify losing the set bonuses to obtain that, that's great. I'm not as energized about that for non-Dark/Dark builds.

 

Of course you wouldn't want the ATO proc in an AoE power if you're focusing on AVs or pylons. If that's your focus MG makes a lot more sense, assuming you can withstand melee range with the enemy (that may be a whole other topic).

I have a build in which that ATO set goes into Dark Grasp

Still the +dmg proc triggers enough so I can consistently have it at 3 stacks if I am spamming the hold. You can verify this yourself in the videos. 

The ST hold is something I use regularly  wether fighting groups or a single target. 
Even then MG is still carrying procs if the ATO set is in DG. I am still using MG in the cycle when I am close enough to use it. 

 

[oedipus_tex]

5 minutes ago, Voltak said:

I have a build in which that ATO set goes into Dark Grasp

Still the +dmg proc triggers enough so I can consistently have it at 3 stacks if I am spamming the hold. You can verify this yourself in the videos. 

The ST hold is something I use regularly  wether fighting groups or a single target. 
Even then MG is still carrying procs if the ATO set is in DG. I am still using MG in the cycle when I am close enough to use it. 

 

 

 

Yeah there's an argument for ST holds too. Especially for Fire or Mind Control, with those super fast animating holds.

 

Lately on Dark I've been leaning toward Fearsome Stare just because I tend to spam that power so much in AoE situations. With 40 recharge, 16 targets it's got major capability to build stacks. That does mean losing some -ToHit in Fearsome if you 6 slot it, but that's a trade I'm okay with. Other times I'm more traditional and prefer it in Heart of Darkness just because the ATO is so much better than the purple Stun set.

[Voltak]

You can get faster stacks in quicker recharge powers like DG , or MG. 

[oedipus_tex]

2 minutes ago, Voltak said:

You can get faster stacks in quicker recharge powers like DG , or MG. 

 

 

You can get faster stacks with those powers if you are cycling those powers, yes. I think that's the asterisk that needs to be placed on the ATO. It's a bonus you get only if you use the power it's in.

 

I will always be opening on a pack with an AoE control and usually spamming it again when its back up. Part of this comes down to playstyle and the kinds of situations you find yourself in. On my Electric/Psi for example the ATO set is in Static Field, and that power is spammed, resulting in steady 40% bonus at all times, even out of combat if necessary. 

 

I may value capped Ranged defense more than some other players. Against a pylon or stationary enemy its a net DPA loss. However if it means I can safely race to the next group of enemies and make what I was fighting chase me while disregarding their attacks, its a net gain.   

[Voltak]

18 hours ago, oedipus_tex said:

 

 

You can get faster stacks with those powers if you are cycling those powers, yes. I think that's the asterisk that needs to be placed on the ATO. It's a bonus you get only if you use the power it's in.

 

I will always be opening on a pack with an AoE control and usually spamming it again when its back up. Part of this comes down to playstyle and the kinds of situations you find yourself in. On my Electric/Psi for example the ATO set is in Static Field, and that power is spammed, resulting in steady 40% bonus at all times, even out of combat if necessary. 

 

I may value capped Ranged defense more than some other players. Against a pylon or stationary enemy its a net DPA loss. However if it means I can safely race to the next group of enemies and make what I was fighting chase me while disregarding their attacks, its a net gain.   

It's good and it can't hurt to throw a hold if any enemies around.  IT's a proc, it's behaving like a proc. 

Opening a crowd with an AoE is fine. That does not mean you cannot find an opportunity to engage the bosses or harder targets in the groups with MG. 

My defenses on my Dominator are all Range defenses, on all 3 of my builds. 

I have nothing but gains.  

I hope by now you understand I dont have a build that is ST focused.  

It's just that my builds (besides the Pylon test one)  is very good for whatever, groups or ST.  

So, my builds can do extremely difficult things (groups or AVs)  using MG and my builds do them well. 

Therefore it makes zero sense for me to recommend to anyone to skip MG after seeing what I can do with it.