Behold! A Thwackin' Cometh! (Inv/WM, Because Screw Your End Bar That's Why)

[Aurora_Girl]

Lo, I have become a Convert of the Crunchy, an Apostle of the Aggro Magnet, a Knowledge...r...of Knockup!

 

I love this character, I love tanking, I love the costume and the name and everything about her, so I want to 100% love her build. I've run it past a few SG mates as well as the Discord, but wanted to cover all the bases here and see if there are any tweaks or input on the following:

 

1. Gaussian's proc in Build Up or Invincibility? If the latter, where's the slot coming from?

2. Keep Build Up? Obviously I love it for AoE alphas, but could there be a better power pick (Hover, maybe? Unstop to use as a mule for one of the Res uniques, thus freeing up the slot for the Gaussian's proc in Invincibility?)
3. Damage procs in Shatter, too much?
4. Anybody have experience with the Chance for BU in ranged attacks? Doesn't seem that it'll go off often enough to bridge the gaps between BU firing.

Build Caveats:

 

1. Fly's a must, and I've had hover-based melee toons before but didn't think it worked with the WM animations.

2. Mu Mastery is also a must, for concept.

 

Pull no punches, I'm open to ideas!

 

 

Dawnsong - Tanker (Invulnerability).mxd

Edited December 6, 2021 by Aurora_Girl
Adding Pics

[PLVRIZR]

Gaussian proc in Invincibility, for sure.  Goes off, constantly.  Inv has Dull Pain, so you're over-slotted in Health (my opinion) and Stamina.  No real need for tiny (by comparison) chance-to-heal procs.

 

No Whirling Mace?  Gotta have an AOE!  Speaking of, I moved the ATOs around and slotted most of the winter sets, so your damage isn't as high (or procc-ey), but your Def is outstanding.

 

Finally, you're a tank, so if people are dying around you, you're not doing your job ;-), so Vengeance is counter-intuitive.  I'd drop leadership for the Fighting pool (Kick/Boxing, Tough and Weave) and your choice of another Epic/Mu power.

 

I fiddled and rebuilt (actually blew it up a bit) and came up with this:

 

https://www.midsreborn.com/builds/download.php?uc=1386&c=687&a=1374&f=HEX&dc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

 

Numbers are with no buffs, 1 mob for Invinc, no ATOs, procs, Incarnates or specials.

 

 

These numbers are with 10 mobs for Invinc, one stack of MoT, all procs, Resilient Alpha and Melee Hybrid incarnates (at T4):

 

 

 

Again, you give up damage output for durability...but that's the way I roll.  YMMV.

 

Edited December 6, 2021 by PLVRIZR
fiddled in Mid's

[Luminara]

You're tanking now?

 

 

[Major_Decoy]

On 12/6/2021 at 9:38 AM, PLVRIZR said:

Gaussian proc in Invincibility, for sure.  Goes off, constantly.  Inv has Dull Pain, so you're over-slotted in Health (my opinion) and Stamina.  No real need for tiny (by comparison) chance-to-heal procs.

 

No Whirling Mace?  Gotta have an AOE!  Speaking of, I moved the ATOs around and slotted most of the winter sets, so your damage isn't as high (or procc-ey), but your Def is outstanding.

 

Finally, you're a tank, so if people are dying around you, you're not doing your job ;-), so Vengeance is counter-intuitive.  I'd drop leadership for the Fighting pool (Kick/Boxing, Tough and Weave) and your choice of another Epic/Mu power.

 

I fiddled and rebuilt (actually blew it up a bit) and came up with this:

 

https://www.midsreborn.com/builds/download.php?uc=1386&c=687&a=1374&f=HEX&dc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

 

Again, you give up damage output for durability...but that's the way I roll.  YMMV.

 

What I dislike most about this build is that it obviously uses Force Feedback proc to keep perma-hasten, but sticks it in Kick, which is otherwise entirely unslotted? At least putting it in Jawbreaker allows you to slot  Force Feedback and an accuracy? I mean, you lose 8% regeneration, but there are so many other places that could have gotten that extra slot to get more than 8% regeneration. It also means kicking and putting away the War Mace all the time. Sure, there's the No Redraw option, but there are other places for that proc.

 

You underestimate the value of both Power Transfer and Panacea. (Panacea's 3PPM of 7.5% Max Endurance (22.5% Recovery equivalent) according to Bopper so it out performs Numina's Convalescence on both health recovery and endurance recovery)

 

 

[PLVRIZR]

9 hours ago, Major_Decoy said:

What I dislike most about this build is that it obviously uses Force Feedback proc to keep perma-hasten, but sticks it in Kick, which is otherwise entirely unslotted? At least putting it in Jawbreaker allows you to slot  Force Feedback and an accuracy? I mean, you lose 8% regeneration, but there are so many other places that could have gotten that extra slot to get more than 8% regeneration. It also means kicking and putting away the War Mace all the time. Sure, there's the No Redraw option, but there are other places for that proc.

 

You underestimate the value of both Power Transfer and Panacea. (Panacea's 3PPM of 7.5% Max Endurance (22.5% Recovery equivalent) according to Bopper so it out performs Numina's Convalescence on both health recovery and endurance recovery)

 

 

Great points, all, and one of the reasons discussions like this are helpful for everyone, especially when it's not an "apples to apples" build comparison...because it brings even further perspective, into view.

 

Honestly, all my tanks take Fighting (even though the top-end Inv ones don't even run the Tough toggle...it's just a mule), and rather than leave Kick un-enhanced, that's where the FF goes.  I'm not chasing perma-Hasten, by any means, and Kick rarely is in my attack rotation, unless I situationally need the chance for a +recharge.

 

I would consider myself a "Min/Maxxer", but only as it relates to survivability, on tanks.  I have some RP caveats, however, especially as it relates to the +chance to heal procs.  Personally, I can't stand the green +numbers, hovering over my tanks.  Squishies and Brutes, fine, but not my meat shields.  "we don't need no stinkin' 50 HP every now and then"... IMHO, if you need that to save your arse, you've got bigger problems with the situation (or your build)...

 

I'll liken it to my real life:  In 2002, I finally was at a point in my professional life, that I could afford ordering a new car and paying MRSP.  I traded my 1998 Ford SVT Mustang Cobra (Bright Atlantic Blue, bought pre-owned in 2000), for a 2003 Ford SVT Mustang Cobra...Ford code named - the "Terminator" (Sonic Blue, supercharged 4.6 DOHC, six speed, IRS), which I ordered from the factory.  At the time, the Bassani or Borla X-pipe and straight through mufflers were making the most horsepower, on the dyno, but I stuck with the factory H-pipe and Flowmaster chambered mufflers, because I wanted the musclecar rumble, not the NASCAR scream.  While I gave up ~15-20 RWHP, I enjoyed every minute of my time behind the wheel, because it sounded like I wanted (and it still put down 400+ RWHP and ran a 12.5 @ 115, with a rookie [me] behind the wheel)....same reason I forgo the Panacea and other +chance for HP procs.  ***as an aside, my Cobra drowned, two weeks short of its 14th birthday in Baton Rouge, during the "Great Flood" of August 2016, with 51K original miles on the ODO.  A total loss.  I don't enjoy the time "behind the wheel" of my tanks, with green numbers hovering over me.  But that's just me.  If it works for anyone else, I shall not judge.

[Major_Decoy]

For your own builds it makes total sense to make decisions on how you like to play. You don't like the floating green numbers. That's fine, but if you're making recommendations and saying "you give up damage output for durability" but you choose to slot a Numina's Convalescence over Panacea, then you're giving bad advice, because Panacea provides more health  per minute and more endurance per minute. It may not be to your taste, but Panacea is the better choice.

Edited December 24, 2021 by Major_Decoy

[PLVRIZR]

16 hours ago, Major_Decoy said:

That's fine, but if you're making recommendations and saying "you give up damage output for durability" but you choose to slot a Numina's Convalescence over Panacea, then you're giving bad advice, because Panacea provides more health  per minute and more endurance per minute. It may not be to your taste, but Panacea is the better choice.

 

Don't know that I've ever been accused of giving "bad advice", when putting a Num's unique in a build (but I guess there's a first time for everything)...also, never said one was better than the other, if you'll re-read my post, I never mentioned either, just included it in a build example.

 

You make a valid point, but missed the mark by being overly critical.  As I also said, it's great that we have the ability to post cross-build examples and ideas.  Everyone must make their own choice in how they execute...and with unslotters being (fairly/comparatively) inexpensive, we can try and try again.

 

Merry Christmas!