Kinetic Melee: which secondary?

[Arcadian-Prime]

I have a concept in mind that involves Kinetic Melee. I know, I know... Many don't care for it and say it is lower damage. I just know the animations.

 

Anyways, I'm hoping to take a secondary that can shore up some of it's weaknesses. These are the ones I have in mind:

 

Ice Armor: Chilling Embrace has -dmg, which stacks nicely with KM. Icy Bastion is an awesome T9 and I can rotate between that and Shadow Meld.

 

Shield: Just seems very sturdy. AAO can boost damage, and shield charge is cool.

 

Rad Armor: Brings two AOE's, and Meltdown is a good T9 with an extra damage boost on Scrappers.

 

Dark Armor: Dark seems to have a lot of tools, and is usually pretty strong when kitted out.

 

Would love to hear anyone's thoughts.

[Nemu]

If you want to try something weird and wonderful. Look no further!

 

 

[SomeGuy]

2 hours ago, Arcadian-Prime said:

Many say it is lower damage.

 

 

Many are wrong.  I've done km/fa, km/sd, and currently have a km/bio. The set can be tricky to learn how to get the most out of it, that's a truth, but it definitely can do good damage.

 

/rad armor pairs well with most anything, and it has the best T9 in the game. And don't dismiss EA. That set is straight up GOOD. It's easily top tier. I honestly feel that EA is sturdier than SD (*feel* is the key word). You're Ice Armor idea(I have zero experience with it) sounds like a good one, really. Slap -rchg and -dmg on a thing.

 

KM is a cool set if you like the animations and sound.  The final AV in Aeon is KM for a reason.

[StriderIV]

1 minute ago, SomeGuy said:

 

Many are wrong.  I've done km/fa, km/sd, and currently have a km/bio. The set can be tricky to learn how to get the most out of it, that's a truth, but it definitely can do good damage.

 

/rad armor pairs well with most anything, and it has the best T9 in the game. And don't dismiss EA. That set is straight up GOOD. It's easily top tier. I honestly feel that EA is sturdier than SD (*feel* is the key word). You're Ice Armor idea(I have zero experience with it) sounds like a good one, really. Slap -rchg and -dmg on a thing.

 

KM is a cool set if you like the animations and sound.  The final AV in Aeon is KM for a reason.

Listen to this guy, he’s a legend.

[Arcadian-Prime]

2 minutes ago, SomeGuy said:

 

Many are wrong.  I've done km/fa, km/sd, and currently have a km/bio. The set can be tricky to learn how to get the most out of it, that's a truth, but it definitely can do good damage.

 

/rad armor pairs well with most anything, and it has the best T9 in the game. And don't dismiss EA. That set is straight up GOOD. It's easily top tier. I honestly feel that EA is sturdier than SD (*feel* is the key word). You're Ice Armor idea(I have zero experience with it) sounds like a good one, really. Slap -rchg and -dmg on a thing.

 

KM is a cool set if you like the animations and sound.  The final AV in Aeon is KM for a reason.

This was nice to hear, thanks Someguy. How do you feel KM performs on a Scrapper compared to a Stalker or Tanker?

 

Apparently Stalkers get that 100% crit on Burst from hide, which is nice. My thoughts are the Scrapper ATO's might pull them ahead.

[SomeGuy]

I haven't tried it on Stalks or Tankers. I can't have an opinion on that one. In terms or ST? I would have to only guess the Stalker version pulls ahead? Maybe even AOE due to crit from hide with Burst? Something to keep in mind though, Stalkers have a REALLY low HP cap and base. You will feel the difference in survivability even compared to a scrapper. Tankers are just nuts at laughing off incoming damage.

 

You do have to make KM work though, you really need to maximize those Power Siphon stacks.

[lemming]

I have a KM/EA Brute that does well even with just generic IOs.  A scrapper should do great

[StriderIV]

2 hours ago, SomeGuy said:

I haven't tried it on Stalks or Tankers. I can't have an opinion on that one. In terms or ST? I would have to only guess the Stalker version pulls ahead? Maybe even AOE due to crit from hide with Burst? Something to keep in mind though, Stalkers have a REALLY low HP cap and base. You will feel the difference in survivability even compared to a scrapper. Tankers are just nuts at laughing off incoming damage.

 

You do have to make KM work though, you really need to maximize those Power Siphon stacks.

I know OP asked about the T9. I’m curious myself. SUPER long animation time, but I think (on Scrappers and Stalkers) if gives an additional chance to crit? Is it something you take?

[SomeGuy]

39 minutes ago, StriderIV said:

I know OP asked about the T9. I’m curious myself. SUPER long animation time, but I think (on Scrappers and Stalkers) if gives an additional chance to crit? Is it something you take?

 

https://cod.uberguy.net/html/power.html?power=scrapper_defense.radiation_armor.meltdown&at=scrapper

 

https://cod.uberguy.net/html/power.html?power=stalker_defense.radiation_armor.meltdown&at=stalker

 

Basically, the scrapper version gives a tap over 41% DMG (stalker version does 33%) while active (60s), gives 15% resistance to all (enhanceable if you want), and the "crash" is easily worked around. The crash lasts 10s and doesn't let you recover end during that time. But you can pop all the blues you want. Oh, and during meltdown, your recovery is boosted 30%. And on a decent build with recharge, it isn't crazy to have it up fairly often. One minute active and a little over a minute down.

 

So basically, you do more damage and your harder to kill. And the "crash" is easily worked around.

 

It doesn't boost chance to crit though.

 

It's a MUST-HAVE power for me when I do Rad Armor. Lots of T9s are skippable, but Meltdown sure isn't to me.

Edited March 31, 2022 by SomeGuy

[Koopak]

Just keep in mind concentrate strike is not affected by the scrapper atos

[StriderIV]

7 hours ago, SomeGuy said:

 

https://cod.uberguy.net/html/power.html?power=scrapper_defense.radiation_armor.meltdown&at=scrapper

 

https://cod.uberguy.net/html/power.html?power=stalker_defense.radiation_armor.meltdown&at=stalker

 

Basically, the scrapper version gives a tap over 41% DMG (stalker version does 33%) while active (60s), gives 15% resistance to all (enhanceable if you want), and the "crash" is easily worked around. The crash lasts 10s and doesn't let you recover end during that time. But you can pop all the blues you want. Oh, and during meltdown, your recovery is boosted 30%. And on a decent build with recharge, it isn't crazy to have it up fairly often. One minute active and a little over a minute down.

 

So basically, you do more damage and your harder to kill. And the "crash" is easily worked around.

 

It doesn't boost chance to crit though.

 

It's a MUST-HAVE power for me when I do Rad Armor. Lots of T9s are skippable, but Meltdown sure isn't to me.

MB man, I meant the T9 for KM, Concentrated Strike. Meltdown is definitely the bees knees haha

[SomeGuy]

1 hour ago, Koopak said:

Just keep in mind concentrate strike is not affected by the scrapper atos

 

Not sure what you meant by this, but ATO2 is absolutely triggered if you put it in CS. Were you saying it isn't affected by the increased crit chance?

[SomeGuy]

1 hour ago, StriderIV said:

MB man, I meant the T9 for KM, Concentrated Strike. Meltdown is definitely the bees knees haha

OHHHHH

 

Yeah, you definitely take CS. It doesn't increase crit chance and doesn't "crit" (like Energy Transfer). What it does have is a chance to instantly refresh power siphon.

 

I slap the ATO2 in it and call it a day. The ATO there goes off fairly regular. And you can get a lot of crits in right after.

Edited March 31, 2022 by SomeGuy

[Arcadian-Prime]

8 hours ago, StriderIV said:

I know OP asked about the T9. I’m curious myself. SUPER long animation time, but I think (on Scrappers and Stalkers) if gives an additional chance to crit? Is it something you take?

This.

[Arcadian-Prime]

1 hour ago, Koopak said:

Just keep in mind concentrate strike is not affected by the scrapper atos

Do you take the KM T9? What powers do you slot the KM ATO's in?

[Koopak]

7 hours ago, SomeGuy said:

 

Not sure what you meant by this, but ATO2 is absolutely triggered if you put it in CS. Were you saying it isn't affected by the increased crit chance?

 

Correct, it makes a decent place to slot Critical Strikes proc but it does not benefit from +crit

[StriderIV]

10 minutes ago, Koopak said:

 

Correct, it makes a decent place to slot Critical Strikes proc but it does not benefit from +crit

Gotcha. So you wouldn’t slot the whole set on there, just the crit strike proc?

[SomeGuy]

30 minutes ago, StriderIV said:

Gotcha. So you wouldn’t slot the whole set on there, just the crit strike proc?

 

It all depends on my goals for the build, really. The set for ATO2 is really good all the way through, but even then a lot of time I personally only slot the proc in a power. So, all comes down to goals.

[Koopak]

4 hours ago, StriderIV said:

Gotcha. So you wouldn’t slot the whole set on there, just the crit strike proc?

I trend toward not using the full set, usually just the proc and maybe the other 5 pieces elsewhere because the recharge will mess up the proc rate, at 4ppm you wanna keep above 15 seconds recharge before global recharge. That said I also favor putting it in a proc optimized AoE as often you can get close to the proc rate of a single target power while having the increase proc chance caused by it checking for each target hit. Ultimately this trades boss performance for better performance in all other situations though.

[SomeGuy]

Every bonus in that set is good, but the 4pc 5% AOE def is really awesome for positional defense. Iv'e come to love that a lot for Shield Defense.

[WindDemon21]

Just beware, that Concentrated Strike DOES NOT benefit from the ATO proc/global. It's really bad. On top of not getting crits in general, you can't even use it to reliably recharge power siphon with the ATOs. So either skip it, or put the proc IN it, but that is still REALLY bad given how long its animation is. It needs fixed asap. why I have stopped two kin melee scrappers so far on homecoming alone.

[WindDemon21]

The long animation with the crit proc in it too, also really ruins using it for the aoe's as well during gaussians, and it's slow cast means you're forfeiting 2 extrra stacks of power siphon boosts.

[WindDemon21]

Ideally your best best is still to put it in focused burst and skip CS entirely besides it being a set mule/proc bomb on scrappers.