Intangible powers

[The_Warpact]

I know Dimensional Shift from Gravity Control is one such power. But, what other ones are out there that do the same or sorta the same thing?

Coming up with an idea for a toon in which that power is centric to their build with everything else being support for that power or personal protection ie tough/weave, PP, etc.

 

 

[Outrider_01]

Dark Miasma and dark Affinity

[capricorpse]

The Gravity one is the best IMO, because it's now a toggle you can control.  Anyone who enters the phase field will be phased and able to affect the phased enemies, anyone outside isn't and can't.

 

The Stealth pool also has a Phase Shift ability which is handy in a pinch, lets you run through enemies and they can't affect you.

 

If you went Gravity, you could get Force Field?  Personal FF is essentially a phase, you can't affect anyone and they can't affect you.  And later that set has a single-target phase power, though it is on a timer and not a toggle.  

[oedipus_tex]

Personal Force Field is an interesting power. It sets you to Only Affect Self, but doesn't actually make you Intangible. It actually works very similarly to the power Rest. You can't attack, but enemies can attack you. PFF happens to include very high Defense and Resist buffs, but enemies can still hit you through it.

 

Something kinda interesting about PFF by the way is that if you happen to get hit with a -Resist power and go into PFF and it pushes your Resists to 100% or higher, you ignore those resist debuffs entirely. That's true of any situation where you hit 100% Resist, just especially likely to happen with PFF since it provides around +40% Resist on a Defender, so just PFF + Tough + APP armor is likely to trigger that for Slash and Lethal resist. Probably not a situation people encounter too often, but interesting anyway. I used to think this power was not very good at end game since on most archetypes that get their resist cuts off at 75%, but it turns out resistance to resistable resistance debuffs has no cut off.

 

The Force Field power Detention Field applies the Untouchable, Only Effect Self, and Immobilized effects. Untouchable and OnlyEffectSelf are technically mezzes, so Mag 5.96 will IIRC mezz a normal Boss but not an Elite Boss. 

 

 

 

 

Dark Miasma has a power that is superficially similar, but it uses the actual Intangible effect, Mag 3.

 

 

 

FYI Black Hole is one of the most universally hated and skipped powers in the game. Gravity's Dimension Shift used to be a clone of this power but was updated in a revamp of Gravity Control late in the live game's history. I still wouldn't describe Dimension Shift as great, but at least it is better than Black Hole. Come to think of it I can't even think of the last time I saw someone cast Black Hole, which is probably a good thing. If ever there was a power built to annoy and frustrate team mates, this is the one.

 

Edited April 11, 2022 by oedipus_tex

[arcane]

You can go /Dark, /FF, or /Sonic if you really want to go all in on intangibility, but one other super niche build you could try is Grav/Traps. 
 

I will start laying Caltrops/Poison Trap/Acid Mortar and 3-4 Trip Mines and then drop my Dimension Shift field and wormhole a mob right into all of it. It’s immensely satisfying solo, but pretty poor on teams because of set up times. But, solo? Watching a controller instantaneously blow up a whole mob *including even the bosses (lv 53 tho 😞 )* is pretty dope.

 

As for the Dimension Shift, it can pulse a couple more damage procs, protect your operation from other stray mobs so you don’t overaggro, and it looks super cool 🙂 

 

Mine is Mako for the extra pet and Water Spout. Max chaos.

Edited April 11, 2022 by arcane

[Naraka]

Is Hibernate also a phase self power?

[arcane]

8 minutes ago, Naraka said:

Is Hibernate also a phase self power?

Yes. In fact the nophase timer may very well have been added because Ice Tanks with Phase Shift couldn’t really be killed once upon a time in my childhood.

[The_Warpact]

2 hours ago, oedipus_tex said:

 

FYI Black Hole is one of the most universally hated and skipped powers in the game. Come to think of it I can't even think of the last time I saw someone cast Black Hole, which is probably a good thing. If ever there was a power built to annoy and frustrate team mates, this is the one.

 

Oh boy thats a 57 on the 1 to 10 scale of shit powers, you just take that power to grief or revenge fvck a team.

 

1 hour ago, arcane said:

You can go /Dark, /FF, or /Sonic if you really want to go all in on intangibility, but one other super niche build you could try is Grav/Traps. 
 

I will start laying Caltrops/Poison Trap/Acid Mortar and 3-4 Trip Mines and then drop my Dimension Shift field and wormhole a mob right into all of it. It’s immensely satisfying solo, but pretty poor on teams because of set up times. But, solo? Watching a controller instantaneously blow up a whole mob *including even the bosses (lv 53 tho 😞 )* is pretty dope.

 

As for the Dimension Shift, it can pulse a couple more damage procs, protect your operation from other stray mobs so you don’t overaggro, and it looks super cool 🙂 

 

Mine is Mako for the extra pet and Water Spout. Max chaos.

I was thinking DS on my location then Wormhole to me or Fold Space, then batter with my secondary. Was thinking of Grav/Rad Dom, Rad smacks like a semi and having everyone woozy inside DS then pounding on them sounds sorta fun. If I can fit PFF in I will as a "oh shittles" in case things get spicy in my little love dimension. I'd go Mako but my Grav/Storm is already going that route as the Kaos King.

[oedipus_tex]

Something to be aware of is DS is an oddball of a power, it's a toggle power that has a duration of 20 seconds. Meaning you can only create the intangible aura for 20 seconds before it force drops.

 

That's the reason I don't take that power. 20 seconds just isn't long enough for me to make it meaningful. I usually find it easier to just run away. 

 

You can play with it of course if you still like it. Just giving the heads up on what to expect. It's definitely not full time access to a personal safety dimension. More like a toy that can briefly annoy enemies (and sometimes teammates). 

I hear it's not bad in PVP, tho. Maybe a PVPer can comment on that.

[arcane]

19 minutes ago, oedipus_tex said:

I hear it's not bad in PVP, tho. Maybe a PVPer can comment on that.

They recently nerfed the shit out if it in PvP iirc

[capricorpse]

as someone who plays a lot of Gravity Control, the best use I've ever gotten out of Dimension Shift is in fairly early game, casting it on the back half of a group or an accidental secondary aggro.  I often will only have this power so I can put the Frostfire mission at a super high difficulty, use it on the far half of the first few groups as we engage, and then respec out of it later.  I like setting FF to +3x8 or +4 if the team is tight, so the first hallway can be rough haha

 

The helpful part of DS imo is the auto-hit immobilize.  It's really just expensive, niche aggro portioning. 

[The_Warpact]

7 minutes ago, arcane said:

They recently nerfed the shit out if it in PvP iirc

Big surprise or where is my eye roll emoji...

 

27 minutes ago, oedipus_tex said:

Something to be aware of is DS is an oddball of a power, it's a toggle power that has a duration of 20 seconds. Meaning you can only create the intangible aura for 20 seconds before it force drops.

 

That's the reason I don't take that power. 20 seconds just isn't long enough for me to make it meaningful. I usually find it easier to just run away. 

 

You can play with it of course if you still like it. Just giving the heads up on what to expect. It's definitely not full time access to a personal safety dimension. More like a toy that can briefly annoy enemies (and sometimes teammates). 

I hear it's not bad in PVP, tho. Maybe a PVPer can comment on that.

20 sec wow thats shit-tastic...at least in DS you can attack the baddies, the other powers mentioned you can't correct?

 

I guess I can Wormhole/Fold Space to me then DS, wham, bam, spank you ma'am.

 

Any idea why there's a 20 sec timer on a toggle? Why not a toggle and let it go. I can't think of the reasoning on that one.

[oedipus_tex]

21 minutes ago, The_Warpact said:

20 sec wow thats shit-tastic...at least in DS you can attack the baddies, the other powers mentioned you can't correct?

 

I guess I can Wormhole/Fold Space to me then DS, wham, bam, spank you ma'am.

 

Any idea why there's a 20 sec timer on a toggle? Why not a toggle and let it go. I can't think of the reasoning on that one.

 

 

Dimension Shift will shift everyone inside it, friend or foe, or you, if you're inside. Everyone inside it can affect each other, everyone outside it cannot. 

 

Teams generally do not benefit from not being able to affect each other. Nothing outside a Dimension Shift affects anything inside, so this can cause heals, long cooldowns, all kinds of other buffs, as well as nukes and big debuffs to unexpectedly miss. Most people do not appreciate this at all.

 

I assume it's got a 20 second timer so players can't just hide inside it forever. I don't know how long it would have to last for me to consider it for a power pick. At least a full minute or two seems a lot more reasonable. 20 seconds is just long enough in most cases to completely screw things up.

 

I've experimented with this power a dozen different ways to see if I could make something of it. For example, I tried a Grav/Storm strategy where I summon a DS and drop Tornadoes inside while I stand outside. Doesn't work though. 

 

I do think "true" pets like the Singularity can do damage inside DS while you stand outside it, but how often do you want a pet fighting enemies without you there to help them? And for just 20 seconds. It might be a viable strategy for a particularly strong Lore pet, but I am not so sure.

 

If you really need a power like this you're almost always better served with a pool or APP power like Hibernate or Phase Shift. 

[The_Warpact]

3 minutes ago, oedipus_tex said:

 

 

Dimension Shift will shift everyone inside it, friend or foe, or you, if you're inside. Everyone inside it can affect each other, everyone outside it cannot. 

 

Teams generally do not benefit from not being able to affect each other. Nothing outside a Dimension Shift affects anything inside, so this can cause heals, long cooldowns, all kinds of other buffs, as well as nukes and big debuffs to unexpectedly miss. Most people do not appreciate this at all.

 

I assume it's got a 20 second timer so players can't just hide inside it forever. I don't know how long it would have to last for me to consider it for a power pick. At least a full minute or two seems a lot more reasonable. 20 seconds is just long enough in most cases to completely screw things up.

 

I've experimented with this power a dozen different ways to see if I could make something of it. For example, I tried a Grav/Storm strategy where I summon a DS and drop Tornadoes inside while I stand outside. Doesn't work though. 

 

I do think "true" pets like the Singularity can do damage inside DS while you stand outside it, but how often do you want a pet fighting enemies without you there to help them? And for just 20 seconds. It might be a viable strategy for a particularly strong Lore pet, but I am not so sure.

 

If you really need a power like this you're almost always better served with a pool or APP power like Hibernate or Phase Shift. 

Well like I said I want it as part of the chain to set the kill zone. Wormhole to my location, DS, then Rad melee to decimate the mob.

Doable? Who knows. 

[oedipus_tex]

9 minutes ago, The_Warpact said:

Well like I said I want it as part of the chain to set the kill zone. Wormhole to my location, DS, then Rad melee to decimate the mob.

Doable? Who knows. 

 

 

I can see that potentially working, maybe. Stuff that doesn't get Wormholed tends to chase you down a few seconds after you injure their buddies (Wormhole itself won't do it). So you might be able to dodge a couple of ranged attacks if you drop it underfoot immediately after a WH. 

[arcane]

23 minutes ago, The_Warpact said:

Well like I said I want it as part of the chain to set the kill zone. Wormhole to my location, DS, then Rad melee to decimate the mob.

Doable? Who knows. 

You’ll just have to either (1) cast WH then DS or (2) if you cast DS first, cast WH into DS but while standing outside DS. It’s certainly doable because I do it 🙂
 

If you Fold Space, you’d probably need to cast that one first otherwise you’d have to fly directly over DS to drop them in DS but still be able to cast FS.

 

And yes, your pets will fight things in DS whether you’re in there or not. If it’s just a Singularity maybe that’s not worth a lot. Add Enflame, another pet, LocAoE stuff, etc., tho, and yes they will tear up everything in DS while you stand outside. Same principle as pets doing your dirty work while you’re in Phase Shift, but the other way around.

Edited April 11, 2022 by arcane

[Naraka]

1 hour ago, oedipus_tex said:

 

I assume it's got a 20 second timer so players can't just hide inside it forever. I don't know how long it would have to last for me to consider it for a power pick. At least a full minute or two seems a lot more reasonable. 20 seconds is just long enough in most cases to completely screw things up.

 

I've experimented with this power a dozen different ways to see if I could make something of it. For example, I tried a Grav/Storm strategy where I summon a DS and drop Tornadoes inside while I stand outside. Doesn't work though. 

 

 

I don't know what you guys are talking about. DS is a fun and versatile tool. If you're a player that wants to experiment and not worry about the same herd and burn strats all the time, there are other users for this power. Of course someone could say you can duplicate these effects in other ways but that's entirely fine. But not everyone wants to duplicate the same thing the same way all the time lol 

 

The simplest application is just as a pocket corner pull: aggroing another group and then sitting inside the first with your DS on is similar to a corner pull but with the stipulation that the 2nd spawn probably wasted their ranged volley in the process. Or do it in reverse and drop the DS between you and the mob and add they run toward you, they get caught in the net.

 

A flash-aggro tool that you can use around a corner in prep for an around the corner wormhole or just to prep for a team.

 

I think one of the major strengths of Gravity is in unconventional control. It's not meant to stand behind a tank or keep a lot of foes held but rather to move and position foes. My Grav/Energy Dom often doesn't even throw out a hold or keep his Singularity out, he's sneaking ahead, scoping out where spawns are and scooping them up to dump or draw them back to the team. 

 

But it's been a while. This was before they implemented Fold Space which I think should be on a much longer cool down.

[The_Warpact]

14 minutes ago, Naraka said:

 

I don't know what you guys are talking about. DS is a fun and versatile tool. If you're a player that wants to experiment and not worry about the same herd and burn strats all the time, there are other users for this power. Of course someone could say you can duplicate these effects in other ways but that's entirely fine. But not everyone wants to duplicate the same thing the same way all the time lol 

 

The simplest application is just as a pocket corner pull: aggroing another group and then sitting inside the first with your DS on is similar to a corner pull but with the stipulation that the 2nd spawn probably wasted their ranged volley in the process. Or do it in reverse and drop the DS between you and the mob and add they run toward you, they get caught in the net.

 

A flash-aggro tool that you can use around a corner in prep for an around the corner wormhole or just to prep for a team.

 

I think one of the major strengths of Gravity is in unconventional control. It's not meant to stand behind a tank or keep a lot of foes held but rather to move and position foes. My Grav/Energy Dom often doesn't even throw out a hold or keep his Singularity out, he's sneaking ahead, scoping out where spawns are and scooping them up to dump or draw them back to the team. 

 

But it's been a while. This was before they implemented Fold Space which I think should be on a much longer cool down.

There is alot of possibilities as far as I'm concerned about tactical advantages with Gravity.

The thing about Fold Space is it doesn't have the stun component, which to me is worth it on WH.

[arcane]

1 hour ago, The_Warpact said:

There is alot of possibilities as far as I'm concerned about tactical advantages with Gravity.

The thing about Fold Space is it doesn't have the stun component, which to me is worth it on WH.

I just took both Wormhole and Fold Space on my Grav/Storm/Mako 🙂 

[Snarky]

9 hours ago, The_Warpact said:

I know Dimensional Shift from Gravity Control is one such power. But, what other ones are out there that do the same or sorta the same thing?

Coming up with an idea for a toon in which that power is centric to their build with everything else being support for that power or personal protection ie tough/weave, PP, etc.

 

 

Phase Shift from the Concealment Pool is a "Only Self" power.  now i have not tested it but this may put you back in phase with anyone you shift.  Since you are building to that theme it is something to keep in mind.  It is normally used as an "oh crap" button to get out of trouble.  Maximum duration is 30 seconds

[The_Warpact]

1 minute ago, arcane said:

I just took both Wormhole and Fold Space on my Grav/Storm/Mako 🙂 

I can see using Fold Space and locking them down with some serious pain being dealt on the baddies.

If you roll with one attack chain (WH>DS>melee), then into the next (FS>CS>Melee) you could move with a steam rolling team. 

Might be fun.

[oedipus_tex]

A kinda nice thing about Fold Space with Gravity is you can go through Teleport Target to get there. TP Target can be used to position Singularity precisely. You actually can cast it in mid air and Singularity should stay pretty close to that height. 

 

A dirty Gravity trick I like to use is to put kb to kd in Singularity and Wormhole enemies directly on top of the guy, or just underneath him. If Wormhole is recharging and I just want to burst into the next group sometimes I'll just teleport Singy right into the middle of the pack, and let his reverse Repel recent everyone.

 

If you happen to be /Traps there are a few traps I think you can TP that way too, though I forget which ones. Should be any that can be killed. It's been a long time since I tried so I could be completely lying.

 

 

In any case yeah, it's totally worthwhile to take Fold Space and Wormhole. They both serve very different functions. Wormhole is used to move a pack of already gathered enemies from point A to B, still in a pack, OR to serve as a Stun in the style of Flashfire. Fold Space is more about gathering a chaotic group and recentering them. Fold Space can be used like Wormhole to position things if you're careful, but it's not ultra reliable when used that way, and of course it aggros, and has no Stun.

 

Edited April 12, 2022 by oedipus_tex

[The_Warpact]

46 minutes ago, oedipus_tex said:

A kinda nice thing about Fold Space with Gravity is you can go through Teleport Target to get there. TP Target can be used to position Singularity precisely. You actually can cast it in mid air and Singularity should stay pretty close to that height. 

 

A dirty Gravity trick I like to use is to put kb to kd in Singularity and Wormhole enemies directly on top of the guy, or just underneath him. If Wormhole is recharging and I just want to burst into the next group sometimes I'll just teleport Singy right into the middle of the pack, and let his reverse Repel recent everyone.

 

If you happen to be /Traps there are a few traps I think you can TP that way too, though I forget which ones. Should be any that can be killed. It's been a long time since I tried so I could be completely lying.

 

 

In any case yeah, it's totally worthwhile to take Fold Space and Wormhole. They both serve very different functions. Wormhole is used to move a pack of already gathered enemies from point A to B, still in a pack, OR to serve as a Stun in the style of Flashfire. Fold Space is more about gathering a chaotic group and recentering them. Fold Space can be used like Wormhole to position things if you're careful, but it's not ultra reliable when used that way, and of course it aggros, and has no Stun.

 

I have a Grav/Time and Grav/Storm, I use the first sorta like support and he was the team backup when my VG 1st beat Aeon SF.

My Grav/Storm of course you know about. 

I play them differently hence why I wanted to know about DS and what its capabilities and applications could be.

[JasperStone]

Peacebringers have Quantum Flight ... I think the endurance has been tweaked

You shift your quantum matrix and become more energy than matter. No longer bound by the laws of normal physics, you become intangible to other entities and can fly at high speeds. However, after 30 seconds the phase out effect will wear off. 30 seconds later, if this power is still active the user will become phased out once again. Quantum Flight offers greater flight speed and some stealth, but costs more endurance.

[arcane]

12 hours ago, oedipus_tex said:

A kinda nice thing about Fold Space with Gravity is you can go through Teleport Target to get there. TP Target can be used to position Singularity precisely. You actually can cast it in mid air and Singularity should stay pretty close to that height. 

 

Right. Both my Grav/Sonic and my Grav/Storm run both Teleport Target and Sorcery ever since Singularity was given the vacuum effect. It’s pretty glorious.

 

Since Wormhole and Fold Space don’t grab level 54 bosses, it’s the most consistent way to put the now-best-pet in the middle of the whole group. And between the toggles I put on him, his AoE knockdown and pull, and whatever other damage I cast, it’s remarkably quick at vaporizing mobs for controllers.

Edited April 12, 2022 by arcane