Omega-202 Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 (edited) @Troo, thanks for showing what can be done on a whim. To those saying its still absurd to suspect that someone was/is playing games with the yellow market and that this is just natural supply and demand, I ask again: why is this only happening with yellow salvage? The argument that yellow salvage is some sort of bottle neck or tipping point between supply and demand still rings hollow to me. The main reason I don't buy the "organic price shift" narrative is because of what the main demand driver is for yellow salvage: crafting and converting yellow recipes. If the salvage market dried up so quickly, why are the go-to yellow recipes for craft>rare>convert still super cheap with low bid volume? ESPECIALLY in view of yellow recipes being non-fungible (outside of level) and all yellow salvage being completely interchangeable. Recipe drop supply is way lower than yellow salvage supply, so where is all the yellow salvage going? And if someone (or a lot of someones) are mass crafting, then why is the price of desireable rares steady? The supply should be up and the price should be down. As a goof, Troo showed that a rich player (...or honestly most vet players) could absolutely screw up the market easily if so inclined, so why are so many ridiculing the idea that a more dedicated troll could mess with it for a laugh? EDIT: Not to mention converters also holding steady. Are we to assume that organic marketeers crafting and converting enough to dry up the yellow salvage market had no effect on the converter price? How could that be? Edited June 17, 2022 by Omega-202 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yomo Kimyata Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 (edited) 8 hours ago, Troo said: oopsie I just want everyone to know that part of Troo's joke is that they were overpaying by 25k to dip into the dev's 100k ceiling... There's still 9,999,900 to go before the devs offer another 10mm there! Edited June 17, 2022 by Yomo Kimyata I like editing 2 Who run Bartertown? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arcane Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 I bought like 8,000 converters a couple nights in an hour, and my bids on salvage or recipes are on 100-150 of any given item at a time. I see the prices swing as I’m mid-bidding-process all the time. It doesn’t take a scheme to move the market, just regular daily activity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omega-202 Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 8 minutes ago, arcane said: I bought like 8,000 converters a couple nights in an hour, and my bids on salvage or recipes are on 100-150 of any given item at a time. I see the prices swing as I’m mid-bidding-process all the time. It doesn’t take a scheme to move the market, just regular daily activity. But again, why was uncommon salvage the only price that shot up? Why didnt anything else skyrocket? Why is there such a high standing bid for uncommon salvage but nothing comparable on any of the other pieces needed for the "craft yellow recipe>convert rare" process? Nobody is arguing that standard market participation moves the needle. That's so obvious as to be pedantic to point out. You're missing the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omega-202 Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 14 minutes ago, Yomo Kimyata said: I just want everyone to know that part of Troo's joke is that they were overpaying by 25k to dip into the dev's 100k ceiling... There's still 9,999,900 to go before the devs offer another 10mm there! Even as a joke though, it shows that a single person can bottom out the whole standing market...and then some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troo Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 (edited) Update: this morning, after buying out all the player sales, 500 new sales posted Me selling hundreds now drives the price down but someone has propped the price up over 10k. Next, me trying to buy 10.. Likely the same person propping up the price from falling below 10k has those new sales posted over 25k. Confirmed, these were all priced the same. 25,050-ish note: I could have held or destroyed those 2500 yellows but i sold them back cheap. Edited June 17, 2022 by Troo 1 "Homecoming is not perfect but it is still better than the alternative.. at least so far" - Unknown (Wise words Unknown!) Si vis pacem, para bellum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troo Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 22 minutes ago, Yomo Kimyata said: overpaying by 25k to dip into the dev's 100k ceiling... there was a number of them, maybe 200 priced over the seed price (not just under). 1 "Homecoming is not perfect but it is still better than the alternative.. at least so far" - Unknown (Wise words Unknown!) Si vis pacem, para bellum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheZag Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 Maybe someone was badging for the market ones and decided that yellow salvage was a good place to buy and resell to get the badges without spending too much. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yomo Kimyata Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 7 minutes ago, Troo said: there was a number of them, maybe 200 priced over the seed price (not just under). Ok, I admit I don't understand how you could know this? If there are 10 million listed at 100,000, and 200 listed at 125,000, your 125k bids would come out of the ones seeded at 100k. Unless there is something that I am missing? Who run Bartertown? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troo Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 Just now, Yomo Kimyata said: Ok, I admit I don't understand how you could know this? If there are 10 million listed at 100,000, and 200 listed at 125,000, your 125k bids would come out of the ones seeded at 100k. Unless there is something that I am missing? thats what it took to get it below 10,000,000 sales "Homecoming is not perfect but it is still better than the alternative.. at least so far" - Unknown (Wise words Unknown!) Si vis pacem, para bellum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omega-202 Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 Just now, TheZag said: Maybe someone was badging for the market ones and decided that yellow salvage was a good place to buy and resell to get the badges without spending too much. SCRRRRRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAKKK sorry, that's just the sound of the goalposts being moved. I honestly don't care what this person's motivation is (actually I don't even care that they're doing it all that much). I do care that people in this thread are burying their heads in the sand and attacking someone for suggesting something fishy is going on. Now that @Troo has thrown enough money at the problem to show that someone has set up a "buy 10k, sell 25k" scheme, can people admit that they were wrong and that we have evidence that someone decided to play "aribter of the yellow salvage"? Probably not, but its a shame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arcane Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 (edited) 25 minutes ago, Omega-202 said: But again, why was uncommon salvage the only price that shot up? Why didnt anything else skyrocket? Why is there such a high standing bid for uncommon salvage but nothing comparable on any of the other pieces needed for the "craft yellow recipe>convert rare" process? Nobody is arguing that standard market participation moves the needle. That's so obvious as to be pedantic to point out. You're missing the point. I would need evidence to go along with a “someone is doing this purposefully with the sole intent of raising prices” theory. No one has presented that so market forces are all we have to go off of. Though I’m starting to want to keep my bids high because of the obnoxious weeping and gnashing of teeth in this thread, so it’s plausible. The amount of finger pointing over 25k influence is absurd. Edited June 17, 2022 by arcane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troo Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 Its an sql database. HC team can see what's happening. They also can see the shared ip addresses of multiple accounts. Its not that hard. "Homecoming is not perfect but it is still better than the alternative.. at least so far" - Unknown (Wise words Unknown!) Si vis pacem, para bellum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arcane Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 1 minute ago, Troo said: Its an sql database. HC team can see what's happening. They also can see the shared ip addresses of multiple accounts. Its not that hard. “It wouldn’t be hard to get evidence” is, shockingly, not itself evidence 🙂 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omega-202 Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 (edited) 8 minutes ago, arcane said: I would need evidence to go along with a “someone is doing this purposefully with the sole intent of raising prices” theory. No one has presented that so market forces are all we have to go off of. Though I’m starting to want to keep my bids high because of the obnoxious weeping and gnashing of teeth in this thread, so it’s plausible. The amount of finger pointing over 25k influence is absurd. @Troo just showed that theres a 10k/25k back stop set up by buying out and then relisting the whole float.... What more evidence can you want? Seriously? The curtain just got yanked down and you're still not seeing it Edit: and again, its not about the money. Its about people like you doing everything you can to try and rationalize and explain around what is pretty apparent. Edited June 17, 2022 by Omega-202 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yomo Kimyata Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 8 minutes ago, Troo said: thats what it took to get it below 10,000,000 sales This is a basic accounting issue. If the seeding price is 100,000 (which the devs have repeatedly told us), then you should never have needed to pay more than 100,000 to get supply down to the 10mm level. Is the seeding price higher than 100k? I'd be surprised at that. 1 Who run Bartertown? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troo Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Yomo Kimyata said: Is the seeding price higher than 100k? I'd be surprised at that. I don't think so. 100k seemed right. I think someone figured if there were a number of items over the seeded items that it might prop up an inflated price. While gobbling up everything for sale at a much lower price above what many would typically pay. In that way it would appear items were for sale in addition to the seeded items. I guess could have been an error in the seeded total. Edited June 17, 2022 by Troo "Homecoming is not perfect but it is still better than the alternative.. at least so far" - Unknown (Wise words Unknown!) Si vis pacem, para bellum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arcane Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 3 minutes ago, Troo said: oh geez. seeing for sales for hundreds at the exact same price over $25k. While having even more bids at essentially the exact same weird number price. That's enough proof for me. People in this thread haven’t just alleged that the market has been moved by high bidders. They’ve alleged intent and malice. Still no sign of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troo Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 (edited) This is why we will never see moving more than 10 items at a time. Some people are dicks and would abuse it. Edited June 17, 2022 by Troo 1 "Homecoming is not perfect but it is still better than the alternative.. at least so far" - Unknown (Wise words Unknown!) Si vis pacem, para bellum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arcane Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 The fact that people are willing to call each other dicks over someone paying a nickel for what’s worth a penny is where I take issue with this thread. You can earn said nickel faster than you can even type dick in this game. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omega-202 Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 (edited) 6 minutes ago, arcane said: People in this thread haven’t just alleged that the market has been moved by high bidders. They’ve alleged intent and malice. Still no sign of that. So you admit its happening? That's a huge flip from a few posts up. Eat crow and just walk away instead of moving the goalposts. How in the world can we prove motivation? Edited June 17, 2022 by Omega-202 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arcane Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Omega-202 said: So you admit its happening? That's a huge flip from a few posts up. Eat crow and just walk away instead of moving the goalposts. How in the world can we prove motivation? Huh? I never denied prices were moving and that people making high bids would contribute to that. Maybe if you can’t prove motivation you shouldn’t be accusing people of bad motivations like that? Edited June 17, 2022 by arcane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troo Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 (edited) 2 minutes ago, arcane said: Huh? I never denied prices were moving and that people making high bids would contribute to that. Maybe if you can’t prove motivation you shouldn’t be impugning people like that? Last post and I'll exit. Do you agree that there are some people who are dicks? Edited June 17, 2022 by Troo "Homecoming is not perfect but it is still better than the alternative.. at least so far" - Unknown (Wise words Unknown!) Si vis pacem, para bellum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arcane Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 Just now, Troo said: Last post and I'll exit. Do you agree that there are some people who are dicks? Obviously - thread is full of them 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apparition Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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