Make enhanc converters less random.

[captainstar]

Some days I spend 130, or more, enhanc converters trying to get the right IO.

So my idea is this, make the random chances for next IO (in the same type of IO, like Ragnarok) less random.

 

[Rudra]

How would you make it less random? It's great to have a suggestion, but having a suggestion that provides a justification and/or player thought up means of implementation is better.

 

Also, the two points of the converter system is to provide players a means of getting an IO they want from an IO they have and to provide a sink for players' accumulated inf'.

[captainstar]

Just now, Rudra said:

How would you make it less random? It's great to have a suggestion, but having a suggestion that provides a justification and/or player thought up means of implementation is better.

 

Also, the two points of the converter system is to provide players a means of getting an IO they want from an IO they have and to provide a sink for players' accumulated inf'.

 

 

Maybe they can do 2 or 3 different orders, within the same type of IOs. But each of these orders will not repeat the same IO.

[captainstar]

I'm not suggesting this for very rare IOs btw. I mean, 1 very rare to other diff very rare.

Just the same types of IOs.

Edited May 11, 2023 by captainstar
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[Major_Decoy]

3 hours ago, captainstar said:

Some days I spend 130, or more, enhanc converters trying to get the right IO.

So my idea is this, make the random chances for next IO (in the same type of IO, like Ragnarok) less random.

 

You shouldn't be trying to get "the right IO" with enhancement converters, that's not really how enhancement converters are intended to be used. They're great if you've got a bunch of uncommon IOs that you can't sell for the amount it cost to craft them, but if you want a specific IO and it's not for sale, you're usually better off using the merits to buy the enhancement or recipe.

[Rudra]

Same type of IO would be things like defense buff or ranged damage. Which is the out of set conversion. Same set would be trying to change one enhancement from the Ragnarok set to another enhancement from the Ragnarok set. Same set conversions are called in set conversions. And in set conversions are fine as is.

[BrandX]

7 hours ago, captainstar said:

I'm not suggesting this for very rare IOs btw. I mean, 1 very rare to other diff very rare.

Just the same types of IOs.

You mean, trying to get the right IO in the set you're already having it in?

[XFUNK]

You're doing the converters wrong.  Instead of taking a crap recipe and rolling until you get what you want, you should try another method. 

 

Take a bunch of crap yellow enhancements and convert them until you get a considerably better one, like a defense or healing or something in the 1-2 million range and then stop and move onto the next one. Then you can convert from there to get a LOTG or a numina. Now sell one of those off to get more converters. It helps to have a list up of all the possible enhancements by level range too. You will need a bunch of converters to start off but with this method, you can almost get an infinite loop going if you're paying attention to what you're doing and doing the right conversions. 

[lemming]

One thing I'd love to see is a way to just say

I'd like to convert X to Y and it will cost Z number of converters.

 

Z would be the expected chance of random conversions to be less than say 20% of not arriving at it.

So, for a simple example, we'll have Celerity: Run Speed and you want Celerity: Stealth

50% Chance of getting the right one each roll. 

So, it would be a 12.5% of not getting on the third try which is less than 20%, so it would be a cost of 9 converters.

 

Something with six different enhancements and you want a particular one would be 9 conversions, so 27 converters.

 

That's just on converting to a particular enh within a set.   The math gets more complicated with the rarity and type.  I could see wanting to just have a goal first of wanting a particular set.  (if you want to turn a random PvP enh to anything in Shield Wall for instance)

Or even, take this uncommon and convert until it's an enh from a defense.

 

[SwitchFade]

Conversion system is fine the way it is, sorry, no vote.

[biostem]

Might as well just offer an option to select the specific IO in the set of the one you already have, for some much-inflated cost...

Edited May 12, 2023 by biostem

[Parabola]

The randomness of converters has the effect of incentivising market use. It is far more efficient to convert into anything with market value, sell that, and use the proceeds to buy what you specifically need. This increases supply overall and I'd be surprised if the Devs decided to mess with it.

[Greycat]

Eh, I read it and think - aside from the other options we already have - that having something that prevents you rolling back and forth to the *same* IOs multiple times (normally something within a set, granted) would be nice. Probably be game-able, though. I do know I've had more than a few instances where it seems I'm rolling in a set (or even category) and getting something like:

 

Positron's Glowing Nosehar: Acc/Dam

Positron's Glowing Nosehair: End/Rech

Positron's Glowing Nosehar: Acc/Dam

Positron's Glowing Nosehair: End/Rech

Positron's Glowing Nosehar: Acc/Dam

Positron's Glowing Nosehair: End/Rech

Positron's Glowing Nosehar: Acc/Dam

Positron's Glowing Nosehair: End/Rech

Positron's Glowing Nosehar: Acc/Dam

Positron's Glowing Nosehair: End/Rech

Positron's Glowing Nosehar: Dam/End

Positron's Glowing Nosehar: Acc/Dam

Positron's Glowing Nosehair: End/Rech

 

(at which point, I give up, buy the thing, try to convert something completely unrelated and get what I just bought....)

 

So, a streakbreaker of sorts might be nice, but other than that...

[Forsetti]

I like the concept very much, but it needs a how to fix...

 

That said,

 

I usually go to the enhancement converter to change an IO to another of the same type in the hope of getting the correct ability mixture IO. This is because at times when I am buying IOs at AH and I need a set of 6, at times, 1 or 2 of them are not available, so I buy 2 IOS and convert them till I get those 2 I need to complete my set.

 

Yet, it annoys me when I try to convert the IO, the not so random number generator, gets stuck in stupid, and keeps giving me the same exact IO type over and over. This is why I support this recommendation. I would think the possible solutions are:

 

1) The computer/server keeps track of what you have received and makes sure it does not repeat till all 6 choices has been sorted through, if you pay twice the enhancement converter price.

2) Pay six times the price in enhancement converters and a pop-up menu appears and you select what you want.

 

Regards

[SwitchFade]

3 hours ago, biostem said:

Might as well just offer an option to select the specific IO in the set of the one you already have, for some much-inflated cost...

Like ....... 100 merits .... ?   😄

[captainstar]

21 hours ago, BrandX said:

You mean, trying to get the right IO in the set you're already having it in?

 

yup

[Rudra]

That's an "in set" conversion. And depending on the set, the worst chance you will ever have is a 20% chance of getting what you want. And the best chance is 50% for the small sets. I'm of the opinion that in set conversions are fine as is. I thought you were specifically talking about out of set conversions. So that puts me against the OP.

[BrandX]

11 hours ago, captainstar said:

 

yup

I mean, yeah it uses 3 at a time, but I often gotten it fast more than slow.  130 Converters in the same set, has not happened that often.

That said, you can always sell it, then buy the one you want with the influence from the sale, as they tend to be the same price.

[Arc-Mage]

You do realize that Enhancement Converters drop on grey level NPCs?

 

You don’t get an easier farm outside of AE then that.

[Rudra]

Not only do Enhancement Converters drop from any mob regardless of level difference, but you can also use Reward Merits to buy 3 Enhancement Converters per merit spent.

 

(Edit: I currently have a character with I think almost 2,000 Enhancement Converters. So they are rather plentiful.)

Edited May 14, 2023 by Rudra

[Yomo Kimyata]

While we are at it, let's make every item character specific.  That way there's no danger that ebil marketers, or anyone else who possesses rudimentary knowledge of math, or anyone else with a tiny bit of sticktuitiveness, can exploit any other players.

[Wavicle]

I don't know if anyone mentioned this, you can sell converters on the ah for inf and then purchase what you want, 100% non-random.

[MHertz]

If I were to change the system at all, I would do so from the opposite direction.

 

Create a menu for inventors that says “what are you working toward right now?” and let them choose a particular category of item: Healing, Resist, or whatever. Tweak the drop rates so you are more likely to get that one thing, at the cost of a lower drop rate overall.

 

Suppose the % chance to drop an IO from a minion is 2.5%. You set yourself for “healing” and your drop rate goes down to 2.0%, but when you do get something, you have a 40% chance of finding healing recipes. Maybe if you have invention badges you can boost that to 50%.
 

That would feel more like an invention system to me, and less like a loot-drop gambling system.

[biostem]

4 minutes ago, MHertz said:

If I were to change the system at all, I would do so from the opposite direction.

 

Create a menu for inventors that says “what are you working toward right now?” and let them choose a particular category of item: Healing, Resist, or whatever. Tweak the drop rates so you are more likely to get that one thing, at the cost of a lower drop rate overall.

 

Suppose the % chance to drop an IO from a minion is 2.5%. You set yourself for “healing” and your drop rate goes down to 2.0%, but when you do get something, you have a 40% chance of finding healing recipes. Maybe if you have invention badges you can boost that to 50%.
 

That would feel more like an invention system to me, and less like a loot-drop gambling system.

Or just run content that gives you merits, then spend them on exactly what you want...

[MHertz]

1 hour ago, biostem said:

Or just run content that gives you merits, then spend them on exactly what you want...

Yeah, but that feels more like buying something than inventing it.