Chance to Hit ala Acc/ToHit Deep Dive

[shortguy on indom]

• Made this for my own enjoyment.
• Mainly for solo (or small team) play at lvl 50.

 

This may or may not be useful.  So pass or play.

Screenshot and spreadsheet attached.

Spreadsheet is LibreOffice open source, but you can probably open it using whatever.

 

• No need to enter numbers... just read the notes.
• You can enter your own numbers if you want.
• The numbers which were used represent a very well equipped toon as far as Acc/ToHit is concerned.
• Added things original formula did not account for:  inspirations/incarnates/which incarnates work the best/team play using tactics an support/hard mode play/etc. (probably some more).

 

Thx for your time.

 

HitChance.ods

[Snarky]

can anyone boil this down to a simple algebraic equation... chance is x% where x = base + acc tot + to hit tot?

[shortguy on indom]

Hope this helps.

 

Its solved in three parts:

 

To solve:

 

First:

 

AccMods  =  the power's inherent Accuracy  ×  (1.0 + the power's Accuracy Enhancements + all global Set Accuracy bonuses)

 

AccMods = 0.75 x (1 + .667 + .45)

AccMods = 0.75 x (2.117)

AccMods = 1.59         AccMods are not limited, you can have as much as you can get.

 

Then:

 

ToHitMods = ( BaseHitChance + ToHitMods – DefMods )

ToHitMods = (0.30 + 0.40 - 0.20)

ToHitMods = 0.50      ToHitMods are limited.  See below.

 

ToHitMods result HAS TO be between 0.05 to 0.95.  i.e. (5% to 95%).  If the result was less than 0.05, the game rounds up to 0.05 i.e. (5%).  If result was say, 0.110 then game rounds down to 0.95. i.e. (95%).

 

Then: to get your answer.

 

Hit Chance = AccMods x ToHitMods

Hit Chance = 1.59 x 0.50

Hit Chance = 0.795     Hit Chance is limited. See below. Same idea.

 

Hit Chance result HAS TO be between 0.05 and 0.95.  i.e. (5% to 95%).  If the result was less than 0.05, the game rounds up to 0.05 i.e. (5%).  If result was say, 0.110 i.e. (110%) then game rounds down to 0.95. i.e. (95%).

 

[shortguy on indom]

To make a long story short... if you are fighting +4 or +5 ...   bosses/elite bosses/AVs/heroes.... by yourself your about maximum Chance to hit them is about 45% using everything you have + incarnates....but you need to actually build for max Acc/ToHit.

 

With a small team of say 4 or less, better hope that other folks (as well as you) are running tactics and support.

 

I mainly solo or small team, so it matters to me.  YMMV

 

Large team and hard mode a little different, things get easier.

 

Read my notes in the spreadsheet if you need more.

[Captain Fabulous]

2 hours ago, Snarky said:

can anyone boil this down to a simple algebraic equation... chance is x% where x = base + acc tot + to hit tot?

(base % chance to hit + tohit modifiers) multiplied by accuracy modifiers.

So with a 75% base chance to hit, a 10% tohit buff, and 33% accuracy SO slotted you get
(75+10) * 1.33 = 85 * 1.33 = 113% chance to hit, capped at 95%.

Tohit debuffs work the same way as tohit buffs, they're just a negative value. Subtract from your base chance to hit and then multiply by accuracy.

This is why tohit is far more effective than accuracy.

[shortguy on indom]

Agree with above, all depends on what you want to do though.

 

If you only solo or short team... you need as much Acc and ToHit as you can get.

 

If you are running lvl 50 material...

 

using the captains numbers above... with the purple patch... at +4 bosses:

 

So with a 39% base chance to hit, a 10% tohit buff, and 33% accuracy SO slotted you get
(39+10) * 1.33 = 49 * 1.33 = 65.17%

 

But again those numbers the capt. used are unrealistic unless you are in a team with 4 or more.

 

See the notes. lol

 

 

 

 

 

 

[aethereal]

1 hour ago, shortguy on indom said:

Agree with above, all depends on what you want to do though.

 

If you only solo or short team... you need as much Acc and ToHit as you can get.

 

If you are running lvl 50 material...

 

using the captains numbers above... with the purple patch... at +4 bosses:

 

So with a 39% base chance to hit, a 10% tohit buff, and 33% accuracy SO slotted you get
(39+10) * 1.33 = 49 * 1.33 = 65.17%

 

But again those numbers the capt. used are unrealistic unless you are in a team with 4 or more.

 

See the notes. lol

 

I genuinely can't tell what you're suggesting.  Maybe you're implicitly talking about some weird hard mode thing?

 

But if you're imagining that it's hard to cap chance-to-hit against non-hardmode bosses at level 50, solo, you're, uh, wrong.

 

So, point number one:

If you're level 50 and you've worked up to a T3+ Alpha, you have a level shift.  That +4 boss is only a +3 boss to you.

 

Second, 10% to hit buff and 33% local accuracy and no global accuracy is not...  great.  It's easy to, without specifically chasing it, get an 80%+ global accuracy buff -- a solid accuracy bonus is a frequent feature of low-level set bonuses that you look to for global recharge or defense.  Most sets, even pretty bad ones, will give you more than 33% local accuracy.  And you can get more than 10% to-hit just with Kismet and Tactics, if you need it.

 

If you're not putting a set in your power -- for example, you're proccing it -- then accuracy can be more of a challenge, but, like, an SO is real far from your best option in terms of putting one slot towards accuracy.

 

Normal mode Bosses do not have 175% (!!) defense.

[shortguy on indom]

ummm.

 

Critter Rank	Maximum Defense
Minion	+24.06% at level 1 +77.37% at level 21+
Lieutenant, Sniper	+90.25% at level 1 +131.25% at level 21+
Boss Boss, Elite Boss, AV/Hero, Pet+95.00% at level 1 +175.00% at level 21+ , Elite Boss, AV/Hero, Pet	+95.00% at level 1 +175.00% at level 21+

 

 

[shortguy on indom]

Not sure if the copy/paste worked from the wiki:

 

Boss, Elite Boss, AV/Hero, Pet:   +95.00% at level 1;
+175.00% at level 21+

 

There are lvl 55 bosses: tyrant and the giant robot in the holdenyaeger (spelling) come to mind. 

 

Not implying anything. What I have stated is backed up by numbers.  See attached Ssheat.

 

What information have you used to determine I am wrong?  What am I imagining?  

 

Please back up your statements.

[Captain Fabulous]

Your chart is the defense cap for various critters. They won't ever come close to those caps, for obvious reasons.

[shortguy on indom]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I genuinely can't tell what you're suggesting.  Maybe you're implicitly talking about some weird hard mode thing?

• I do mention ‘hard mode’ play but have no idea to what you are referring to.

 

But if you're imagining that it's hard to cap chance-to-hit against non-hardmode bosses at level 50, solo, you're, uh, wrong.

• Possibly, you may have some experience with a unique character which I or anyone else in playing the game can compare to or replicate. Please post your build, as I would like to learn how you achieved this with solo play.

 

So, point number one:

If you're level 50 and you've worked up to a T3+ Alpha, you have a level shift.  That +4 boss is only a +3 boss to you.

• Agree.  To add to that, there are higher level enemies, i.e. +5

 

Second, 10% to hit buff and 33% local accuracy and no global accuracy is not...  great.  It's easy to, without specifically chasing it, get an 80%+ global accuracy buff -- a solid accuracy bonus is a frequent feature of low-level set bonuses that you look to for global recharge or defense.  Most sets, even pretty bad ones, will give you more than 33% local accuracy.  And you can get more than 10% to-hit just with Kismet and Tactics, if you need it.

 

If you're not putting a set in your power -- for example, you're proccing it -- then accuracy can be more of a challenge, but, like, an SO is real far from your best option in terms of putting one slot towards accuracy.

• From my numbers computed, a toon would need in excess of 200% Accuracy to solo or small team to take on a +4 foe to hope to get enough tactics and support buffs from teammates to get anything approaching 95% Chance to Hit.  ….But if you do have a toon which has 95% Chance to Hit, would be interested to see.  Please post your build.

 

Normal mode Bosses do not have 175% (!!) defense.

 

• Answered that above.  Please use Wiki ‘Limits’ and ‘Purple Patch’ searches to verify. 

 

[shortguy on indom]

26 minutes ago, Captain Fabulous said:

Your chart is the defense cap for various critters. They won't ever come close to those caps, for obvious reasons.

• Hope you are correct.  All I have to go on as far as enemy defense for bosses/elite bosses/Avs etc is from the Wiki Limits.
• If those values are actually used in the present day game, then I guess may be correct.  I do not know of a way to verify those values.

[shortguy on indom]

Pains me to actually say it, but the game difficulty is not extreme for a team of 7-8... unless you are solo or member of a small team.

I am not suggesting that a team of 4 run an itrial or hardmode... that is obviously extreme.

 

To do a easy test of 'Chance to Hit'....

• while you are fighting an lvl 54 AV in a mission...
• ...wait about 20 seconds, watch the AV health bar, watching how fast it is going down
• ...then pop a medium or large team yellow...
• If it starts going down faster, you know what the issue is.
• if no difference then, you have enough.

This test gets a little more interesting when you are running AE 801's.  lol. Very fun.

 

Most of time a team is a team, I never ask what the other's have for a build.  I just like having fun.  So l I can do is maximize my own too.

 

Have fun, it's just a game.  The devs make the rules and I enjoy challenging content with smaller team size.

 

To each his own.

 

[Captain Fabulous]

You can use the in-game combat monitor to see what your chance to hit is for whatever you're fighting.

[Doomguide2005]

7 minutes ago, Captain Fabulous said:

You can use the in-game combat monitor to see what your chance to hit is for whatever you're fighting.

    More specifically your last hit chance and or your combat logs.  And no, few if any endgame foes reach the defense hard caps listed in the article "Limits".  Some Hardmode (or other endgame foes) foes can temporarily push defenses to ugly values higher than normal however by using buffs on top of their pre-existing inherent Hardmode buffs or other special buffs.  But even in those cases of triple digit defense (or conversely to hit vs character) the values rarely reach hard caps to my knowledge.  Lord Recluse in Ms Liberty TF  with his Orange tower active comes to mind as one example where a foes defense is buffed to or beyond the hardcap.  I've yet to  look at stacked hardmode Cimerorans to see how high those tend to go.

[Doomguide2005]

20 hours ago, Snarky said:

can anyone boil this down to a simple algebraic equation... chance is x% where x = base + acc tot + to hit tot?

     Strictly speaking no.  Base to hit is part of the whole "+to hit tot" portion of "Attack Mechanics" as in the hcwiki and the "acc tot" is a multiplier to the "to hit tot" not additive.

 

     But generally if the '+to hit tot' portion of the equation is relatively high say 65% then further boosting accuracy is the fastest way to increase the likelihood of actually striking the target.  Conversely if the '+ to hit tot' portion is low (sub 50) boosting your to hit is likely your best option.  Problem is in combat there's only the ability to boost To Hit.  Accuracy can really only be increased by changes in the build outside of combat.

[tidge]

19 hours ago, Doomguide2005 said:

    More specifically your last hit chance and or your combat logs. 

 

I monitor "Last Hit Chance"; I find it to be a never-ending source of frustration when I see "MISS", especially when chaining single-target attacks.

[Doomguide2005]

11 minutes ago, tidge said:

 

I monitor "Last Hit Chance"; I find it to be a never-ending source of frustration when I see "MISS", especially when chaining single-target attacks.

Yeah, I tend to do both but primarily monitor last hit chance.  However if something unusual happens ... like Bobcat in Tinpex killing me 3 times in one fight recently when I can't clearly remember the last time any AV has killed her I go over the logs to check out what they say or if mother luck just truly had its day.

[shortguy on indom]

I am going to try to monitor the 'Last Hit Chance,' because monitoring Combat Attributes/Base/ToHit only shows the value if you are fighting an even level enemy.

 

If you are fighting Bosses and such especially with the Purple Patch would be different.

[shortguy on indom]

One thing to add to all this 'Chance To Hit' talk would be to keep in mind that the CTH can be different for each attack power you have, because the Inherent Accuracy of each power usually varies.  

[tidge]

It might break the UI (too many checks?) but I would really like to see "Last Attack Roll" as something I could have on the HUD, as opposed to scrolling through the logs. The AoE effects confuse things, but often on single-target attacks I simply want to see those numbers above 95% when I miss.

[Captain Fabulous]

Just now, tidge said:

It might break the UI (too many checks?) but I would really like to see "Last Attack Roll" as something I could have on the HUD, as opposed to scrolling through the logs. The AoE effects confuse things, but often on single-target attacks I simply want to see those numbers above 95% when I miss.

That's exactly what the "last hit chance" in the combat monitor is.
 

 

1 hour ago, shortguy on indom said:

I am going to try to monitor the 'Last Hit Chance,' because monitoring Combat Attributes/Base/ToHit only shows the value if you are fighting an even level enemy.

 

If you are fighting Bosses and such especially with the Purple Patch would be different.

Last hit chance isn't even-level only. It's literally the chance your last attack had to hit whatever you were fighting, whether it be a -10 minion or a +5 AV.

[tidge]

17 hours ago, tidge said:

It might break the UI (too many checks?) but I would really like to see "Last Attack Roll" as something I could have on the HUD, as opposed to scrolling through the logs. The AoE effects confuse things, but often on single-target attacks I simply want to see those numbers above 95% when I miss.

 

17 hours ago, Captain Fabulous said:

That's exactly what the "last hit chance" in the combat monitor is.

 

The "last hit chance" DOES NOT show what the "last attack roll" was... otherwise you would occasionally see "last hit chance" be greater than 95% every time you miss an attack.

[Andreah]

Why would we care what the last attack roll was exactly? Do we still not trust the random number generator to be fair?

[tidge]

Sometimes I just want to see where in that 5% I landed. I never look at the logs for when I hit... unless I am in MoG territory.