Ninja Assault for Dominators

[FirstRingOfSaturn]

Some months ago I had made an Electrical Blast/Ninja Training blaster just for fun. It was just intended as a style over substance toon, but in the end it turned out much better than expected and i had much fun with it. I liked the idea of having sword attacks, wielding a big sword with a blaster. Also made a variant with Archery/Ninja Training for a more physical blaster.

 

I think Ninja Assault or Nin-Jutsu Assault could be a nice secondary addition for a Dominator, again for the joy of hacking away with big swords 🙂 or maybe just Sword Assault?

 

[CoeruleumBlue]

I would approve of this. I still dislike the fact the only ToHit/Perception boost options on dominators are Savage Assault and Arsenal Assault personally and they're not adding any more power pools or epic pools that have it for dominators so that should probably be a power in it, and of course a stealth power similar to the ones blasters get.

 

I honestly don't even like the Ninja Training set on blasters because there's literally only one self-buff in the entire set so they're all very style-over-substance in my opinion. You're hitting way too many attacks on Ninja Training blasters and I told people if they like that they should just make a melee archetype already and get ranged attacks from an epic pool and maybe also power pools (though some of the melee and armor sets also come with limited ranged attacks anyway,) but I actually think it'd work great on Dominators, just also they should have more than one toggle or long-recharge self-buff or trap (like the caltrops Ninjutsu gets) type power. 

 

So yeah I say put in some swords, some unarmed attacks, some ninja stars, a smoke bomb (maybe with a confuse like the Ninjutsu armor gets,) a stealth power that gives you crits, and a ToHit/perception power, and probably a caltrops and I'll be happy having a third fight-y option for Dominators that isn't the very distinct claw attacks and the equally-distinct assault rifle attacks.

 

Dominators are the only class besides Controllers I have gotten to level 50 so far and I would be happy with more fight-y options for them since I don't like the element attacks like fire and ice for the assault sets personally. I want to have a crowd control set and either a fight-y set or like a psionics or dark set. The stone one is kind of fun but I usually end up making those look like some kind of mystical gem, meteors, or lava so it doesn't feel very "earth element" to me personally. I wanted to try the spines one but it seems a lot like the Ninja Training one, too style over substance since there are nearly no toggles or self-buffs in the whole set. 

[Rudra]

37 minutes ago, CoeruleumBlue said:

I still dislike the fact the only ToHit/Perception boost options on dominators are Savage Assault and Arsenal Assault

Electricity Assault: Build Up

Martial Assault: Envenomed Blades

Radioactive Assault: Fusion

Thorny Assault: Build Up

 

If you are going to count Savage Assault's Spot Prey, then you need to also count the others.

 

Edit:

  

37 minutes ago, CoeruleumBlue said:

I honestly don't even like the Ninja Training set on blasters because there's literally only one self-buff in the entire set so they're all very style-over-substance in my opinion.

Ninja Training is a manipulation set. Blasters get manipulation sets for secondaries, not support or armor sets. What were you expecting?

  

37 minutes ago, CoeruleumBlue said:

You're hitting way too many attacks on Ninja Training blasters and I told people if they like that they should just make a melee archetype already and get ranged attacks from an epic pool and maybe also power pools (though some of the melee and armor sets also come with limited ranged attacks anyway,)

Ninja Training has 3 melee attacks, just like every other manipulation set.

  

37 minutes ago, CoeruleumBlue said:

I want to have a crowd control set and either a fight-y set

You mean like Martial Assault that Dominators already get access to with its unarmed attacks, shuriken, and caltrops?

 

Edited Friday at 06:01 AM by Rudra

[CoeruleumBlue]

23 minutes ago, Rudra said:

Electricity Assault: Build Up

Martial Assault: Envenomed Blades

Radioactive Assault: Fusion

Thorny Assault: Build Up

 

If you are going to count Savage Assault's Spot Prey, then you need to also count the others.

 

Edit:

  

Ninja Training is a manipulation set. Blasters get manipulation sets for secondaries, not support or armor sets. What were you expecting?

  

Ninja Training has 3 melee attacks, just like every other manipulation set.

  

You mean like Martial Assault that Dominators already get access to with its unarmed attacks, shuriken, and caltrops?

 

 

I specifically said "ToHit/Perception buffs," as in ones that increase ToHit more than slightly, and also increase Perception, even if it's only slightly. Build Up/Envenomed Blades/Fusion are "increases damage and slightly increases chance to hit." Not good for precision-based builds.

 

Other manipulation sets tend to have more toggles and self-buff powers. Even Mental Manipulation has three (World of Confusion, Concentration, Drain Psyche.) Ninja Training is basically a dominator assault set with a total of one self-buff/toggle and the entire rest of the set is click attacks with short recharges. For that reason, I think Ninja Training just sucks and if you want to play it you should play a stalker, scrapper, brute, or Arachnos widow instead, because you're going to be spending the entire time clicking attacks and only get more toggles and self-buffs from epic pools or power pools.

 

Like yes, blasters get manipulation sets for secondaries but most other manipulation sets have multiple toggles and/or long-recharge powers, not like nine melee attacks. You're not going to make a build with nine melee attacks and nine ranged attacks, not even if you're a blapper. That basically just leaves you taking everything from epic and power pools which are intentionally underpowered compared to just getting those from your main power pools, which confirms my opinion that Ninja Training is not very good even if it looks stylish and works fine on style-over-substance toons. 

Edited Friday at 06:18 AM by CoeruleumBlue

[Rudra]

15 minutes ago, CoeruleumBlue said:

I specifically said "ToHit/Perception buffs," as in ones that increase ToHit more than slightly, and also increase Perception, even if it's only slightly. Build Up/Envenomed Blades/Fusion are "increases damage and slightly increases chance to hit." Not good for precision-based builds.

Spot Prey has a 10 second duration with a 90 second base recharge. Also "not good for precision-based builds".

 

15 minutes ago, CoeruleumBlue said:

Even Mental Manipulation has three (World of Confusion, Concentration, Drain Psyche.)

Since when is World of Confusion with its psionic DoT, enemy confuse, and no other effects a self-buff?

 

15 minutes ago, CoeruleumBlue said:

Like yes, blasters get manipulation sets for secondaries but most other manipulation sets have multiple toggles and/or long-recharge powers, not like nine melee attacks. You're not going to make a build with nine melee attacks and nine ranged attacks, not even if you're a blapper. 

You obviously have never even looked at the set. As I told you earlier, Ninja Training has three melee attacks just like every other manipulation set, not nine. What does it have? Here we go again....

 

Immobilizing Dart (Available at level 1, this is a ranged single target immobilize that does toxic damage.)

Sting of the Wasp (Available at level 1, this is the first of three possible melee attacks in the set.)

Choking Powder (Available at level 4, this is a ranged single target hold that does toxic damage.)

Shinobi (Available at level 10, this is a stealth power toggle that also boosts your damage for your first attack coming out of it like a weak Assassin Strike,)

The Lotus Drops (Available at level 16, this is the set's only AoE melee attack.)

Kuji-In Toh (Available at level 20, this power buffs your regeneration, recovery, psionic damage resist, and fear resist.)

Smoke Flash (Available at level 24, this is an AoE placate effect that also renders the affected targets briefly more vulnerable to your attacks.)

Blinding Powder (Available at level 28, this ranged cone, not to be confused with a melee cone, reduces targets' perception and ToHit while also possibly putting them to sleep or confusing them.)

Golden Dragonfly (The third and last melee attack in the set.)

 

Edit: Oh yeah, would you look at that? It has two self buff powers, not one. (Kuji-In Toh's effects last for 210 seconds with a 200 second base recharge time, so you can even keep it up constantly.)

 

Edited Friday at 06:31 AM by Rudra

[CoeruleumBlue]

4 minutes ago, Rudra said:

Spot Prey has a 10 second duration with a 90 second base recharge. Also "not good for precision-based builds".

 

Since when is World of Confusion with its psionic DoT, enemy confuse, and no other effects a self-buff?

 

You obviously have never even looked at the set. As I told you earlier, Ninja Training has three melee attacks just like every other manipulation set, not nine. What does it have? Here we go again....

 

Immobilizing Dart (Available at level 1, this is a ranged single target immobilize that does toxic damage.)

Sting of the Wasp (Available at level 1, this is the first of three possible melee attacks in the set.)

Choking Powder (Available at level 4, this is a ranged single target hold that does toxic damage.)

Shinobi (Available at level 10, this is a stealth power toggle that also boosts your damage for your first attack coming out of it like a weak Assassin Strike,)

The Lotus Drops (Available at level 16, this is the set's only AoE melee attack.)

Kuji-In Toh (Available at level 20, this power buffs your regeneration, recovery, psionic damage resist, and fear resist.)

Smoke Flash (Available at level 24, this is an AoE placate effect that also renders the affected targets briefly more vulnerable to your attacks.)

Blinding Powder (Available at level 28, this ranged cone, not to be confused with a melee cone, reduces targets' perception and ToHit while also possibly putting them to sleep or confusing them.)

Golden Dragonfly (The third and last melee attack in the set.)

 

Edit: Oh yeah, would you look at that? It has two self buff powers, not one.

 

 

You are distorting my words. I said "toggles or self-buffs," and World of Confusion is clearly a toggle. That doesn't change the fact that almost everything in Ninja Training is an attack and Devices is better if you don't want to constantly be pressing buttons, since almost everything that does damage in Devices is a trap that you can just put on the ground and leave there, which is oddly something it shares with the Ninjutsu armor set but not Ninja Training. Ninja Training still overwhelmingly appears to be the most attack-oriented blaster secondary in the game and that makes it not very good in my opinion, they might as well have just made a sword option for the taser in Devices and an alternate animation for Targeting Drones that doesn't have a drone behind you and it'd have been more in line with the other ninja sets in the game.

[Rudra]

4 minutes ago, CoeruleumBlue said:

 

You are distorting my words. I said "toggles or self-buffs," and World of Confusion is clearly a toggle. That doesn't change the fact that almost everything in Ninja Training is an attack and Devices is better if you don't want to constantly be pressing buttons, since almost everything that does damage in Devices is a trap that you can just put on the ground and leave there, which is oddly something it shares with the Ninjutsu armor set but not Ninja Training. Ninja Training still overwhelmingly appears to be the most attack-oriented blaster secondary in the game and that makes it not very good in my opinion, they might as well have just made a sword option for the taser in Devices and an alternate animation for Targeting Drones that doesn't have a drone behind you and it'd have been more in line with the other ninja sets in the game.

You keep digging your hole deeper. "almost everything that does damage in devices is a trap you can just put on the ground and leave there, which is oddly something it shares with the Ninjutsu armor set"? Ninjitsu has zero traps you put on the ground. None. Nada. Zilch. Armor sets don't include attacks, though some do have damage auras. And no armor set lets you place an attack for enemies to run into.

 

Blaster secondary attacks:

Atomic Manipulation - 3 melee attacks, 2 ranged attacks, 4 other

Darkness Manipulation - 3 melee attacks, 2 ranged attacks (if you count Dark Pit), 4 other (5 if you don't count Dark Pit as an attack)

Devices - 1 melee attack, 2 ranged attacks (I'm counting the pet), 2 trap attacks, 4 other

Earth Manipulation - 3 melee attacks, 2 ranged attacks, 4 other

Electricity Manipulation - 4 melee attacks, 1 ranged attack, 4 other

Energy Manipulation - 5 melee attacks, 4 other

Fire Manipulation - 3 melee attacks, 1 ranged attack, 5 other

Ice Manipulation - 4 melee attacks, 2 ranged attacks (if you count Shiver), 3 other (4 if you don't count Shiver)

Martial Combat - 4 melee attacks (5 if you count Burst of Speed), 4 other (5 if you don't count Burst of Speed)

Ninja Training - 3 melee attacks, 3 ranged attacks (if you count Blinding Powder), 3 other (4 if you don't count Blinding Powder)

Plant Manipulation - 3 melee attacks, 3 ranged attacks, 3 other

Sonic Manipulation - 4 melee attacks, 2 ranged attacks (if you count Sound Cannon), 4 other (5 if you don't count Sound Cannon)

Tactical Arrow - 6 ranged attacks (5 of which may count as other instead), 3 other

Temporal Manipulation - 3 melee attacks, 3 ranged attacks (2 of which may count as other instead), 3 other

 

So please, continue to claim that Ninja Training is all attacks and more attacks than any other manipulation set.

[Chance Jackson]

I support it but what will the ranged attacks be? Martial Assault already has the Ninja Star attacks so what does that leave for a katana set; Wind Scar/Vaccum slash style attacks?

[biostem]

1 hour ago, Chance Jackson said:

I support it but what will the ranged attacks be?

My guess - adapt Widow training's poison dart and dart burst.  You could then have an "explosive dart" as a ranged AoE, and then maybe combine claws' focus and shockwave ranged FX with a katana animation...

[Arbegla]

I think the OP is conflating the differences between Blasters Manipulation powers with a Dominators Assault powers. Yes, they occasionally share some powers between the, and yes include both melee and ranged attacks, but they overall have different use cases, and different playstyles. 

If you want to play a 'ninja' Dominator, first of all, what primary do you pick, as none of the primaries really support a 'ninja's hide in the shadows' playstyle without dipping heavily into the power pools, and secondly, Martial Assault already has the Shuriken ranged attacks, and 3 melee, non-weapon based attacks, two of which are AoEs.

[CoeruleumBlue]

2 hours ago, Arbegla said:

I think the OP is conflating the differences between Blasters Manipulation powers with a Dominators Assault powers. Yes, they occasionally share some powers between the, and yes include both melee and ranged attacks, but they overall have different use cases, and different playstyles. 

If you want to play a 'ninja' Dominator, first of all, what primary do you pick, as none of the primaries really support a 'ninja's hide in the shadows' playstyle without dipping heavily into the power pools, and secondly, Martial Assault already has the Shuriken ranged attacks, and 3 melee, non-weapon based attacks, two of which are AoEs.

 

Illusion Control

Darkness Control

Plant Control

Arsenal Control

Mind Control

 

...I think dominator primaries fill the ninja playstyle way way more than blaster ones personally. Literally 2/5 of the ones I listed come with their own stealth powers, and hiding among a bunch of walking plants would be way more ninja-y to me than throwing a fireball at someone, though that's just my two cents. Plus I think a lot of people who want the Ninja Assault set specifically want it to go with all their shadow pets from Illusion Control or Darkness Control.