Jump to content
We are currently experiencing network issues ×
Sir Myshkin

Proc Monsters - Controller Edition

Recommended Posts

Ah yes, now I remember that part of the discussion starting August 1, 2019 and that's part of the reason why I was looking to use 5-6 damage procs in Distortion Field for my Time Manipulation builds (Controllers can add Will of the Controller damage proc while Masterminds have no corresponding counterpart that can be slotted in from ATO sets).

 

However, it's possible that some update to Homecoming since then changed the underlying dynamics, so a retest to validate/verify might be in order.  Doesn't need to be as rigorous as your first series, so long as the proc chances are still weighing in "near" where the computed formula imputes they ought to be.


IifneyR.gif

Verbogeny is one of many pleasurettes afforded a creatific thinkerizer.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, Redlynne said:

Ah yes, now I remember that part of the discussion starting August 1, 2019 and that's part of the reason why I was looking to use 5-6 damage procs in Distortion Field for my Time Manipulation builds (Controllers can add Will of the Controller damage proc while Masterminds have no corresponding counterpart that can be slotted in from ATO sets).

 

However, it's possible that some update to Homecoming since then changed the underlying dynamics, so a retest to validate/verify might be in order.  Doesn't need to be as rigorous as your first series, so long as the proc chances are still weighing in "near" where the computed formula imputes they ought to be.

It could be worth looking at for potential changes, which is why I ask for details on what specifically is being seen. Before I retest something, I need to know if it's really an oddity or just small sample size..

 

The test is actually easier to do now thanks to the standardized combat log parser, so really anyone can do these tests. However the challenge of the test is knowing how many enemies are within the patch the whole time, so really it's just time consuming. Also, the test needs to not stack DFs, so ultimately any testing requires manually monitoring the screen the entire time. Its not something I can set on auto and look at data later.

 

If anyone wants to do the test and have me look at the results, I'll be happy to do so. Just make sure only 1 enemy is in the patch the entire time, don't stack patches, and tell me what procs are slotted. Then upload your chat log and I'll parse it. 

Edited by Bopper


PPM Information Guide                Survivability Tool                  Interface DoT Procs Guide

Time Manipulation Guide             Bopper Builds                      +HP/+Regen Proc Cheat Sheet

Movement Speed: Guide              Recharge Guide                   Base Empowerment: Temp Powers


RubyRed's API Tool                       Mids' Reborn                       Beta Server Information

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Bopper said:

I'm curious what you're seeing @josh1622. Do you have numbers?

I tested it last year a couple months after the server went up.  I slotted a single 3.5 damage proc (impeded swiftness) and used distortion field 100 times on a single mob that was immobilized.  Out of 500 proc opportunities I only recorded 31 procs.  I'll re-do my tests soon and see if the results match your numbers this time.

Edited by josh1622

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, josh1622 said:

I tested it last year a couple months after the server went up.

Outdated test results probably need to be re-verified.  If nothing else, something might have changed in the meantime between now and then.


IifneyR.gif

Verbogeny is one of many pleasurettes afforded a creatific thinkerizer.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, josh1622 said:

I tested it last year a couple months after the server went up.  I slotted a single 3.5 damage proc (impeded swiftness) and used distortion field 100 times on a single mob that was immobilized.  Out of 500 proc opportunities I only recorded 31 procs.  I'll re-do my tests soon and see if the results match your numbers this time.

A lot of stuff under the hood got stealth adjusted, whether knowingly or not, that changed the dynamic of quite a few powers, Rains being one of them, between July and October last year (2019), I don't recall exactly when, just that there were quite a few tests that were done and certain results came out differently in between there. A lot of what Bopper tested was around that time as well, which sounds like probably happened after what you tested. It'd probably be worth going back and re-checking your experience. I don't personally have a */Time Character without having to roll up a test character just to look at that one thing. Already have some stuff slated to check on Heal procs in Electrical Affinity that I've been trying to get around to for the last four nights.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't record numbers, but it's been my experience that damage and hold procs don't work well in Distortion Field (which was a proc BEAST on Live). Overpowering Presence: Energy Font will spawn EVERY time I use the power, but that's about it, sadly.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, EmperorSteele said:

Overpowering Presence: Energy Font will spawn EVERY time I use the power

Only upon casting or do you get extra Fonts over time from it?


IifneyR.gif

Verbogeny is one of many pleasurettes afforded a creatific thinkerizer.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, EmperorSteele said:

Just on casting.

That then basically confirms my surmise about how the Energy Font proc is coded.  It can only be procced when the Controller casts, not when Pets and/or Pseudopets cast powers independently of the Controller.  There must be some kind of inherent limitation in the code to prevent pets from summoning pets via procs, which then means that only the initial casting is "valid" for checking the proc chances for Energy Font.


IifneyR.gif

Verbogeny is one of many pleasurettes afforded a creatific thinkerizer.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
53 minutes ago, Redlynne said:

That then basically confirms my surmise about how the Energy Font proc is coded.  It can only be procced when the Controller casts, not when Pets and/or Pseudopets cast powers independently of the Controller.  There must be some kind of inherent limitation in the code to prevent pets from summoning pets via procs, which then means that only the initial casting is "valid" for checking the proc chances for Energy Font.

 

Of course, otherwise you'd have Singularity summoning little singularities 😉

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 4/3/2020 at 6:29 PM, Sir Myshkin said:

Side note: Personally I think Fire/Electric is looking to be one of the more interesting iterations since Fire Imps can get buffed and healed in triplicate pretty quickly, and those buffs can come back to the player, and the set is a little self-fixing from an endurance stand point if enough of the +End procs get dropped around. Might finally be able to run Hot Feet! There's also the obvious Elec/Elec combination for a sap-minded build that also has the same effect on Gremlins from a buff standpoint. Definitely not a Fire/Kin, but a bit more forgiving when it comes to Imp positioning and healing.

I have a somewhat unrelated question about Fire Control. I notice in your builds you did not slot Fire Cages for procs (potentially Trap, Posi, and Anni procs). Why?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Silverado said:

I have a somewhat unrelated question about Fire Control. I notice in your builds you did not slot Fire Cages for procs (potentially Trap, Posi, and Anni procs). Why?

It comes down to necessity in the build more than anything. In the Fire/FF build that was a personal build for one of my own characters that I didn't want to involve Hasten, but the need for some of that additional global has to exist somewhere. In the Fire/Dark/Psi build, that one was purpose built for testing proc triggers in toggles, but also needed to be strong enough to survive sitting in a spawn for long periods of time so a big shift in over-packing WoC and HF.

 

It comes down to the secondary that was paired with it, and the reason it existed in the first place. You could easily toss a bunch of procs in there for sure.

 

And, I can't even tell you how many times I've built, rebuilt, modified, altered, shifted, changed, and stressed over that Fire/FF build trying to squeeze every last ounce of juice out of it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I tried the Mad King idea (proc city) on my Sentinel.  Not bad.  (I spliced your sentinel build with a defender 'proc' build.  Not an entirely successful build.

 

Just lacks for accuracy.  I'll do a rebuild staying close to your use of Psi on the epics.

 

A lot of fun in the main.  I emphasis the unstoppable power.  Gives insane def' numbers.  I have to time the 'drop' to put my shields back up.

 

Azrael.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.962
http://www.cohplanner.com/

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Level 50 Natural Controller
Primary Power Set: Plant Control
Secondary Power Set: Poison
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Stone Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Strangler -- Dvs-Acc/Dmg(A), Dvs-Hold%(3), Lck-%Hold(3), Lck-Acc/Hold(5), HO:Perox(5), HO:Perox(7)
Level 1: Alkaloid -- Heal-I(A)
Level 2: Envenom -- ShlBrk-Acc/DefDeb(A), ShlBrk-%Dam(7), TchofLadG-%Dam(15), AchHee-ResDeb%(17)
Level 4: Weaken -- CldSns-ToHitDeb(A), CldSns-Acc/ToHitDeb(17), CldSns-ToHitDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(19), CldSns-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(19)
Level 6: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 8: Seeds of Confusion -- CrcPrs-Conf(A), CrcPrs-Conf/Rchg(9), CrcPrs-Acc/Conf/Rchg(9), CrcPrs-Acc/Rchg(11), CrcPrs-Conf/EndRdx(11), CrcPrs-Conf%(13)
Level 10: Combat Jumping -- LucoftheG-Rchg+(A), Ksm-ToHit+(15)
Level 12: Roots -- Empty(A)
Level 14: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 16: Tough -- StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), GldArm-3defTpProc(25)
Level 18: Vines -- SprWiloft-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear(A), SprWiloft-Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/Rchg(25), SprWiloft-EndRdx/Rchg(34), SprWiloft-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/EndRdx(34), SprWiloft-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/EndRdx/Rchg(34), SprWiloft-Rchg/Dmg%(36)
Level 20: Weave -- LucoftheG-Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def(21), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(21)
Level 22: Maneuvers -- LucoftheG-Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def(23), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(23)
Level 24: Super Jump -- BlsoftheZ-ResKB(A), BlsoftheZ-Travel/EndRdx(36)
Level 26: Carrion Creepers -- PstBls-Acc/Dmg(A), PstBls-Dam%(27), JvlVll-Dam%(27), TraoftheH-Dam%(29), ImpSwf-Dam%(29), ExpStr-Dam%(31)
Level 28: Paralytic Poison -- UnbCns-Acc/Hold/Rchg(A), UnbCns-Dam%(31), GhsWdwEmb-Dam%(31), GldNet-Dam%(33), NrnSht-Dam%(33), Lck-%Hold(33)
Level 30: Neurotoxic Breath -- PcnoftheT-Acc/Slow(A)
Level 32: Fly Trap -- SlbAll-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(A), SlbAll-Dmg/Rchg(40), SlbAll-Dmg(40)
Level 35: Poison Trap -- Arm-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(A), Arm-Dam%(36), Obl-%Dam(37), ScrDrv-Dam%(37), Erd-%Dam(37), GhsWdwEmb-Dam%(39)
Level 38: Venomous Gas -- DarWtcDsp-ToHitDeb(A), DarWtcDsp-ToHitDeb/EndRdx(39), DarWtcDsp-ToHitdeb/Rchg/EndRdx(39), DarWtcDsp-ToHitDeb/Rchg(40)
Level 41: Fissure -- JvlVll-Acc/Dmg(A), JvlVll-Dam%(42), PstBls-Dam%(42), ExpStr-Dam%(42), OvrFrc-Dam/KB(43)
Level 44: Seismic Smash -- Hct-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(A), Hct-Dam%(45), TchofDth-Dam%(45), Mk'Bit-Dam%(45), GldNet-Dam%(46), GhsWdwEmb-Dam%(46)
Level 47: Earth's Embrace -- Pnc-Heal/EndRedux(A), Pnc-EndRdx/Rchg(48), Pnc-Heal/Rchg(48), Pnc-Heal/EndRedux/Rchg(48), Pnc-Heal(50)
Level 49: Rock Armor -- LucoftheG-Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def(50), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(50)
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Containment 
Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run 
Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Health -- Pnc-Heal/+End(A), NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(43), Mrc-Rcvry+(46)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A), PrfShf-EndMod(43)
Level 50: Nerve Partial Core Revamp 
------------

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

After working with it for a while, ill/traps just isn't a good proc monster. I mean, it doesn't really need it, but it's ALL PETS with the pet proc limits, and if you WANT perma PA there's just too many demands on your sets to give you the freedom to proc up.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So im looking over this gravity/time build.. and im intrigued.. however, I was wondering how I might fit Propel in the build?  Is it possible without screwing everything up?

 

Honestly I just love the power and want to use it.  I dont mind if I am a little weaker for having it, but I dont understand the nuances of these proc builds well enough to figure out how to add it in without screwing everything up.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Damoklese said:

So im looking over this gravity/time build.. and im intrigued.. however, I was wondering how I might fit Propel in the build?  Is it possible without screwing everything up?

If it’s the build that has Crush in it, then just swap that out for Propel and you’ll be fine 🙂 There should even be a propel-inclusive build in my post specifically about testing Gravity as I used it in my testing for performance.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a plant/nature controller that I'm switching over to a proc'd-out build (Strangler, Seeds, Carrion) and was wondering how Overgrowth (13s off perma w/o incarnate) effects Carrion Creepers (or psuedopets in general).  Guess it'd be a similar question for things like Mindlink and Farsight.  PBAoE clickies that buff.

 

I know it buffs actual pets, but what about pseudo pets?  I suppose with Overgrowth and Carrion Creepers, if it did buff them, it only buffs the ones that are up/out at the time Overgrowth is clicked.  Any new spawns would not be buffed...

 

Curious if anyone's done testing on this.  Nature is an amazing set, basically due to Wild Growth and Overgrowth.  Perma those bad-boys ASAP.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/12/2019 at 11:54 PM, Sir Myshkin said:

Electric

  • Procs have the ability to bend some of this sets AoE centered focus into strong ST capabilities. Jolting Chain is, *ahem* off the chain.

Thank you for this guide.

 

I had started an Electric/Poison controller, which I was struggling with. I couldn't understand how jolting chain could be useful. Now I can take on mobs of 20+ and come out with full health and end.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Alright, I have a brand-new Elec/Pain controller I want to figure out thanks to this thread. Concept-wise, I'm digging into the Experimentation pool, and I was wondering if an Idea I had had any legs.

 

Specifically, realizing that Corrosive Vial and Anguishing Cry can both take Lady Grey, Achilles Heel, and Shieldbreaker (among other things).

 

I know that Corrosive Vial spawns a "pseudo-pet", and thus has an initial proc chance at cast and then another chance every 10s. The power lasts for 15s, so that's two chances to proc.

 

Corrosive Vial can also take a lot of pure damage procs that Anguishing cry can't.


So what I want to know is whether or not Corrosive Vial could be another candidate for a proc-heavy power, especially if your secondary (Pain in my case) doesn't have a lot of proc-able powers. I was also curious whether it would be overly redundant or whether it would be a Good Idea to have Corrosive Vial AND Anguishing Cry both slotted with Achilles at the least.

 

I guess I have one more question- A lot of the "proc" builds for Electricity control don't take Static field. What am I missing? That's one of my favorite powers in the set, and it can even take a few procs if you don't want to "one-slot wonder" the power.

 

Thanks, and sorry if these are dumb questions, I'm kind of bad at this game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, Zinnar said:

I know that Corrosive Vial spawns a "pseudo-pet", and thus has an initial proc chance at cast and then another chance every 10s.

I did do some light testing with the power a couple months ago just to see what would come of it. The power will do "okay" for its effectiveness with procs, but it wasn't something that was significantly impressive given that the Vial doesn't dramatically do anything else that screams "take me!" The power at best really only has value on tough targets (EB/AV/GM) where it might balance out long-term to some worthwhile damage, however I doubt that considering I couldn't even get two applications of it to kill a -6 group of Malta.

 

Is it neat? Sure. Do procs help give it some better utility? Considerably. Would I go out of my way to put it into a build? Probably not.

 

11 hours ago, Zinnar said:

A lot of the "proc" builds for Electricity control don't take Static field. What am I missing?

Sleep abilities are ... well, they're pretty much useless. Unless you solo and can actually take proper advantage of the effect to help you mitigate/balance a crowd on command, there's not really any greater circumstance in a team that the sleep won't just get cancelled by someone else's AoE the moment you cast it. A crowd control bent on not attacking has never flowed well in CoH. On top of complications with Sleep, there's also the added aspect that several other abilities in Electric Control are just better crowd maintenance abilities that can be reduced to relatively low cooldowns. Jolting Chain causes KD, and Synaptic Overload is group confusion, both refresh pretty quickly, and the confusion effect lasts a considerable length of time.

 

That being said, you don't have to skip the power, you can take it if it suits your play style, you just have to be mindful that it is somewhat situational utility.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 6/20/2020 at 12:39 PM, Zinnar said:

Specifically, realizing that Corrosive Vial and Anguishing Cry can both take Lady Grey, Achilles Heel, and Shieldbreaker (among other things).

I have the same troller and it's a joy to play. I'll post my build at a later date because I can't export running Mids through Wineskin, but I wanted to advise you specifically on Anguishing Cry. On my build it refreshes around every 30s. It's duration is 30s, so the effect is pretty much perma, but slotting this with anything but an Achilles Heel is a waste. Mine has 2x rch and 1 Achilles. With 2 force feedback in the build it can come up quicker but not by much. Point being, any power you use every 30s shouldn't take up too many of your slots assigned for process enhs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Are these builds still viable? Was considering the Grav/Time and a Plant/Dark. Which of the Plant/Dark builds have the highest damage potential for some solo but mostly groups?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...