super hume registration debate

[EmeraldFox]

ooc:

 

Ok here goes.  Marvel civil war 1 comic nook series.  Those that dont know after a disaster involving untrained reality show heros and some super villans resulting in the deaths of a lot of people including 60 kids the government passes an act that when made into law says that heros have to register ALL details with the goverment.  Name age hero id and who they are behind the mask.  As you can imagine it did not go down well with some.  Im a huge fan of this and ever since homecomeing went live it has me wondering what would happen if this happened all over America in the world of city of heroes?  What would cause this and how would heroes react?  So this is the only answer to what i can think of.  An rp debate by all of the characters we play to debate the pros cons of this as well as what maybe the outcome.

 

Im not going to say outright what side my character is on just yet.  I want to hear all sides of this argument first.  So heres the scenario.  Kings row.  A new hero has just taken down a small number of clock work.  but based in bad intel he never bothered to research he never realized that one of them had a built in bomb that the police were notified about and had asked him to stay away till the bomb squad got there but he never listens.  When it went off took  out a packed school play ground as well as half a block including the hero.

 

Time skip two months.  the registration act has been passed.  this act entails  ALL heroes register and be drafted to work for the government.  Every details is asked.  Name age ethnic back ground are they lgbt and who they are under the mask.  As you can imagine this does not go down well with everyone.  A number of heroes call for a debate before this bill goes live and is passed into law and the Paragon mayor and council offer the use of the council chambers for this debate...  This is where the story begins

 

rp:

 

Madra Rua walked into city hall.  This debate had been rumored for a while among the super community as well as the bill it represented.  The kings row massacre was the name given to this bomb and that idiot rookie attempting to do the job himself and not wait for back up has been the straw that broke the camels back.

 

Some supported this registration act while other's opposed it.  He had decided to not say a word until he had heard both sides of this debate.  Walking inside the chambers he looks around to see if anyone else had arrived and goes to sit down at one of the councilor seats waiting for others to arrive

[biostem]

Why would a hero's sexuality be part of their registration process?  Also, if it were a cop who confronted a badguy, who turned out to be strapping a bomb and it took out several innocent people, how would the results be any different?  I realize game mechanics are different than how things would be viewed within the game world, but you'd think there'd be a standing evacuation order for instances where you saw a bunch of animated clockwork automatons mulling about.

 

In reading your post a few more times, do you mean that the hero was contacted by the police and told *not* to engage the clockwork because they had a bomb, or do you mean that said hero had already engaged them and only then was informed about the bomb, but by then it was too late?

 

From a purely pragmatic standpoint, I'd say that there should be regulations in place to this effect:  Heroes are permitted to intervene without having to seek permission, in fighting low-level crimes, (muggings, robberies, etc), provided they take reasonable steps to use nonlethal means and either wear some sort of bodycam/data recorder.  For larger incidents or those with a much greater potential for a loss of life, they need to seek permission from the authorities.  A key here is that they'd need what amounts to "hero air traffic controllers", who can respond to requests and events quickly.

 

The whole problem with what was presented in Civil War, (I'm not too familiar with the comics, so I'm goin by the movie), is that they wanted UN approval for all actions, which would be so horrendously slow to respond, and likely take so long in deliberations, that the crime would be over and done with, and they'd be better off spending that time picking out caskets for the victims...

 

From an RP perspective, I'd imagine that many vigilante-style heroes or those whose values differ enough from modern Western societies wouldn't pay the regulations very much heed...

[Cyrickain13]

I think this should be the OOC chat. And another RP chat should be made.

I can see reasons for heroes to register and not register

[reconfigureyourface]

Except the game already has registration. The FBSA is what you're describing via Civil War, just Civil War had a more... violent introduction.

 

So do you want the RP in the past? Do you want to be part of a present day resistance?

 

 

Edited August 21, 2019 by reconfigureyourface

[EmeraldFox]

im talking about a deeper form of registration here country wide.  in the city of heroes comics it mentions that in a different part of America there is a differnt form of regulation due to a commit.  As for the lgbt thing it was a demonstration of just how invasive a lot of registration can be these days as i have heard storys of similar thing happening in real life unfortunately.   As for the hero in this scenario yes he was contacted by the cops but chose like the new warriors in the comics not to go with the intel and get in over his head just for the glory thinking he could handle it when in all effect sadly he could not

[reconfigureyourface]

Just now, EmeraldFox said:

im talking about a deeper form of registration here country wide.  in the city of heroes comics it mentions that in a different part of America there is a differnt form of regulation due to a commit.  As for the lgbt thing it was a demonstration of just how invasive a lot of registration can be these days as i have heard storys of similar thing happening in real life unfortunately.   As for the hero in this scenario yes he was contacted by the cops but chose like the new warriors in the comics not to go with the intel and get in over his head just for the glory thinking he could handle it when in all effect sadly he could not

It is described as in the US... Man, maybe go read the paragon wiki and flesh out this idea? Then, I'll gladly RP with you about it. 

[Myrmidon]

We are the future, Charles, not them. They no longer matter.

[AerialAssault]

Hi

 

I’ll be blunt and say that this is an ill conceived idea. It also seems like one made on a spur of the moment, that doesn’t have any clearly defined goals beyond being a parrot of an already well-known plot from Marvel. From my experience, every Roleplay Event that comes about because of these spurs of the moment ultimately gutters & fails because the momentum and ‘honeymoon’ period eventually wears out with no satisfying conclusion. It also has far reaching implications that would affect the foundations of virtually every character’s RP, and I am generally opposed to any RP Event which tries to do this.

 

So, as to why I think this isn’t a good idea? Reconfigureyourface pretty much summed it up; America already has the FBSA, and the Citizens Crime Fighting Act covers vigilantism so that even unlicensed heroes can fight crime, so long as they follow the same laws that police officers do. It even allows certain supergroups to ‘deputy’ unlicensed heroes, thus allowing them the freedoms & protections that actual licensed heroes get. There is even a UN Special Council of Super Human Activities so again, one of the major sticking points of the Civil War is already an accepted part of City of Heroes lore.

In short, there is no real need for a Civil War plot-line because the measures are already in place, and in the case of the CCFA, has been in-use for decades.

 

Now, you could, for example, run a Roleplay Event wherein a government official is trying to overturn the CCFA, or increase the powers of the FBSA/make the registration process more invasive. That might tickle some people’s fancy, but it would not be something I would be personally invested in.

 

Ultimately, I feel a plot-line of such magnitude would be something reserved for an actual in-game task force or signature story arc, which naturally would have to be taken to the Suggestions forum.

 

See the following:

Citizens Crime Fighting Act

UN Security Council of Super Powered Activities

Edited August 21, 2019 by AerialAssault

[Bastille Boy]

I read the post subject and thought this was about David Hume. If 18th century Scottish philosophers are resurrected with superpowers, they should definitely be required to register with the authorities.

[Heraclea]

(Those philosophers, given superpowers, would be a great danger.  They'd lead you to question the very existence of any reality outside your own head.)

 

Government attempts to organize superhumans have come to grief before.  Consider the example of Vanguard, a morally corrupt organization of fanatics.  Time and time again they have proven themselves willing, not only to recruit known criminals, but worse, to adopt fighting methods contrary to the mos maiorum (ancestral custom). Unsurprisingly, their members are a greater threat than the Rikti, who seem an honorable warrior culture bound by their own tradition.  The blind indiscipline of their ranks causes many incidents.  

 

The objection may be made that ours, too, is an army of superwomen directed by a government.  But ours is exactly that: an army, united in the purpose of its civilizing mission.  And there is no real difference between our army and our government; and uniquely among the earth's armies, ours is run by its soldiers, all of whom have a voice in its direction.  Most importantly, we exclude men from our ranks.  Their flightiness, impracticality, and fondness for vainglory makes them poor soldiers, at least in command positions.  This seems directly related to the problem with Vanguard.  I have spoken with the Lady Grey about the possibility of being more selective in their recruiting and excluding males from leadership positions; she listened politely and has not acted.  

 

I say no.  And it remains my opinion that the Vanguard should  be abolished.

[Malclave]

On 8/31/2019 at 8:50 AM, ejworthing said:

I read the post subject and thought this was about David Hume. If 18th century Scottish philosophers are resurrected with superpowers, they should definitely be required to register with the authorities.

Hmmm. Socrates the Lich King, Necro/ Time MM where the pets are other dead philosophers.

 

Other than that, what I always wondered was why heroes without powers had to register.

[AerialAssault]

43 minutes ago, Malclave said:

Hmmm. Socrates the Lich King, Necro/ Time MM where the pets are other dead philosophers.

 

Other than that, what I always wondered was why heroes without powers had to register.

It's assumed that 'Natural' heroes have mental or physical capabilities far beyond what your standard, or even above average human could achieve. Someone who has naturally attuned their body to say, punch through sheets of steel (i.e. a Martial Arts character) would be on the FBSA's radar. In a similar vein, there are a number of psychics who have attained their powers through rigorous training and self-discipline. While they're still not technically super-powered, they possess abilities that no ordinary human could achieve.

 

Now, a hero without any notable powers (for example, can't throw a punch that can knock down a Mek Man) would still need to register to be afforded the legal protections that heroes receive, otherwise they'd basically just be a costumed cop and liable to all those same rules & regulations (see the Citizens Crime Fighting Act I linked further up).