Human-form PB: my single target DPS is awful

[Extor Prime]

So I rolled, IOd and incarnated a human-only PB on Justin, and I find that at the very least my single-target DPS is on an underwhelming side.

My build is below; I have permahasten, permalightform and all the usual stuff. Picked musculature core, degenerative core, barrier core, assault core and ionic core for incarnates. And... I couldn't even put a dent into a pylon, which means I cannot even achieve 101 DPS.

 

What should my ST rotation be? Is this even a realistic goal?

 

Build:

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Thanks in advance!

[Redlynne]

Have you ever considered Sorcery?

I hear Enflame helps with bragging rights versus Pylons.

 

[Extor Prime]

I don't care about bragging rights, I want some respectable single-target performance. The pylons are a good test of whether you can or can not hit 101 effective DPS, which is in most cases enough to grind down an AV (albeit slowly).

 

I read this forum and it's PB this and PB that, and I just want to know if it can be anything other than a plug for a hole on the team (which, let's face it, almost requires a triform). Sure, it can send a standard spawn packing, and look pretty good doing it, but with incarnates everyone can send a standard spawn packing. Now I won't lie, I'm completely enamored with the concept and the LOOK of a human-only PB (to the point that I fear that if I actually squeeze out proper performance from it, I'll abandon my VERY good controller main). But at my first go, the performance wasn't there at all. I compared the build I made to the ones from the forum, and everything lines up pretty well; again I won't lie, I haven't ever seriously played a PB, not even back on Live, so my immediate assumption is that I'm doing it wrong and screwing up the attack chain.

 

I'll certainly give sorcery a look if it helps with ST damage. Does Enflame remain helpful in general situations of single hard target takedowns, or is it just a crutch for the pylon runs?

[Redlynne]

Enflame    

Positron's Blast - Damage/Recharge: Level 27
Positron's Blast - Chance of Damage(Energy): Level 20
Annihilation - Accuracy/Damage/RechargeTime: Level 27
Annihilation - Chance for Res Debuff: Level 20
Frozen Blast - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge: Level 27
Frozen Blast - Recharge/Chance for Immobilize: Level 27

 

Positron's Blast (2) (Enflame): 2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery

Annihilation (2) (Enflame): 1.35% Max End

Frozen Blast (2) (Enflame): 10% ResEffect(SpeedRunning), 10% ResEffect(RechargeTime), 10% ResEffect(SpeedFlying)

 

The number of burn patches the power puts down/spawns gives you multiple bites at the apple (so to speak) per activation of the power for being able to score those procs.  The Immobilize proc helps keep stuff in the fire (so they warm up?).  The Resistance debuff makes your $Target(s) faceplant/explode faster.  The energy damage proc is self explanatory.

 

Now, obviously, this isn't a slotting optimized for Pylon burn downs for "max deeps" ... but it is a slotting that will be useful against anything mobile which doesn't teleport away periodically.

[Microcosm]

I'll add that you don't have any -res procs anywhere, which could help. Rstrike is your best dpa for single targets, so make sure you prioritize that and not IStrike. You might want to look to the Fighting pool to get to Cross Punch, which, if you take both Boxing and Kick on the way, is actually pretty good damage. I use Rstrike > Gleaming Blast > Cross Punch on my PB, and Photon Seekers whenever they're up. I'd definitely swap your slotting on Glinting Eye and Gleaming Blast (though putting a full set like that in Glinting Eye hurts a bit), and get the Apocalypse proc in there.

[Haijinx]

Im curious whether dwarf and nova have better single target dps than human form.

 

Since they both have better damage scale.

 

Tbh it shouldn't be necessary for anyone in any AT at the incarnate level to have to use pool powers to reach 101 dps.  

 

Is PB damage so low because of how their inherent works?  

[BGSacho]

(I use DPA to mean "Damage per animation second". DPA = Damage / cast time for a given skill)

 

The two big questions are: Do you have enough high DPA attacks to form an attack chain?

 

The highest ST DPA attacks for a human PB are, in order(with unslotted DPA given)

Photon Seekers - 122 DPA
Radiant Strike - 70 DPA

Quasar - 56 DPA

Incandescent Strike - 50 DPA

Gleaming Blast - 38 DPA

Glinting Eye - 24 DPA

An attack chain with your build's recharge levels should look roughly like this:
RS -> IS -> RS -> GB -> GE 
(You can replace GB/GE with Photon Seekers and Quasar when they're off CD for significant dmg boosts)

This attack chain achieves an unslotted DPS of 56, let's round it down to 50 for slightly easier math / to account for casting Inner Light. With dmg enhancement(100%), musculature(~30%), inner light(~70%), you're looking at 200% dmg for close to 150 dps.

 

Things you can do to improve your DPS:

Damage procs. RS gives you roughly 6 DPS per non-purple proc, IS and GB ~2.5 each. You can slot RS as 5-slot hecatomb + any other proc, IS with 5-slot crushing impact(from your RS) + a dmg proc, and GB with 5-slot apocalypse(with the dmg proc) + one more dmg proc - this slotting should give you ~20 dps more than your current setup.

 

-Res procs. PBs can easily slot achilles heel - that's a significant dmg boost if you can fit it into the rotation, e.g. in GB and GE.

 

Cross Punch? I haven't tested it thoroughy, but Cross Punch with Boxing + Kicking is almost surely higher DPA than GE(I think it deals roughly the same damage as smite). Being able to replace GE with a "smite-like" skill would net you another ~15 DPS.

Between these suggestions and the usage of Quasar/Photon Seekers into the build(especially just after inner light), you should be able to break 200 DPS.

 

 

The lack of high DPA attacks to flesh out the rotation really hurts PB ST dps - falling back to GB/GE is painful. To put these numbers into some perspective - stj stalkers form an attack chain of 80-100 DPA skills, at least a third of which will be crits. If you can find a way to fit more higher DPA skills into your attack chain, that would be the solution for more DPS.

 

As an aside - damage scale isn't really relevant, since the different forms don't really share the same skills. For example, human form blast is the same DPA as nova form blast, and radiant strike is higher DPA than dwarf smite.

Here's some form DPAs for PBs:

Nova Blast - 38 DPA

Nova Eye - 41 DPA
Dwarf Smite - 42 DPA

Nova Form of course has the extra benefit of +45% dmg. With the numbers used earlier, we can compare human blast(73 dmg + 200% dmg = 219) vs Nova Blast(66 dmg + 245% dmg = 230) - the damage isn't hugely different.




 

Edited August 22, 2019 by BGSacho

[BGSacho]

What about tri-form warshades?

PROs:
High DPA attacks - Gravity Well(74 DPA), Black Dwarf Mire(60 DPA), Dwarf Smite, Nova Eye.
Proc monsters - Gravity Well, Gravitic Emanations(!), Black Dwarf Drain(!) can be slotted with procs to achieve decent DPA
Essences can achieve higher sustained DPS than photon seekers

CONs:
Not as much +dmg% vs 1 mob(~40% vs ~70%, assuming you slot build up into sunless mire, which is more questionable than inner light)
RS is more DPS than gravity well due to its low recharge

Black Dwarf Mire is high DPA but low DPS
Photon Seekers are obviously better than no essences
Inner Light frontloads a lot of its +dmg%, which allows you to use it with high DPA attacks. Mires just provided a steady +dmg%.

What would a rotation look like?
Black Dwarf Mire -> Gravity Well -> Smite -> Nova Eye -> Nova Blast

This gives you a baseline of ~52 DPS, lower than a human-form PB, but not significantly so. This chain can be optimized to not use Smite(or Nova Blast) with high recharge, but I prefer the lower recharge version and slotting more procs into my powers instead.



 

Edited August 22, 2019 by BGSacho

[Auroxis]

For a Human PB you have four key attacks: Radiant Strike, Gleaming Blast, Incandescent Strike, and Cross Punch.

 

All four attacks are decent DPA (for a PB) and can fit lots of procs (including four purple procs).

[Extor Prime]

OK, I definitely could work in some damage procs into the build and an Achilles Heel here and there as well.

What are your thoughts on using the Gleaming Bolt as an additional Achilles Heel carrier? I don't think I can find many slots for it, but as a one-slotted power specifically for AH proc it could work. Or would it cause effective DPS loss?

[Auroxis]

Gleaming Bolt isn't effective for procs due to its fast recharge time, i'd just leave it behind after leveling. No need to slot it.

[Iron Alex]

On 8/22/2019 at 10:08 AM, Extor Prime said:

OK, I definitely could work in some damage procs into the build and an Achilles Heel here and there as well.

What are your thoughts on using the Gleaming Bolt as an additional Achilles Heel carrier? I don't think I can find many slots for it, but as a one-slotted power specifically for AH proc it could work. Or would it cause effective DPS loss?

hey regarding the Achilles heal.. Ive been searching the old forums, studying to learn from the past as well as the present. a player name john_printems was discussing about pb dps and that Achilles heal actually gimmped it more. Then microcasm answered after that about changing attack chain. 

 

http://web.archive.org/web/20120906205000/http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=291838&page=2

 

so what is the verdict on Achilles heal in the new PPM world..?

[Auroxis]

Achilles' Heel doesn't proc any differently, you just need to avoid placing procs into fast recharging powers like Glinting Eye and Gleaming Bolt if you want to make the most out of them. Radiant Strike and Gleaming Blast are good candidates for Achilles' Heel.

Edited August 28, 2019 by Auroxis

[Hyperstrike]

Here's my Human Form.
Technically he took Dwarf.  But it's a bunch of mules, nothing more.

Attack Chain: Radiant Strike --> Incandescent Strike --> Radiant Strike
Estimated DPS: 195.7795

 

Hero Plan by Hero Hero Designer 2.23
https://github.com/ImaginaryDevelopment/imaginary-hero-designer

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Eclipse Phase ACTUAL - NOT IN ORDER: Level 50 Natural Peacebringer
Primary Power Set: Luminous Blast
Secondary Power Set: Luminous Aura
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Leadership

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Gleaming Bolt -- Dcm-Acc/Dmg(A), Dcm-Dmg/EndRdx(11), Dcm-Dmg/Rchg(11), Dcm-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(13), Dcm-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(13)
Level 1: Incandescence -- ImpArm-ResPsi(A)
Level 2: Gleaming Blast -- Apc-Dmg/Rchg(A), Apc-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(15), Apc-Acc/Rchg(15), Apc-Dmg/EndRdx(17), Apc-Dam%(17)
Level 4: Shining Shield -- ImpArm-ResPsi(A)
Level 6: Radiant Strike -- Hct-Dmg/Rchg(A), Hct-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(23), Hct-Acc/Rchg(23), Hct-Dmg/EndRdx(25), Hct-Dam%(25)
Level 8: Proton Scatter -- PstBls-Acc/Dmg(A), PstBls-Dmg/EndRdx(27), PstBls-Dmg/Rchg(27), PstBls-Dmg/Rng(29), PstBls-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(29)
Level 10: Essence Boost -- Pnc-Heal/EndRedux(A), Pnc-EndRdx/Rchg(31), Pnc-Heal/Rchg(31), Pnc-Heal/EndRedux/Rchg(31), Pnc-Heal(33), ImpArm-ResPsi(33)
Level 12: Inner Light -- AdjTrg-ToHit(A), AdjTrg-ToHit/Rchg(33), AdjTrg-ToHit/EndRdx/Rchg(34), AdjTrg-EndRdx/Rchg(34), AdjTrg-ToHit/EndRdx(34), RctRtc-Pcptn(36)
Level 14: Luminous Detonation -- Rgn-Dmg/Rchg(A), Rgn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(36), Rgn-Acc/Rchg(36), Rgn-Dmg/EndRdx(37), Rgn-Knock%(37)
Level 16: Thermal Shield -- ImpArm-ResPsi(A)
Level 18: Incandescent Strike -- SprEssTrn-Acc/Dmg(A), SprEssTrn-Dmg/Rchg(37), SprEssTrn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(39), SprEssTrn-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(39), SprEssTrn-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(39), SprEssTrn-Rchg/Global Heal(40)
Level 20: Quantum Shield -- ImpArm-ResPsi(A)
Level 22: White Dwarf -- Ags-Psi/Status(A)
Level 24: Reform Essence -- Prv-Heal(A), Prv-Heal/EndRdx(40), Prv-EndRdx/Rchg(40), Prv-Heal/Rchg(42), Prv-Heal/Rchg/EndRdx(42), Prv-Absorb%(42)
Level 26: Solar Flare -- SprAvl-Acc/Dmg(A), SprAvl-Dmg/EndRdx(43), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(43), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(43), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(45), SprAvl-Rchg/KDProc(45)
Level 28: Kick -- FrcFdb-Rechg%(A)
Level 30: Tough -- GldArm-3defTpProc(A), StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(45), UnbGrd-Max HP%(46)
Level 32: Dawn Strike -- SprKhlGrc-Acc/Dmg(A), SprKhlGrc-Dmg/Rchg(46), SprKhlGrc-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(46), SprKhlGrc-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(48), SprKhlGrc-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(48), SprKhlGrc-Rchg/FormBuff(48)
Level 35: Restore Essence -- RgnTss-Regen+(A)
Level 38: Light Form -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(50)
Level 41: Weave -- LucoftheG-Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def(50)
Level 44: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(50)
Level 47: Combat Jumping -- LucoftheG-Rchg+(A)
Level 49: Maneuvers -- LucoftheG-Rchg+(A)
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Cosmic Balance
Level 1: Energy Flight -- BlsoftheZ-ResKB(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 10: Combat Flight -- LucoftheG-Rchg+(A)
Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Health -- Pnc-Heal/+End(A), NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(19), Mrc-Rcvry+(19)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A), PrfShf-EndMod(21)
Level 22: White Dwarf Antagonize -- MckBrt-Taunt(A), MckBrt-Taunt/Rchg(3), MckBrt-Taunt/Rchg/Rng(3), MckBrt-Acc/Rchg(5), MckBrt-Taunt/Rng(5), MckBrt-Rchg(7)
Level 22: White Dwarf Flare -- FrcFdb-Rechg%(A)
Level 22: White Dwarf Smite -- FrcFdb-Rechg%(A)
Level 22: White Dwarf Step -- Empty(A)
Level 22: White Dwarf Strike -- FrcFdb-Rechg%(A)
Level 22: White Dwarf Sublimation -- Pnc-Heal/EndRedux(A), Pnc-EndRdx/Rchg(7), Pnc-Heal/Rchg(9), Pnc-Heal/EndRedux/Rchg(9), Pnc-Heal(21)
Level 50: Cardiac Core Paragon
------------
------------

 

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