Obitus

If your point is simply to compare the damage you gain from each Hybrid Assault power, in absolute terms, then I think I understand where you're coming from. If, for example, the base damage of your power (adjusted by AT scalar) is 100, then adding +75% in +damage will always give you 75 damage per attack. (As long as the +75% damage buff doesn't get cut off by the cap, anyway.) And if the double hit proc, likewise, is always just the base damage of the power (unadjusted by AT damage scalar), then you'll always get that number. You can certainly compare in those terms, and if I jumped past that too quickly, then I apologize. But I also think it's worth clarifying for other readers that when your example says "Assault Core multiplies all damage by 1.75," you don't actually mean that Assault Core is a separate, multiplicative damage boost. The net benefit of that +75% damage will shift wildly based on the player's other +damage buffs. Likewise, the net value of any proc effect, regardless of its PPM, will look much stronger if you attack very slowly (using powers with commensurately long recharge timers and low base damage, as in the example).

Ok, lemme see if I understand you correctly: 1. You're saying that the +damage buff from Hybrid Assault Core is net, i.e. separate from normal +damage buffs? Because if it isn't, then like it or not, damage slotting (among other +damage buffs) is an important consideration for determining the net value of the buff. On the other hand, if Assault Core is a net damage buff, as your numbers imply, then that's a huge honking deal, but your early description of the power's function suggests the opposite, when you say that Assault Core's +damage respects the damage cap. 2. I understand that the double hit doesn't scale with the AT damage scalar, which is why I kept your 600 damage figure. This is one of those important bits of info for which I thanked you at the beginning of my post. I haven't yet had a chance to earn Hybrid on any of my characters, so all of this is new to me. 3. I admit that my memory of how procs work is foggy, but my understanding was that a proc with, e.g. a 6 procs-per-minute baseline would provide more-or-less 6 procs per minute regardless of how often you use the powers in question. Now I seem to recall that the PPM mechanic does take into account recharge slotting, such that e.g. a power with 60s base recharge slotted for 100% recharge would have its proc chance basically cut in half. But the PPM mechanic doesn't take into account global recharge from haste or IO set bonuses. Is that right? If so, then yeah, you could potentially end up with more than six procs, but still it's worth noting that a 6 PPM proc looks a lot better (like a higher proportion of the baseline damage) when you assume an unrealistically slow attack rate of 10 per minute. 4. Or maybe the Hybrid Assault Radial's proc effect has a higher PPM? It's hard to find numbers on this.

This is great information. Quantitative data about newer powers/mechanics is generally very hard to find - so I'm grateful to find this thread. That said, if your description of Hybrid Assault's mechanics is accurate, then I'm not sure the examples you provided afterwards are useful/relevant. For example, if Hybrid Assault Radial only gives us a second hit of the base damage (not modified by AT scalars), then its proportion of the total will plummet if the player uses standard damage slotting (+95% damage), not to mention other damage buffs. This principle holds for the Hybrid Assault Core too, of course. Likewise and perhaps most importantly, most players will attack more than 10 times per minute. It's difficult to make a precise estimate across all builds and powersets, but I suspect the truth is closer to 30-40 attacks per minute on average. So unless I'm misunderstanding something, which is entirely possible, your Scrapper examples should look more like this: Radial Scrapper: 30 hits for 112 damage = 3360 damage * 1.95 slotting = 6552 damage 3 critical hits for = 3 * 112 * 1.95 = 655.2 damage 6 doublehit procs for = 600 damage 6552+655.2+600 = 7807.2 damage over a minute. Core Scrapper: 30 hits for 112 * (1 + 0.95 slotting + 0.75 hybrid) = 9072 damage 3 critical hits for 112 * (1 + 0.95 slotting + 0.75 hybrid) = 907.2 = 9979.2 damage over 1 minute 9979.2-7807.2= 2172 extra damage you're dealing each minute with Core over Radial as a scrapper. This comparison, again if I understand it correctly, will shift quite a bit as the player gains/sheds damage bonuses. In the extreme case, for instance, if the player gets Fulcrum Shifted to the damage cap, then the Core boost will do literally nothing. Just based on the idea that Radial has a soft limit of 6 procs per minute, though, my suspicion is that the Core will generally be better, almost regardless of the player's AT damage scalar. Then again, it's not clear to me how often/consistently the player can stack the +damage from the Core boost. Please do correct me if I'm wrong on all of the above. I appreciate the discussion. (Actually, it occurs to me that we were both double counting the crit damage, because 10 attacks with one of them being a crit should yield 11x single-attack damage, not 12x - or in my case, 33x single-attack damage, not 36x. I've fixed that now.)

Ha, don't feel bad. The other night, I managed to spend 140 million on 14 stacks of converters. 126 million down the tubes, but at least someone got an early Christmas present. And hey, sometimes painful lessons are the best ones. Always, always, double check your digits before you go on a rapid fire buying spree. And maybe avoid marketeering while intoxicated :P

I've only just discovered this new version of CoH, so this might be presumptuous, or premature (or my info might be out of date), but I thought I'd link to my ancient thread with a fairly exhaustive comparison of Street Justice and Martial Arts attack chains: https://web.archive.org/web/20120905235041/http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=276359 Wow, it's crazy to be back.