Demons/Dark/Soul End Level Build Feeback Please

[Two5boy]

Hi everyone,

I've been playing my Demons/Dark/Soul Mastermind for a while now, and I've worked hard to min/max it using ideas and suggestions I've gathered from forum posts. However, I'd love to get more direct feedback from the community on improving my build further.

My Ultimate Goals

1. Handle +4/x8 content reliably.
2. Solo GMs and AVs.
3. Solo Trials, if possible.

Current Choices

I’ve picked my Epic Pool and Incarnates based on theme rather than raw performance. I’m aware that Banished Pantheon Lore pets or something like Mu Patron or Ice Epic might be more effective choices, and I’m open to switching if necessary to hit my goals.

At the moment, my Alpha is T4, and the rest of my Incarnates are T3.

What I’m Looking For

I’d appreciate any advice on:

• Slotting optimizations for my pets and powers.
• Set bonuses I should prioritize to improve survivability, endurance, or damage output.
• Ideas for better synergy between Demons/Dark/Soul and my chosen powers.
• Suggestions for Incarnate abilities or Epic pools that might fit my goals.

Thanks in advance for taking the time to help! Looking forward to your ideas and suggestions.

 

Regards

Darkest Night v3.mbd

[StrikerFox]

Consider scaling back on the S/L res. The T2 Ember Demon provides +15% res to S/L/T, +20% to F, and +10% to C (Which Mids' does not show). Those percentages are at lvl 50, unenhanced. 

 

Darkest Night, Cloud Senses over Dark Watchers. 

 

Are you going to run with Ageless Destiny? If not, I think the build will struggle with endurance at times, especially if powers are being spammed. Just using Howling Twilight, Soul Tentacles and Soul Storm is over 50 end in 6 seconds.

 

Have you tried building with the newer Dark Mastery PP. Just wondering if more resistances can get to +75%. Ember Demon providing +res to S/L/F/C/T, Shadow Fall providing E/N/P and Murky Cloud F/C/E/N. Tough, Shield Wall, Reactive Defense and set bonuses to top it all off. The Howling Twilight and Dark Pit, double stun combo might be fun. Also Soul Consumption might help with any endurance issues (Though I've never used it).

 

I typically slot the MM for survivability and enough endurance to sustain the build. I slot pets for damage while still integrating unique pet IOs. This is probably how I would slot the pets. Don't worry too much about the T1 pet endurance. Only the Cold Demonling will struggle after 5 mins of non-stop attacking.

 

MinMax Demon Pet Slotting.mbd

[Onlyasandwich]

Other than what @StrikerFox mentioned about resists from the Demons, a pretty good build overall! Not too far off from how I handled my own of the same combo.

 

The biggest issue will likely be end sustainability. It's pretty major here. You only have 1 end/sec positive, even accounting for accolades. Ageless can certainly solve this if you're comfortable relying on it, though this won't help you at lower levels or exemping. Twilight Grasp with the Theft proc as you have helps a heckuva lot, but as is you'll just be spamming it constantly to stay afloat and sometimes get unlucky.

 

I went more proc-tastic on my own build. As a result, yours is a bit sturdier, and will be more capable on hard targets like AV's and GM's, which you've said is a priority.

 

Proc bombing Howling Twilight gets you a decent little nuke, but the up-time is so low that I don't find it to be worthwhile. I prefer to get some recharge and lean on it for its basic functionality.

 

I wouldn't sleep on the whip attacks! They are a good force multiplier for your demons with their -res, and can be procced out to do really good damage. Also have some good FFback opportunities that will feed the other parts of your build.

 

Here's my build for comparison. I have a decent chunk more recovery, and this build still struggles with blue:

Demon Dark.mbd

 

I can plow through +4X8 if I'm on my toes, but have to be really aggressive about ensuring my debuffs and controls are down. Once you account for the resist buff from the Ember demon, my resists are also pretty comparable to what you have here. I don't know that this combo will ever be "swim in the chaos without worry" on this setting, but you can definitely wrestle hard content into submission. Going into bodyguard and spamming Twilight Grasp will get you through quite a bit if you keep things tight.

 

For a defensive layer, I've focused mostly low hanging fruit for ranged defense, allowing Fearsome, Fluffy, and Darkest Night to pick up the slack when it really counts.

Edited December 31, 2024 by Onlyasandwich

[DocMidknight]

   I'm loving all the proc'd out slotting of powers, I went a little different approach in my build......more because I suffer from scrapperlock on my little dark one. Built for resist and defense without the need of the shields from the demon and can handle most things without an issue when I'm focused. I really wanted to add more of the soul powers to her but I had certain things that I had to have for her build, mostly due to my insane playstyle and her desire to hover/fly instead of walking. My usual tactic is send in the boys, hit howling twilight and then my heal to replenish my end bar followed by a little fear and whip attacks.......strangely she still manners to survive even with my best attempts to get her hospitalled

DoD.mbd

[Two5boy]

15 hours ago, StrikerFox said:

Consider scaling back on the S/L res. The T2 Ember Demon provides +15% res to S/L/T, +20% to F, and +10% to C (Which Mids' does not show). Those percentages are at lvl 50, unenhanced. 

 

Darkest Night, Cloud Senses over Dark Watchers. 

 

Are you going to run with Ageless Destiny? If not, I think the build will struggle with endurance at times, especially if powers are being spammed. Just using Howling Twilight, Soul Tentacles and Soul Storm is over 50 end in 6 seconds.

 

Have you tried building with the newer Dark Mastery PP. Just wondering if more resistances can get to +75%. Ember Demon providing +res to S/L/F/C/T, Shadow Fall providing E/N/P and Murky Cloud F/C/E/N. Tough, Shield Wall, Reactive Defense and set bonuses to top it all off. The Howling Twilight and Dark Pit, double stun combo might be fun. Also Soul Consumption might help with any endurance issues (Though I've never used it).

 

I typically slot the MM for survivability and enough endurance to sustain the build. I slot pets for damage while still integrating unique pet IOs. This is probably how I would slot the pets. Don't worry too much about the T1 pet endurance. Only the Cold Demonling will struggle after 5 mins of non-stop attacking.

 

MinMax Demon Pet Slotting.mbd 17.58 kB · 2 downloads

Thanks very much @StrikerFox the slotting tips and changes are really helpful.  I think I am will change my slotting based on your suggestions.  I am impressed how you manage to get 2 procs on demonlings and still got good enhancements.

 

I been thinking of Dark Mastery but I like the visuals on Soul tentacles and storm and see what I can achieve with Murky Cloud.  Also good idea on the resistance as I forgot about the ember demons buffs on Mids.

 

Also do you think it is not worth enhancing Demons Resistance and healing?

 

Really appreciate this

Edited January 1 by Two5boy

[Two5boy]

14 hours ago, Onlyasandwich said:

Other than what @StrikerFox mentioned about resists from the Demons, a pretty good build overall! Not too far off from how I handled my own of the same combo.

 

The biggest issue will likely be end sustainability. It's pretty major here. You only have 1 end/sec positive, even accounting for accolades. Ageless can certainly solve this if you're comfortable relying on it, though this won't help you at lower levels or exemping. Twilight Grasp with the Theft proc as you have helps a heckuva lot, but as is you'll just be spamming it constantly to stay afloat and sometimes get unlucky.

 

I went more proc-tastic on my own build. As a result, yours is a bit sturdier, and will be more capable on hard targets like AV's and GM's, which you've said is a priority.

 

Proc bombing Howling Twilight gets you a decent little nuke, but the up-time is so low that I don't find it to be worthwhile. I prefer to get some recharge and lean on it for its basic functionality.

 

I wouldn't sleep on the whip attacks! They are a good force multiplier for your demons with their -res, and can be procced out to do really good damage. Also have some good FFback opportunities that will feed the other parts of your build.

 

Here's my build for comparison. I have a decent chunk more recovery, and this build still struggles with blue:

Demon Dark.mbd 42.46 kB · 3 downloads

 

I can plow through +4X8 if I'm on my toes, but have to be really aggressive about ensuring my debuffs and controls are down. Once you account for the resist buff from the Ember demon, my resists are also pretty comparable to what you have here. I don't know that this combo will ever be "swim in the chaos without worry" on this setting, but you can definitely wrestle hard content into submission. Going into bodyguard and spamming Twilight Grasp will get you through quite a bit if you keep things tight.

 

For a defensive layer, I've focused mostly low hanging fruit for ranged defense, allowing Fearsome, Fluffy, and Darkest Night to pick up the slack when it really counts.

Thank you @Onlyasandwich for sharing your build.  I wasn't sure about the whip attacks but you might have swayed me.  You have some really good power ideas which I am going to look through

[Two5boy]

8 hours ago, DocMidknight said:

   I'm loving all the proc'd out slotting of powers, I went a little different approach in my build......more because I suffer from scrapperlock on my little dark one. Built for resist and defense without the need of the shields from the demon and can handle most things without an issue when I'm focused. I really wanted to add more of the soul powers to her but I had certain things that I had to have for her build, mostly due to my insane playstyle and her desire to hover/fly instead of walking. My usual tactic is send in the boys, hit howling twilight and then my heal to replenish my end bar followed by a little fear and whip attacks.......strangely she still manners to survive even with my best attempts to get her hospitalled

DoD.mbd 48.03 kB · 0 downloads

Thank you @DocMidknight - I am impressed you managed to get such high defence!  I didn't think about Agility Core - I might give it a try and see how it works out.  I also want degenerative but went down the reactive route and I am at T3 so need to weight and build a another degenerative once I re-done my Alpha

[StrikerFox]

6 hours ago, Two5boy said:

Also do you think it is not worth enhancing Demons Resistance and healing?

 

Heals, no; resistance, depends. 

We can't really trust pets to use their heal at the right time, in the correct location and/or target. Consider yourself to be the healer. Anything the Ember Demon and Dark Servant heals is just bonus. 

Resistance depending on your build and what you're satisfied with. On your build, Demons is slotted with a +46.41% res buff. So S/L/T res will bump up from +15% to around +22%, fire res from +20% to around +29% and cold from +10% to close to +15%. Pet's will get lower as the MM gets an extra 5ish% from the Ember Demon buffs. I don't believe the Ember Demon receives any of it's own buffs so makes no difference to it.

Pet-wise, the pet unique IOs will do more for them than enhancing +res on the Ember Demon. +10% res from Sovereign/Expedient or +5% def from Edict/CtA VS +5% to S/L/T, +7% to F and +3% to C (Those percentages are on top of the base amounts). But if you decide to slot for +res, drop the procs from the Demonlings.

[Two5boy]

So I updated my build to include Dark Mastery but I am struggling to get S/L to high enough level with Murky Cloud @StrikerFox any ideas how I can improve this or do you think I am fine at 37.56% before Ember demon buff?

 

I am also struggling to get a Whip attach in so I might revisit Shadowy binds.  I do miss Soul Tentacles on Soul Mastery

 

 

Darkest Night v4 Dark Mastery.mbd

[StrikerFox]

11 hours ago, Two5boy said:

So I updated my build to include Dark Mastery but I am struggling to get S/L to high enough level with Murky Cloud @StrikerFox any ideas how I can improve this or do you think I am fine at 37.56% before Ember demon buff?

 

I am also struggling to get a Whip attach in so I might revisit Shadowy binds.  I do miss Soul Tentacles on Soul Mastery

 

 

Darkest Night v4 Dark Mastery.mbd 45.5 kB · 0 downloads

 

Managed to get there. With Ember Demon's buff, S/L/F/E/N will be at +75%. Cold will be at +65%. Swapping IOs around lost a bunch of +recharge and the procs in Demonlings were removed. Also endurance looks worse so that's probably an issue. I think +50% total S/L res is enough unless you're soloing really hard content at 4x8. I just wanted to know if /Dark could get there easily with Murky Cloud. Thanks for trying it out!

 

Darkest Night v4 Dark Mastery2.mbd

[Two5boy]

2 hours ago, StrikerFox said:

 

Managed to get there. With Ember Demon's buff, S/L/F/E/N will be at +75%. Cold will be at +65%. Swapping IOs around lost a bunch of +recharge and the procs in Demonlings were removed. Also endurance looks worse so that's probably an issue. I think +50% total S/L res is enough unless you're soloing really hard content at 4x8. I just wanted to know if /Dark could get there easily with Murky Cloud. Thanks for trying it out!

 

Darkest Night v4 Dark Mastery2.mbd 46.01 kB · 2 downloads

Thanks for looking at it @StrikerFox. Looks like too many sacrifices need to be made to achieve the resistances in your build. I might tinker a bit and see if I can closer without losing too much recharge, endurance and damage. 

[StrikerFox]

Not sure if everyone knows this but Mids' has a set bonus search feature. Click the WINDOWS tab in Mids, and scroll down to SET INSPECTOR. In the pop-up window, pick what's needed in the three drop down menus. Resistances, Smashing and 3% for example. It will list the IOs with the three prerequisites and the number of IOs needed to get it.

 

[Two5boy]

I am wondering if anyone has tried Ice mastery and what do you think about it?

 

I am thinking it looks a pretty awesome epic with S/L defence along with C/F resistance. 
 

Also with Hoarfrost you can increase your HP with only around 30s ish downtime