sentinel Semi-Reworking the Sentinel into a tanky ranged AT (or, really, anything to make Sentinel better)

[tidge]

45 minutes ago, Uun said:

Sentinels have multiple fast cycling PBAoEs/TAoEs in addition to the nuke. Scrappers typically have no more than one.

 

This feels more like an observation that the Blaster primaries were ported to Sentinels instead of the Scrapper primaries.

[Rudra]

51 minutes ago, tidge said:

1 hour ago, Uun said:

Sentinels have multiple fast cycling PBAoEs/TAoEs in addition to the nuke. Scrappers typically have no more than one.

 

This feels more like an observation that the Blaster primaries were ported to Sentinels instead of the Scrapper primaries.

I'm not sure about the purpose of this statement. With modifications, it is the Blaster primaries on Sentinels. Sentinels are basically shorter range Blasters with armor sets rather than manipulation sets. (Edit: And yes, since they get full armor sets, they lose out on the damage and range.)

 

Edited yesterday at 01:46 AM by Rudra

[tidge]

10 hours ago, Rudra said:

I'm not sure about the purpose of this statement. With modifications, it is the Blaster primaries on Sentinels. Sentinels are basically shorter range Blasters with armor sets rather than manipulation sets. (Edit: And yes, since they get full armor sets, they lose out on the damage and range.)

 

The "statement" is a "no duh, Sentinels have (essentially) Blaster primaries"...yet for me the "Ranged Scrapper" take is more true to my experience. Sentinels don't play like armored Blasters for me... and if I am being honest about my own initial perceptions, trying to play a Sentinel like an armored Blaster was a disappointing experience.

 

"Sentinels are armored Blasters" is one take, but for me... Sentinels and Blasters play very differently. My Blasters tend to be Blappers, and because Blasters are much more fragile, they don't get played like the armored classes. As I wrote earlier... the main playstyle difference between Scrappers and Sentinels is that in fights, Sentinels have a LOT more targets of opportunity compared to Scrappers (because of the 8 ft melee range). Blappers have even more targets of opportunity than Sentinels (longer ranges) but my Blasters are trying to cycle AoE and spawn-wipe before they take too much damage... the armors of the Sentinels mean that they can be a lot more casual, and their poorer damage/AoE (compared to Blasters) makes them feel a lot more like Scrappers who happen to have range > 8 feet.

 

The change to Vulnerability was IMO enough of a re-tinkering for Sentinels. There are a handful of individual powers in sets that I could support being revised, but (writing only for myself) I feel that because Homecoming has been nearly endlessly porting primary and secondary power sets between ATs that many of my perceptions in this spectrum have been dulled... Sentinels get rather ho-hum (less effective) Blaster primaries combined with secondaries that can be 'set and forget'... so I can see why people have different opinions about how to categorize them.

 

EDIT: I suppose I should add this... There is an AT that (to my experience) plays like an "Armored Blaster", the Arachnos Soldier. We don't get much variety in the types of "blasts" with either of the paths obviously. For my feels, a Soldier that focuses on the melee is a lot like a Blaster doing similar from the secondary melee picks, but it is the ranged attacks on the Soldiers that get the job done.

Edited 19 hours ago by tidge

[Rudra]

16 hours ago, tidge said:

"Sentinels are armored Blasters" is one take, but for me... Sentinels and Blasters play very differently. My Blasters tend to be Blappers, and because Blasters are much more fragile, they don't get played like the armored classes. As I wrote earlier... the main playstyle difference between Scrappers and Sentinels is that in fights, Sentinels have a LOT more targets of opportunity compared to Scrappers (because of the 8 ft melee range). Blappers have even more targets of opportunity than Sentinels (longer ranges) but my Blasters are trying to cycle AoE and spawn-wipe before they take too much damage... the armors of the Sentinels mean that they can be a lot more casual, and their poorer damage/AoE (compared to Blasters) makes them feel a lot more like Scrappers who happen to have range > 8 feet.

I feel Sentinels are more akin to armored Blasters than they are to ranged Scrappers. Regardless, Sentinels play like Sentinels, not like Blasters or Scrappers. They lack the range and damage output of Blasters. They lack the crits of Scrappers and also vastly outrange Scrappers. (I don't care how little range anyone thinks 60 feet is, it is still much better range than the typical 7 feet of a Scrapper.) If players approach Sentinels thinking "Blaster" except with armor, they are going to be disappointed because the reduced range puts them in close combat sooner than Blasters (other than melee-locked Blappers) and their attacks lack the power to clear the field as fast as Blasters. If players approach Sentinels thinking "Scrapper" except with range, they are going to be disappointed because Sentinels take the approach of consistent damage and lack the damage output of a Scrapper to clear the field as fast as a Scrapper in melee range. And if players approach Sentinels as "support" because of their inherent, they are going to be disappointed because despite the inherent, Sentinels are not a support AT, they are a consistent damage AT that can take hits.

 

Add to that the push to change the inherent because it doesn't stack and I'm left going "WTH?" because at least Sentinels have an inherent that benefits the team unlike other damage ATs or even just high durability ATs that focus on benefitting themselves. (Tankers with their Gauntlet is an exception to that, but even Gauntlet doesn't bolster the team, it shields the team. Sentinels can bolster the team, but their design emphasizes durability and consistency to me.) (Edit: And before anyone argues that you aren't losing effect from having multiple Tankers on a team versus multiple Sentinels? You actually kind of are. Because no target can be under the effects of a taunt from more than one source. I'm not sure, but I believe taunts don't stack, just replace, so you can't even layer them on a single target from different Tankers to hold its attention. And if two or more Tankers are trying to taunt an opponent? Only one of them is able to at a time. And no matter how fast a Tanker, Brute, or Scrapper gets their taunt effect power's recharge down to? They can never layer that taunt source, just replace/renew.) (Edit again: Followed by Tankers can taunt different enemies is matched by Sentinels can use Vulnerability on different enemies.)

 

So in the end, my advice to anyone trying a Sentinel is to play it as a Sentinel. Not as a Blaster, not as a Scrapper, and not as a Support. As a mid-range armor AT that just happens to be able to knock down a target's DEF and damage resists consistently regardless of level difference. You aren't going to be the hero of the team taking down AV's in a few hits. You aren't going to be the meat shield of the team (though you can build for it with the Presence pool) except with strategic positioning and the willingness of teammates to stand behind you. You aren't going to be the primary close combatant of the team (unless your team lacks melee types). What you are is consistent ranged damage that can stand there and blast targets, such as to bait them into closing with you for the melees to shred without aggroing extra spawns or fearing the alpha from the spawn when you get their attention, that doesn't really care if the fight gets intense or brutal.

 

Edited 3 hours ago by Rudra