Tenebrose

Any thoughts on if this will help alleviate the issues with the Auction House, Character Items, and Super Packs? Or if this will allow the removal of the timers put on claiming items from character items? A while back, these became issues for some players, where character items and some features (like super packs) would lock up entirely until the next reboot. Often it would happen after placing items on the AH. I don't recall all the details (the posts are here in the forums), but some of the blame was placed on Excelsior's server woes. Changes were put into place to limit the speed of claiming items, where attempting to claim items faster than one in about a second would essentially lock up your ability to claim more items for around 5 seconds. Also last week, for the first time in probably over a year, I had character items and super packs lock up for hours with the reply of Character or Account item claim failed, another request is pending.

Ultima Online has survived for over two decades on nostalgia. I'd wager that, with so few updates and an interface from the stone ages, nostalgia is its greatest asset. So nostalgia is a powerful engine. But nostalgia isn't the only thing that makes this game run. It's an enjoyable casual game with unique mechanics and an awesome dedicated player base.

Players leave for shiny, new stuff. Then they return when they realize that the game they've loved for years is still the right fit for them.

Still can't claim items or open Super Packs reliably. It's now been about a month since this became basically unusable. This has been a chronic issue for well over a year. Until about a month ago, things were manageable. Annoying, but managable. Now, it's been days since I've been able to get anything out of Email -> Character Items. I was hoping the updates for the new Page would clear things up, even unintentionally via a reboot or reindex. But it's still a no go. I wasn't even on for the last few days, and still can't claim items. Is this just going to be the state of Character Items going forward? Should we avoid Super Packs? How are we supposed to claim items we already have in Character Items or open packs we already have? If the answer is, "Homecoming is not supporting Super Packs anymore" or "We are going to limit the Super Packs / Character Items in some way", that would be nice to know.

This has been an issue in the past. The "fix" at that time was to put a timer on how quickly items could be pulled from email. But now the email system is again essentially unusable. My understanding at this point is that the original system was implemented by people who didn't understand how to design a responsive SQL database. For all the more this needs to do, there's no reason for the lag we are seeing. I'm not privy to the code, but this is likely one of two things: a poorly designed database, or poor implementation of an ORM.

Obviously they hated SQL because they didn't know how to use SQL. "Inserts are SLOW" "Per row overhead is high on updates" "This was Bad" & "This was Good" But "CrypticDB" was a good laugh. You can always tell when a developer has no DB management background. They always want to relegate it to a secondary concern over what they know.

I didn't know that was still an active "thing". It looks more like a zombie thread. I expressed my interest in helping out on this specific issue directly to the engineer working on it last year. Felt a little more useful than adding my name to a thread that's been posted to literally once a year for the last 2 years, especially since I was only offering to help for this one issue at the time and not applying for a "development" role.

I'd have to first perform the blood ritual to sell my soul to the entity that runs the server. I mean, I'm cool with that. My soul's only worth about $1.33 now anyways. I can do without drama, tho.

After opening an untold number of packs over the last year, I'm 99% certain it's a built-in delay. It is consistently at the point when the 4th card is halfway flipped. If you try just before that, you'll get the message. Occasionally, the queuing issue does extend that time more, but since last year, I've never been able to open a pack before the 4th card is approximately halfway through it's flip. There's no logical reason that opening a pack would consistently cause a 3 second (approximate) delay due to the queue, while nothing else appears to have that long of a delay. If it was the queue itself, we should see less of a delay when few people are on and more of a delay when more people are on. But that's not happening. Most likely, the five items are all added to the queue as separate records as soon as the pack is opened and the contents generated. In the meantime, the gump handles displaying what was just sent to the queue and controls the chat entries. That would explain why the items immediately appear in email, and why the engineer was concerned enough to add a longer delay to opening the packs.

There is a built in delay on opening the packs. If you try to open the packs before the 4th card flips halfway, you'll get the "please wait" message. I'm sure it's a timed delay that I never timed, but the cards flipping are consistent and that comes out to the 4th card flips halfway. So it's probably like 3 second or somesuch. You get all the rewards as soon as you open the pack, even if the cards don't flip. You can confirm this by looking at your email when the "cards flipping" gump opens, especially something that comes up often, like converters or unslotters. You'll see that the items appear immediately in your email before the cards even start flipping. Even the messages you receive in chat are only delayed to not spoil what you are getting: They normally appear as each card flips. But if you close the gump before the cards start flipping, all five messages will immediately appear. The "cards flipping" gump is just for looks, and the delay is programmed. If you close the gump, you'll still have to wait the hardcoded time to open a second pack. Besides the hardcoded delay, there's always a chance the queue gets boggled down. If that happens, everything tied to that queue can still take a while. I seem to recall a dev mentioning that the rewards from raids and incarnate stuff were tied to the same queue. Honestly, I don't remember exactly, but it was something that didn't sound like it should have been in the same queue in the first place. Point being, this was a bigger issue than just the packs, AH, and email. The original design certainly wasn't QAed for the level of use we put on the packs and email system. The throttles put on the packs and email are annoying, but likely necessary without major updates. If only they could find a SQL engineer with decades of experience in working with large databases, massive throughput, and (as a bonus) been with the CoH game since Day 1 of live. Where could they ever find such a person? (a-hem)

There's no doubt that this system wasn't designed for the traffic it is now getting. And I'm assuming that the current hardware may not be as powerful as that on live. To further complicate matters, SQL has changed quite a bit over the years. If Homecoming upgraded to a newer version (I hope they did), that could cause issues if the original scripts are not as compatible. Regarding "batching" the claiming of items, I get that is a very low priority ask. To my knowledge, there's nothing currently in the system like that, so it will be net new code. And if "let a handful of people claim a lot of items quickly" is up against "create new powersets, missions, incarnate abilities, etc., etc.), we know what's getting cut. However, from the outside at least, doing something like disabling the "claim" button for a second instead of punishing the user with a 3+ second cooldown for clicking it too soon seems like a reasonable ask.

Also, you can create a hotbar button to open the packs. Again, it won't open faster than using the RightClick->Open menu on the packs themselves, but it's a heck of a lot easier. /macro hero salvage_open S_HVSuperPackSalvage /macro rogue salvage_open S_RVSuperPackSalvage

I was vocal a year ago when the entire system would choke out for hours on this issue. It's worlds better now, but certainly not left in a good user experience. This is what I gathered from the rather vague discussion at the time: Character Items, the Auction House, and the opening of Super Packs are all linked in the same SQL queuing system. Other essential game functions (which, I don't know) also use the same queuing system. Apparently, spamming claiming of character items along with other issues would aggravate blocking in SQL. This in turn caused havoc elsewhere in the game, to the point of bringing the larger-population servers to their knees. Dev work was done to help alleviate the blocking in SQL, but it didn't resolve it to a satisfactory level. In the end, a timer was added to throttle how often Super Packs can be opened and Character Items can be claimed. This seemed to resolve the more critical issue of the servers choking out. How I've been handing this: 1. You can't open a second super pack before the 4th card in the first is halfway flipped. Don't bother trying until that time. 2. Character items can't be collected more than one per second. If you try too soon, you are essentially "punished" by the button turning gray for around 3 seconds. Yes, if you are trying to collect 60 converters, you'll be clicking the button 60 times, once a second, on the second, for a full minute. If you are in battle and want to quickly collect a few inspirations, carefully time your clicks or you'll be S.O.L. I don't know the stance of Homecoming on input macros, but it's ridiculous if using one to claim dozens or hundreds of items is frowned upon with this restriction in place. It's unreasonable to ask users to click a button exactly one second apart for minutes just to collect some salvage from your own email. 3. Even if you wait the full amount of time, sometimes the queue will still get backed up. Usually it resolves within a minute or two, compared to a year ago when it took literally hours or server reboot. One thing I've noticed is that placing things onto the AH often causes the rest of the features to get locked up. If you are both claiming items and plan to sell, make sure to claim as much as you can, then put stuff up for sale. (Edit: If things get locked up, you'll usually know when they clear because the first action to get locked will resolve. So if it locked collecting a Character Item, you'll hear the "ding" of one being collected when it clears. Or the Super Pack will open. This will happen even if you log out of one character and into another, since it's bound to the account. There no reason to spam the button when it's already locked up; they won't resolve.) I raised these as QOL issues a year ago, especially the claim button's "gotcha" programming. There's no reason the "claim" button on Character Items should be available within a second if it is only going to punish the user. Disable it for at least that built-in second. It's obviously possible, considering it's already happening if you click it too soon. I've also suggested adding a means to "Collect 10" or "Collect #". From what I heard, I feel that may not be possible since it likely would still need to fire off X number of requests to claim the items. That would be no different than spamming the button. With over 2 decades of SQL experience on business databases that would dwarf anything in CoH (Homecoming, and likely live), I understand the frustration SQL can sometimes bring. I also know all too well how it is to work on a feature that likely was thrown together with a short deadline and little resources. Still, I'd love to see the code and help resolve these issues.

Thanks for the update! I tried hammering the system to see how things responded: - Bought and opened 80 packs - Pulled 70 ATO's, Brainstorm ideas, some convertors* - Put most stuff up on the AH - Pulled more ATO's and some more convertors - Bought and opened 10 packs - etc Usually it would have easily locked up by the time I bought more packs. It didn't lock up once! So, that seems to have fixed the issue... with one QoL elephant in the room... *So this gets more into "Suggestions" I guess, as I am assuming the timer on claiming stuff from email is going to be needed going forward. It's generally not an issue. Even claiming 70 ATO's was not a problem at all. However, as I was claiming Convertors, Brainstorm Ideas, and Unslotters, it became suspect that the "Please wait a moment" message was less keyed off a system resource restriction and more of a built in timer on the button itself: As long as I clicked the button almost exactly once every second, the message never appeared. If I click it faster, it almost always showed up. Again, I get it and understand why it was likely necessary. However, there could be some QOL improvements here: 1. Don't let the "Claim" button be clickable until 1 second (or whatever the timer is) passes. It feels almost like a "punishment" for clicking the button before it was ready. If it is clicked too soon, you get stuck with the "Please wait a moment" message for around 3 seconds. No sense allowing it to happen just to punish the player. 2. Change the "5x" for Convertors and Unslotters to work like other salvage that is awarded in groupings: You can claim all 5 with one click. I get that would mean we would have a place in our email for "1 Convertor/Unslotter" salvage and "5x Convertor Unslotter" salvage. But it's not hard to open a few packs and end up with 30-60 items to claim. It shouldn't take a full minute of painfully clicking one button every second just to claim them. Alternatively, perhaps only have them in groups of 5x and rebalance the rewards table to handle that? Just throwing ideas at the wall. 3. (Maybe a pipe dream): Allow claiming 5/10/20 of an item with one click. I'm figuring this would still wreck havoc with the email system, as if the user clicked the button 5/10/20 times, but perhaps preparing the system to handle them in groups would make it possible? Please don't take these suggestions as criticism of how the original issue was resolved. As a fellow software (and specifically SQL) developer, I get that sometimes "Can't you just make the computer do stuff faster?" isn't realistic. So, on that end, a heartfelt THANKS is in order for all involved!

Are there any updates on this issue? I haven't been on in a while but had about 15 minutes to log in at lunchtime. I was able to grab some items out of email, put things on the AH, but became frustrated and logged out when I couldn't claim more than a handful few convertors over the course a minute. So I can't tell if the original locking issues persists, but the timer to claim items is nearly as bad when you're trying to claim a few hundred convertors or brainstorm ideas.