battlewraith

No lol. Not like a suggestion forum. You were not hired to review proposals. There is no particular reason to view you as an authority to determine which ideas "hold up." And most importantly, there is no stipulation that an idea suggested has to meet your review specifications. That's an assumption that you are making. People that serve on different types of creative teams are selected for qualifications they bring to the table. Those qualifications and processes are going to vary if you're doing a sociological study vs. a theatrical production vs. an animated short. Making a blanket assumption for random posters on a video game suggestion forum strikes me as pretty daft. At worst they will waste a lot of time and experience a lot of aggravation trying to defend what they may have thought was a fun idea to the unofficial REVIEW TEAM, which is probably irrelevant to the actual success or failure of said idea. It's not about expecting people to immediately accept ideas. It's a criticism of your review team mentality. It's fairly common in this forum to have people declare an idea a bad idea, justify that stance with a screed that is basically a declaration of their game preferences, and/or give some ridiculous lecture on some tangential subject like...oh I dunno...how you need to be rounding out your build with power pool attacks. I think people just get fed up with garbage feedback from opinionated crusty forum vets who are bent on the status quo. Even at the height of the game's population, the forum posters were a small percentage. Now with a much smaller number of people, I think it's probably more apparent that people like you are sucking the oxygen out of the room. And you would would clutch you pearls and complain about "what forums are about" until you were the only person left in the room.

LOL right, of course don't entertain the actual criticism at all, just assume that it's fragile people trying to suppress your ability to discuss (ie crap on ideas you don't like). I do think you accidentally described the problem. People are anti-disagreement--meaning they see how these threads are received and think it's not worth trying to post a suggestion on these forums because of the shitbirds--and they refrain from replying--they abandon the suggestion thread and don't post here again. Or they don't even bother to begin with.

The point of a suggestion forum is for ideation. It's for people to share their ideas and desires for future development. The notion that this a place to come and debate peoples suggestions is idiotic. You're not a dev, you don't have insider knowledge of what they can or plan to do, so what are you debating exactly? Typically it's people gatekeeping based on their own biases or understanding of the game. And it's generally the same small group of people all the time. It wrecks the suggestion forum as a pathway for community engagement in exchange for a few individuals getting the ego gratification of LARPing as a dev.

This is not about being valid. This is not a forum for logical debate. As Sovera pointed out, the devs are going to do whatever they want. Making a suggestion here is appealing to them. Unfortunately, doing so means running the gauntlet of a handful of players who take their self appointed duty to be rooting out bad ideas. Bad typically meaning things they don't like because it doesn't fit with their subjective experience of the game. I think this results in three things: 1. People are discouraged from posting suggestions. 2. People are turned off by the community. 3. To the extent that suggestions matter at all, the game design is steared towards a samey-same paint by the numbers orthodoxy.

Which doesn't really support your feedback, does it? I remember my controllers being really lame until getting a pet. Ultimately somebody's making a suggestion based on their subjective experience of gameplay. I will never understand the people that drop in to crap on ideas while acting like they're solving a math problem.

No you're talking about a minion character with no minions. I see how you're viewing this, I just don't think you're lack of imagination is compelling. The MM invokes some substance, mental constructs, the stuff of dreams, whatever. That substance is made to look and behave like something else, but it's an illusion. It's not really the thing it appears to be. Obviously the pets would work differently than the controller pets. That's a game mechanic issue. Thematically, there is no issue. This is a game where you can be in another dimension and summon a thug that rides in on a motorcycle. Nitpicking about an illusion having a real world effect in the game is silly.

There's no thematic problem with an illusion MM set. Illusion basically means deceiving the senses. A card trick is an illusion, it doesn't mean there are no cards. Even the phantasm from the controller set has reality. The MM version would just be toning down the control and building on that aspect of the pets.

Yeah but you're evil not crazy. Also apologies about my terminology here, I don't mean to offend or mischaracterize evil people.

I think at first glance that thread seemed to be trolling or some sort of language issue. The more I think about it--I have seen weird manifestos like that pop up in different places. Often there is a characteristic connection with something mundane, local politics or the mechanics of a video game, with grandiose statements about conspiracies or the ultimate nature of reality. I think there is a decent possibility that someone is experiencing mental health issues and it's probably not a good vein for humor.

The hypocrisy. Idiots manipulating market. We get a thread. Market manipulating idiots. Silence. Crickets chirping.

A whip set would be awesome. A version based on Indiana Jones would be...really lame. Worse than Hawkeye level lame. Keep it superpowered, something that would not be laughed off by a super powered enemy.

Judging from the way you're overreacting, I'd say that dig must've hit you hard. I didn't see anyone accuse you of moral decrepitude. Complaining about copyright infringement while on the forums for a renegade game is hilarious and it isn't hypocritical to point that out. Assuming that NCSoft approves of this in any way is flat out silly--probably they just don't feel it's worth their time to pursue the issue when the game would just go covert again.

If you'd actually paid attention, I had a long post on the previous page explaining why this proposal is a bad idea. So no, a video of people using an exploit to attack lowbies training up in Atlas Park is not me suddenly changing my mind. You are beyond tedious. Regarding the embedded video, people can simply click on the title to go to youtube and see the description. Or if they don't understand that, they could ask questions in the thread about that incident. It's moot because tone deaf Sherlock was on the job to preemptively belabor the obvious.

It says it right in the description that you copied. You are literally that guy for which every little detail needs to be spelled out. If you got it, I'm confident that others can figure it out as well. It's a joke anyway FFS.

Is it too much to assume that people can read?

I'm kind of surprised that nobody has pointed out that something like this actually happened, lol:

Just out of curiosity, how do you like Mike Mignola's pacing on Hellboy?

If you want to make an argument that relates to inconvenience, I think a better example is badging (which was also a major factor in stoking up anti-pvp sentiment). I have absolutely no interest in badges, apart from the ones that are necessary for accolades. Yet it's very common to have to spend time in pve doing things more slowly and in a manner that involves more hassle in order to help a group get a badge. Certainly I could not join teams that are doing badge runs, or I could be the lone person that objects when a group decides to pursue a badge on the fly, but that means I lose the opportunity to run that content and would have to wait for another group that doesn't care about badging to come along. The overall cost of waiting is probably more than just sucking it up and having to deal with the hassle of getting the badges. Obviously, badgers don't give a damn about that because--who doesn't want badges? Amiright? Having said that, I don't see this idea working out for a number of reasons: 1. If people who didn't want to pvp actually left the area for 20 minutes--the zones would probably be empty for the duration of the event, more or less defeating the purpose. 2. If anti-pvpers did not leave the zone when this happened--some of them would die. Sooner or later a competent person would show up and people would die. Not only that, but competent pvpers might show up and actually clear out the zone. And these anti-pvpers would lose there minds. They would be raging on these forums about getting defeated, and they would likely then avoid these events which would return us to #1. 3. Best case scenario is if individuals or groups take it upon themselves to try to police these events. So for example people could just bring a bunch of unkillable tanks to the zone and have them hang out taunting aggressive players. The problem with this outcome is that, if it's successful, it kind of defeats the purpose of this being a pvp event. My SG had a saying back on live "I squashed your pixels, I didn't slap yer mama." Dedicated pve-ers in this game are built different. Some of them would still be complaining about this on their deathbed. While I derive a certain schadenfreude from this, I don't think this plan would pay off. If it was gonna work, I think the existing zones would've had more appeal for more players. If you want to mix it up, offer some sort of non-deathmatch option. A huge racetrack appears, an easter egg hunt, etc.

If the devs saw fit to address this issue, I don't think it would be on par with burning down the Ferris wheel or outlawing cars. My understanding is that the current devs are a volunteer team who are doing this out of love for the game and goodwill towards the community. If those are the kind of values by which you're motivated, then I would think that a priority would be addressing aspects of gameplay that make people sick and/or prevent people from experiencing the entire breadth of content. Addressing it could also prevent similar issues from arising further down the developmental road. The fact that the actual number of people might be relatively small doesn't make it a waste of time or less laudable.

LOL 2 years later?

Noice! Thanks for the heads up.

I think he's confused because it's a meaningless distinction. The league, for example, was open to anyone. Now that it's underway, you can't join this round. A TF has slots for players to join. Once it fills up, those slots are gone. I've never heard anyone in PVE describe a full team as "Closed PvE." If you wanna discuss that proposed event, you can do so in the actual thread. The OP was commenting on the anti-pvp crowd and their attitudes not really making sense. But of course people keep circling back to the original thread. Par for the course.

People think and adapt. They will change their tactics in order to win. That's the core distinction here. I don't attack people in a pvp zone because I don't like them, any more than I attack a pve mob because of it's personality. So if there's a player in a pvp zone, despite the actual design/narrative justification/stated purpose etc. of the zone I should tailor my activities to what random individuals in the zone want. Is that what you want? Do you tell other people in pve how to play their characters?

This is an MMO. The core activity, which people do pretty much nonstop is grinding in order to get stuff. People want those set bonuses, accolades, incarnate abilities, etc. so that they can feel badass and easily tear through content. There's no referee that shows up on behalf of those poor mobs and says "hey, back off. You burned these guys down before they even were aware that you were there." Enter pvp. That same drive to leverage abilities and gain whatever advantage possible is used against other players. Now all of a sudden there are complaints about people being dishonorable because they have better gear, or the same group that gathered together to take down Lord Recluse are gankers because they focused down an individual in a pvp zone (who didn't go to the effort of getting a team). There's an obvious hypocrisy here. It's not about the other person doing something dishonorable. It's about the aggrieved not being willing or able to easily get what they want, so they vilify the people in their way. As far as I'm concerned, it doesn't matter whether people agree with this assessment or not because pretty much all of the anti-pvp sentiment relates to one type of pvp: deathmatch. Coh offers two types of deathmatch: arena and zone. Arena is under-utilized and zone is an inherently unbalanced situation that people bumble into. These modes can be improved, but what the game really needs is other types of pvp that are not deathmatch. These game modes might not even involve characters directly affecting each other, or only being able to affect each other after completing a pve objective and earning some sort of temp power. There are tons of things that could be done. But any time "pvp" is mentioned, you have to wade through these rehashed traumas of people getting mocked in a zone by some twat 10 or 15 years ago. And yes, that is a gross simplification but it's close enough to get the point across.

Which team are you on?