Critique for Thugs/Thermal Radiation

rex monday · September 30, 2021

I put this build together after looking around at some Thugs/X and X/Thermal builds on the board here. I wanted to see if anyone could offer some suggestions to tune this up a bit. Most of my power choices are a combination of theme and light maximization, so there's wiggle room for power changes if something would work better/can be recolored to look vaguely fiery. Plus, I wanted to try out more of the Sorcery powers to see if they'd be fun and useful.

This Villain build was built using Mids Reborn 3.0.4.7
https://github.com/Reborn-Team/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Level 50 Magic Mastermind
Primary Power Set: Thugs
Secondary Power Set: Thermal Radiation
Power Pool: Sorcery
Power Pool: Leadership
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Heat Mastery

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Call Thugs -- SprCmmoft-Acc/Dmg(A), SprCmmoft-Dmg/EndRdx(3), SprCmmoft-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(3), SprCmmoft-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), SprCmmoft-Rchg/PetAoEDef(5), OvrFrc-Dam/KB(7)
Level 1: Warmth -- Pnc-Heal/EndRedux(A), Pnc-EndRdx/Rchg(7), Pnc-Heal/Rchg(9), Pnc-Heal/EndRedux/Rchg(9), Pnc-Heal(11), Pnc-Heal/+End(11)
Level 2: Fire Shield -- UnbGrd-ResDam(A), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(13), UnbGrd-Rchg/ResDam(13), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(43)
Level 4: Cauterize -- Prv-Heal(A), Prv-Heal/EndRdx(15), Prv-EndRdx/Rchg(15), Prv-Heal/Rchg(17), Prv-Heal/Rchg/EndRdx(17), Prv-Absorb%(19)
Level 6: Equip Thugs -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 8: Mystic Flight -- BlsoftheZ-ResKB(A)
Level 10: Plasma Shield -- UnbGrd-ResDam(A), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(19), UnbGrd-Rchg/ResDam(21), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(43)
Level 12: Call Enforcer -- SprMarofS-Dmg(A), SprMarofS-Dmg/EndRdx(21), SprMarofS-Acc/Dmg(23), SprMarofS-EndRdx/+Resist/+Regen(23), ShlBrk-%Dam(25), TchofLadG-%Dam(25)
Level 14: Arcane Bolt -- Apc-Dam%(A), Apc-Dmg(36), Apc-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(37), Apc-Dmg/Rchg(37), FrcFdb-Rechg%(37)
Level 16: Enflame -- Ann-ResDeb%(A), Ann-Acc/Dmg(36), Ann-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(36)
Level 18: Gang War -- ExpRnf-+Res(Pets)(A), EdcoftheM-PetDef(27), SvrRgh-PetResDam(27), CaltoArm-+Def(Pets)(29), RechRdx-I(29), RechRdx-I(31)
Level 20: Thaw -- ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A)
Level 22: Rune of Protection -- TtnCtn-ResDam/EndRdx(A), TtnCtn-ResDam/Rchg(31), Ags-Psi/Status(46), GldArm-3defTpProc(46)
Level 24: Maneuvers -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(31), Rct-Def(33), Rct-Def/EndRdx(48)
Level 26: Call Bruiser -- ExpRnf-Acc/Rchg(A), ExpRnf-Acc/Dmg(33), ExpRnf-Dmg/EndRdx(33), ExpRnf-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(34), SprMarofS-Acc/EndRdx(34), SprMarofS-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(34)
Level 28: Forge -- AdjTrg-ToHit(A), AdjTrg-ToHit/Rchg(40), AdjTrg-ToHit/EndRdx/Rchg(43)
Level 30: Tactics -- GssSynFr--Build%(A), AdjTrg-ToHit(48), AdjTrg-ToHit/EndRdx(50), AdjTrg-ToHit/EndRdx/Rchg(50)
Level 32: Upgrade Equipment -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 35: Heat Exhaustion -- Acc-I(A), RechRdx-I(40)
Level 38: Melt Armor -- AchHee-ResDeb%(A), AnlWkn-%ToHit(39), AnlWkn-DefDeb(39), AnlWkn-Acc/Rchg/EndRdx(39), AnlWkn-Acc/DefDeb(40)
Level 41: Bonfire -- SuddAcc--KB/+KD(A), FrcFdb-Rechg%(42), Ann-ResDeb%(42), Ann-Acc/Dmg(42)
Level 44: Fire Ball -- Rgn-Dmg(A), Rgn-Dmg/Rchg(45), Rgn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(45), Rgn-Acc/Rchg(45), Rgn-Dmg/EndRdx(46)
Level 47: Combat Jumping -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), Ksm-ToHit+(48)
Level 49: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(50)
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Supremacy
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Health -- Mrc-Rcvry+(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A)
Level 1: Punk
Level 1: Arsonist
Level 12: Enforcer
Level 26: Bruiser
------------

The_Warpact · October 1, 2021

OK I had a long winded critique, but, I changed it so i wouldn't be so...critical? Anywho, I understand you mish-matched 2 builds, try this instead.

It concentrates getting your def and res up, recharge, and end management. Of course Incarnate stuff will help out later so its on there, but, if you shut that stuff off you are way more survivable, I'm not a fan of the sorcery pool but, I incorporated it since you wanted to try it.

This is how I would play it, so I made the build how i would like it. You are highly survivable with good debuffs, and attacks this will cause mobs to initially go after you unless you have key commands/macros for your bruiser to be the tank then this frees you up to cause all the havoc you want. If the arsonist wants to be a suicidal dick don't follow him down that rabbit hole let his ass die it's easier to spawn him again.

Use your commands, command your pets, it will make your job as a mastermind wwwwaaayyy easier.

Take this as my opinion, it has led me to almost exclusively play as a MM...although I do love my pet heavy trollers...in no way shape or form am I an expert but, it's served me well so far.

Good luck and above all else have FUN!

This Villain build was built using Mids Reborn 3.0.5.6
https://github.com/Reborn-Team/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Level 50 Magic Mastermind
Primary Power Set: Thugs
Secondary Power Set: Thermal Radiation
Power Pool: Sorcery
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leadership
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Mace Mastery

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Call Thugs

(A) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage
(3) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Damage/Endurance
(3) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
(5) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Recharge/Pet +AoE Defense Aura
(5) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Damage
(7) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance

Level 1: Warmth

(A) Preventive Medicine - Heal
(37) Preventive Medicine - Heal/Endurance
(37) Preventive Medicine - Endurance/RechargeTime
(40) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime
(40) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime/Endurance
(40) Preventive Medicine - Chance for +Absorb

Level 2: Fire Shield

(A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance
(7) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance
(9) Unbreakable Guard - Endurance/RechargeTime
(9) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime

Level 4: Cauterize

(A) Preventive Medicine - Heal
(43) Preventive Medicine - Heal/Endurance
(43) Preventive Medicine - Endurance/RechargeTime
(43) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime
(46) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime/Endurance

Level 6: Equip Thugs

(A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 8: Mystic Flight

(A) Blessing of the Zephyr - Knockback Reduction (4 points)

Level 10: Plasma Shield

(A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance
(11) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance
(11) Unbreakable Guard - Endurance/RechargeTime
(36) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime

Level 12: Call Enforcer

(A) Achilles' Heel - Chance for Res Debuff
(13) HamiO:Enzyme Exposure
(13) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Damage/Endurance
(15) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Endurance/Pet +Resist +Regen
(15) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(17) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Damage/Endurance/Recharge

Level 14: Boxing

(A) Empty

Level 16: Tough

(A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance
(17) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance
(33) Unbreakable Guard - Endurance/RechargeTime
(34) Unbreakable Guard - RechargeTime/Resistance
(34) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime
(34) Unbreakable Guard - +Max HP

Level 18: Gang War

(A) Recharge Reduction IO
(19) Recharge Reduction IO
(19) Edict of the Master - Defense Bonus
(21) Sovereign Right - Resistance Bonus
(21) Expedient Reinforcement - Resist Bonus Aura for Pets
(23) Call to Arms - Defense Bonus Aura for Pets

Level 20: Weave

(A) Reactive Defenses - Defense
(31) Reactive Defenses - Defense/Endurance
(33) Reactive Defenses - Defense/Endurance/RechargeTime
(33) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed

Level 22: Maneuvers

(A) Reactive Defenses - Defense
(23) Reactive Defenses - Defense/Endurance
(25) Reactive Defenses - Defense/Endurance/RechargeTime
(31) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed

Level 24: Hasten

(A) Recharge Reduction IO
(25) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 26: Call Bruiser

(A) Sudden Acceleration - Knockback to Knockdown
(27) Expedient Reinforcement - Accuracy/Damage
(27) Expedient Reinforcement - Damage/Endurance
(29) Expedient Reinforcement - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(29) Expedient Reinforcement - Endurance/Damage/Recharge
(31) Soulbound Allegiance - Damage

Level 28: Forge

(A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 30: Arcane Bolt

(A) Apocalypse - Damage
(48) Apocalypse - Damage/Recharge
(50) Apocalypse - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
(50) Apocalypse - Accuracy/Recharge
(50) Apocalypse - Damage/Endurance

Level 32: Upgrade Equipment

(A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 35: Heat Exhaustion

(A) Endurance Reduction IO
(36) Accuracy IO

Level 38: Scorpion Shield

(A) Reactive Defenses - Defense
(39) Reactive Defenses - Defense/Endurance
(39) Reactive Defenses - Defense/Endurance/RechargeTime
(39) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed

Level 41: Melt Armor

(A) Achilles' Heel - Chance for Res Debuff
(42) Touch of Lady Grey - Defense Debuff/Endurance
(42) Touch of Lady Grey - Defense Debuff/Recharge/Endurance
(42) Touch of Lady Grey - Recharge/Endurance

Level 44: Tactics

(A) Adjusted Targeting - To Hit Buff
(45) Adjusted Targeting - To Hit Buff/Recharge
(45) Adjusted Targeting - To Hit Buff/Endurance/Recharge
(45) Adjusted Targeting - Endurance/Recharge
(46) Adjusted Targeting - To Hit Buff/Endurance
(46) Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - Chance for Build Up

Level 47: Rune of Protection

(A) Gladiator's Armor - TP Protection +3% Def (All)
(48) Steadfast Protection - Resistance/+Def 3%
(48) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 49: Vengeance

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed

Level 1: Brawl

(A) Empty

Level 1: Sprint

(A) Empty

Level 1: Supremacy

Level 2: Rest

rex monday · October 11, 2021

On 9/30/2021 at 7:22 PM, The_Warpact said:

OK I had a long winded critique, but, I changed it so i wouldn't be so...critical? Anywho, I understand you mish-matched 2 builds, try this instead.

It concentrates getting your def and res up, recharge, and end management. Of course Incarnate stuff will help out later so its on there, but, if you shut that stuff off you are way more survivable, I'm not a fan of the sorcery pool but, I incorporated it since you wanted to try it.

This is how I would play it, so I made the build how i would like it. You are highly survivable with good debuffs, and attacks this will cause mobs to initially go after you unless you have key commands/macros for your bruiser to be the tank then this frees you up to cause all the havoc you want. If the arsonist wants to be a suicidal dick don't follow him down that rabbit hole let his ass die it's easier to spawn him again.

Use your commands, command your pets, it will make your job as a mastermind wwwwaaayyy easier.

Take this as my opinion, it has led me to almost exclusively play as a MM...although I do love my pet heavy trollers...in no way shape or form am I an expert but, it's served me well so far.

Good luck and above all else have FUN!

This Villain build was built using Mids Reborn 3.0.5.6
https://github.com/Reborn-Team/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Level 50 Magic Mastermind
Primary Power Set: Thugs
Secondary Power Set: Thermal Radiation
Power Pool: Sorcery
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leadership
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Mace Mastery

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Call Thugs

(A) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage

(3) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Damage/Endurance

(3) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge

(5) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Recharge/Pet +AoE Defense Aura

(5) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Damage

(7) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance

Level 1: Warmth

(A) Preventive Medicine - Heal

(37) Preventive Medicine - Heal/Endurance

(37) Preventive Medicine - Endurance/RechargeTime

(40) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime

(40) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime/Endurance

(40) Preventive Medicine - Chance for +Absorb

Level 2: Fire Shield

(A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance

(7) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance

(9) Unbreakable Guard - Endurance/RechargeTime

(9) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime

Level 4: Cauterize

(A) Preventive Medicine - Heal

(43) Preventive Medicine - Heal/Endurance

(43) Preventive Medicine - Endurance/RechargeTime

(43) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime

(46) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime/Endurance

Level 6: Equip Thugs

(A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 8: Mystic Flight

(A) Blessing of the Zephyr - Knockback Reduction (4 points)

Level 10: Plasma Shield

(A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance

(11) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance

(11) Unbreakable Guard - Endurance/RechargeTime

(36) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime

Level 12: Call Enforcer

(A) Achilles' Heel - Chance for Res Debuff

(13) HamiO:Enzyme Exposure

(13) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Damage/Endurance

(15) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Endurance/Pet +Resist +Regen

(15) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge

(17) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Damage/Endurance/Recharge

Level 14: Boxing

(A) Empty

Level 16: Tough

(A) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance

(17) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance

(33) Unbreakable Guard - Endurance/RechargeTime

(34) Unbreakable Guard - RechargeTime/Resistance

(34) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime

(34) Unbreakable Guard - +Max HP

Level 18: Gang War

(A) Recharge Reduction IO

(19) Recharge Reduction IO

(19) Edict of the Master - Defense Bonus

(21) Sovereign Right - Resistance Bonus

(21) Expedient Reinforcement - Resist Bonus Aura for Pets

(23) Call to Arms - Defense Bonus Aura for Pets

Level 20: Weave

(A) Reactive Defenses - Defense

(31) Reactive Defenses - Defense/Endurance

(33) Reactive Defenses - Defense/Endurance/RechargeTime

(33) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed

Level 22: Maneuvers

(A) Reactive Defenses - Defense

(23) Reactive Defenses - Defense/Endurance

(25) Reactive Defenses - Defense/Endurance/RechargeTime

(31) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed

Level 24: Hasten

(A) Recharge Reduction IO

(25) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 26: Call Bruiser

(A) Sudden Acceleration - Knockback to Knockdown

(27) Expedient Reinforcement - Accuracy/Damage

(27) Expedient Reinforcement - Damage/Endurance

(29) Expedient Reinforcement - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge

(29) Expedient Reinforcement - Endurance/Damage/Recharge

(31) Soulbound Allegiance - Damage

Level 28: Forge

(A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 30: Arcane Bolt

(A) Apocalypse - Damage

(48) Apocalypse - Damage/Recharge

(50) Apocalypse - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge

(50) Apocalypse - Accuracy/Recharge

(50) Apocalypse - Damage/Endurance

Level 32: Upgrade Equipment

(A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 35: Heat Exhaustion

(A) Endurance Reduction IO

(36) Accuracy IO

Level 38: Scorpion Shield

(A) Reactive Defenses - Defense

(39) Reactive Defenses - Defense/Endurance

(39) Reactive Defenses - Defense/Endurance/RechargeTime

(39) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed

Level 41: Melt Armor

(A) Achilles' Heel - Chance for Res Debuff

(42) Touch of Lady Grey - Defense Debuff/Endurance

(42) Touch of Lady Grey - Defense Debuff/Recharge/Endurance

(42) Touch of Lady Grey - Recharge/Endurance

Level 44: Tactics

(A) Adjusted Targeting - To Hit Buff

(45) Adjusted Targeting - To Hit Buff/Recharge

(45) Adjusted Targeting - To Hit Buff/Endurance/Recharge

(45) Adjusted Targeting - Endurance/Recharge

(46) Adjusted Targeting - To Hit Buff/Endurance

(46) Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - Chance for Build Up

Level 47: Rune of Protection

(A) Gladiator's Armor - TP Protection +3% Def (All)

(48) Steadfast Protection - Resistance/+Def 3%

(48) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 49: Vengeance

(A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed

Level 1: Brawl

(A) Empty

Level 1: Sprint

(A) Empty

Level 1: Supremacy

Level 2: Rest

Sorry, I didn't see that you'd replied to me until just now. Thanks for the build, it's really good. I can see that the defense and resists are way better this way. One of the reasons I was trying to fit in Sorcery was for theme. The character has magic-looking helpful flames and I wanted to tie an attack or two to that. What's your view on throwing Enflame on the Bruiser? And are the Flame Mastery attacks so lackluster as to skip them?

Edit: One more thing - Ring of Protection doesn't allow for any kind of recharge reduction so that frees up one slot.

Edited October 11, 2021 by rex monday

The_Warpact · October 11, 2021

4 minutes ago, rex monday said:

Sorry, I didn't see that you'd replied to me until just now. Thanks for the build, it's really good. I can see that the defense and resists are way better this way. One of the reasons I was trying to fit in Sorcery was for theme. The character has magic-looking helpful flames and I wanted to tie an attack or two to that. What's your view on throwing Enflame on the Bruiser? And are the Flame Mastery attacks so lackluster as to skip them?

Edit: One more thing - Ring of Protection doesn't allow for any kind of recharge reduction so that frees up one slot.

Use Forge on your Bruiser instead of Enflame, I've used Enflame once and was not terribly impressed.

Typically with ranged attacks and/or debuffs I use Scorpion Shield for the defense. I have used resistance based sets on my more aggressive type MMs, and realistically that is up to you.

I just used my template for an old build I had and incorporated Sorcery into it for you.

I had forgot about the RoP changes thanks for the reminder.

How about this you tell me what you want in the build and I'll do one, okay?

tidge · October 18, 2021

I won't bother posting my Thugs/Thermal/Heat (character concept) build, but I will say this: I don't really enjoy playing it. I'm pretty sure I know what the problem (for me) is. The pools chosen are Fighting (Kick/Tough/Weave) / Leadership (Maneuvers/Tactics) / Sorcery (Spirit Ward/Mystic Flight/RoP) / Speed (Hasten)

What I think disappointed me is that the character held off on any offense until Heat Mastery (Bonfire / Fire Ball / Char). I certainly don't have an expectation of the MM doing much offensively, but playing the game (relatively old school missions and TF for XP) felt like I was supporting the henchmen instead of them supporting me. By the time I had some actual attacks, they were typical (i.e. less than stellar, even with %proc) MM performance and didn't offer the amount of control/debuff I enjoyed with Robots/Traps. I particularly found Bonfire to be disappointing when compared to equivalent powers on other ATs.

Chalk this up to the choices not meeting my expectations and preferred play style. I'm not going to call for an overhaul of Thermal Radiation, but I will write this: I don't like the relative recharge-to-duration times of Heat Exhaustion and Melt Armor. It feels to me that as single-target attacks (requiring a ToHit check) that the recharge times are simply too long and the durations aren't long enough, except possibly on enemies below Boss level. Maybe I am downplaying (or ignoring!) balance issues, but these don't feel like they are really contributing to map clear times or against single hard targets.

rex monday · October 18, 2021

Yeah, I think I'm committed to thermal on this character for theme reasons. Until I can get high enough for an attack or two from Heat Mastery, I'm using Arcane Bolt and I might use one of the Thugs pistol attacks so I can feel like I'm actually participating. It's definitely a more reactive secondary, but the heals are impressive.

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