Crab question

[Wuteva]

If someone is used to playing Brutes/Tanks are crabs going to be difficult to transition to?

 

Also how "fun" are they?

 

Are they squishy?

 

Just wonder like the way they look but I dont really know anything about them

[mcdoogss]

I thoroughly enjoyed leveling my Crab Spider.  However they play differently than tankers or brutes.  They do have available melee attacks, however they dont have a full melee attack chain (a single target attack w/ 4s cd, a melee cone 10s, pbaoe 20s).  They don't have taunt so they can't really hold aggro.

 

They can be easily built to have layered scrapper-level survivability though.  Softcapped positionals with 50-70% resistances across the board is doable without sacrificing too much, plus a dull pain clone self heal and good status protection, not to mention toggles that buff the team (think leadership buffs with lower endurance costs and higher bonuses).   

 

In my opinion, the most effective two approaches with crabs are:

 

1) ranged AOE-focused tankmage.  Basically a better version of a Sentinel, you have a seamless aoe rotation with venom, frag, suppression and at least one of the AOE attacks from mu or leviathan pools.  ST is adequate on your own and supplemented for hard targets with the summoned arachnobots

 

2) crabbermind.  You still have soft capped defenses, and more than decent resistances/status protection as well as your AE buff toggles but you also have 6 pets and loads of recharge to resummon them often.  This kind of build can pump out obscene DPS on hard targets, but fair warning the pets die a lot in +4/x8 content solo.  

 

practically any approach you take with a VEAT will be a superb teammate

 

This is a crabbermind build i have saved although it's a bit old and out of date now

 

Spoiler

This Villain build was built using Mids Reborn 3.0.6.0
https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

oliver: Level 50 Natural Arachnos Soldier
Primary Power Set: Crab Spider Soldier
Secondary Power Set: Crab Spider Training
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Mu Mastery

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Channelgun

• (A) Superior Spider's Bite - RechargeTime/Global Toxic
• (3) Superior Spider's Bite - Accuracy/Damage
• (3) Superior Spider's Bite - Damage/Endurance/RechargeTime
• (5) Superior Spider's Bite - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/RechargeTime
  

Level 1: Crab Spider Armor Upgrade

• (A) Steadfast Protection - Resistance/+Def 3%
• (9) Impervium Armor - Psionic Resistance
• (9) Gladiator's Armor - TP Protection +3% Def (All)
  

Level 2: Combat Training: Defensive

• (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
• (5) Reactive Defenses - Defense/Endurance
• (11) Reactive Defenses - Defense
  

Level 4: Longfang

• (A) Apocalypse - Chance of Damage(Negative)
• (11) Apocalypse - Damage
• (13) Apocalypse - Damage/Recharge
• (13) Apocalypse - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
• (17) Apocalypse - Damage/Endurance
• (19) Gladiator's Javelin - Chance of Damage(Toxic)
  

Level 6: Hasten

• (A) Recharge Reduction IO
• (19) Recharge Reduction IO
  

Level 8: Kick

• (A) Empty
  

Level 10: Suppression

• (A) Ragnarok - Chance for Knockdown
• (21) Ragnarok - Damage
• (21) Ragnarok - Damage/Recharge
• (23) Ragnarok - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
• (23) Ragnarok - Damage/Endurance
• (25) Bombardment - Chance for Fire Damage
  

Level 12: Venom Grenade

• (A) Superior Dominion of Arachnos - Recharge/Chance for -Dmg and Terrorize
• (25) Superior Dominion of Arachnos - Accuracy/Damage
• (27) Superior Dominion of Arachnos - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
• (27) Superior Dominion of Arachnos - Damage/Endurance/Recharge
• (29) Superior Dominion of Arachnos - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
• (40) Bombardment - Chance for Fire Damage
  

Level 14: Tactical Training: Maneuvers

• (A) Reactive Defenses - Defense/Endurance
• (15) Reactive Defenses - Defense
• (15) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
• (17) Shield Wall - +Res (Teleportation), +5% Res (All)
  

Level 16: Tough

• (A) Unbreakable Guard - +Max HP
• (31) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance
• (31) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance
• (33) Unbreakable Guard - Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime
• (39) Impervium Armor - Psionic Resistance
  

Level 18: Weave

• (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
• (31) Reactive Defenses - Defense
• (50) Reactive Defenses - Defense/Endurance
  

Level 20: Hover

• (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
  

Level 22: Frag Grenade

• (A) Bombardment - Chance for Fire Damage
• (33) Bombardment - Damage
• (33) Bombardment - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge/Endurance
• (34) Overwhelming Force - Damage/Chance for Knockdown/Knockback to Knockdown
• (34) Positron's Blast - Chance of Damage(Energy)
• (34) Force Feedback - Chance for +Recharge
  

Level 24: Fortification

• (A) Aegis - Psionic/Status Resistance
• (36) Aegis - Resistance/Endurance
• (36) Aegis - Resistance
• (36) Aegis - Resistance/Recharge
• (39) Aegis - Resistance/Endurance/Recharge
• (43) Impervium Armor - Psionic Resistance
  

Level 26: Maneuvers

• (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
• (37) Reactive Defenses - Scaling Resist Damage
• (50) Reactive Defenses - Defense/Endurance
  

Level 28: Serum

• (A) Preventive Medicine - Chance for +Absorb
• (29) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime
  

Level 30: Mental Training

• (A) Flight Speed IO
  

Level 32: Aim

• (A) Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - Chance for Build Up
  

Level 35: Mu Lightning

• (A) Power Transfer - Chance to Heal Self
• (37) Power Transfer - Damage/EndMod
• (37) Power Transfer - Damage/Accuracy/Endurance
• (39) Power Transfer - EndMod
• (40) Power Transfer - Damage/Recharge
• (40) Power Transfer - Damage/Accuracy/Recharge/Endurance
  

Level 38: Call Reinforcements

• (A) Expedient Reinforcement - Endurance/Damage/Recharge
• (42) Expedient Reinforcement - Accuracy/Damage
• (42) Expedient Reinforcement - Accuracy/Recharge
• (43) Expedient Reinforcement - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
• (46) Soulbound Allegiance - Chance for Build Up
  

Level 41: Ball Lightning

• (A) Superior Frozen Blast - Recharge/Chance for Immobilize
• (42) Superior Frozen Blast - Damage/Endurance
• (43) Superior Frozen Blast - Accuracy/Damage
• (45) Superior Frozen Blast - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
• (46) Superior Frozen Blast - Damage/Endurance/Accuracy/RechargeTime
  

Level 44: Summon Striker

• (A) Expedient Reinforcement - Accuracy/Recharge
• (45) Expedient Reinforcement - Accuracy/Damage
• (45) Expedient Reinforcement - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge
• (46) Expedient Reinforcement - Endurance/Damage/Recharge
  

Level 47: Summon Spiderlings

• (A) Call to Arms - Defense Bonus Aura for Pets
• (48) Expedient Reinforcement - Accuracy/Damage
• (48) Expedient Reinforcement - Resist Bonus Aura for Pets
• (48) Sovereign Right - Resistance Bonus
• (50) Edict of the Master - Defense Bonus
  

Level 49: Fly

• (A) Winter's Gift - Slow Resistance (20%)
  

Level 1: Conditioning | Hidden 

Level 1: Brawl

• (A) Empty
  

Level 1: Sprint

• (A) Run Speed IO
  

Level 2: Rest

• (A) Empty
  

Level 2: Swift

• (A) Flight Speed IO
  

Level 2: Hurdle

• (A) Jumping IO
  

Level 2: Health

• (A) Panacea - +Hit Points/Endurance
• (7) Miracle - +Recovery
  

Level 2: Stamina

• (A) Performance Shifter - Chance for +End
• (7) Performance Shifter - EndMod
  

Level 1: Prestige Power Dash

• (A) Empty
  

Level 1: Prestige Power Slide

• (A) Empty
  

Level 1: Prestige Power Quick

• (A) Empty
  

Level 1: Prestige Power Rush

• (A) Empty
  

Level 1: Prestige Power Surge

• (A) Empty
  

Level 4: Ninja Run 

Level 49: Afterburner 
------------
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Edited October 17, 2021 by mcdoogss

[tidge]

I enjoy the Soldier VEATs; I don't think of them as melee characters. I've used all three available builds on my Soldier VEAT, and the melee based one is the one I enjoy playing the least. It survives very well, but its clear times are pitiful. I found this build to be the most embarrassing to play on teams, as it could survive large rooms with max aggro on SF/TF turned way up, but it couldn't hold any sort of aggro (even with the Presence pool) and couldn't defeat enemies fast enough to make a difference. In solo play, I simply found this to be boring... I keep meaning to respin this build to still be a survivor but to double-down on team bonuses and enemy debuffs.

 

The Soldier Attacks are pretty seamless for my Bane, and I have all of my core attacks by lvl 18, with Shatter for the hard targets (I delayed this pick until lvl 41). I usually run this on teams.

 

The Crab has even more AoE, and went the Crabbermind route. I tend to play this one more solo. The pets are fun, but I consider this to be somewhat niche, YMMV

 

I will write this about the Soldier VEATs: because of the possibility of different builds, these (even more than the Fortunata/Widow) gave me a much better personal understanding of certain game mechanics (like aggro, enemy debuffs) than I had from just playing more 'classic' ATs. In particular: if a tricked-out Soldier/Bane/Crab has trouble holding aggro in x8 content with the Presence pool, I can't see why a "Tankermind" would find Provoke to be useful. On paper, it looks like a no-brainer, but in practice I find it to be quite niche.

 

Full disclosure: I really like the Presence pool, and often 5-slot Provoke.

[Redletter]

On 10/16/2021 at 12:49 PM, Wuteva said:

If someone is used to playing Brutes/Tanks are crabs going to be difficult to transition to?

 

Ehhhh? Sorta but not really. You're REMARKABLY tough for a class that isn't like, LISTED as a tough guy? And since you get a LOT of different powers, it's pretty easy to fit in a whole bunch of different IO sets that give you bonuses to make even beefier. You also have no problem GETTING aggro because you have TONS of AoE powers and can hit massive groups of mobs to get them, and all their friends who saw you hit 10 guys for big chunks, to run over and try to smack you IF there's nobody tanking. The only problem is that you don't have a native taunt so if you want one, you'll need to grab Provoke.

 

On 10/16/2021 at 12:49 PM, Wuteva said:

Also how "fun" are they?

 

Stupidly fun. Surpression alone is cool enough to carry the class, but it has a ton of other tools that make it just really interesting to play, since you can basically build whatever OTHER

class you want while also doing everything you want with the classes inherent tools.

 

On 10/16/2021 at 12:49 PM, Wuteva said:

Are they squishy?

 

Not TOTALLY? But you'll find yourself getting bullied by mobs if you're the only person tanking and you're not spec'd out to TAKE a beating. I can pretty reliably take on a pack of 4-5 goons at +1 but any MORE than that and Im going to really draining my inspirations. What will make you think you're squishy is when you launch a venom grenade, and it's deceptively large AoE hits way more guys than you thought it would, and now a room and a half of enemies lob everything they have at you at once killing you nearly instantly...

 

Which is kinda ok, since you can just use an awaken and just get to running - like, you don't suffer from awaken dizziness. You can just GO. 

 

On 10/16/2021 at 12:49 PM, Wuteva said:

Just wonder like the way they look but I dont really know anything about them

 

They're stamina whores. It's common to both of the arachnos classes, but they SUCK down stamina and it only gets worse if you do the REALLY fun thing and take LEadership ON TOP of your Arachnos Training buffs (which ae just the leadership buffs, but better) and stack them - becoming a MASSIVE passive buff pylon (like I do).

 

Like. I can't stress enough how much stamina they consume. I wish I had anything to compare it to, but literally no class I have ever played goes through stamina as quickly as the Arachnos archetypes do. I have no idea WHY theyre moves are so expensive, because they're pretty comparable to moves other classes get for far cheaper? But it's fucking nuts. On my 40ish Crab I have 2-3 IOs for endurance cost slotted into EVERY power. It's honestly more important than damage for me right now, since I can kill and hit just fine.

 

My big problem is that the crab pack doesnt come with a jetpack animation, and you dont have rocket boots, so it's hard to make the crab look good when in flight - and your probably gonna want that, since my crab without it REALY wishes they had the ability to fly.

[KaizenSoze]

12 minutes ago, Redletter said:

Like. I can't stress enough how much stamina they consume. I wish I had anything to compare it to, but literally no class I have ever played goes through stamina as quickly as the Arachnos archetypes do. I have no idea WHY theyre moves are so expensive, because they're pretty comparable to moves other classes get for far cheaper? But it's fucking nuts. On my 40ish Crab I have 2-3 IOs for endurance cost slotted into EVERY power. It's honestly more important than damage for me right now, since I can kill and hit just fine.

 

I know why Widows/Forts are end hogs, the expensive claw attacks. It's not the AT toggles, they are cheaper than the pool versions.

 

Not sure about Crabs though, but likely it's your AOE attacks. A quick glance shows a lot of +15 end attacks.

 

Full sets will help a lot with endurance. You should post your build.

 

My Bane is the only end stable melee VEAT I have. Some ranged Widow/Fort/Wolfspider builds are end stable. Ranged attacks have reasonable end costs.

[Redletter]

3 hours ago, KaizenSoze said:

I know why Widows/Forts are end hogs, the expensive claw attacks. It's not the AT toggles, they are cheaper than the pool versions.

 

Not sure about Crabs though, but likely it's your AOE attacks. A quick glance shows a lot of +15 end attacks.

The Crab melee's are actually pretty cheap. Like, comparatively. It's more efficient for me to run up and smack a fool than it is for me to shoot them.

3 hours ago, KaizenSoze said:

Full sets will help a lot with endurance. You should post your build.

Im a poor little crabbo with a very smooth brain. I couldnt afford a build, even if I could plan one out. What follows is basically what I managed to scrounge together by the kindness of people who have enough money to throw away and every crumb of INF i've gained across 40 levels of leveling.

3 hours ago, KaizenSoze said:

My Bane is the only end stable melee VEAT I have. Some ranged Widow/Fort/Wolfspider builds are end stable. Ranged attacks have reasonable end costs.

My Bane build is all ranged attacks, since I gave them the leadership buffs as well? And having the full buff suite active makes them a great team mate to have sitting in the back with the other ranged bois.

[KaizenSoze]

34 minutes ago, Redletter said:

The Crab melee's are actually pretty cheap. Like, comparatively. It's more efficient for me to run up and smack a fool than it is for me to shoot them.

Im a poor little crabbo with a very smooth brain. I couldnt afford a build, even if I could plan one out. What follows is basically what I managed to scrounge together by the kindness of people who have enough money to throw away and every crumb of INF i've gained across 40 levels of leveling.

My Bane build is all ranged attacks, since I gave them the leadership buffs as well? And having the full buff suite active makes them a great team mate to have sitting in the back with the other ranged bois.

Oh dear you need some money. Are you on Excelsior?

 

At the very least 3 slot stamina.

[Redletter]

3 hours ago, KaizenSoze said:

Oh dear you need some money. Are you on Excelsior?

Im on Everlasting at the moment, but this character in particular hops between them often because, while I do RP as them, they're escencially my first stab at the crab and it's FAR easier to find TF runs on Excelsior. Like, I've been basically running SBBs there as often as I can, since that's just a cool IO set and I wanna throw it on ether Surpression (the single power that got me to make a crab in the first place) or Omega Manuever (I hear it's pretty bad, but it looks so cool that I may just slot it out completely just for style).

3 hours ago, KaizenSoze said:

At the very least 3 slot stamina.

Stamina was the next thing I was gonna start slotting, yeah. That stamina infusion thing in there either doesnt proc a lot, OR it's a miniscule amount compared to the consumption of the class.

[KaizenSoze]

5 minutes ago, Redletter said:

Im on Everlasting at the moment, but this character in particular hops between them often because, while I do RP as them, they're escencially my first stab at the crab and it's FAR easier to find TF runs on Excelsior. Like, I've been basically running SBBs there as often as I can, since that's just a cool IO set and I wanna throw it on ether Surpression (the single power that got me to make a crab in the first place) or Omega Manuever (I hear it's pretty bad, but it looks so cool that I may just slot it out completely just for style).

Stamina was the next thing I was gonna start slotting, yeah. That stamina infusion thing in there either doesnt proc a lot, OR it's a miniscule amount compared to the consumption of the class.

I sent you an forum IM. My standard stamina slotting is two stamina IOs and one performance shifter proc.

 

Also, slot SO end reducers as you get them as drops until your can respec. Check the auction house just in case for IOs.

[Two Dollar Bill]

My Crab builds tend to have an unhealthy obsession with managing endurance costs, so this thread might be informative.

My current Crab build doesn't have so many discounts but still barely budges from full endurance. Part of my secret is... no Hasten. My ranged attack chain will pause for a moment as I run out of attacks unless I close in and use Slice and Arm Lash.

Edited November 17, 2021 by Two Dollar Bill