Tanker vs Brute - solo and teams

[Prototech]

Hi Everyone,

 

I tried forum searching this but if there is a big thread about it already please let me know and I will go there in shame.

 

Basically I've been trying to decide between Tanker and Brute as my main mighty melee dude. Tanker was my original preference purely thematically, I liked the added focus on defense and icon (I know silly right). However I leveled a SS/INV Tanker and a SS/INV Brute for about 20 levels and the Brute is just way way better. Tanker hits like a noodle and dies more just because he can't kill anything.

 

Thinking ahead to max level team ups, I did want to tank and there is the only plus I see to the tanker from a gameplay perspective (easier aggro) but that simply not enough to justify slogging through boring solo play. I may have to put fun over theme and go brute.

 

I guess what I am asking, why Tanker for any other reason than high end TANK play? Is it the nature of INV and SS too, just not ideal for a Tanker?

 

Insight very welcome please.

[Tersival]

For me it comes down to the difference between the classes' inherent powers, Fury and Gauntlet.

 

From: https://cityofheroes.fandom.com/wiki/Inherent_Powers#Gauntlet ...

 

- A Tanker's AoE attacks and auras to taunt every PvE enemy they affect. Their single-target attacks taunt the enemy hit and up to four more around it.

 

- A Brute's single target attacks only taunt the target they hit.

 

i.e. A tanker is committed to protecting his group by drawing the attention of their enemies. For a brute, this role is secondary to doing the most damage they can do.

 

In practice, there's very little practical difference in a balanced team. Go with the archetype that resonates with you psychologically, in your gut. At the end of the day its a game. Play what's more fun for you.

 

[Konru]

There are 5 archetypes that came with the original City of Heroes, 5 more archetypes that came with City of Villains, and 4 Epic Archetypes that were added to be unlocked by having a high-level character.

 

Scrapper is pretty solo-friendly.  But the original hero archetypes were team oriented.  Almost "holy trinity," except pure healing was replaced to an extent with buffing and debuffing support.  Tankers shield the entire team and do so by drawing aggro with everything they do.  Defenders provide buffing and debuffing support.  Blasters and Scrappers do the DPS.  Controllers lock down enemies so everything isn't attacking at once.  Both Defenders and Controllers heal, if they took healing powers.  But between the Tanker's defense and resistance, the Defender's defense and resistance buffing, and the Controllers locking down enemies, the team can clear most content without taking more than trivial damage.  Of course, there were some trinity-breaking combinations that just sorta worked really well.

 

Originally the 5 red-side archetypes were built more "me first."  Brutes mimic Tankers but they are more damage-focused than defense focused, and lack some of the taunting ability of Tanker.  They only taunt the targets they hit automatically rather than everyone in the area.  Corrupters mimic Defenders, but trade some support power for base damage power.  Dominators mimic Controllers, but trade secondary support for secondary damage powers.  Stalkers are almost identical to Scrappers, except have stealth built in and prefer to actively shed aggro.  Masterminds are their own team rolled into a single package.

 

A for why tanker for any other reason than high-end tank play?  Well, low-end tank play would be it.  Tankers get their defense much earlier than Brutes.  Lower level Brutes are pretty much Scrappers with a built-in aggro draw and a need to take attacks to a certain extent to build enough fury to deal decent damage.  Of course, aggro matters little to solo play.  Who are you taking the aggro from or who is to take aggro from you?  Brutes will need to use their Taunt and Provoke powers more than Tankers will to truly act as a tank a high levels.  But they should be able to get the job done just fine.

 

Regarding specifically Invulnerability and Super Strength.  Invulnerability is just a solid but boring set.  It gets the job done, but doesn't help at much with your DPS output or control like other sets can.  Super Strength's knock-back can actually be annoying to other teammates that want everyone together for their big AoE attacks.  But it might also help you stay alive longer by keeping enemies on the floor instead of attacking you.  It's a double-edged sword on a Brute who wants to be taking those attacks.  But neither are actually all that bad.

[Mr. Vee]

Hurl and hand-clap are the only KB powers in SS. Both are skipped quite often but could be fixed with one of the kb to kd IOs.

[Prototech]

Thanks so much for the replies guys. I agree with 'play what's fun to you' to a great extent, gameplay brute wise is definitely way more fun just not perfect thematically but I can adjust. If I make Tankers in the future it will be with the goal of pure team play.

[Inasogard]

I've been playing this game for a long time.  The only thing a tanker is better at is holding aggro.  If you level up a brute and get him decked out in full Set IO's he can tank anything a tank can and hold aggro just as well, along with doing WAY more damage.  I myself love tanks, the way they are now, they just don't compare.

 

With all the work the Devs are doing here now, I am truly hoping to see some tweaking done with tanks.  Would love to See their Taunt hit up to 16 targets, and pull them all within melee range! (DROOL).  As for damage, all they would need to do, in my opinion at least, is give tanks a reason to hold aggro by giving them a 3-5% boost to damage for every mob they have taunted on them.  I believe the cap is 16, so its only an 48-80% damage boost., which would still be below Brutes.

 

Either way, the game offers so much!  I'm so glad to be back!

 

[Prototech]

I had dreams for years about playing this game again... I couldn't agree more with the sentiment. It's so damn good, better today that I'm older and wiser and done with 'addiction loop' games.

[Without_Pause]

Thanks so much for the replies guys. I agree with 'play what's fun to you' to a great extent, gameplay brute wise is definitely way more fun just not perfect thematically but I can adjust. If I make Tankers in the future it will be with the goal of pure team play.

 

Honestly, this is me. I have one tank for the time I want to play that role, but I can easily make more than the two brutes I'm currently running. I might once I get the two I have to 50.

[AkuTenshiiZero]

In my experience, Inv is just not a very good set.  I never liked it.

 

Both Brutes and Tankers can tank.  Tankers will always be better at just raw survivability because they have the greater defensive numbers.  Brutes will always have higher damage, but they WANT to be attacked because that makes their damage even better.  The long and short of it is this: Hero ATs are traditionally built for team play, Villain ATs are better built for soloing.  That is not to say you can't go against those generalizations, but that's just the general trend.

[Shadojak]

Short answer:

 

I find Brutes excel when solo, Tanks excel in groups/teams.

 

I have used my Brute in groups and have soloed with my Tank, so its all possible. 

 

You have to have a team that understands your Brute may drop some agro and have patience with your slower DPS as  a Tank when solo.