vexyvirus Posted March 1 Posted March 1 (edited) Hey all! Looking for input, and suggestions for optimizations on a build I've got on my Pistols/Fire Sent. I built for mixed defenses (Primarily resist of course, given my secondary pool), and perma Hasten after including agile incarnate. Now that I'm finally 50 and dabbling in incarnates, what other incarnates should I be looking to pick up? Anyway, here's the build! Hero SentinelBuild plan made with Mids' Reborn v3.6.6 rev. 3 ──────────────────────────────Primary powerset: Dual PistolsSecondary powerset: Fiery AuraPool powerset (#1): FightingPool powerset (#2): FlightPool powerset (#3): LeadershipPool powerset (#4): SpeedEpic powerset: Psionic Mastery ────────────────────────────── Powers taken: Level 1: Dual WieldA: Superior Opportunity Strikes: Accuracy/Damage3: Superior Opportunity Strikes: Damage/RechargeTime3: Superior Opportunity Strikes: Accuracy/Damage/RechargeTime5: Superior Opportunity Strikes: Accuracy/Damage/Endurance5: Superior Opportunity Strikes: Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/RechargeTime7: Superior Opportunity Strikes: RechargeTime/Chance for Opportunity Level 1: Fire ShieldA: Titanium Coating: Resistance/Endurance7: Titanium Coating: Resistance9: Titanium Coating: Endurance9: Titanium Coating: Resistance/Recharge Level 2: Molten EmbraceA: Invention: Endurance Reduction Level 4: Kick(Empty) Level 6: Suppressive FireA: Superior Sentinel's Ward: Accuracy/Damage13: Superior Sentinel's Ward: Damage/RechargeTime13: Superior Sentinel's Ward: Accuracy/Damage/RechargeTime15: Superior Sentinel's Ward: Accuracy/Damage/Endurance15: Superior Sentinel's Ward: Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/RechargeTime17: Superior Sentinel's Ward: RechargeTime/Chance for +Absorb Level 8: Swap Ammo Level 10: Healing FlamesA: Preventive Medicine: Heal/RechargeTime25: Preventive Medicine: Heal40: Steadfast Protection: Resistance/+Def 3% Level 12: Bullet RainA: Bombardment: Accuracy/Recharge/Endurance19: Bombardment: Damage19: Bombardment: Accuracy/Damage/Recharge21: Bombardment: Accuracy/Damage/Recharge/Endurance21: Bombardment: Chance for Fire Damage23: Force Feedback: Chance for +Recharge Level 14: ToughA: Gladiator's Armor: Resistance17: Gladiator's Armor: Recharge/Resist23: Gladiator's Armor: End/Resist25: Gladiator's Armor: Resistance/Rech/End40: Gladiator's Armor: Recharge/Endurance42: Gladiator's Armor: TP Protection +3% Def (All) Level 16: Plasma ShieldA: Unbreakable Guard: Resistance27: Unbreakable Guard: Resistance/Endurance29: Unbreakable Guard: Resistance/Endurance/RechargeTime43: Unbreakable Guard: +Max HP Level 18: Executioner's ShotA: Decimation: Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge29: Decimation: Accuracy/Damage/Recharge31: Decimation: Damage/Endurance31: Decimation: Accuracy/Damage31: Decimation: Chance of Build Up33: Force Feedback: Chance for +Recharge Level 20: ConsumeA: Efficacy Adaptor: EndMod/Recharge Level 22: WeaveA: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed34: Reactive Defenses: Defense/Endurance34: Reactive Defenses: Defense34: Reactive Defenses: Scaling Resist Damage Level 24: HoverA: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed27: Shield Wall: +Res (Teleportation), +5% Res (All)33: Shield Wall: Defense/Endurance36: Shield Wall: Defense36: Shield Wall: Defense/Endurance/Recharge Level 26: Hail of BulletsA: Armageddon: Damage/Recharge36: Armageddon: Damage/Recharge/Accuracy37: Armageddon: Recharge/Accuracy37: Armageddon: Damage/Endurance37: Armageddon: Chance for Fire Damage39: Fury of the Gladiator: Chance for Res Debuff Level 28: Cauterizing BlazeA: Preventive Medicine: Heal39: Preventive Medicine: Chance for +Absorb39: Preventive Medicine: Heal/Endurance40: Preventive Medicine: Endurance/RechargeTime50: Preventive Medicine: Heal/RechargeTime50: Preventive Medicine: Heal/RechargeTime/Endurance Level 30: Phoenix RisingA: Invention: Recharge Reduction Level 32: ManeuversA: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed42: Luck of the Gambler: Defense43: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Endurance43: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Endurance/Recharge45: Luck of the Gambler: Endurance/Recharge47: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Recharge Level 35: Mass HypnosisA: Call of the Sandman: Accuracy/Sleep/Recharge Level 38: FlyA: Blessing of the Zephyr: Knockback Reduction (4 points)42: Blessing of the Zephyr: Run Speed, Jump, Flight Speed, Range/Endurance47: Blessing of the Zephyr: Run Speed, Jump, Flight Speed, Range Level 41: Psychic ShockwaveA: Scirocco's Dervish: Accuracy/Damage45: Scirocco's Dervish: Damage/Endurance46: Scirocco's Dervish: Damage/Recharge46: Scirocco's Dervish: Accuracy/Recharge46: Scirocco's Dervish: Chance of Damage(Lethal)48: Eradication: Chance for Energy Damage Level 44: HastenA: Invention: Recharge Reduction48: Invention: Recharge Reduction Level 47: Link MindsA: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed50: Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control: Chance for Build Up Level 49: Evasive ManeuversA: Luck of the Gambler: Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed ────────────────────────────── Inherents: Level 1: Opportunity Level 1: Brawl(Empty) Level 1: Sprint(Empty) Level 2: Rest(Empty) Level 1: SwiftA: Invention: Flight Speed Level 1: Hurdle(Empty) Level 1: HealthA: Panacea: +Hit Points/Endurance11: Panacea: Heal Level 1: StaminaA: Performance Shifter: EndMod/Recharge11: Performance Shifter: Chance for +End45: Performance Shifter: EndMod Level 8: Chemical Ammunition Level 8: Cryo Ammunition Level 8: Incendiary Ammunition Level 38: Afterburner Edited March 1 by vexyvirus
vexyvirus Posted March 1 Author Posted March 1 I do want to 5 slot Apocalypse into Executioner Shot over Eradication, but currently can't because of Influence issues.
FupDup Posted March 1 Posted March 1 (edited) I think you forgot to post a link to the build. Anyways, I would recommend against the Agility alpha incarnate power here because it doesn't really do a whole ton for Fiery Aura. The endmod portion doesn't help much because Consume's recovery buff is fairly short in duration, and the defense portion doesn't help since Fire doesn't have any defense on its own (and no DDR). A lot of people would also say that the recharge from Agility would nerf your damage proc rate, but since the build doesn't appear to have many damage procs that part won't really hurt much in this case. I'd have to see the build in Mids to decide on the best replacement but my first instincts are either Musculature for more damage, Cardiac for resistance and endurance reduction, or Vigor for greater healing, endurance reduction, and accuracy. Edited March 1 by FupDup .
vexyvirus Posted March 1 Author Posted March 1 3 minutes ago, FupDup said: I think you forgot to post a link to the build. Anyways, I would recommend against the Agility alpha incarnate power here because it doesn't really do a whole ton for Fiery Aura. The endmod portion doesn't help much because Consume's recovery buff is fairly short in duration, and the defense portion doesn't help since Fire doesn't have any defense on its own (and no DDR). A lot of people would also say that the recharge from Agility would nerf your damage proc rate, but since the build doesn't appear to have many damage procs that part won't really hurt much in this case. I'd have to see the build in Mids to decide on the best replacement but my first instincts are either Musculature for more damage, Cardiac for resistance and endurance reduction, or Vigor for greater healing, endurance reduction, and accuracy. Here's the current Mids build I've got! I appreciate the input! Obviously I'm not fully in the know on how Incarnate's work. So if I'm understanding correctly, Alpha's primarily modify your existing power values? Current Build.mbd
FupDup Posted March 1 Posted March 1 Just now, vexyvirus said: Here's the current Mids build I've got! I appreciate the input! Obviously I'm not fully in the know on how Incarnate's work. So if I'm understanding correctly, Alpha's primarily modify your existing power values? Current Build.mbd 46.02 kB · 0 downloads Yes. Alphas don't give you "free" goodies like IO set bonuses do, they're like a global enhancement. So for example, if you pick an alpha power with resistance enhancement, it only boosts your existing resistance-giving powers. If you don't have any res powers, it won't give you anything. .
vexyvirus Posted March 1 Author Posted March 1 2 minutes ago, FupDup said: Yes. Alphas don't give you "free" goodies like IO set bonuses do, they're like a global enhancement. So for example, if you pick an alpha power with resistance enhancement, it only boosts your existing resistance-giving powers. If you don't have any res powers, it won't give you anything. That's good information to have! Thank you so much.
FupDup Posted March 1 Posted March 1 (edited) So here's my first stab at it. Current Build.mbd A summary of my changes and reasoning: -Swapped Agility for Cardiac because the resistance and endurance reduction will be more useful here -Added in Temperature Protection for some extra survival and slow protection, but had to drop Evasive Maneuvers for it -Dropped/swapped some defensive IO set bonuses (like Opportunity Strikes is now 5 slots instead of 6) because Fiery Aura has no native defense and no protection against defense debuffs -Swapped Dual Wield for Pistols because the latter has higher damage-per-animation -Swapped Eradication for Apocalypse like you planned to do later -Swapped power order around a bit to flow a bit better -Swapped slotting of Healing Flames and Cauterizing Blaze because the full set has a much greater impact in the former power because it has higher values -Added the Miracle and Numina procs to Health for more recovery -Added Kismet To-Hit to more consistently hit enemies -Boosted various IOs to +5 for more power -Enabled the passive health and endurance accolades -A bunch of other rearrangements that I don't remember Edited March 1 by FupDup .
vexyvirus Posted March 1 Author Posted March 1 2 hours ago, FupDup said: So here's my first stab at it. Current Build.mbd 45.11 kB · 1 download A summary of my changes and reasoning: -Swapped Agility for Cardiac because the resistance and endurance reduction will be more useful here -Added in Temperature Protection for some extra survival and slow protection, but had to drop Evasive Maneuvers for it -Dropped/swapped some defensive IO set bonuses (like Opportunity Strikes is now 5 slots instead of 6) because Fiery Aura has no native defense and no protection against defense debuffs -Swapped Dual Wield for Pistols because the latter has higher damage-per-animation -Swapped Eradication for Apocalypse like you planned to do later -Swapped power order around a bit to flow a bit better -Swapped slotting of Healing Flames and Cauterizing Blaze because the full set has a much greater impact in the former power because it has higher values -Added the Miracle and Numina procs to Health for more recovery -Added Kismet To-Hit to more consistently hit enemies -Boosted various IOs to +5 for more power -Enabled the passive health and endurance accolades -A bunch of other rearrangements that I don't remember Thank you so much! If I wanted to slot in the Aegis +Psi resist, where would you consider putting it to lose as little internal synergy as possible? Also earlier you mentioned a lack of procs, is that something I'd want to slot more of? I know certain Pistol attacks are good for proc monster slotting (Like Suppressive Fire), but I'm not exactly sure what the benefits of doing so would be, how it would affect the rest of my build, and what the math behind it would look like.
FupDup Posted March 2 Posted March 2 (edited) Procs are generally a matter of personal taste, at least when your AT/powerset has high base damage like Sentinels usually do. Proc'ing will get you more damage and more damage type diversity (helps deal with enemies who resist your main damage type) but it might come at the cost of set bonuses, depending on exactly what gets replaced. DP in particular is known for having somewhat low single target damage, and having so many secondary effects does give it a wide variety of proc options, so many people do lean on procs to make up for the lowish base damage. Most veteran players do tend to lean on procs in general, especially for a set like DP, but I'm a bit of a weirdo who likes to cram in more bonuses most of the time. If you wish to go that route I won't be as knowledgeable, but just know a few things: 1. Proc rate is based on both the base recharge and the enhanced recharge of a power, meaning that quick powers like your T1 blast will tend to be poor for procing (good for set bonus holding). Hard hitting powers with slow recharge tend to be the best proc choices, like Executioner's Shot or Suppressive Fire in this case. 2. Slotting recharge enhancement directly in a power will reduce the proc rate, but global recharge from things like Hasten, LOTG, or set bonuses will not hurt you. Some powers have long enough base recharge that they can retain a high proc rate even when slotted with recharge directly. Sometimes the set bonuses gained can make this a worthwhile exchange, like 5-slotting Apocalypse for the 10% global recharge and other stuff it comes with. 3. Mids actually has a built-in proc chance calculator, but I think it only works properly for single-target powers? You can see the estimated proc chance by hovering over a power's damage chart in the lower left corner of the interface: Edited March 2 by FupDup .
vexyvirus Posted March 2 Author Posted March 2 22 hours ago, FupDup said: Procs are generally a matter of personal taste, at least when your AT/powerset has high base damage like Sentinels usually do. Proc'ing will get you more damage and more damage type diversity (helps deal with enemies who resist your main damage type) but it might come at the cost of set bonuses, depending on exactly what gets replaced. DP in particular is known for having somewhat low single target damage, and having so many secondary effects does give it a wide variety of proc options, so many people do lean on procs to make up for the lowish base damage. Most veteran players do tend to lean on procs in general, especially for a set like DP, but I'm a bit of a weirdo who likes to cram in more bonuses most of the time. If you wish to go that route I won't be as knowledgeable, but just know a few things: 1. Proc rate is based on both the base recharge and the enhanced recharge of a power, meaning that quick powers like your T1 blast will tend to be poor for procing (good for set bonus holding). Hard hitting powers with slow recharge tend to be the best proc choices, like Executioner's Shot or Suppressive Fire in this case. 2. Slotting recharge enhancement directly in a power will reduce the proc rate, but global recharge from things like Hasten, LOTG, or set bonuses will not hurt you. Some powers have long enough base recharge that they can retain a high proc rate even when slotted with recharge directly. Sometimes the set bonuses gained can make this a worthwhile exchange, like 5-slotting Apocalypse for the 10% global recharge and other stuff it comes with. 3. Mids actually has a built-in proc chance calculator, but I think it only works properly for single-target powers? You can see the estimated proc chance by hovering over a power's damage chart in the lower left corner of the interface: Gotcha, so it's really more of a preference choice people make on sets/classes that sacrifice some of their upfront damage for additional support effects in order to supplement damage. Were I to consider making that change on Suppressive, how many procs vs. Accuracy/Damage is typically favored? Are you still chasing some of the early set bonuses, and what over all global recharge are you typically aiming for? Asking more out of curiosity, as I am looking at making a Defender/Corruptor as my next character and learning some of the standard practice slotting techniques seems valuable.
FupDup Posted March 2 Posted March 2 (edited) How many set pieces you try to frankenslot in there vs. pure procs is also another preference call, influenced by what exact kind of set bonuses you might be able to snag in there. I think most people lean toward only 1 or 2 acc/dam pieces and then fill in the rest with procs, but as I said I'm less knowledgeable on that subject since I tend to just cram in full or mostly full sets most of the time. Some of the more min-maxxed builds use Hami enhancements for acc/dam here instead of set pieces, which does give a slightly higher base value but you don't get the set bonuses. Some examples of partial set slotting could be 3-slotted Thunderstrike for energy/negative defenses, Devastation for some regen and max HP, or Gladiator's Javelin for recovery and max HP, and then the remaining slots filled in with procs. Also note that people tend to load procs into single target powers more often/more heavily than AOE powers because the latter typically don't proc as consistently, so AOE powers might be good set bonus holders for things like ATOs if you want to go the proc route. Edited March 2 by FupDup .
vexyvirus Posted March 5 Author Posted March 5 On 3/2/2024 at 5:43 PM, FupDup said: How many set pieces you try to frankenslot in there vs. pure procs is also another preference call, influenced by what exact kind of set bonuses you might be able to snag in there. I think most people lean toward only 1 or 2 acc/dam pieces and then fill in the rest with procs, but as I said I'm less knowledgeable on that subject since I tend to just cram in full or mostly full sets most of the time. Some of the more min-maxxed builds use Hami enhancements for acc/dam here instead of set pieces, which does give a slightly higher base value but you don't get the set bonuses. Some examples of partial set slotting could be 3-slotted Thunderstrike for energy/negative defenses, Devastation for some regen and max HP, or Gladiator's Javelin for recovery and max HP, and then the remaining slots filled in with procs. Also note that people tend to load procs into single target powers more often/more heavily than AOE powers because the latter typically don't proc as consistently, so AOE powers might be good set bonus holders for things like ATOs if you want to go the proc route. After doing a bit of messing around with the Sentinel DPS sheet, it seems the Proc build is much more powerful when it comes to single target. Now that I have all of the purple sets for the initial build, I think I'm going to start acquiring the pieces to put together the higher damage build as a later goal. In the meantime however, I am far tankier than I ever expected occasionally pinch hitting to draw aggro when the Tank/Brute is out of action for one reason or another. Thank you again so much for providing guidance, and showing me how to improve my initial build! With a tentative Proc build I took a lot of your modifications, such as slotting for Slow resist and swapping out Evasive for Thermal, as well as adding more +recharge speed to account for the lost Recharge Reduction I was getting on Suppressive Fire. Let me know what you think! Proc Build.mbd
FupDup Posted March 6 Posted March 6 (edited) Looks pretty good for the most part, aside from my obsession with set-slotting. One thing I see is that your self-rez maybe shouldn't have that KD proc slotted into it, because the power already has KB by default so this means they will stack their magnitude together and fling your enemies even further than default. Swap it out with one of the other pieces from Avalanche to keep the slow resist bonus. You could then move the Avalanche proc to replace Overwhelming Force in Psy Shockwave because it has a higher proc rate (assuming you want the soft control). Otherwise, I don't see anything else to complain about. EDIT: I guess one other possible concern might be the extremely low proc rate on the Decimation Build Up proc. I don't have maths, but it might potentially be better (or at least way more consistent) to replace the two pieces of Deci with 2 pieces of Gladiator's Javelin (including toxic proc). This would come at the cost of 1.5% en/neg resistance but that loss should be manageable. Edited March 6 by FupDup 1 .
vexyvirus Posted March 6 Author Posted March 6 1 hour ago, FupDup said: One thing I see is that your self-rez maybe shouldn't have that KD proc slotted into it, because the power already has KB by default so this means they will stack their magnitude together and fling your enemies even further than default. Swap it out with one of the other pieces from Avalanche to keep the slow resist bonus. You could then move the Avalanche proc to replace Overwhelming Force in Psy Shockwave because it has a higher proc rate (assuming you want the soft control). Good shout. I didn't know that KD and KB stacked magnitude like that. I just ran the comparison of Javelin vs. Deci in the DPS calculator, and they're very very close. I think you're probably correct about the consistency factor, especially when I have Link Minds as a consistent Build Up proc already.
TECHWON Posted March 6 Posted March 6 On 3/1/2024 at 2:35 PM, FupDup said: So here's my first stab at it. Current Build.mbd 45.11 kB · 10 downloads A summary of my changes and reasoning: -Swapped Agility for Cardiac because the resistance and endurance reduction will be more useful here -Added in Temperature Protection for some extra survival and slow protection, but had to drop Evasive Maneuvers for it -Dropped/swapped some defensive IO set bonuses (like Opportunity Strikes is now 5 slots instead of 6) because Fiery Aura has no native defense and no protection against defense debuffs -Swapped Dual Wield for Pistols because the latter has higher damage-per-animation -Swapped Eradication for Apocalypse like you planned to do later -Swapped power order around a bit to flow a bit better -Swapped slotting of Healing Flames and Cauterizing Blaze because the full set has a much greater impact in the former power because it has higher values -Added the Miracle and Numina procs to Health for more recovery -Added Kismet To-Hit to more consistently hit enemies -Boosted various IOs to +5 for more power -Enabled the passive health and endurance accolades -A bunch of other rearrangements that I don't remember I agree, slotting for sentinels can be slight tricky but once its level can be good
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