beradical

I'm definitely confused. Aren't tankers low damage? That's the reason I've never played one and kinda thinking they're a Tier3 AT at large. But you know your stuff, so I'll assume I'm misinformed.

I would like EM/Sd Stalker more if I could get more crits out of my AoEs. LR & SC don't break hide and crit, ball lightning and TS do. I tried putting the Hide proc in TS, so I could LR > SC > TS + crit > proc rehide > ball lightning + crit, but it never quite worked like I hoped. Sometimes only boss was left and then if I hit AS it's bio break time with slow-form. TS is so small radius you need to use it early for max mobs and effectiveness, but I tend to use the tp aspect of LR so never opened with TS. So eventually I just gave up and put the hide proc in AS, but I would really loved to have had an AoE crit machine. And Elec/Shld never worked out great for that. Obviously it's still great AoE damage, but I wasn't able to break it open. Does Savage Leap break hide and crit? With stacks of frenzy I know Rending Flurry's radius increases (making it superior to TS), does it crit from hide? Can you SC > SL for crit + frenzy > AS for rehide proc + frenzy > RF for large radius crit?

Gotcha. Well this toon is strong, offensively, at early levels, which is absolutely awesome. Some AT-sets don't take the low level powers, so they don't start to get decent until their 40s, which makes them tough to level. Fire/Fire gets good powers from the start. That said, survivability largely comes from set bonuses, and I don't typically buy those until I hit lvl 50. So your blaster will be very squishy until then, which means the aggressive melee style will be a lot tougher, and you might want to hang back in ranged a bit more. Lastly, yes, lol, this gam gets more fun at lvl 50. For a lot of us, we've run the 1-50 content so many times now we just power-level our toons in AE, when the real grind starts getting incarnated, IOd, and accolades. Then we can run through all of the SFs and trials. And being strong at low levels means that when I exemplar down to run a low level TF, I'll have strong attacks, unlike many of my toons.

All super fair points. I don't have experience with Scrappers, but think their ATOs look pretty great on paper. I thought their base chance for crit was really good?

Hmm, my build is getting worse. I'm not really seeing the vision of what I'm trying to accomplish. Is the goal just decent to mediocre defense and resists, just to slow the rate of incoming damage, then moderate with the 3 pseudo-heal/absorb/regens? I can get S/L res and E/N def to caps, it just looks like swiss cheese, but maybe that's the point of a hybrid secondary. Jawbreaker>Clobber>Shatter are your main ST Chain, and WM & CC are your only 2 AoEs, so Pulvarize and Moonbeam are just mules? Bio is such a power-heavy set having a couple additional unused powers hurts.

I agree with your reasoning, he has a Dark mechanic and flavor to his survivability (secondary skills). His unique attack is TPing mobs until they are drained, and acrobatic leaping is his defining style. So clearly leaping and TP pools, But he's expert fencer, and uses his tail for multiple swords, so I'm actually going DB/DA. But has to be Stalker, his fighting mechanics require TP-based surprise and placate, and he has stealth. Also, damn I would love to see a TP-based melee set and mobs. How awful would that be, your Kin just got TP foed to the group of EBs, or the stone tank just got TP'd down the hall.

Yeah, I read Frosticus' guide and realized how much stronger it was, and was about to roll one, but then I got thinking about the never-ending struggle of figuring out exactly what a Stalkers' role is, and the frustration of the AS slow-form and hide mechanics. I want to love the Stalker, it was virtually all I played on live. But the changes to AS didn't fix it's fundamental flaws, to the point that we don't even bother take Placate or slow-AS anymore, and I'm convinced I would be better off w/o Hide. Which is basically just a Scrapper with shittier ATOs and less crits. So then I ask myself, when would I want a Stalker? Thinking back to the best 8-person teams I have been on, usually 3-4 blasters, 2-3 corruptors (rad + kin) and a Scrapper or high damage brute. Taunt is super useful in the multiple AV fights, and I don't think Sav/Shld Stalker could tank Arachnos AVs or Freedom Phlanx, let alone hold aggro. But I know a Scrapper can, I've seen it many times (not sure if /Bio can though). This means I join LRSF and see a bunch of blasters, corrs, fenders and say, I'll grab my Scrapper. But when would I say I'll grab my stalker? If the teams need dps I'll grab the blaster, ranged is faster and more versatile than melee, unless you are explicitly trying to hold aggro. If teams needs buffs/debuffs then corr or fender. I wish they'd change it, make Stalkers more like Blasters, very squishy and higher damage. This would make them more challenging, fun and valuable.

Solid feedback @josh1622 - You were invaluable in helping me get my Elec/Shld Stalker spec'd, and once again I can't thank you enough. I'll get back to the mids drawing board in-between AE runs. Are you putting KB>KD in Shatter and CC?

This is actually a really solid point, the mechanics are the best clue we have. Straight up damage and survivability overlap a lot between the various ATs and sets, I have stalkers way tougher than my fire brute. And my proc'd out Defender does better ST dmg (solo) than my elec stalker. So applying mechanics: Wolverine clearly gets enraged, which could be considered fury making him a brute. The question is does his fighting style lend itself more to fury than crits? I say no, he loves his head-shots and joint-shots, he's just an angry scrapper. Hulk doesn't seem to aim his shots for crits, he just smashes, and gets particularly nasty when angry, so I think the mechanics are clearly brute. And DD is clearly crit-based. So the question is does he use more stealth/hide/placate tactics for his crits, or straight up melee for crits? I remember quite a few fights where DD killed the lights to use stealth to his advantage, and he definitely has stealth/hide mechanics. But I also remember even more fights where he used/threw his baton mid-battle for nasty crits and headshots. So despite being far squishier than Wolverine, he might just be a /SR scrapper whose toughness is limited solely to avoidance, and weak against an enemy with massive ToHit leveling out his defense, aka Bullseye or even Punisher. Who are both Blasters? The mythical ranged Scrapper that ya'll have been dreaming about?

First time with both WM & Bio which looks a bit confusing. At least WM looks straight-forward. My focus is solid ST dmg for AVs, but with enough AoE for the cleanup (which is most of a TF or trial). WM was recommended as a solid choice. Will pool ranged attacks cause a delay for redraw, such as Moonbeam? What about the Mace Mastery powers, such as Mace Beam? Are any of the Bio powers skippable, they all look valuable on paper? I know Shadow Meld is popular, but at 3s cast time it's a bit long, is it worth taking Moonbeam and SM? Should I fill the Psi gap in def and/or res? Psi is pretty common in end-game and has me a bit worried. Should I make room for Confront so it could dual-purpose off-tank in Defensive Adaption? Or should I just make a 2nd build intended specifically for that? Here is my first attempt, any assistance or superior builds would be greatly appreciated. Money is no object.

I am absolutely not an expert, but I didn't like your build for S/L farming. I guess OwtS is fine, I have it on my Elec/Shld Stalker but solely as a mule. I don't like the crash. The plus recovery and hit points is cool, but I'd rather just pop Ageless as the plus rech lets you kill more faster, which OwtS doesn't. Instead I just tried to get situational def and S/L res capped, without sacrificing too much rech, using as much of your existing build as possible. Personally, I prefer the Mu pool, it adds a ranged for runners and unique set types, a solid AoE, and the cages can be proc'd out for solid AoE dmg as well. Hopefully someone more skilled will respond to you, but until then, maybe this will give you some ideas.

This is a really solid idea @Siderous. Nothing worse than chasing down runners, or trying to fit in a ranged just for runners. Pool powers don't often fit into chains well, can cause redraw, don't take ATOs, don't stack assassin focus for stalkers, or other set-specific mechanics. It's also solid for slows.

Hmm, by the dominant logic here, are we to assume that Wolverine is a Brute?? Nah, I think he is the archetypal scrapper, like his arch-nemesis Sabretooth. They charge straight into a fight. I think Hulk is the ideal brute, and Superman is more known for his toughness and super strength than raw damage output, so I'll classify him as Tanker. So are we to pit Daredevil in the same class as Wolverine? Not even close folks. DD is a Stalker, and yes, we Stalkers love to scrap head on. Ya'll are talking like Stalkers get AS in and turn and run off lmao. We just don't like to announce our presence and charge in, which is why we don't get taunt. Likewise Nightcrawler has to be Stalker. They use stealth/surprise for max burst damage, including placate for mid-battle rehide -> burst. Aka TP away, TP foe. Or hide in shadows. Batman is the tougher call, cause he loves his stealthy burst damage, but he's Wolverine scrappy and tough. I'd still lean towards /Devices Stalker, because he just isn't that tanky without a full on mech suit.

I think it is the most fun toon I've played yet, that said, I'm really partial to melee squishies, there is a real challenge to living on the edge, which imo makes the rewards greater. Soloing a tower in LRSF and nuking the entire room of longbow w EBs is incredibly satisfying. Again, my Elec/Shld Stalker is more than capable of this, and is much more sturdy, but the Fire/Fire Blaster also has the ST damage to bring the party to the AV fight as well. It's like his primary is AoE and his secondary is ST, roughly speaking. I've seen some people complain there he has no buffs, debuffs or heals. But this is a benefit, just focus on damage, damage, moar damage, NOT health, endurance, team mates, control, a clicky for mez protection. Instead, kill faster, even if mezzed. Soft cap means maybe 5% get through(?), this means you need to drop mobs fast, so it's 5% for 1-2 mobs, not 5% for 8+ mobs. And everything has fast rech and cast times. This means you are never locked in a long animation (except the nuke) if pink dots or blue cracks or Tyrant crackles emerge. This means you are always actively engaged, moving, killing. I think I'm sticking with the top build, AND going with Musc, Ageless, Assault Radial. It is definitely not conservative approach, but moar damage. And with such a simple playstyle, it's really not a bother to pop a purple when needed (note to self: research macros/binds for inspirations). This toon is a monster with rech, you can cycle through your top 3 attacks seamlessly, top 2 with a +rech boost for absurd damage. And if I'm running a mez-heavy mish like UG, I'll swap back to Clarion and/or Melee Core. I struggled at first, a lot. I died a ton, and spent half the mish soft napping, and wondered what I was doing with my life. I was convinced he was narcoleptic. But once I got all my T3s and IO sets, it radically changed, and I don't get hit much so I don't get mezzed much. I still keep 1 wakie and P2W rez handy for the occasional hard nap, but level shifts + soft-caps + aggressive playstyle = sturdy.

Totally understood, they look awful on paper. But IMO they are both awesome if you play aggressive and live in melee. Here's the thing - mobs run from me like no other toon I've played. So I open with Rain of Fire (-SPD) and charge into the group with Hot Feet toggled, both -SPD powers help a lot to slow down runners, and both have large radius. Then I pop Burn then Inferno hitting as many mobs as possible. Despite it's awful radius, Burn has solid damage and fast rech so I can keep stacking it while hugging the B, EB, AV, etc. I try to keep Burn and Rain of Fire active at all times, keeping Hot Feet and Cauterizing Aura toggled. None of these powers do a lot, but collectively they really add up for some impressive dmg, so I can focus my attacks on the biggest baddie and everyone else just melts in the process. Fire Ball is meh but 1s cast time is hard to beat, so well worth it while minions and LTs are still alive. All in all this has been super successful formula, I'm still using top build with Clarion and I'm really impressed. I don't think he does as much AoE damage as my Elec/Shld stalker with crits, but he does more ST dmg, with ranged attacks so I don't have to chase runners. He doesn't faceplant much, though he likes to take naps midbattle, so Flares and Ring of Fire still get use. It's a well crafted AT-set, challenging to build, many layers of damage, and it's very rewarding to charge into a group of mobs and see them run and melt away. Did I mention it's challenging to build?

It's awful on my Fire/Fire Blaster, not sure which PBAoE it is but they all run towards me at opening attack, and then turn and scatter. So frustrating on an AoE heavy toon with 4 PBAoEs...at least I'm ranged so I get the consolation prize of shooting them in the back.

War Mace certainly looks strong, and has piqued my interest. Ice looks weak on AoE, can you proc out ice patch, or just frost and frozen aura for AoE?

What are some primaries with awesome ST dmg for AVs, but enough AoE for the mob cleanup duty? **For context, I'm working on my swiss army knife collection of "toons I'll actually want to play" that add a significant contribution to end-game content. This list keeps shrinking as I retire my underperformers, including trollers, doms, widow, brutes and ST melee toons. No offense to lovers of these ATs, but I find there are more dynamic alternatives. My philosophy has changed and I now believe damage is the best mitigation, and a team of 8 fast & high damage toons will perform best. Any toon not contributing to massive speed and damage is missed potential; the team would have been better served with another AT-set. So far there are 4 toons I actually play: (1) Fire/Fire melee Blaster is probably the most fun and challenging, and the ST & AoE damage is awesome. (2) Fire/Kin Corruptor is a lot of fun to play, very busy, and makes a noticeable contribution to the team. (3) Rad/Son Defender is a great buffer/debuffer, with mediocre 300 st dps. It gets more play time than my Fire/Poison Defender because it's easier to debuff, Accelerate Metabolism is a great and has good heal, so I feel it adds more team value. But I'm beginning to suspect this is no longer a Tier 1 toon, and a top performing blaster or scrapper will probably add more value - but I'm still on the fence. (4) Elec/Shield Stalker is my top performing AoE toon due to crits, AoE radius and rech, but the mediocre ST chain annoys me to no end. 2 best attacks are long-form AS and Zapp, so for ST kills I have to open with my 3rd best attack to break hide and enter combat, just so I can then use AS & Zapp. The Hide proc can only go in AS which means a much lower attack gets the crit, and long-form AS is sort of useless. So that got me thinking about Scrapper. I thought maybe a Bio Scrapper with 2 builds, 1 for max damage, and 1 for off-tank w taunt. That would give me max dmg (blaster), max speed (kin corr), max de/buff (radfender) or dual-purpose scrapper, and I honestly think that's all you need anymore. What Scrapper sets should I be looking at?

It's a lot tougher to soft-cap M/R than S/L/R just because of Scorpion Shield, I could get fairly close in melee but not ranged, but gained 2 strong resist+mez powers, while still having Demonic Aura. I'd love to get the ranged up to 40 but couldn't see how.

Ok, lemme mock that up in mids. Darkir said in another post that most AoEs are either melee or ranged, so M/R should be sufficient. I'll see how high I can get ToHit, I ran out of slots for Kismet and was so focused on survival, but I'll see what I can come up with. TY @Krazie Ivan

I am still running the top build, my gut instinct says the higher base res and rech will do more good long term, and make the toon more dynamic because it doesnt rely on Ageless, so I can pop in Clarion or Barrier or Ageless depending on the SF/Trial mobs and team composition. However there are times when damage starts coming in and I don't have a lot of mitigation options other than inspirations. Demonic Aura is nice but long rech, Hybrid Support is a decent compromise as it still offers some dmg buff in addition to defense, but no res. This is where Rune of Prot would be awesome. And this toon really shines with max rech. On a team with a Kin I can really spam just my hardest hitting attacks and my dps output skyrockets. I don't see anyway I could get decent defenses and max rech, so it doesn't seem like a viable avenue, unless there are sets with both def and rech I have missed.

I'm sure it varies for powersets. Both ranged and flying are awesome with cones, but my Fire/Fire does far more damage in melee due to it's 4 PBAoEs which are my money makers. That set would not perform well in flight or ranged. He isn't that squishy once soft-capped, except for def debuff and the alpha strike that gets through defense and one-shots me, but honestly that happens on my def-based stalkers and all squishies. I've been running LRSF all week, and I can solo a tower, corner herd the longbow, and nuke them to high hell before they kill me. The only struggle is mez, which depends entirely on the powersets of the LB B/EBs, so it might require me to pop Clarion. Honestly the hardest thing about my fire/fire blaster is that mobs run like I have never experienced before. None of my stalkers or scrappers seem to instill that same amount of fear as this guy, and that really sucks given the amount of PBAoE I do.

Here is what I finally settled on, now that I hit 50 today and finished Black Scorpion arc to unlock that pool. Close to S/L/R soft-cap. Lost a lot of resist, so the zero DDR is going to hurt at times. Couldn't find a way to fit in Rune of Protection that didn't just blow up everything. Added more mez & slow resists with 3 Winter sets. I like to open with RoF for the slow, and it has good proc rate, so I moved Defiant Barrage there to open w Mag 1 prot. 140% rech isn't enough, but 1 rech buff from teammate and don't need Flares for ST Chain: BB > B > RoF, and can cycle AoEs almost continuously. Will see how it does once I get Ageless T4.

40% M/R is acceptible at lvl 50 running +4x8 TFs and trials, the damage is real and I'm not yet incarnated. I don't mind the squishy and lack of heal, but mez is a real problem. I don't want Clarion, so I might need to look into Sorcery, which would blow this whole build up. I'll keep working and post my updated build once I have it tested in game live.