How is thermal as a Robot secondary?

[Ensaga]

I've freshly returned like so many others and haven't played since live (if that's what we're calling it - this seems pretty live though!). I'm working on a Bots/TM but I'm at the point where I'm jumping into enemy groups for Time's Juncture which put's me in the position of tanking while my bots are hanging back to shoot. Even if I get them to pick up agro first, I'm still standing among the enemies to debuff them  and I need to run back to give give my guys any healing. It just feels awkward at the moment. I don't know if this changes in later levels so I'd like to hear about that, if it does.

 

Alternatively I'm wondering how thermal works. Are the thermal shield skills wasted when stacked with the protector bots shields? I love this as a secondary on Demons, but of course the 12 pet is healing and not duplicating efforts.

 

I also considered dark but know even less about that except the heal is a faster recharge than TM and it seems like a lot of the powers can be used while hanging back with my minions.

 

Any advice would be appreciated, in the mean time I'm having a complete blast rediscovering one of my favourite MMOs!

[tidge]

I have /Thermal on a Thugs Build, and do not like it.

 

I have a Robotics/ Build and I can't imagine using a dedicated Healing / Henchman Buffing secondary with it. The inherent recharge times on Heat Exhaustion and Melt Armor are simply too long to improve henchmen performance IMO.

 

There is another thing I don't like about /Thermal: until level 28, the secondary offers nothing to pull aggro to the MM... and some advice for a new player, don't rely on Provoke, as it requires a ToHit check and has a target cap of 5 targets.

[StrikerFox]

14 hours ago, Ensaga said:

Alternatively I'm wondering how thermal works. Are the thermal shield skills wasted when stacked with the protector bots shields? I love this as a secondary on Demons, but of course the 12 pet is healing and not duplicating efforts.

 

I also considered dark but know even less about that except the heal is a faster recharge than TM and it seems like a lot of the powers can be used while hanging back with my minions.

 

Thermal shields provide +damage resistance while Protector Bots provide +defense. Thermal works well with Demons because Demon pets have inherent high damage resist and Thermal shields stacks on top of that. Demons will be at +90% resist to several damage types, and most times Thermal heals is enough to keep them alive.

The Bots/Thermal combo would do well in most content but may struggle in others. I think you will be healing harder when fighting enemies that stack -def debuff. But on the other hand, I find range pets easier to play than melee pets so Bots/Thermal may do just as well as Demons/Thermal.

I think on paper, Dark is the strongest MM secondary. To varying degrees, Dark checks off a lot of boxes a player may want in a MM secondary. 

+Defense - Shadow Fall

-Defense - N/A

+Dam Res - Shadow Fall

-Dam Res - Tar Patch

+Tohit - N/A

-Tohit - Darkest Knight/Fearsome Stare

+Heals - Twilight Grasp

+Regen - N/A

-Regen - Twilight Grasp/Howling Twilight

+Absorb - N/A

+End - N/A (Theft of Essence)

-End - N/A

+Damage - N/A

-Damage - Darkest Knight/Twilight Grasp

KD/KB - N/A

+Mez Pro/Res - Shadow Fall

-Mez 1 - Howling Twilight/Petrifying Gaze

-Mez 2 - Fearsome Stare/Tar Patch

Rez - Howling Twilight

Extra Pet - Dark Servant

Proc Slots - Multiple on most powers

[Ensaga]

Thank you for the replies and the education!

 

This part I don't really understand:
 

Quote

...offers nothing to pull aggro to the MM

 

Maybe it's just because i'm in the early game, but pulling agro to me sounds like a death sentence - so far at least I don't feel like I should be tanking. Or does this mean literally pulling them into melee range / piling up the enemies?

 

I've been trying to quickly nail down a choice while the bonus xp buffs are live on the servers, but now I've discovered there are merchants who offer a limited amount of them for free (presumably per character) so I'm pretty tempted to just try everything. I did bubbles on live but even if changes have been made, I've looked at the list and it still seems like the least interactive powerset. I love the idea and look but it's a bit too dull.

[Jen-Ru9]

Keeping your minions in Bodyguard mode and within Supremacy range will split any damage you receive across all of them. Effectively your minions become ablative armor, and using this MMs can tank a surprising amount of stuff by attacking first and soaking the alpha. Something that lets you grab a bunch of aggro is useful but only essential for a play style that focuses on that 'tankermind' aspect.

 

As far as /FF goes, it's had some changes but is still a very Set It and Forget It set I think? I admittedly haven't touched it since Live because my old Bots/FF left me hearing that bubbling sound in my dreams...

[tidge]

1 hour ago, Ensaga said:

Maybe it's just because i'm in the early game, but pulling agro to me sounds like a death sentence - so far at least I don't feel like I should be tanking. Or does this mean literally pulling them into melee range / piling up the enemies?

 

As @Jen-Ru9 wrote: If the henchmen are close by, and in Bodyguard mode, they act as a pool of Health AND will attack that which is aggro-ed by the MM. Generally, I don't want enemies to focus-fire on the henchmen. Even better is to have pseudo-pets deployed that will also draw aggro... which is one of the aspects of Traps that makes it a powerful secondary. Robots are ranged attackers so they are generally better about staying where you want them to stay, and in Bodyguard mode, if they aren't being knocked around they will often stay somewhat clustered.

 

For much of the Live era; Dark was probably the most useful Secondary choice. It is still a good choice, but it isn't IMO as dominant a choice. From my memory of Live, it was the PBAoE heal (available at low levels) plus Shadow Fall which made it a 'peak early and never look back' set. and who doesn't like Dark Servant? These days, it really is not that important to worry about healing henchmen, and sufficient defenses/resistances can be achieved by any combo of powers. The best two powers in /Dark Miasma for MMs are IMO Tar Patch and Howling Twilight, for the -Res and -Regeneration.... but again, in an era with Enhancement sets and Envenomed Daggers, it is possible for (m)any other MMs to get there too.

 

Keep in mind that the game directly rewards defeating enemies, not keeping henchmen alive.

[Ensaga]

Again thank you guys. I was aware of the bodyguard settings but was only thinking of that as just another helpful defence. I also have a habbit of directing my bots which I think sets them back to aggressive. I'll go give that method a shot right now.