My journey and a bit troubled by my Storm/Elec Defender

[grooAm]

I re-started a few weeks ago on Homecoming after a lengthy break on Rebirth.

 

I had a Demon/Storm MM on Rebirth, so I decided to roll something Storm/ and went with Elec for the idea of having another pseudo pet and that elec powers might give end back (storm being end hungry and all that). Plus Electrical Storm fits 🙂

Starting new, not accepting donations and basically SSF, I also for some reason decided to make this toon my main badger. And, since I had never done gold or red 100%, I also wanted to run all missions. I've just completed gold yesterday on Oro and hit 50 at the same time.

 

Anyways ... the experience has been ... wonky. And, for the most part, a total slog.

Anything up to lvl 10 was fine, but it is always, and there is not that much content (I haven't started red yet)

The 10-19 range is where its been the hardest honestly. At first I locked my level at 20, keeping all the DFB buffs, which was fine'ish but slow due to not having any real damage powers at that point (I decided to skip the second attack on elec, taking gale at first, which was a terrible idea)

Mid 15 I decided to make a second build, level it past 20 and got a 4 slotted Zapp on the attack chain, which made it slightly more bearable. Of course I lost DFB and had to slot acc, loosing the +rech on the set bonusses meant that everything took longer still.

In fact the experience was so soul destroying, that I made 5 alts during this time, just to see how different ATs stack up against that level range.

My nature/thugs mm soloed Frostfire unslotted with no bruiser out of the gate, something my defender had to ask for help for (and I was fully slotted). The mm is about twice as fast on all missions, but only because of travel times, on pure map clearing I would say its three times as fast.

 

For the 20-30 range I set it to -1x8, because Elec is good with AOE and Storm has inbuilt fear, because I've got no mitigation. (tried the fighting pool on build 2, but it didn't get far, because of end struggles plus I still died if short circuit missed bosses).

It feels "powerful", but I think its a lot of flash and clicking and still takes a long time.

 

Teaming higher level content (safeguard missions, etc.): sometimes I can solo an entire event other times I get faceplanted by the first group. The key seems to be a mixture of "Does the group try to get away after Freezing Rain/Tornado?" and "Does my Short Circuit/Ball Lightning drain all the bosses/lieuts and KEEP them drained?".

During the Ms Liberty Task Force I literally had no impact or team utility, yet contributed to half the deaths.

I have 65 Stealth AOE, but no team teleport, because I have no slots ...

 

Overall: I like the character. I made a nice costume and all, But. Storm/Elec feels anti-synergetic. I have three different defense mechanisms (KD, Fear from FR and Tornado and End drain) but they are all ... occasional. And that's fine, because I'm not a controller. But I also do not have the sustain/defense to survive if something tries to fight back.

While end drain is fun, nothing like an elite boss just looking at you while you Zapp away, it doesn't help survive the alpha of a group. I cannot count the number of times I've been one-shotted by a half drained group.

I can also not count the number of times i died by a fully drained group, because this or that boss got off a hold/mezz fully end drained. I think elec should drain to slightly under 0 (maybe -5?) on defender to avoid the short circuit -> mob end tick -> mez -> dead

And the damage is ... low. Without a group lockdown, Tornado sits on one mob, while everyone scatters. My only dmg tool is Zapp.

I feel like a secondary with -toHit or any kind of immob would fare much better than Elec.

Edited January 31 by grooAm
add mez

[grooAm]

Storm/

Gale skip: not worth it without slotting, not worth it in most circumstances, useless in groups. Utility I've got with other stuff. My problem is surviving a group (doesn't help) and dmg (doesn't help)

O2 Boost: great, even only for the Preventative Maintenance Absorb Proc. My only self heal outside of greens. Useful in teams, Thinking of 6 slotting it for the +rech and end discount on PM.

Snow Storm: Weird. You can kite some bosses/elite bosses very early. A Lot of mobs completely ignore the slow and its a huge end hog. didn't use it at all for the last 20 hours. Thinking of skipping it and taking both attacks on Elec instead.

Steamy Mist: yes. +Def, Stealth, I got it 6 slotted and put in Gladiators, LotG, Kismet and Steadfast

Freezing Rain: 6 slotted, currently with 6 Ice Mistral, but I'm sure there is better slotting for it, just don't know what ...

Hurricane: The -toHit is nice, but the Repel is bad, I can't use it to jump into a group hidden and set up, because it immediately unhides me, and usually doesn't hit the whole group. After everyone scatters, its not useful anymore. Plus its massive end drain. I tried to herd a group together by skirting on the outside, but if Tornado or FR is up, they all scatter faster than I can herd. I would need Snow Storm for that too. and that I can't afford plus its 7 seconds doing stuff that doesn't contribute much to anything.

Thunder Clap skip: amazing animation, everything else is bad. Had it in once, specced out of it. I don't think its useful for lockdown because on x8 my problem is the two bosses.

Tornado: 6 slotted with Sudden Accel. Overwhelming Force is probably better, but I don't have 6 yet (weird on Rebirth everyone is constantly running SBB, here nobody seems to know about it). I was playing with the idea of purple stun set for the +rech 10%, plus it would be an interesting group lock down, if it works ...

Lightning Storm: 6 Slotted Sudden Accel, Probably something/anything else here would be better? Thought was, I have enough scatter already, and I don't want to piss of my team 😞

 

/Elec

Charged Bolts: 2 slot power transfer, one is the self heal, which doesn't proc often enough to be meaningful in a fight 😞 DPA is fine, but I can't click it as often as its up, because of all the other things that want to be clicked at ...

Lightning Bolt skip: Probably should have taken it instead of CB or Snow Storm and slotted it somewhat ...

Ball Lightning: 6 slotted Power Transfer. Ok DPA and looks good. Plus AOE, why not take it? Self Heal doesn't trigger often enough, but then maybe it is and I'm taking more dmg than I think? And i can't take the self heal out, because then I loose the 7.5 recharge set bonus.

Short Circuit: 6 slotted Power Transfer. Terrible DPA, but that's not what it is for. Drains about 70% of most bosses, if it hits. Which is a huge pain, because even with 95% ToHit (95 to hit bonus, 1.41x Accuracy bonus), i feel it misses all the time. And usually, if it does, I'm dead. (misses the bosses that is). Same comment about the Heal proc.

Charge Up skip: Don't need the Acc, I'm already at 95%, and I can't do anything above +1 solo anyways. Dmg is negligible.

Zapp: I want to skip it. don't ask my why. It has good DPA. 4 slotted it with a sniper set. Probably should be 6 slotted with something ... Also misses a LOT. I have a clip where it missed 4 times in a row against a boss mob. I don't know. maybe the 5% auto miss needs a look at? For like AT's that do low dmg or for single targets? Because 5% miss on Ball Lightning isnt a big deal if I hit 10+ Mobs. Again, this is also about survival.

Tesla Cage skip: I want to take it, but its single target, the dmg is probably not worth it. It cant lock down EB's and I would need to 6 slot it probably plus take the hold power from Elec Pool?

Voltaic Sentinel: I tried it extensively. Have it 6 slotted with some pet dmg sets. Its not good. It breaks stealth, its power is lackluster even on 6 slotted and it drains end. Will specc out of it. It is anti synergetic, even if its cool to have a little ball of lightning that follows you around. Cute and all that. Not worth the power pick, not worth the slots 😞

Thunderous Blast: Amazing. 6 Slotted Positron's Blast, but should probably put Power Transfer in and bump it to +5?

 

Leadership: all for the frankenslots and such. Probably take out Victory Rush. Not sure about Tactics, but then I have a problem with mezzes too

Speed: Hasten. Yeah because Storm and Elec want it ...

Electricity Mastery

Thunder Strike: 6 slotted Sudden Accel. I never use it, because in Team settings its too slow and too low dmg, and in solo, I'm only up to 30 in Oro.

Charged Armor: 6 slotted Unbreakable+Aegis. On paper its great and should help survive the alpha. Don't know if it does. I haven't much used it. Oro content still too low.

Power Sink: no idea. Never used it. Never needed it.

Overall Electricity feels like a mis-pick. Maybe Ice instead? I read somewhere its great with Storm.

 

Pools/Powers I want to take, but don't have the space 😞

Fighting: it doesn't fit the build, but elec is all about melee range and my sustain is terrible.

Sorcery: for Flight and the Mez protection, which is the second biggest hole outside of simply getting one-shot ...

Teleport: For team teleport after sneaking to the boss in missions

Flight: I heard Hover is great with anything Storm, but I hate hover. so probably take 3 powers to be faster with hover?

 

Appreciate any help with the build if anyone has insights, otherwise I'll shelf it and start over with my badger 😞

 

Edited January 31 by grooAm

[grooAm]

I should add, that I have a full set of superior Defender ATOs, I just don't know where to slot it and if its even worth doing it, or if I should re-roll. (I saw the storm/ thread, which got me thinking of re-rolling this)

Again, I like the char, but it hasn't been much fun, and it doesn't look like the struggle will get better until incarnates, at which point its just becomes like every other incarnate.

I'm also up to 549 badges so far \^^/ 

Edited January 31 by grooAm

[Mopery]

 

I thought perhaps you could use some Inspirations.

[grooAm]

Yeah, I've been chucking them like there is no tomorrow. There was a time, when engaging a group and didn't have a full bag of pills, I would do a forced trip to the hospital to ask the nurse for more 😄

The reply wasn't as useful as was hoping it to be, but it made me chuckle.

So thanks ^^

Edited January 31 by grooAm

[grooAm]

So ... another life shattering experience.

I just did Summer Blockbuster with a fairly low level team, meaning the entire thing took a bit longer.

I do my normal rotation of TB -> SC and try to keep the AV's end drained, and the strangest thing happened. They started to full tilt run around the map. Snow Storm did not slow them down to any degree I could see.

After a bit of experimenting it seems, as soon as mobs are completely end drained a lot of them just start to aimlessly run around, waiting for end to recover. I have noticed the amazing scatter in missions and thought this is simply the fear effect from Tornado and Freezing Rain. But it seems both sets have crazy scatter and both sets want a secondary that has some form of lockdown/immob.

Which means that Storm/Elec is actually the worst combination of powers for a somewhat team oriented defender and terrible solo?

 

Is there something I am missing here?

[Uun]

• As you've correctly noted, slows often don't seem to have a noticeable effect. The movement floor is 10% and you need to hit that or close to it for the effect to be noticeable. You can achieve that with 90% -speed, but that's affected by the purple patch so you need a bit more against higher level foes. I've had good results with Time/Distortion Field, Poison/Neurotoxic Breath, Trick Arrow/Glue Arrow and any number of controller powers, all of which have higher base values than Snow Storm. The problem with Snow Storm is that even on a defender it's only 62.5% -speed. You need to slot 2x slow IOs (plus end red) for it to do anything on its own. You can also stack it with Freezing Rain.
• You can 6-slot Freezing Rain if you want the set bonuses, but it will work fine with just 2x recharge IOs. I usually 3-4 slot a Defense Debuff set.
• Ball Lightning is a good candidate for %dmg procs. Slot acc/dmg, acc/dmg/end and 3-4 procs.
• Don't skip Charge Up. Slot it with the Gaussian's %buildup proc. Use before Thunderous Blast (or Zapp).
• Tesla Cage is primarily a -end/-recovery/hold power. It doesn't do much damage unless you slot it with %dmg procs.
• You're 100% correct that end drained mobs will take off running. Consider taking Electric Fence (ST immobilize) instead of Thunder Strike. 
• Power Sink is a terrific end drain/end recovery power. It's auto hit and doesn't need more than 2-3 slots.

[Uun]

3 hours ago, grooAm said:

I do my normal rotation of TB -> SC and try to keep the AV's end drained, and the strangest thing happened. They started to full tilt run around the map. Snow Storm did not slow them down to any degree I could see.

 

AVs heavily resist -end, -speed and a laundry list of other debuffs.

 

https://homecoming.wiki/wiki/Archvillain_Resistance

[grooAm]

@Uun, thanks for the reply.

• I'll spec out of Snow Storm. I do not use it currently and it has marginal use in team content. I tried slotting dmg procs, but they have abysmal chances to hit. Which is fine. Its not meant as a damaging power.
• The defense debuff in FR seems a good idea against higher level content or group content. I will try that.
• I will try the dmg procs in Ball Lightning. I have never tried a proc monster or even stacking procs in a single power. Do procs/proc chance go up when the enhancement is leveled? Or +5?
• Electric Fence isn't really going to address my main issue though, right? Which is 10+ mobs take off running around, pulling in more mobs, the scattered mobs stay out of my short circuit radius and are all too far apart for Tornado and Ball Lightning.
  Especially grouped the scatter is a major pain. Solo I can just turn it down to less than x8. although I can do -1x8, it just takes forever to hunt down 100 mobs individually when elec and storm are essentially centered around aoe.
• Yes, noted about Power Sink, but it just isn't available in 30 exemplared Oro content 😞

I do know about the AV resistances. Its just, basically in the SBB I would have helped the team more had I not drained the AV, because we spent a somewhat hilarious 20 minutes chasing after the Heist AV's. And that is not something I would like to repeat.
Again, the problem is, the main advantage of Elec on a defender is end drain (factor 1.49 if I remember correctly), yet I should not end drain because it makes the content take twice as long as it should and a major pain for the team and for me. So why play it as a defender? Also the drain is the mitigation part of the powerset (like -ToHit is on Dark, etc), but it doesn't mitigate when everything is allowed to scatter.

Elec on Stalker is amazing. And I am sure Elec on a Defender is great if paired correctly. My question was more: Am I screwed? Because Storm/Elec Defender is simply not fun most of the time. It can be amazing in small tight spaces like safeguard bank or so, but on open maps I find it completely unplayable.

Half the powers work counter synergetic, not only between the powersets but also within a single set. The tools Storm/Elec has against scatter (Snow Storm, FR, Thunder Clap and Tesla Cage) are insufficient. The mitigation of both sets is insufficient (I feel) to play it in higher level content. And the support side of a defender for team play is small.

[schrodingercat]

just a tip, if something is drained and running around, it isn't hitting anyone. It won't pull other mobs back to your team unless it has a debuff anchor (like snow storm) on it. You can use your other tools like tornado (with a kb->kd enhancement) to keep them bouncing around instead of running around, or gale them and knock them down with kb->kd. Many things ignore speed debuffs, but very few things ignore knockup/knock back.

 

Hurricane should never be used in the middle of mobs. It should be used for area denial and ranged attacker protection. I generally (on live) would jump in, end drain, then hop back out and have tornado/hurricane running after dropping freezing rain. This is significantly easier to pull off on homecoming since they made changes to the sapper mechanics. Remember also hurricane provides significant protection by debuffing range. That means touching a dark ringmistress or a fortunata with hurricane effectively neuters their entire attack set.

 

Edited January 31 by schrodingercat

[Uun]

2 hours ago, grooAm said:

I will try the dmg procs in Ball Lightning. I have never tried a proc monster or even stacking procs in a single power. Do procs/proc chance go up when the enhancement is leveled? Or +5?

Proc chances don't change with the proc's level, nor does boosting it. The primary factor affecting proc chances is recharge slotted in the power. There are quite a few guides, but I would start with these.

 

 

 

[grooAm]

@schrodingercat

Everything KB is slotted with a full set of sudden acceleration (which includes a KB -> KD). The issue, especially in missions is not that the running mobs pull in another group, but that Tornado chases running mobs, which does pull other groups.

So basically in missions I cant use Tornado, or I can't use End drain. End drain is significantly tighter protection as it neuters everything, unless everyone runs around and then they come back one by one. Even if they don't kill me, because it is much more difficult to ensure complete drain on waves of mobs, it still takes forever me waiting for mobs to finally come back.

Also in most gold missions the layout is very open large rooms with few places to "hide" behind to force mobs to go around.

And a Boss with even a sliver of blue can pretty much one shot me. Which means I need to stay close to a running boss. If there are two, it starts to be difficult.

 

Btw. there is  a reason why nobody in CoH/CoV likes running mobs and teams especially abhor anyone who scatters things. Because it takes forever.

Call it meta if you will, but if a powerset forces the player to sit around until a mob comes back (kill all missions, etc.) and that happens every single group, then this is a bad powerset. DPS, especially on larger groups goes down exponentially against single mobs in a group. This becomes ever more an issue with 10+ groups.

I am not saying Storm/ is bad or /Elec is bad on defender.

All I have basically experienced is pointing me towards: Storm/Elec Def is terrible. Or at least, with what I'm experiencing, not worth playing or spending any time with.

In retrospect I regret the 100% gold on this toon. It surely took me close to 40 hours. Again, had I done this on my thugs/nature it would have taken less than half that time.

 

I was wondering if there is anything I am fundamentally doing wrong or if the build could be made significantly better with the issues I described.

I'd love to see a video of someone running a lvl 30 -1x8 gold mission arc, just to see if its the same ...

 

Basically your response and the response Uun have made my decision. I will shelve the toon and try a Storm controller and see if that's better. And try elec on a Stalker 😄

 

[grooAm]

@Uun,

 

thanks for the info on proc monster ^^ ...

 

As I said in my previous post, I consider the Storm/Elec dead and not worth continuing to play any further. With the field crafter badge and all my AH stuff, he'll just sit somewhere in a corner dealing in possibly legal enhancements.

I will remake the idea as /Storm Controller (maybe plant? that sounds like a great pairing) and /Elec Defender (maybe rad. my first toon ever was a rad defender back in 2004?)

Ill try the proc slotting on the /Elec. Maybe rad will be able to slot something too ...

I will also make Elec/ stalker just so I can see what I could have had, had I picked the right AT for the job 😄

 

I consider this topic closed unless someone has an amazing way to make the build work (for 100% mission running. starting at lvl 25) thanks for reading 🙂