AT Suggestion: "The Dyad"

[biostem]

Something similar to this idea has probably already been suggested, (there's nothing new under sun, as it were), but here's my take:

 

AT Name:  The Dyad

Primary Powerset:  Close-quarters Combat

Secondary Powerset: Close-in Support

 

The "Close-quarters Combat" set consists of a mixture of melee attacks and armor powers, while the secondary set consists of ranged attacks and support powers.

 

This AT would actually consists of 2 entities;  One having the primary powers and the other having the secondary.  I'm not sure at this point how pool powers would be handled - maybe just given to both characters, (though that may be too good - perhaps only share travel powers between the 2 characters, with other pools having to be assigned to one or the other).  The special ability of this AT is that you, the player, only directly controls 1 of the characters at any given time, with the other being able to be issued mastermind-like commands, (but there's no bodyguard mode nor any supremacy buff).  As long as 1 member of the dyad is alive, the character as a whole can remain fighting.  You would have to use an awaken or some other rez power to revive the other member of the dyad if they are downed, (perhaps rest could be adjusted to also rez the other member of the dyad, as there isn't really a summon power for them - they just exist alongside each other).  There would be a special inherent power that allows for easy switching between which specific member of the dyad you are in direct control of at any given moment.

 

Your thoughts or feedback are welcomed!

 

Edited April 30 by biostem

[Laucianna]

Honestly sounds quite complicated and sadly I don't see the Devs working on adding it as it's unlike anything we have atm where you swap control of one toon to another. Great concept though! 🙂 

[Rudra]

It's been brought up before. And I don't think it can be implemented the way you describe. Your best option honestly would be to dual-box and run two characters, swapping control between them when you want.

[biostem]

22 minutes ago, Rudra said:

It's been brought up before. And I don't think it can be implemented the way you describe. Your best option honestly would be to dual-box and run two characters, swapping control between them when you want.

Honestly, the idea was sort of an outgrowth of this notion I got when playing MMs, where I feel the T1s are a joke and would rather have 1 single powerful minion/henchman.  Yeah - the issue would be that there really isn't a mechanism by which you can readily swap a PC for an NPC and visa-versa.  I wonder if a more pragmatic approach would be to allow the player to select which of the 2 you'd want to directly control, then have the other simply follow MM-like commands, (you could have both the close-quarters and ranged sets as your initial primary selection, with the type you select locking out that category for secondary set choices, like how choosing shield defense locks you out from certain melee sets).

 

Perhaps the inherent ability would be a power that simply teleports you to the other character's location, then 1 to recall them to you, or some sort of general "help me out here" power, which causes the other member of the dyad to do something, (like the close-quarters character could taunt your target, while the support character uses their support power(s) on you).

Edited April 30 by biostem

[Rudra]

5 minutes ago, biostem said:

I wonder if a more pragmatic approach would be to allow the player to select which of the 2 you'd want to directly control, then have the other simply follow MM-like commands,

That is much less a dyad and more a master with combat slave. You would wind up with a MM that only gets the T3 pet for all intents and purposes. Just with more attacks/abilities available to both characters.

[biostem]

4 minutes ago, Rudra said:

That is much less a dyad and more a master with combat slave.

You're not wrong, but whenever discussing these proposed ATs, we need to think in terms of what can actually be accomplished.  I mean, when you get right down to it, all player characters are "slaved" to the commands of the player...

[megaericzero]

8 minutes ago, Rudra said:

You would wind up with a MM that only gets the T3 pet for all intents and purposes.

So a Controller/Dominator? 😛

Well, depending on the set.

[Rudra]

8 minutes ago, megaericzero said:

So a Controller/Dominator? 😛

Well, depending on the set.

Yes. Like you said, depending on the set since there would only be 1 pet. However, most likely with the pet available as the T2 power at 1st level. Or more likely a MM that only gets 1 T1 pet*, no T2s or T3, and the lost pet powers being replaced with either additional pet upgrades or more attacks. This would also require the new "MM" to have attacks more in line with possibly a Sentinel for END cost and damage.

 

So regardless of if this AT is called Dyad, or Sidekick like I think it was in another thread, or whatever other names were pitched for the idea, probably the best way to build it is as a spin off from MMs.

 

Edit: * By T1 pet, I don't mean like MM T1 pets that you get more of as you level, just that it would be a base pet available early on.

 

(Edit again: And yes, to differentiate it from Controllers and Dominators so they don't resume screaming to get their pets at level 1, the new AT's pet would need to remain a base pet like the MM's, using MM pet scalars, but getting access to more pet upgrades to keep the pet more effective in combat at high levels.)

Edited April 30 by Rudra

[biostem]

I don't envision the other member of the dyad/duo/whatever you want to call them, as an actual power - they'd simply exist next to the one you are actually controlling.  It would be more like you're playing a "mini-tanker" alongside a "mini-defender".

Edited April 30 by biostem

[Rudra]

14 minutes ago, biostem said:

I don't envision the other member of the dyad/duo/whatever you want to call them, as an actual power - they'd simply exist next to the one you are actually controlling.  It would be more like you're playing a "mini-tanker" alongside a "mini-defender".

That's a major part of what I don't think can be done. Let's try breaking it down. First, when you get into the character creator, you only have 1 character you can design with you having to start a new character to design the partner. Then you have the question of powers. Is the actual character you are running the mini-tanker with a mini-defender following you around keeping you healed? Or are you the mini-defender praying your mini-tanker "partner" grabs the correct aggro? Then there is the question of power progression. Without an actual character to level up, your "partner" won't be getting any new powers unless you have a way to assign those powers to them. That's why the best bet to do this is dual boxing with the paired characters. Otherwise, the second best option is to use the MM AT as a template and modify it to have a robust partner (pet).

 

(Edit: If the proposed AT simply assigned the primary set to the controlled character and the secondary set to the "partner" pet, then you're going to run into the problem of less access to powers for both characters requiring heavy dipping into pool powers to make up the difference. And even then, you would wind up with the problem that splitting powers between them as you level up means each gets much less powers than any other AT leaving them at a massive disadvantage in combat at high levels. Which character gets the new power? Which gets the new enhancement slots?) (Edit again: And if the primary and secondary are built as complete ATs themselves, and you can grow both characters at the same time with MM pet command ability, then you have a wildly over-powered AT.)

Edited April 30 by Rudra

[biostem]

3 minutes ago, Rudra said:

That's a major part of what I don't think can be done

What would probably have to be done is:

 

1. You pick either the close-quarters or support set for yourself.

2. The above choice then filters out what options you have for your secondary.

3. The secondary choice could then setup a system by which that NPC member of the dyad gets some starter powers and can actually use them, (think in terms of a custom AE NPC, just adjust the level to that of the main player's).

 

As for your concerns about the other member of the dyad "behaving" - that's kind of what the "help me out here" click power that I mentioned above, would do.  It's not perfect, but I think it could work...