Quick Damage Proc Questions

[BlackSpectre]

If I wanted to take a crappy tier 1 attack power that I'd normally skip and try to make it a good power using damage procs, what would the general guidelines be?

 

For example, would it generally be best to 2-slot accuracy and then add 4 damage procs to a single power? Should all 6 enhancement slots be procs?

 

If 4 enhancements with procs are in a power, will all the procs have a 90% chance to proc so all 4 can proc in one hit, for example, or will only one proc activate at a time? 

 

I see on the wiki that an enhancement will proc a range of damage, 7-72 for example. What determines how much damage a proc does?

 

I'm using this calculator to answer most of my other proc questions https://proc-calc.weebly.com

Edited Monday at 11:43 PM by BlackSpectre

[Nightmarer]

When doing that, I usually go for 5 procs and a +5 acc/dmg from any set, usually one that gives me a bonus together with one of the procs however, I usually round up my builds with +acc and pretty much always get Tactics, otherwise, just a +5 acc/dmg is low accuracy (on a regular 75% accuracy power).

 

Also, I check the dmg on Mid's, it takes into accounts the ppm, dmg, etc...

 

Just an example:

 

 

 

Edited yesterday at 12:10 AM by Nightmarer

[Maelwys]

8 hours ago, BlackSpectre said:

If I wanted to take a crappy tier 1 attack power that I'd normally skip and try to make it a good power using damage procs

 

The main point worth bringing up here is that T1 attacks tend to have extremely fast base recharge times. So it's unlikely to become a "good power" by adding damage procs.

 

Proc activation rates are primarily governed by recharge time, so powers that recharge in only a few seconds will gain very little from being procced out. That's not to say "don't proc it", especially if the power is going to be a part of your regular attack chain... but that you'll get comparatively little bang for your buck by procbombing T1 or even T2 attacks. A rule of thumb is to avoid procbombing anything with a base recharge time of under ~6 seconds.

Instead I'd focus on procbombing your other higher recharge attacks first, then only procbomb those very low-base-recharge attacks if you have spare enhancement slots left AND if you wouldn't be better off using them to get a particular set bonus (like Global Recharge and/or Global Accuracy).

 

Generally you'll want all your attack powers to have at least 95% hit rate against enemies that are +3 to you (set the relative level slider in Mids and untoggle stuff like Build Up and Gaussian Procs).

Whenever you're procbombing attacks a single Acc/Dam IO or HO will not get you to that 95% accuracy threshold unless you also have a considerable amount of Global Accuracy... and whilst using 2x Acc/Dams plus 4x Procs in each power is a valid way to build, being able to swap out one of those Acc/Dams for things like Dam, Dam/End or Acc/Dam/End tends to give better overall numbers and set bonus opportunities. More Global Recharge is also very handy to achieve a seamless attack chain and get important defensive clicky powers up sooner. Therefore trying to fit in a few sets of five purples in your lower base recharge attacks and/or toggles can work wonders.

[tidge]

@Maelwys hit the most relevant points about T1/T2 primary/secondary powers and why (not) to choose to add %damage pieces to them.

 

The only other point adjacent to what was added is IMO this: The T1/T2 powers are often single-target attacks. It might not be entirely noticeable if only facing default (Nx1) spawn sizes, but my experience has been that it is generally better to have %damage in AoE, because ultimately defeating an entire spawn ends up requiring fewer attacks if the AoE is applying %damage to several of the critters. Put another way:  an unreliable %damage in a single target may not be reducing the number of attack clicks necessary to clear an entire spawn.

 

TL;DR: for me, it comes down to a balance opportunity cost of using those slots somewhere else, sacrificing set bonuses, spamming low-level attacks without Endurance Reduction, blah blah blah fishcakes.

 

There are times when I will add %damage to T1/T2 powers:

• Below level 10, I'll drop in the P2W/START %damage pieces, as there aren't really any better options at those levels.
• The character is an AT that both/either doesn't have a good damage scale and/or doesn't really have enough low-level damaging attacks without using %damage.

The only exception I make to the second point is Masterminds: they have a poor damage scale but their damage should be coming from the henchmen, so  T1/T2 powers either get set bonuses or franken-slotted to improve henchmen performance.

[twozerofoxtrot]

T1/T2 attacks (outside if Control Holds) are always set bonus fodder.

 

Either ATOs or in some cases Very Rares.

 

In the case of VRs, the low End Redux values of the set impact you less cause T1/T2 powers usually have lower activation costs, while the stacked up damage lets you get the most (consistent) bang possible per button press

 

[Maelwys]

I'd a quick hunt through some builds.

The closest thing I currently have to a "Procbombed T1 attack" is on my Crabbermind VEAT - Channelgun has a 5 second recharge time and is effectively a "T1 blast"; and it's slotted with 4x ATOs (including the global Toxic Damage proc) plus 2x additional damage procs. However that toon only has six attacks which get chained back to back constantly; and all of them are 6-slotted. Channelgun gets used every 7 seconds and the two extra procs bring it from ~186 to ~218 damage per activation.


My Bio/Staff Tanker has a similar looking setup for Mercurial Blow which has a base recharge time of 3 seconds. However it is the only attack in the build which can take an Achilles Heel -res proc; and as such it makes sense to use it as part of the toon's limited Single Target attack chain and increase its output as much as possible. The two damage procs in it raise it from ~153 to ~188 damage per activation.


I also have a 6th slot in my Fire/Ice Blaster's T2 attack which has a 4 second recharge time; but this one was more of an afterthought (I happened to have one spare enhancement slot and a smidge of extra ST damage was more useful to me than a E/N defense set bonus!). It brings it from ~217 to ~232 damage per activation.


The rest tend to all look more like this:







The fastest-recharging "fully procbombed" attack I can find across my builds is this Water/Cold Corruptor's T2 attack; which has a 7s base recharge time. The last four enhancement slots are all Damage Procs and they bring it from ~153 to ~298 damage per activation; almost doubling the attack's effective damage.


I have a very large number of builds with 8s+ base recharge time powers that are all fully procbombed. Although some have more procs "available" than others.

[Championess]

Pretty much what everyone said here is good information.  As a summary for powers I'd look to proc out ideally I'd want its recharge in the 10-15s range for ST attacks and also has access to a good amount of procs.  Animation time also factors into the equation.  If animation + recharge doesn't get near 12s or more I'd use the power as a mule for sets.

[shortguy on indom]

On 3/17/2025 at 7:18 PM, BlackSpectre said:

Should all 6 enhancement slots be procs?

 

 

On 3/17/2025 at 8:08 PM, Nightmarer said:

When doing that, I usually go for 5 procs and

• IF YOUR T1 ATTACK HAS LESS THAN 72 DAMAGE (WITHOUT PROCS)........MATH SAYS 5 OR 6 PROCS WILL GET IT DONE.   NO LESS.

[BlackSpectre]

I had no idea Mids includes proc damage in powers! that makes it an even more amazing  app! Very cool!

 

I went through my new ice/ice Controllers powers using the proc calculator and it looks like only a few powers are worth procing out at all. The trade offs are killer. 
 

“Nope, that defense debuff needs to be stronger. I can’t take any enhancements away to use for damage procs.”

 

”Nope. I need that set bonus to boost _____. I can’t take any enhancements away to use for procs.”

 

Etc.  just killer. 
 

I did discover one power that would work fantastically… Sleet. 4 slotting to get the defense debuff and acc up, lets me add 2 different 22% -res procs, both of which should proc most of the time on a hit. It’s not damage, but it makes that power super good! The mobs just melt away when I’m on a team!

I need to put in more thought and research to try to get that toon’s damage up. Most of the powers that do damage in ice/ice do so little damage, 6-7 pts, that they’re not even worth counting as sources of DPS for that toon. Thats what prompted me to look Into procs, but initially it doesn’t look like procs will help get damage up much with that toon. I’ll keeping looking though. Maybe I’ll have a breakthrough? 😀

 

Thanks for the answers and the examples. Super useful! 

[MoonSheep]

18 hours ago, Maelwys said:

I have a very large number of builds with 8s+ base recharge time powers that are all fully procbombed. Although some have more procs "available" than others.

 

i love that, posting a screenshot of my poison/fire defender to share the love of procs

 

fireball - 3 damage procs

poison trap - 5 damage procs

inferno - 4 damage procs

char - 4 damage procs

greater fire sword - 4 damage procs

blaze and bolt - 2 damage procs (sad)