More Perception in Epics

[Rudra]

1 hour ago, CoeruleumBlue said:

If you're on a VEAT and you took full ranged and full melee, for example, you probably can't double-dip in leadership and also take the armor sets.

The VEATs have their leadership powers in their armor sets. So yes, VEATs can absolutely double dip in leadership and also take the armor sets. I am seriously starting to question if you even play the game now.

 

1 hour ago, CoeruleumBlue said:

Options do not make up for what you actually pick in actuality, what you actually pick should matter.

And this line is gibberish. "Options do not make up for what you actually pick"? (I'm intentionally dropping your redundant "in actuality".) Options make up your picks. Your character's primary and secondary power sets provide options for you to pick. Not just power pools. Power pools expand your options for building your character. And yes, what you pick matters. It really does. And from starting to question if you even play the game, I'm moving into "are you a troll?" territory now.

 

1 hour ago, CoeruleumBlue said:

Also, yeah, if there are barely any available +Perception bonuses to layer on in PvP on, say, blasters or dominators, and sometimes not even on defenders or controllers or some of the melee armor sets... *See thread title* 

The way the PvP'ers were layering Perception was by taking Tactics and any other +Perception power they got from their ATs. Like Targeting Drone. Then the team's Perception would find even the stealthiest character.

 

Edit: And you still haven't answered what ice cage power you are talking about for boosting Perception.

 

Edited Monday at 04:56 PM by Rudra

[CoeruleumBlue]

27 minutes ago, Rudra said:

The VEATs have their leadership powers in their armor sets. So yes, VEATs can absolutely double dip in leadership and also take the armor sets. I am seriously starting to question if you even play the game now.

 

And this line is gibberish. "Options do not make up for what you actually pick"? (I'm intentionally dropping your redundant "in actuality".) Options make up your picks. Your character's primary and secondary power sets provide options for you to pick. Not just power pools. Power pools expand your options for building your character. And yes, what you pick matters. It really does. And from starting to question if you even play the game, I'm moving into "are you a troll?" territory now.

 

The way the PvP'ers were layering Perception was by taking Tactics and any other +Perception power they got from their ATs. Like Targeting Drone. Then the team's Perception would find even the stealthiest character.

 

Edit: And you still haven't answered what ice cage power you are talking about for boosting Perception.

 

 

VEATs literally can pick from 40 powers plus the Patron Pools and Ancillary Pools. You literally can't pick everything they can do if you wanted to. Saying that if you pick Hide and Stealth and layer it on them like a Stalker would, you should have your stealth capped at 571 anyway because you had the option to pick something else instead of double-dipping Stealth makes no sense. Ditto for the 1000 feet of stealth on Illusion and Arsenal Control, and extra stealth on anyone who takes Stealth, an IO, and one of the various other stealths that can sometimes stack with Hide. Anything you pick is something else you didn't pick. 

 

Yes, and the fact that lots of ATs don't get +Perception and it's fairly randomly included in Epic/Patron pools when it's included at all is the entire reason for this thread. You can get it from Mace Mastery on Controllers and a few other assorted things, Dominators can't get it at all because it's replaced with a stasis field power no one ever actually takes and no Dominator Primary or Secondary comes with +Perception despite the fact you can do Psi/Psi/Psi, Dark/Dark/Dark, and Arsenal/Arsenal/Mace, as well as Savage Assault which is basically the kind of set that'd have +Perception if it were on an actual melee archetype, etc. Blasters mostly have the same problem. It's kind of weird that a lot of the Radiation sets that have a -Defense because you're making them glow don't also have -Stealth with that even though there is -Stealth sometimes on some powers here and there, etc. Overall I just think perception and stealth are neglected in this game because in a lot of PvP and some PvE content here and there you probably will get your immersion completely broken if you try to play certain things and then run into the fact stealth and perception are neglected due to the fact there's not all that much PvE content (though there's some) that uses it and not many people PvP that often. Yes, but in those couple of scenarios you'll still just be broken out of the feel of being this superhero/villain/ambiguous person and be like "oh no, I can't see them with my ESP/ghost senses/animal senses/targeting device, please help me Mr. Ice Man." Crunching numbers is useful and all but the main point of the game should be immersion in the RP of it all, and this requires for the game to actually be developed in all the places it should. This is also all related to why Sentinels suck in my opinion, because they're completely neglected too, it just gets treated like a training wheels Blaster when I actually do see a valid role for Sentinels even if it's not developed. 

[Rudra]

4 minutes ago, CoeruleumBlue said:

please help me Mr. Ice Man.

For the umpteenth time, what ice cage power are you talking about? You keep harping about 'ice gets +Perception from its ice cage' without ever actually saying what that specific power is. So either finally say what that power is or I'm just going to run with you're full of shit and be done.

[Psyonico]

5 hours ago, CoeruleumBlue said:

Arsenal/Arsenal/Mace

 

It's funny that you mention this combo not having +perception, because targetting drone very much has +perception. 

 

Same with the /devices version... so yes, blasters and dominators do get +perception. 

 

Also, tactical arrow has Eagle Eye, which has + perception.   In fact, there are only 2 blaster primaries and 2 blaster secondaries that *cant* slot the rectified reticle IO for increased perception. 

[CoeruleumBlue]

2 hours ago, Psyonico said:

 

It's funny that you mention this combo not having +perception, because targetting drone very much has +perception. 

 

Same with the /devices version... so yes, blasters and dominators do get +perception. 

 

Also, tactical arrow has Eagle Eye, which has + perception.   In fact, there are only 2 blaster primaries and 2 blaster secondaries that *cant* slot the rectified reticle IO for increased perception. 

 

That's only Rectified Recticle though, I was talking about max perception, not merely increased perception, and also, you can literally slot Rectified Reticle in Tactics anyway so literally anyone can slot it, but slotting Rectified Reticle in Tactics doesn't get you to max perception. It literally doesn't matter how many +ToHit slots are in powers because Rectified Reticle is a unique enhancement and you can't slot more than one no matter how many +ToHit slots you have, you absolutely have to have +Perception somewhere to get max unless you get lucky with Secondary Mutation or Mystic Fortune or you're using the Incandescence Total Radial Invocation. Granted, those at least exist, but in many places incarnates are disabled or just go on cooldown and Secondary Mutation and Mystic Fortune are random. Inspirations can sometimes be turned off too so making those at invention tables will have the same issues and that's also pretty silly to do when there at least kind of are powers you can use, they're just not part of your actual build so they're not so reliable, and it would be better if Epic Pools had more of them since it's still way easier to get a bunch of stealth than a bunch of perception despite perception having a higher cap on every single archetype and being more in-demand.

 

The ice cage thing is probably something from another server like Rebirth I accidentally found and didn't notice where it was from, even though I haven't seen it again.  

[Psyonico]

You just changed your argument. 

 

You first said that Dominators and Blasters don't have any access to +perception. 

 

9 hours ago, CoeruleumBlue said:

no Dominator Primary or Secondary comes with +Perception

 

Which i disproved, you then move the goal post and say that they can't get to max perception. 

 

To which i will refer you to an earlier post i made in this topic.   I said something along the lines of "it doesn't matter if you're at the perception cap because there is only 1 instance in non-AE PvE where any single +perception is won't be enough".  That 1 instance is if you happen to be on a posi 1 with multiple teammates with a -perception power.

 

Not being able to cap perception by yourself is not the only thing you can't realistically cap yourself.   Defense, for example.  No tank can cap defense by themselves without downing lots of purple inspirations.  I'm not even sure barrier at its full strength will cap defense.  Similarly, no AT can cap To-Hit by itself.  Recovery or regeneration? Can't be capped by yourself.  Heck, status resistance probably can't hit the cap even on a specifically built full team.  Pretty much only Kinetics toons can hit the damage cap by themselves.  I don't think its possible for anyone to hit the +range cap ever (unless the devs create a new buff set with a grantable +range buff it will never be reached). All of these caps are more important to reach than the perception cap.

 

So "i can't hit the perception cap" seems like a very odd hill to die on.

[Rudra]

17 minutes ago, CoeruleumBlue said:

Inspirations can sometimes be turned off too so making those at invention tables

You don't combine inspirations or make them at invention tables. You combine them directly in your inspiration tray.

 

21 minutes ago, CoeruleumBlue said:

The ice cage thing is probably something from another server like Rebirth I accidentally found and didn't notice where it was from, even though I haven't seen it again. 

"Probably" from Rebirth? You haven't seen it again? You've spent almost this entire thread complaining that something that probably but not definitely was done on another server that is not Homecoming, and think that is supposed clear anything up? It does not matter what Rebirth or Cake or any of the other servers do or don't do. They aren't Homecoming. So complaining that something happens on one of those servers as justification for Homecoming is out of left field bullshit. You have evidenced over and over in this thread that you have not a clue about Homecoming.

 

Let me give you a hand with your max Perception: You want max Perception? On any AT? Grab the Leadership pool and select Tactics. Right out of the box, Tactics grants a Blaster +242.2 feet of Perception. Controllers? Get +346 feet of Perception. Dominators get +259.5 feet of Perception. Then you hit up any empowerment station in a SG. It really doesn't matter if it is a baseline empowerment station or the super deluxe model. You craft the Increase Perception buff for a single piece of common salvage and it grants your character another +100 feet of Perception that lasts for 90 minutes. With the 500 feet of Perception every AT gets as their base, that means a Blaster is now at 842.2 feet of Perception, a Controller at 946 feet of Perception, and a Dominator at 859.5 feet of Perception. Add in Rectified Reticle on any Aim/Build Up power or in Tactics itself, and now the Blaster is at 942.2 feet of Perception, the Controller at 1,046 feet of Perception, and the Dominator at 959.5 feet of Perception. Grab any friend that also has Tactics and now you are sitting at the Perception cap. Even without that friend, if you are doing PvP? You can see everyone other than a max stealth Stalker. In PvE? You can see everything within Perception range.

[macskull]

35 minutes ago, Rudra said:

Let me give you a hand with your max Perception: You want max Perception? On any AT? Grab the Leadership pool and select Tactics. Right out of the box, Tactics grants a Blaster +242.2 feet of Perception. Controllers? Get +346 feet of Perception. Dominators get +259.5 feet of Perception. Then you hit up any empowerment station in a SG. It really doesn't matter if it is a baseline empowerment station or the super deluxe model. You craft the Increase Perception buff for a single piece of common salvage and it grants your character another +100 feet of Perception that lasts for 90 minutes. With the 500 feet of Perception every AT gets as their base, that means a Blaster is now at 842.2 feet of Perception, a Controller at 946 feet of Perception, and a Dominator at 859.5 feet of Perception. Add in Rectified Reticle on any Aim/Build Up power or in Tactics itself, and now the Blaster is at 942.2 feet of Perception, the Controller at 1,046 feet of Perception, and the Dominator at 959.5 feet of Perception. Grab any friend that also has Tactics and now you are sitting at the Perception cap. Even without that friend, if you are doing PvP? You can see everyone other than a max stealth Stalker. In PvE? You can see everything within Perception range.

The empowerment station perception buff (and the rest of the empowerment station buffs) does not work in PvP, so you'll need inspirations or teammates to reach your perception cap unless you have another source of perception like Targeting Drone).

 

A perception-capped non-VEAT/Sentinel can see a stealth-capped Stalker from 10 feet and a stealth-capped VEAT from from about 300 feet. VEATs and Sentinels have higher perception caps which allows them to act as kind of an anti-Stalker since they can see a stealth-capped Stalker from around 120 feet. That seems like a lot, but when both characters are moving at high speed a Stalker will be in and out of that distance really quick. Again, it's not really that much of a concern because a solo Stalker presents very little threat to someone who's paying attention to their surroundings. If you are getting repeatedly killed by a solo Stalker you're either spending too much time in one spot or being too predictable with your movement, or the Stalker is fairly talented, which is a rare thing these days.

[Rudra]

25 minutes ago, macskull said:

The empowerment station perception buff (and the rest of the empowerment station buffs) does not work in PvP, so you'll need inspirations or teammates to reach your perception cap unless you have another source of perception like Targeting Drone).

 

A perception-capped non-VEAT/Sentinel can see a stealth-capped Stalker from 10 feet and a stealth-capped VEAT from from about 300 feet. VEATs and Sentinels have higher perception caps which allows them to act as kind of an anti-Stalker since they can see a stealth-capped Stalker from around 120 feet. That seems like a lot, but when both characters are moving at high speed a Stalker will be in and out of that distance really quick. Again, it's not really that much of a concern because a solo Stalker presents very little threat to someone who's paying attention to their surroundings. If you are getting repeatedly killed by a solo Stalker you're either spending too much time in one spot or being too predictable with your movement, or the Stalker is fairly talented, which is a rare thing these days.

I don't do PvP, so thank you for the clarification about the empowerment station. Having a teammate with Tactics and your character having Tactics though, means that max stealth Stalker will still be visible at 10 feet away and can't use AS without getting punished for it before it can go off. That Stalker may be able to zip in and out of view too fast, but not attack. And attacking will murder the Stalker's stealth. (So will smacking the Stalker while (s)he/they/it is positioning for the attack.)

[tidge]

Using the doll, can you show the court where Stealth touched you?