WW2 Armies, looking for some historical input...

[srmalloy]

9 hours ago, Baelinor said:

Also, Ninja is Chinese, Shinobi is Japanese (Shinobi no mono, proper).

'Ninja' isn't Chinese; it's just the on'yomi (early-middle Chinese influenced) reading of the two kanji "忍者", the native kun'yomi reading of the kanji being 'shinobi'. Historically, though, 'ninja' was not in common use, with 'shinobi' and other colloquialisms being more common.

[Baelinor]

1 hour ago, srmalloy said:

'Ninja' isn't Chinese; it's just the on'yomi (early-middle Chinese influenced) reading of the two kanji "忍者", the native kun'yomi reading of the kanji being 'shinobi'. Historically, though, 'ninja' was not in common use, with 'shinobi' and other colloquialisms being more common.

 

True, I should have referenced the word 'language' in my comments, I was trying to avoid some of the nuances you are putting forward. However, like you said, Ninja wasn't in general use until after WW2 so doesn't really fit the theme going on here. Shinobi would be more appropriate given the time period, but to each their own.

[Ultimo]

1 hour ago, Baelinor said:

 

True, I should have referenced the word 'language' in my comments, I was trying to avoid some of the nuances you are putting forward. However, like you said, Ninja wasn't in general use until after WW2 so doesn't really fit the theme going on here. Shinobi would be more appropriate given the time period, but to each their own.

Not to confuse things further, but... I actually named them "Genin," since I gave them the ability to summon Genin, and I wanted it to be a little unclear which of them was the summoner... just to make them a little more challenging to fight.

[Baelinor]

5 hours ago, Ultimo said:

Not to confuse things further, but... I actually named them "Genin," since I gave them the ability to summon Genin, and I wanted it to be a little unclear which of them was the summoner... just to make them a little more challenging to fight.

Lol, not confusing. Genin historically is a common term for 'lower person' or 'low rank person'; similar to peasant, serf, slave or similar type structure. Recruitment for many organizations came from the genin and the shinobi was no different. They were still referred to as genin even after recruitment, though their job/clan may have changed. In any case this is a superhero game and historical stuff gets bent to fit the fantasy anyway and the shinobi myth has a lot of stuff already built in. You had just asked for historical references is all and shinobi would be more appropriate in that time period.

 

Interestingly the word ninja has made it into English dictionaries and the plural, ninjas is purely English (Japanese doesn't have plural in the English sense, so in Japanese you would not say ninjas) while shinobi is still just Japanese.

[PLVRIZR]

On 11/2/2025 at 8:05 PM, Ultimo said:

I've always thought that was an unfair characterization.  Remember, the French were the first to be conquered, yet they never stopped fighting back.  Also remember that France controlled most of the Europe and even much of the 'New World' not so long before that... under a fellow named Napoleon.

Fair, and don't get me wrong, as it's a joke and generalization.  I truly appreciate the French, because without their support during the Revolutionary War with England the United States wouldn't be what it is today.

 

You do have to admit that they've surrendered A LOT, since then 🙂

[Ultimo]

Well, I appreciate the info and input!  My next dilemma is figuring out how to make the final mission of the arc more interesting.  At present, you go in, rescue a couple of heroes and wander aimlessly destroying some stuff.  It lacks any Oomph.  It's a bit tedious, and not the best way to finish the arc.

 

The plot of the final mission is supposed to connect to the origin story of my Captain America themed character, the Stalwart Star.  The idea is that the Rikti have come back in time to give the atomic bomb to the Japanese, and disrupt history.  Ouroboros has sent a Mender back to stop it.  The US Army has detected the radioactivity related to the bomb, and sent the Stalwart Star in to try and destroy the bomb and any research the Japanese have done... but they've lost contact with him.  In reality, he got involved in a brawl with the Rikti and fell through time into the present day.

 

Of course, the players are to have minimal knowledge of any of this backstory (at first).  They're to be sent in to locate and help Stalwart Star, or finish his mission.

 

The thing is, I'm not sure how to make it work (I expect the AE forum is a better place for this part of the discussion, so I'll post there as well, but I thought perhaps you guys might offer some thoughts too).

 

My first thought was that the player would enter the mission and fight their way through Japanese patrols, maybe helping out US troops engaged in battles, while the look for the Japanese researchers.  When they find them, they've been defeated and a Mender is about to be killed by Rikti.  The players save him, and he tells them the backstory, giving them the new objective to destroy the Rikti time portal.  The thing is, the players can't actually TALK to the Mender, so he can't assign a new objective.

Anyway, I'm still pondering this one.

[Sakura Tenshi]

Italians were known for atrocious leadership. So there needs to be some power where they either hurt their subordinates or buff their opponents. If you accept Rommel’s word (and I think the UK) the normal troops were fine, just terribly undersupplied ans poorly coordinated by their command.

 

On the note of Japanese army, no, Kamikaze isn’t insensitive. They made manned torpedoes both aerial and submersible and lunge mines. Suicide became a doctrine to the Imperial Japanese High Command, arguably it was from the beginning since they knew if America confronted them they would be screwed and the odds of Pearl Harbor demoralizing the U.S. from joining the war was basically next to zero. And they went and did it anyway.

Edited Wednesday at 09:01 PM by Sakura Tenshi

[Ultimo]

1 hour ago, Sakura Tenshi said:

Italians were known for atrocious leadership. So there needs to be some power where they either hurt their subordinates or buff their opponents. If you accept Rommel’s word (and I think the UK) the normal troops were fine, just terribly undersupplied ans poorly coordinated by their command.

 

On the note of Japanese army, no, Kamikaze isn’t insensitive. They made manned torpedoes both aerial and submersible and lunge mines. Suicide became a doctrine to the Imperial Japanese High Command, arguably it was from the beginning since they knew if America confronted them they would be screwed and the odds of Pearl Harbor demoralizing the U.S. from joining the war was basically next to zero. And they went and did it anyway.

For the Japanese, I gave them the ability to resurrect on defeat, to represent their all-in, fight to the very last attitude, and I gave the Officers Trip Mines, which detonate when they are defeated... a kind of kamikaze attack, though not stated as such.

 

I kept the genin around... ninjas aren't historically accurate, but they're flavourful, if you take my meaning.

 

The Italian troops... I gave the officer a single target heal.  Wasn't sure what else to do.  I had intended to NOT give the troops a grenade attack, which I intended to give to all the other infantry... but the game doesn't appear to HAVE a thrown grenade attack... so they're not really any worse off than any other infantry.

[srmalloy]

16 hours ago, Ultimo said:

but the game doesn't appear to HAVE a thrown grenade attack

There's the Hand Grenade craftable temporary power, but I don't know if the temp powers are configurable for opponents in AE design. 

[Ultimo]

2 hours ago, srmalloy said:

There's the Hand Grenade craftable temporary power, but I don't know if the temp powers are configurable for opponents in AE design. 

Ya, there's a P2W vendor hand grenade power too, but Custom AE characters can't have those (be nice if they COULD, actually... Pool Powers too).  I did think about giving them all smoke grenades instead... but decided against it.