Projector

Again, standing right here. 😉

Damn man...I'm right here

Idea: Add the ability to ping a spot either directly on the map or visually on screen for other players on your team/league. Make this setting DISABLED by default, like so many other settings are, such as showing target distance. It could also be a "Only Accept Leader Ping" or "League Lead Only" or "Team Lead Only" option to minimize trolling. Reason: For coordinated content, such as MoKeyes or hardmode content, the pace of the fights and the need to communicate actually makes some of the harder content of the game pretty inaccessible to people who are uncomfortable using Discord or who outright refuse. I know this is a player-driven move, but I have encountered a lot of frustration when I want to help other players earn badges or complete/learn content that very few, if any, leaders are willing to lead outside of voice chat. Putting coordinates in chat is also a frustrating experience because it also requires you to go into the content separately to even get the coordinates in the first place, which admittedly, is much more frustrating for iTrials. Just calling directions or calling out where to go is entirely too confusing/unreliable. If I say "go left," but a player happens to be facing the opposite direction to me, then there is confusion. If I say "Go East," well the compass in the nav bar is VERY small and people often forget it's even there, and in addition, many players don't play with their map open because they play on smaller screens and need the real estate. I'll give you an example that happened to me the other night while leading a 4Star Lady Grey. During the K'ong fight, we ended up in an unlucky enough position that each of the four Assault Suits blew up in each of the four corners of the room, leaving behind neural fields that made fighting in the corners impossible. So I had to tell my team that instead of fighting in the corners, the middle of each side would be the new "corner" until the neural fields faded. This was an easy adjustment to make in voice, but without voice chat, there really isn't that much time to type custom instructions to the team while fulfilling my role as a lead and actually doing my job. What would have been amazing would have been if I could literally just mark a waypoint on everyone's screen/map and it would be very easy to communicate where I need the team to go next. Likewise for MoKeyes. I spent months brainstorming and tinkering a MoKeyes strategy that would work reliably for a full league of players for an SG I'm a part of. I landed on a strategy that relied on 6 players incanning out of the Obliteration Beam crosshair, but just back and forth between two pre-determined spots: AM's spawn location in the middle and forward from there in between the first and third regen stations. Eight attempts later, and people were still struggling to understand what the two spots were, and the second we would incan, they would be all turned around and would be confused. This happened both when trying to have the whole league move themselves, or when teaching new incanners. I even tried getting the coordinates in a separate run for the two points I wanted incans to aim for, and then typed macros that told the player "AIM HERE: COORDINATES" and they still wouldn't get it. In fact, the majority of the times this method has been successful is when we had a Tac Arrow Blaster with Oil Slick Arrow or I brought my Nature with Lifegiving Spores, so we were able to lay down a visual patch in the spot we wanted incanners to aim for. It was essentially a makeshift location ping. These are two niche instances, and I totally recognize that! I also think that the playerbase will find many many positive use cases for this, and I could see it being a wonderful edition to the game. I don't know how possible something like this would be, and I'm sure that it will somehow break DFB or cause level 1 Hellions to one-shot through Barrier, but I do know that there may be additional hardmode content in the future, and I know how frustrating trying to give directions in this game can be for content that does require some level of coordination. Being able to mark a location for another player would be incredible, and having it be a setting that is defaulted to "off" would absolutely make it opt-in would minimize trolling.

I hear you. To be clear, I wasn't trying to accurately describe your attitude, I was explaining how your post was coming across to some players. Wanted you to be aware of that was all. What shard are you on? I am on Excel and I will say that throughout ToT it was VERY difficult to get other events going, and I know of several TFs, iTrials, MSRs, and Hamis that all ended up being cancelled bc there weren't enough players available. That sucked and I really wish that event was shorter, like 1-2 weeks instead of the whole month. Hopefully, that will alleviate things a bit. But, if you are on any other shard, yeah, it's going to be difficult to do it. Also, I lead a lot of content, and I tailored all of my builds to include things like a hold, TP Target, Combat TP, Fold Space, Incan, and debuffs like Melt Armor where possible in order to help my teams/leagues as much as possible. Precisely bc I never want to be in the position where I can't complete something, I do everything I can to ensure I can put the team on my back as much as possible when I need to. I've had to make some sacrifices in build choices/optimization, but as a leader, I'm usually typing or spamming macros anyway, so as long as I can carry out the core portion of my role while doing so, I don't mind. I would highly recommend that approach if you are someone who leads content regularly (which, if you do, THANK YOU! We need more). And I can tell you that if you take one Hold from an epic/patron pool and you grab the origin hold power, you will be able to hold the greens on your own, albeit it will take a little bit. While you're at it, pick up the GEAS and Vanguard Medal accolades. They REALLY help with holds and recharge, speeding up the process significantly. If you don't want to, log in a toon on Excel and I will literally get you everything you need for those any time. Feel free to add my global in game @Project0r and if you have trouble finding a team or need an 8th for something, I'll happily transfer a toon over and help out if I am free! Regardless of how you choose to proceed, I'm glad that the devs were so quick to implement your second concept idea by including origin temps at the START vendor that they implemented it before you even suggested it! So I guess the matter is resolved? Good work, us!

I love my Stj/Stone Stalker. It's a lot of fun! I would agree with most of what Betty suggested, but I played around with a few different things. I'm visual, so I hope you don't mind I downloaded your build and made some edits! It looks like you were prioritizing Melee/S/L Def, so I tried to keep that, but did switch some other things around: Project0r Version Stalker (Street Justice - Electric Armor)5.mbd Swapped the set out in TP to two range IOs (which I would boost to +5). Since you aren't running Super Speed, this range will feel REALLY good, especially across zones or when teleporting to teammates in mission maps. For example, in LRSF, if you get the access code to unlock the door to Ms Liberty, these two range IOs will allow you to TP back to your teammates from the room with the glowie. 😄 I did make a couple of slot changes to get you some additional max HP. Without accolades, you were down at ~1,300 with a possible max being 2088. If you do get the Accolades, with the changes I made you'll be at 1688 (Without the passive accolades, this build puts you at 1443). I think Max HP gets way overlooked in most builds, since the hits are guaranteed to come at some point no matter how much defense/res you build. Also the Power Transfer set's Chance to Heal is almost always better than flat regen buffs, and stacking them as much as possible can make a big difference in how quickly you regen, even though it obviously won't show in the regen numbers. Power Transfer also does have better set bonuses, so I swapped it into Power Sink. If you are willing to give up a slot somewhere else, say the 6th Ragnarok in Spinning Strike, you could get one more Power Transfer Proc in Stamina. Given your plan to aggressively use Power Sink, you will gain around 180 HP each time all three proc. Leaving it at only 2 would still be around 120hp each time they proc Imo, I would suggest procing something. For example, you could leave the Hecatomb in CU, and proc Assassin's Strike, leaving just the Acc/Dam and the Hide Proc from the ATO set. For the increased number of proc options, I chose to proc out CU, plus who doesn't love more psi damage? This does knock down CU's recharge from ~6 to ~9 seconds, so you may have a slight gap, but that can usually be made up with Placate. Speaking of Placate, throwing two boosted recharge IOs made it virtually equivalent, being 17.02 now whereas before you had 5 slots in it and the recharge was 16.96. Functionally, this shouldn't feel any different. Personally, on my build I have just about everything proc'd that can and I have zero issues with damage output. That being said, Stone Armor is a lot less reliant on set bonuses to get adequate survivability, so that's a little skewed. Basically, I did sacrifice some recharge, but I do think you'll see a little more survivability, while also allowing you to put out some serious damage. An extra almost 400 HP is nothing to scoff at, especially when it means you don't have to give up any defense and only a little resist. Betty most likely knows more than me on all of this, so I'm happy to defer to them and I look forward to having my suggestions torn apart 😄

I totally understand the spirit of your suggestion, and I'm glad you're thinking about the game differently. I don't want to discourage this kind of thinking, and I also want to applaud that you included suggestions, not just a complaint about the content while offering nothing in terms of a solution. Onto your actual complaint and suggestion: 1. Having content that does have some barrier to entry in regard to preparation is a good thing. If you enter into missions unprepared, you will get your ass kicked. That would be true of real-life heroes/villains, as well, I imagine.. So those players with modest or bad builds? Imo, they should encounter content that potentially makes them rethink their build and consider ways to iterate on it. It challenges players to get better, and as you've stated, the content is beatable without those ATs and there are workarounds. In fact, your second concept is already true: everyone can go and get a hold from START vendor in Pocket D mid-TF and still be able to complete it when dealing with the Green mitos. You just have to revoke your current AT-specific temp power first, then it will allow you to pick from any of them. The Taser Dart is the one with a chance to hold. There are other creative ways of dealing with Hami, too: Gravity Control's wormhole will move Hami out of the goo and Fold Space can, too. You'll be able to fight Hami completely away from the Mitos, if you so desire! Second, "spirit of not requiring specific classes and builds" is a personal preference, but doesn't seem to be a part of this game's design philosophy, nor the Homecoming team's. "It's not right that I should be forced to either bring a healer, build for def/resistances, or include a heal. So, I think the enemies shouldn't ever do damage." See the problem? If you make it so no mechanics play to any certain ATs strengths, it's also even less of a reason to bring less powerful ATs. Already, Controllers, Dominators, and Masterminds see significantly less play, especially in higher level content. So removing mechanics that play to their strengths (MMs excluded in this case) would just means those players feel even more excluded. What your suggestion reads as, to me and I would imagine at least a few others, is more akin to, "I want to never have to actively think about what I am doing, and just be able to attack and defeat things mindlessly. So make success guaranteed and make the win automatic."

Hey friends! I'm back with another hardmode guide! This one is for the 4star ITF, which can get very chaotic even for experienced teams! This guide covers the speedy approach to the Task Force with explanations of how to actually navigate each mission and why it's done that way in faster runs (such as avoiding Hostless encounters, maximizing Lore uptime, etc.). This is not the only way to approach a 4Star ITF. Please feel free to do any strategy you like. The only things that matter in 4Star content is that you are able to complete the task force and that you had fun/feel accomplished at the end. Builds don't matter and speed does not matter as long as everyone is having a good time. This is a game, after all! So if you do not want to do this approach, feel free to create your own, do it as a Kill-Most, etc. Just make sure your team is aware of what approach you are taking and that you give clear instructions as you go! Incan Locations/Instructions Helpful Binds/Targeting Macros I will be doing Aeon next! Please let me know what other content you would like to see, if you have any questions, and how I can help you be successful. Also, if anyone knows a more efficient way to stay alive on Brainstorm beyond just spamming Burnout >Barrier, please let me know 😄

Respectfully, that is irrelevant. If a leader is leading something and you don't like how they are leading, that doesn't give you or anyone else the right to do whatever you want. If I am leading a Hami in Abyss with the Hami rush method (ignoring mitos) and part of the league starts attacking mitos and ignores Hami, then those players are in the wrong. Period. Game rules or not, you (general you, not specifically you) are joining something someone else is leading. You want something done your way, then go lead your own SNS on Sunday nights and bring all the Kronos titans you want. But intentionally doing something that the leader has asked you to stop makes you the problem, not them asking you to stop.

Hey OP, I'm sorry you've had a rough experience with Corruptors! I do think you are right that you are missing the big picture. Hopefully this will help. As a result, this is unfortunately a very unfair comparison between Blasters and Corruptors, and it's flawed because it's using an incomplete picture to compare two ATs that have entirely different ways of accessing damage. They have fundamentally different approaches to DPS. Blasters just pump out very high raw damage numbers. Everything they do is about those raw numbers, and their only built-in ways to increase those numbers are with Build Up and Aim. Corruptors, however, find their damage in other ways, specifically through buffs and debuffs via their secondary set. Scourge is also a huge part of this and cannot be overlooked because if Corruptors had blaster damage numbers and got double damage after an enemy drops below 50% health, they'd be absolutely broken. The problem is that you are comparing the two ATs using only the factor that is a Blaster's biggest strength while ignoring the Corruptor's strengths, which inherently makes Corruptors look weak because with your criteria, Blasters get two offensive power sets to contribute to their damage, while, in terms raw damage numbers from offensive powers, Corruptors only have one offensive power set. This example should hopefully show what I mean: As a blaster, if I hit Build Up, Aim, and eat a bunch of Red Insps, I can cap my damage output at 400%. On my own, that is all I will ever be able to do. That's the ceiling. (I recognize that procs can bypass this ceiling a little bit, but that's a nonfactor since corruptors have access to the same procs). As a Corruptor, I can do the same thing via Aim in the primary set and chewing a bunch of reds, or if I'm Kinetics, I can cap my own damage just with fulcrum shift and enough enemies. My damage won't be as high as a Blaster until I start throwing out debuffs. The most effective way to bypass the damage cap is via debuff. I can cap my own and my team's damage output while also throwing out debuffs which make all of our attacks more likely to hit, lower their resistance, lower their regen, etc. AFAIK, debuffs are the only reliable way around the damage cap limitation. If your team needs more DPS, the correct answer isn't always "bring a blaster." The Blaster can only contribute their own individual DPS output to the team, but if you bring a Corruptor that not only can cap their own damage, but can also increase the damage output potential of 7 other players on their team? That one blaster's contribution is a lot smaller. One Blaster doing 50% more damage is worth less than all 8 team members each doing 300% more damage 😄 Also, before anyone brings up that Defenders have generally higher buff/debuff/heal values but the Scourge mechanic is ALSO what pushes Corruptors higher than Defenders, because while Defenders have better debuff values on their powers, the difference in those values is not enough to overcome the increased damage output Corruptors have via Scourge and higher base damage values. In other words, say a Defender can lower a target's resistance by 40%, whereas a Corruptor using the same power can only lower it by 30%. If the Corruptor is actually attacking, the damage it does, especially when Scourge kicks in, will more than make up for that gap in debuff value. Bonus points for anything that increases your team's to-hit chance, because your raw damage values mean nothing if you don't hit anything. This is going to be greatly oversimplified: Let's say an attack does 100 damage, but the enemy is 40% resistant to that attack's damage type. You fire it twice. One hit/one miss = 60 damage. Two hits = 120 damage. Zero hits = 0 damage. Repeat with the same values, but increase your damage by 400% and fire the same attack twice. (This is the limit of a Blaster). One hit/one miss = 240 damage. Two hits = 480 damage. Zero hits = 0 damage. Repeat with the same damage bonus, but -res debuffs make the enemy only 20% resistant to that damage type. (This would be the "limit" for a Corruptor, but the Corruptor has the added benefit of making this the "limit" for their entire team, too). One hit/one miss = 320 damage. Two hits = 640 damage. Zero hits = 0 damage. (Note: I sometimes suck at math, and may be slightly off in how resist affects the damage output here, but I am confident the base assertion is still true, was just trying to give some tangible values to the concepts I was explaining.) You can also test pretty much everything I've said in this post in a farm, and I'd be happy to do it myself, record it, and share it here, if you'd like! I suggest doing it in a farm since the Tank's gauntlet/taunt will keep enemies from scattering/aggroing onto the Corr or Blaster. Round 1: Go with a tank and a fire/fire blaster or an ice/fire blaster, herd two mobs together and see how long it takes to kill both mobs by attacking only with the blaster and whatever taunt/damage auras the tank has. Round 2: Repeat, but swap the blaster for a ice/ or fire/kin Corruptor. Round 3: Repeat, but swap /Kin for /Cold. Round 4: Bring all four, but don't let the corruptors attack, only let them use their buffs/debuffs and have the blaster and tank fight. I guarantee you rounds 2, 3, and 4 will all be faster times than the tank and blaster combo. Not only that, they will also be safer and have better sustain thanks to cold and kin buffs. Anyway, I hope this is helpful and gives you a better idea of the bigger picture in terms of damage output between ATs.

Either you are joking, to which I would say, "Well played," or you are teaming with some of the worst corruptors either build-wise or skill-wise. Kinetics heal is one of, if not the best in the game, and if people aren't getting healed, it's because they are out of position. A well-played /kin makes almost everything in the game a cake walk, relatively speaking. Both /cold and /kin raise the overall DPS of their team by either lowering stats of the enemy via debuffs or by literally increasing the damage % bonus via powers like Fulcrum Shift. Not only that, but they increase the resource sustain (end) for their team, so their team can fight for longer periods of time, too. I genuinely have no clue why your experience has been so bad, but if you play on Excelsior, I'll be happy to show you otherwise. Or I'll happily transfer to your shard and I will run with you. I'm in the midst of a private 4star event that is encouraging different types of 4star runs throughout the next 2 months. This would be considered the hardest content in the game, aside from specific challenges like Really Hard Way or MoKeyes. Of the 55 4star runs that have been done and tracked over just the last 2 weeks, Corruptors are the most used at 175 used, Defenders are #2 at 102 used, and Blasters are number 3 at 43 used. Put another way, after only two weeks, 40% of the toons brought have been Corruptors. Corruptors are easily the strongest AT in the game in team environments, with one well-played corruptor enabling your team to just shred through content. This gets even more insane when you discover that the Scourge mechanic effectively triples Blizzard's damage instead of doubling it.

Honestly, I don't know of many people doing it with any regularity, though I wouldn't classify myself as regular, either. lol Stendhal is the first one that comes to mind! He is a lot of fun to play with, very skilled at the game, and if you haven't seen entertainment until you've seen him farm on his water blaster 😄 Channel Link. I don't know if people realize that @Laucianna makes videos, but here is her channel. Lot of cool perspectives from the biggest Kheldian advocate PLUS one of the best leaders in the game, hands down.

The short version is he wasn't happy playing the game anymore. I don't want to really give specifics on the public forum because that wouldn't really be in the spirit of this post and would detract from it.

Told him it was pointless to give me all of his stuff as I was just going to hang onto it just in case he decides to come back. So, all of it is sitting in my AH storage lol.

Dang, you and @Glacier Peak gonna make me cry. Thank you for the kind words, that actually means a lot. I've spent a lot of time learning as much as I could and have tried to share some of that information whenever possible. It's hard to find time to edit and post new videos, but I do have a couple of ideas kicking around, and once I have some extra time and energy, I will put them together. Most are walkthroughs/narrations of the content itself, and one is an updated "how to tank Omega Kong" that has a LOT of information that I either didn't know for the first one or that I just forgot to include. Regarding your toons, just say when. We can easily get you the 'bonk and badges for them! Also, I can unfortunately confirm that LB3K has quit homecoming. He had I know this because he gave me all of his main's enhancements before he uninstalled.

Really glad to hear someone else say this. It's very validating. People genuinely do not know how to evaluate their own performance in a run or see how they contributed. I have run into this quite often, and it's really frustrating because it does often cause me more stress trying to form because I have to undo that false narrative while also unfortunately, usually outing that player as being carried. This is actually why I think playing an Ice/Cold Corruptor is one of the best ways to learn advanced mode. Not just because it teaches target priority, but also because you can most viscerally feel and experience the results of your powers immediately. I watch Kong just MELT when I hit a double heat loss on him and Dragon, regardless of any other debuffs. I watch AVs suddenly start ticking down faster after I apply a benumb or throw out another sleet. Perhaps no other AT or powerset combo has felt as impactful on fights. You can really feel it, which means you are also aware of when you aren't doing your job. You realize that an AV's health isn't going down, then you look at your power tray and see everything off of cooldown. lol

Thank you for being a part of the solution to this, even if you picked the afk farm server for it 😛 One of these days, I'd be happy to move a toon over there for an evening and join your crew for a run or two, if you'll have me!

I can make this happen for you, no problem

Yeah, but all your other toons are meta! 😛 You may not like this, but I was already well aware there was a stigma. 🙃 That's why this run happened in the first place. As one of the leaders you are referring to, I agree with you. Both for RSI pain reasons and because it's fundamentally less tedious/repetitive, I prefer meta runs because the speed of them allows me to be more flexible with my day/schedule, and I can do more runs that include more people, on occasion. Meta doesn't guarantee short runs, of course, but it does raise the chances of shorter runs happening. Recently, I did a full meta run of Lady Grey that was only 15 minutes! We just hit that big fat red X button in the team window after wiping 4 times back-to-back in the Kong fight. Meta runs fail, too, especially since meta builds tend to already be a high-risk, high-reward, knifes-edge style of gameplay. Legitimately, the run in this post was only fun because of who I was with, but there's a reason I've not done that kind of run again: it wasn't fun for me. That doesn't make it wrong, it just means I don't want to spend an hour and a half in an Aeon. Calling barriers every 25-30 seconds for over an hour is while also calling targets, giving instructions, and changing tactics on the fly as needed is exhausting. So yeah, if I can still do the content without having to do that, wonderful! Part of why I did this off-meta run was twofold: To show there's no significant difference other than time (also some known faster strategies have to be adjusted, such as dealing with Smelters directly at the Cauldron Champion if you have no one with access to rain powers). It's not really easier or harder, it's just....slower, and that's fine for people who want that, but I'm not in that category. To demonstrate to people who do complain about the meta "elitism" that it's certainly possible and just fine to do these however you want. I know people who don't do barrier teams at all, I know people who do specific challenge runs, hell, I know one guy who tanked all of Lady Grey without any toggles or auto powers and only used Brawl for combat! What I don't appreciate is people think the content is somehow gatekept from them because common leaders want meta. Or people who complain when I ask them to bring T4 incarnates to a 4* when that's literally the tier the content was developed around using. Nonetheless, anyone can walk up to Aeon, Imperious, or Lady Grey and select the 4* option--anyone. People seem to think the only solution to the meta elitism stigma is for the current leaders to change how they lead, when in reality the solution is more leaders that lead things in a variety of ways. And if the excuse is that they don't know how to lead them or don't know what to do on them...well, figure it out. There's 1-3star options to make the "figure it out" part even easier. That's what all the "meta" players had to do, and I've watched the strategy for Lady Grey evolve and evolve since its release. Pretty much all of my videos feel out of date now for it lol. And it's also not right for players to force their playstyle on a team they are not leading, so if I join a KM ITF and try and speed it, I'm in the wrong. If I join a speed ITF and hijack it by pulling all the mobs together or not helping the team because I want to fight ambushes, I'm in the wrong. The other reason I've resorted to meta runs more often than not now is because I was, quite frankly, tired of people not showing up with their game face on. Picking roles they don't know how to do properly, but also not asking any questions or pretending they know what they are doing, getting offended when instructed to do something their role is supposed to do (like taunting Kong as the tank), sneaking random power sets when that wasn't what was asked for, etc. It's not just annoying, it's actually disrespectful to me and the team for people to behave that way, and I was done tolerating it. When I say "meta" or "experienced" that naturally encourages a more specific mindset when playing, and it has actually helped reduce the frequency of my runs turning into dumpster fires, but it's also a lot on me when I have to micro-manage everyone else's role alongside all the normal shot-calling and still playing my role effectively. Not every run has to be a learning run, and it's even more aggravating when a run that isn't advertised as such ends up turning into one. Also, it genuinely doesn't seem to matter what variety of runs I do because the second I advertise even one run as meta, the "elitist" accusations pop up. Hell, I have gotten flamed just for asking people to bring T4 Barrier Core, and that was literally all I asked them to bring. I've done countless runs including off-meta stuff, you watched me help someone literally learn how to build an incarnate power just before we started a run, I've led runs where I tank only using brawl, I've led the run in this post, I've led runs with countless off-meta stuff, yet still, the second I ask for a meta run, people's pent up frustration about meta gatekeeping gets thrown at me. That I know of, I've been one of the more inclusive consistent leaders when it comes to what I've allowed on runs. So, with that being the case, and knowing that even if I don't ask for meta builds or team comps, I'm still going to be called elitist just asking for what is literally the bare minimum (T4 Alpha/Destiny slot), then what's the point of trying to do something I actively don't want to do for people who are going to complain anyway? I'd rather spend my time playing the game the way I enjoy playing it.

Wait, who are you in game??? Curious to know which ones you've been on with me lol

Even so, I think there's value beyond the instructional aspect for leaders for the idea for two reasons: 1. If there's not an active league in the zone while the Mino is on cooldown, people entering the zone would get a popup giving them a hint as to what they can be doing in the meantime. So, in the absence of said leaders, players can still get instructions. That alone is reason enough for me, tbh. 2. A progress bar on the motes would also tell you how many you have left to find, or if it simply said "Find all 7 motes" so that you can tell how many you still need to look for without just straight telling you which ones you need to find.

With talk around the difficult of leading Labyrinths, clarity and confusion around what to do and when, and the confusion around people trying to find the motes while also running the labyrinth, etc. I wanted to propose two, hopefully straightforward changes that would give league leaders something UI-based to lean on when giving instructions and instructing players on the ideal times to look for motes/badges. I propose three potential options. These could both be implemented or it could be an either/or thing: 1. When the Minotaur is defeated and the hour countdown starts for respawn, could the nav bar also read, "Find 7 Hidden Motes of Power while the Minotaur is down! Then visit the Gate of Darkness" wherever you are in the zone? The level shifts are basically meaningless during that time anyway. Having this show up as subtext in the navbar could be something concrete leaders can point to as another "phase." 2. A itrial-style (fun words to say out loud back to back) pop-up window that opens once you access the core that has a progress bar for the seven motes. So, now once players enter the Core, there is a clear signal to everyone that there's something specific to do as well as a progress bar that tells you how close you are. That pop-up would then stay with you no matter where you go in the zone until you leave or log-out. Alternatively, its appearance doesn't have to be tied to the Core, but instead could be just be tied to the Mino defeat, so no matter where you are in the zone, if the Minotaur has been defeated, the pop-up will be active until he respawns! 3. Make a league pop-up window the entire time you're in the zone that contains all the info currently in the nav bar, but also shows how many Malfos are spawned in zone at any given time, and then, once you access the core or the Minotaur is defeated, the progress bar for the motes shows up until you leave the zone, log out, or the Minotaur respawns. Having the pop-up window trigger once the Mino is defeated would also discourage new players from leaving the zone immediately like I did the first couple of times I fought the Minotaur, thinking that was all there was. Bonus points if the pop-up also shows which weapon the Minotaur is carrying, though this feels like a double-edged sword of people coming, seeing it's not the one they need, and leaving immediately before helping lol. If the game detects you have all seven motes, the nav bar or popup windows could still say to hunt for them, but it could also just not show that part of the instruction anymore. I don't know what's possible or not possible. I could easily picture introductory macros being written around the expectation of the UI prompting players these directions: "Welcome to the Labyrinth of Fog! Our aim is to gain access to the Core of the Labyrinth by defeating the Minotaur that's hunting us down! To We will need to acquire 10 level shifts before challenging the Minotaur, here's how we will do it" *insert normal instruction macros here* "Once the Minotaur is defeated, we will enter the core and begin hunting for the Motes of Power! If you happen to find one sooner, make sure not to leave the zone until we find them all!" I should also point out that these macros can exist on their own, and probably do, without any of my proposed changes. What my proposed changes aim to do is give those leaders more credibility in their instructions by giving an in-game prompt that encourages players to begin seeking out the motes intentionally at that point. It also gives a distinct purpose of what to do when the respawn timer is counting down, rather than showing up to zone, seeing the Mino is down, and thinking there's nothing to do until it's back. I know other raid zones don't give these kinds of hints regarding what to do and when, but this zone is entirely different in its mechanics, expectations, depth, and the way it's led. So, I feel that giving players some sense of direction at these key junctures could be helpful. Potential downsides: 1. May not be room on the nav bar. 2.Players may not like having pop-up windows and may hate having them take up screen real estate during iTrials and zone events like the Prison Break in Bricks. 3. Favors one specific approach to the labyrinth, which is Level Shifts>Mino>Core>Motes. I would argue that the zone design actually favors this approach anyway because the orange area isn't even accessible until you can get to the core (or if you happen to have the Mino aether costume). I decided to make this a new thread since it's a very specific suggestion, but I'm happy to delete this and make it a reply in another, if needed.

I don't think this suggested change makes the base game harder overall, it would just adjust combat scaling to be around IOs past level 35. That's all. So, the only point at which the game gets harder when you hit level 35 and haven't upgraded to IOs yet. Which, could be problematic the same way that the old leveling walls around DOs and SOs were back in live. My bigger concern is moreso around drops, but I think there could be in-game lore reasons that could turn basic training IOs into drops as well as buyable enhancements from the stores once you hit level 35 and that wouldn't be problematic necessarily. There would probably need to be something additional added in the form of a popup box or something that explains that SOs are no longer effective for post 35 content and encouraging players to start getting training IOs. Now that I think about it though, the drops and store changes would have to happen once you hit level 32, not level 35, as it would need to be at the minimum level that you can start slotting said enhancements. Though, I supposed normal training IOs could just start dropping as soon as you hit their earliest available level, and then they just upgrade in drop rate once you're 32. I honestly wonder if just adding the training IOs to the drop pool would be enough, rather than outright removing SOs. I don't think this is a bad idea, I just don't know what fundamental problem it solves for the game. I know not everything should be seen that way, sometimes a QoL change is a QoL change and that's fine. I just wonder, of all the complaints of issues I typically see, such as MM pets not being even level at 50, or Controller/Dom usability in harder content, etc., where this really sits and if it's important enough to be worth that much developer investment. The main hurdles I have in my mind to this are mostly market-based-- Selling SOs is a decent way to keep a basic income when leveling, especially if leveling with XP doubled. The training IO recipes sell for a LOT more than regular enhancements, so, if the enhancements themselves turn into sellable drops, how will that impact selling price. Would the actual IOs be sellable at the market and buyable at the market? And if so, what price point would make sense if a level 50 damage IO recipe sells for 110k. Does that mean the enhancement should be purchasable for that amount? Or more? Or would the price of recipes need to come down, thus nerfing a source of income for many players. I haven't mentioned farming in this mainly because while the financial side is relevant to how farming impacts the game, I know balancing decisions aren't made around farming and shouldn't necessarily be. So, the solutions to any market-based problem should start from a place that looks at the game as if farming doesn't exist, and then tweaked in anticipation of how farming could impact/abuse said changes. At least, that's how I've understood farming to be treated for game balancing issues. Personally, if the market questions could be reasonable addressed, I think a great compromise would actually be to leave SOs in the game as they are and just introduce IOs into the drop pool, similar to how SOs were changed to drop at much earlier levels. Just make the IO drop rate rarer than SOs, so people are still encouraged to go build the recipes as they start adding them into their builds. Basically, IOs wouldn't drop enough to slot out a build as fast as SOs do, so SOs would still make up the bulk of a mid-game build, with Training IOs acting more like a special treat that makes seeking them out via auction house and crafting more enticing as players see the stat differences. As it stands now, when they lowered level access to SOs, the change didn't require the removal of DOs or basic TO enhancements, so I don't necessarily think making training IOs available via drops would be particularly harmful, and if anything, would make the game even easier from level 35-50 if you don't adjust combat balance at those levels. Then I would keep set IOs still gated behind recipe drops and auction house. Those should be worth the extra effort required to receive the benefits they offer.

I think this is a MAJOR strength of the Labyrinth that doesn't get appreciated enough--how easily you can just go do one with a pre-made group! It's really cool that there is now a zone raid event that a supergroup can just get together some people for and go do. When Sovereign does Hami Raids and MSRs, there's often still 20-30 minutes of recruiting. It's awesome that if you can get enough people for an iTrial, you have enough people to do a Lab run, and that you can recruit while you're getting started with the run (provided that the Mino hasn't been defeated in the last hour, of course). It won't surprise me to eventually see an player-developed approach to Labyrinth that is somewhat like Hami Raids in that Team 1 usually has a specific setup and is closer to a "premade" team while the rest of the league fills with the general player base.

Updated in the my reply! Thank you!!

I just want to start by saying that @Mezmerais wrong. Not because anything he said is factually wrong. It's just because it's Mez. 😄 Second, I want to highlight something that I think is leading to the chaos: It lacks a clear, consistent, and satisfying sense of progression. The Labyrinth doesn't end when the Mino dies, but there is nothing that really tells you that there's more. If anything, the only thing you see immediately is a reward table, and reward tables in this game almost universally signal the "end" of content, with this being the only exception I can think of. I still have never seen the portal that opens up where Mino is defeated because it's covered by the whole league/lores, even with /noparticles 1 set. I only ever found out it was there because someone told me, and I've gone through it only by guessing lol. Even MSR has a sense of progression. Pylons>Bombs>GM>Kill until shield resets. There is clearly more to the MSR after beating up the aliens on the ship after Ukon dies because 1. There is no reward table. 2. there is a timer that actually increases once you take him down. 3. Mobs continually spawn and respawn and this is visible and immediately actionable. And if someone doesn't know this, the confusion is simple to remedy: stay put and fight enemies in the bowl. It's quick to remedy and easy to understand. Hami raids also have progression. Kill Monsters for EoE and to spawn hami>Kill Hami>Reward Table>Repeat. Abyss/Eden have the element of random incans, but you still are grounded by map position, so the whiplash isn't as harsh. Plus, if someone forgets to incan, the league can easily see Monsters near by and continue killing and it's easy to help those not on the league find where the league is so they can participate. It happens all the time if an incanner doesn't see chat at the right time. I also recognize there's a bias toward the idea of progression for the other zone events have player instructions/tactical contributions have contributed to that sense of progression being made clear to players, but I submit also that the "next steps" are far less burdensome to explain and navigate people through, and if someone misses something, like an EoE, it's not like we have to send someone back up somewhere to help them get it. We can solve that immediately. But in the Labyrinth, it is a repeated case of "Okay, now what?" with no indicator of what to do next. "We killed the mobs here, now what?" We wait until an incanner finds a random spot elsewhere that 2-3 mobs have spawned in. But also, those mobs get deleted once our level shifts are above 5, reducing the challenge and the rewards. Admittedly, this one is an assumption. I haven't actually looked at the exp rewards when mobs turn grey because I'm usually hunting Malfos. (EDIT 2: Thanks @lemming for confirming level shifts do not affect rewards! Leaving the statement for intellectual honesty, but rewards do not actually reduce at all) "We killed Mino, now what?" You don't even know you can't get all seven motes until you kill Mino (or someone tells you) because the orange area is hidden until then. And the timer is a countdown UNTIL something happens, rather than being a indicator of how long you have to continue an action, like it works in an MSR. There's no sense of map- or movement-based progression because you can't see yourself progressing through a map. If I'm lost anywhere else in the game, there are hints that tell me where to go, such as Fog of War still hiding unexplored areas (unless I was stupid and hit reveal on those crey lab maps that have the three elevators on the same floor. IYKYK). The mote progression also isn't linear, which is convenient, but also makes it a constant game of "wait, which one don't I have yet?" and then when you do have them, there's no message or anything that gives a hint or clue of where you are supposed to go. Even a riddle or poem about the black/white portal could thematically work here, idk. That ongoing feedback of progress that reinforces player behavior and rewards them for actions they take, even if it's just a dopamine hit, just isn't there. If I'm killing mobs with the league, once a mob dies, everyone just...stands there, at least until an incanner finds a new mob. The only progression-based feedback I see is if you are off hunting Malfos, but the very heavy trade-off is it gives players a very disconnected feel from a zone-wide league event. I can't see my league get stronger, I can't see them empowered to do anything, and I just keep hunting until 10. It's solo play while being listed in a league, but ignoring everything the league is doing. So, the limited sense of progression isn't unifying. I also don't know what to do with feeling that way. I don't know what the solution is, but I at least think that the topic of progression feel should be included in the conversation. While I'm here I'll share that when I first heard about the Labyrinth, I had presumed it would be more like a roguelite, where the progression through the labyrinth was linear, but also repetitive. The idea of the Mino chasing us had me picturing those sidescrolling/platform games where you have to outrun a flood or some other thing that is chasing you down and if you get stuck on an enemy or can't get to the next platform fast enough, you die. If the league wipes, you start again at the beginning or go to Zone 2, just like when you fail a Hami raid lol. It would be cool if this were the case, and then fogs could spawn along that linear path as you are killing enemies. If you miss a fog, there's no backtracking since the minotaur is chasing, and there would be this constant sense of impending doom, kind of like what you get when Hami is taking just a little too long to kill and the triple and quad blooms are hitting. I also wish it was easier to stay in a specific color. Like, I wish that when I go to green, any doors I click would also be green, and if I click blue, I stay in blue. And maybe there could be predetermined portal locations in each color's maps that take you to the "next" color or the color of your choice (just depending). Maybe the portals would be linearly connected (blue only goes to green, green only goes to red or back to blue, red only goes to yellow or back to green, etc.). Each color's maps would have multiple portals to the next color, so you could still jump at any time, and you have an "oh shit" button if the minotaur is about to catch your league, with the trade-off being that you forfeit any Malfos that you would have missed in the prior color since you leave it early, (while FtF allows players who mistakenly take a portal to rejoin their team.) Idk, this all would require a fundamental rework of the content though, but since I'm spitballing already.... You would still have to kill enemies along the way, and do so fast before the minotaur catches the league, and the enemies you kill could spawn Malfos up ahead at a TBD spawn chance/rate. Or maybe when you defeat the Mino and he is on cooldown, the portals work like the train does and gives the player a list of all of the color zones plus adds Orange, the Colonnade, and the Core until the timer resets and the mino respawns. Though, Orange doesn't seem to hold much purpose aside from containing a mote and being a secret area. If you do nothing but kill enemies and ignore Malfos all the way to the end, you could still predetermine the rewards for the spawns so that you always have enough level shifts to fight the minotaur if you've killed along the way, rather than making it to the end and just being killed because you didn't get enough Malfos. If you leave a color "early," that would raise the importance of killing Malfos, since you now won't have encountered enough mobs to get your level shifts. Right now, it feels more like a random and aimless assortment of mission maps (which, I know a randomizer was used to determine map order, so this is partially intended). This could also make it so the endless colonnade could be located at the "end" of some of the colored maps, being a "reward" for making it to the end. So maybe there's one access point at the halfway color and one access point at the end. If you get the level shifts needed for Mino, you can defeat him and continue progressing the labyrinth to the end. At the moment, there is no sense of "I conquered this area or piece, and now onto the next." A real labyrinth has a linear path that takes you from start to end, obviously with dead ends being the consequence of a wrong turn. Since wrong turns aren't as easily implemented here, the consequence for alternate pathing could be skipping colors all together. But navigating the zone currently feels like I'm just walking around in circles. There's no sense of direction unless you start memorizing door orders. That would also feel more linear and would give a sense of progression to conquering the Labyrinth (even though I understand the real "labyrinth" is the Collonnade.) Lastly, none of this is to take away from the immense amount of work Cobalt and others have put into this. I love that new content is being added, invested in, and is trying to be inclusive of the wider player-base. I can't be thankful enough for more content to explore with people and more things being added to this wonderful relic of a game. I'm forever grateful for everything we have here 🙂 Thanks for coming to my TED Talk! EDIT: Grammar/spelling