Stormwalker
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Posts posted by Stormwalker
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11 minutes ago, Rudra said:
If my target can't hurt me, I don't need as much DPS. As I've said on multiple occasions. I'm fine with playing sub-optimal. As long as I have fun and my character rocks. And if the enemies can't even stand to fight? Then odds are, my character rocks and I am having a blast. (It's what made my Bane Spider so fun. Wolf Spider gun blasts until anything strong and fast enough can get in close. Then proceed to bounce the target in place like a manic basketball player dribbling, except with a mace. And try not to laugh so hard I stop being able to see the screen.)
Oh, I can see how if someone just WANTS to knock a boss around, they might possibly want to slot it. I am, after all, someone who has extolled the virtues of Claws by boasting of its ability to dribble a Zeus-class Titan like a basketball. I understand the value of repeated knockback. But on my Claw scrapper I'm also not giving up any damage to do that, and it's not something I would choose to do if I had to give up a large amount of damage to do it.
My problem with Sudden Acceleration is it's the only option (other than the Unique Overwhelming Force) for players who are pressured into slotting KB -> KD by the need to be good teammates, or just by pressure from other players in general. And for those players, who are slotting KB -> KD either to help their teams, or to appease people and avoid conflict, Sudden Acceleration is very ill-suited to the task. Thus, my request for another actual damage set with a KB -> KD in it, which would be much more suited to those players' needs than Sudden Acceleration is.
Which is to say, if it weren't for the fact that there are people out there who will give you crap just for playing a character with KB, I wouldn't have an issue with Sudden Acceleration at all, because the only people who were slotting it would be slotting it because they want to, not because they feel like they must.
But again, this is not nearly as huge an issue to me as it was, now that I know Explosive Blast's knockback is manageable now. Because I no longer feel like I have to slot it. I can use my one Overwhelming Force in Nova and go on my merry way. But I still feel for other players who feel like they do have to slot it, and I want them to have a better option.
I guess what I'm saying is I feel like it would be hypocritical of me to give up the fight just because it's no longer personally an issue for me when I know it's still an issue for some other people. If I was willing to argue on my own behalf, I should be willing to argue on theirs, too.
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5 minutes ago, Rudra said:
Sure. Except if all my KB attacks have sufficient magnitude to knock that boss/EB/AV/GM down each? Then all my attacks will keep that boss/EB/AV/GM sitting on the ground and well away from my face.
Edit: Damage mitigation by virtue of constant application of the prone condition.
If you slot knockback in all your attacks, which is what it would take to make that practical, you have nuked the Hell out of your DPS.
Also, let's remember which powers it is that players are pressured to slot KB -> KD in. Mostly, it's AoE powers, which don't have rapid cycle times.
If I'm going through my damage rotation on an enemy, I'm cycling single-target attacks on him that I'm not slotting for KB -> KD because there's no practical reason to do so.
Sudden Acceleration is poorly matched to the attacks which need the KB -> KD IO to begin with.
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12 minutes ago, Rudra said:
But if increasing the magnitude of knockback on a knockdown power makes it possible to knock down a target that would otherwise have not been knocked down.... Yeah, I need to go hide my Sudden Acceleration thread. It makes a lot less sense to ask for that change now.
Well, sort of. I seem to recall (though it's been a very long time, so I can't promise I'm remembering it correctly) that repeated applications of KB in rapid succession stack until you overome the target's KB protection - meaning, you're going to knock the target down eventually anyway. With increased Knockback magnitude, that will happen sooner.
That said, Troo's link is news to me. Originally, KD was simply Mag < 1 KB. I was under the impression that was still the case, but from his link apparently that got changed at some point along the way to KD being an actual different kind of KB.
That said, even with that change, Knockback enhancement still offers substantially less benefit in a KD case than a KB case, because the additional mitigation value of pushing the enemy further away from your melee range (and the time that passes before they get back up being longer due to longer air time with the increased KB distance) is lost. So, I would consider KB enhancement in a power that does KD (whether naturally or by KD -> KB) to be an extremely poor investment, and thus I still think the set is poorly designed.
If increasing KD magnitude caused the enemy to get up more slowly due to having hit the ground harder, then there would be considerably more value in it, and at that point it might even be a worthy investment.
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12 minutes ago, Rudra said:
So... increasing the knockback value for a knockdown attack increases the likelihood of actually knocking the target down? So all the knockback enhancements in Sudden Acceleration aren't wasted? Or what? I'm not quite understanding the post. Sorry.
Not exactly. What he's saying is it increases the magnitude of the knockdown, which is to say it will punch through higher levels of KB protection - it will knock down targets it otherwise would not. Which isn't completely worthless, but is not really all that useful in a KD case. In a KB case, increasing knockback magnitude pushes the enemy farther away, which effectively increases the mitigation value of the knockback. In a KD case, the only value is that it will knock down a boss that would have resisted it otherwise. In a power like Power Push, where you have a very high KB chance, this might be valuable. In a damage power where your KB chance is not that high to begin with, not so much.
If it actually increased KB chance, or if it casued targets to stay down longer, then we would have something truly useful.
Actually, what increased Knockdown Magnitude really OUGHT do do is bounce enemies off the ground and back into the air. But it doesn't.
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5 minutes ago, Nemu said:
First this:
Nova only does radial scatter if you are in the middle of a pack of mobs, if you are at the edge they will get knocked back in a single direction. If you use the technique of jousting in the video, you will land at the edge the pack and turn your radial scatter into a directional knockback, because the Nova checks the knockback vector at the time you finish casting your attack.
Second power boost
If you change anything about the build take power boost. The +special it offers can give you a temporary defense buffer against debuffs, enhance your mezzes, boost your to hit when combined with build up/aim to punch through Paragon protector MoG among other things... It's well worth the pick on any AT.
Third general play philosophy:
Keeping stuff at range is your friend except when stuff gets in your face. Your build banks on hover. What if you can't fly anymore? What if you got tagged with -fly and then landed in a caltrops patch? Stuff will get to you, "Get away from me" powers can only hold off so much.
Mobility is paramount on a blaster, and there are enough factions out there that can ground you and slow you, so you need a backup plan to hover, because when fly fails you it will fail spectacularly if that's your only game plan, and you will feel the pain of being grounded, immobilized and/or slowed with no way out.
If anything build a respectable amount of slow resist. The winter travel unique is an easy 20% and you can get another 30-45% just by 2 slotting certain superior winter IOs.
You can also ditch Hasten and make room for combat jumping, as it provides complete immob protection so that's one less Mezz you need to worry about. and should you be grounded it is another means for you to move around quickly.
To make up for hasten you can also cram your build full of force feedback procs. But wait that means I can't slot 6 pieces artillery!. That's right.
This Hero build was built using Mids Reborn 3.2.17
https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsRebornClick this DataLink to open the build!
Level 50 Magic Blaster
Primary Power Set: Energy Blast
Secondary Power Set: Energy Manipulation
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Leadership
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Force MasteryHero Profile:
Level 1: Power Bolt -- SprDfnBrr-Acc/Dmg(A), SprDfnBrr-Dmg/Rchg(3), SprDfnBrr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(3), SprDfnBrr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(5), SprDfnBrr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(5), SprDfnBrr-Rchg/+Status Protect(7)
Level 1: Power Thrust -- ExpStr-Dmg/KB(A), ExpStr-Acc/KB(7), ExpStr-Dam%(9), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg(9), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg(11)
Level 2: Energy Torrent -- SprFrzBls-Acc/Dmg(A), SprFrzBls-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(13), HO:Centri(13), Artl-Acc/Rech/Rng(15), FrcFdb-Rechg%(15)
Level 4: Build Up -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 6: Power Burst -- SprWntBit-Acc/Dmg(A), SprWntBit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(17), SprWntBit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(17), SprWntBit-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg(19), SprWntBit-Rchg/SlowProc(19), FrcFdb-Rechg%(21)
Level 8: Sniper Blast -- SprBlsWrt-Acc/Dmg(A), SprBlsWrt-Dmg/Rchg(21), SprBlsWrt-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(23), SprBlsWrt-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(23), SprBlsWrt-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(25), SprBlsWrt-Rchg/Dmg%(25)
Level 10: Combat Jumping -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), Ksm-ToHit+(27)
Level 12: Aim -- RechRdx-I(A), GssSynFr--Build%(27)
Level 14: Fly -- BlsoftheZ-Travel/EndRdx(A), BlsoftheZ-ResKB(29), WntGif-ResSlow(29)
Level 16: Energize -- NmnCnv-Heal/EndRdx(A), NmnCnv-EndRdx/Rchg(31), NmnCnv-Heal/Rchg(31), NmnCnv-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(31), NmnCnv-Heal(33), NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(33)
Level 18: Hover -- BlsoftheZ-Travel/EndRdx(A), BlsoftheZ-ResKB(33)
Level 20: Maneuvers -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), Rct-Def(34), Rct-Def/EndRdx(34), Rct-ResDam%(34)
Level 22: Kick -- Empty(A)
Level 24: Tough -- StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), RctArm-ResDam/EndRdx(36), RctArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(36), RctArm-ResDam(36)
Level 26: Explosive Blast -- SprFrzBls-Dmg/EndRdx(A), SprFrzBls-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg(37), Artl-Acc/Dam(37), Artl-Dam/End(37), Artl-Acc/Dam/Rech(39), FrcFdb-Rechg%(39)
Level 28: Stun -- Stp-Acc/Rchg(A), Stp-EndRdx/Stun(39), Stp-Acc/EndRdx(40), Stp-Stun/Rng(40), Stp-Acc/Stun/Rchg(40), Stp-KB%(42)
Level 30: Weave -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(42), ShlWal-Def(42), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(43)
Level 32: Nova -- OvrFrc-End/Rech(A), OvrFrc-Acc/Dmg(43), OvrFrc-Dmg/End/Rech(43), OvrFrc-Acc/Dmg/End/Rech(45), OvrFrc-Dam/KB(45), FrcFdb-Rechg%(45)
Level 35: Evasive Maneuvers -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 38: Power Boost -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(50)
Level 41: Personal Force Field -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 44: Temp Invulnerability -- GldArm-End/Res(A), GldArm-RechRes(46), GldArm-RechEnd(46), GldArm-Res/Rech/End(46), GldArm-ResDam(48), GldArm-3defTpProc(48)
Level 47: Force of Nature -- UnbGrd-Max HP%(A), RctArm-ResDam/Rchg(48), RctArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(50), RctArm-ResDam(50)
Level 49: Tactics -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Defiance
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Health -- Pnc-Heal/+End(A), Prv-Absorb%(11)
Level 1: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A)
Level 49: Quick Form
Level 14: Afterburner
Level 50: Freedom Phalanx Reserve
Level 50: Portal Jockey
Level 50: Task Force Commander
Level 50: Vanguard Medal
Level 50: Musculature Radial Paragon
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Tactics does far more for any build than assault. Having an answer against blind is much more useful than taunt or placate resist. And it offers additional to-hit which can be further boosted by power boost and fast snipe benefit from higher to-hit boosts. Speaking of hit chances, turn off the aim and build up buffs and look at your accuracy/to hit chance against +4s, they are not at 95%.
4 Force feedback procs should feed you a steady supply of +recharge, and stun is slotted to knock back foes to provide even more synergy with your game plan. If it were me though I'd rather use total focus, Why just stun when you can stun and take off a huge chunk of life in the process. I suspect it's because of the animation time, not that stun has it any better. Dealing with animation time rooting is only a problem for people that aren't mobile. If you know how to joust (and you should learn it on your melee ATs just for the battle maiden fight in Apex), getting rooted in the middle of a mob due to animation will NEVER be a problem.
Thank you. This is very helpful. This build does everything mine did, does most of it better (slightly less S/L resistance, but only slightly), and does things mine didn't. Which is to say, it's a much better build.
Some of these ideas I should have thought of (I don't know why I forgot to account for Slow resist. I guess I'm too spoiled from maining a Super Reflexes scrapper). But some of them I definitely would not have thought of on my own (the Hami-O in Energy Torrent, for example, and I didn't even know the Kismet +Acc IO existed!), And some of them were things I would have done (the Force Feedbacks) if I had been able to think of a way to get to the Ranged softcap without those 6-pieces, which is where your experience with this kind of build shows.
Even more than the build itself, I appreciate you taking the time to explain stuff. One of those things I am always trying to get across to people in my work (software engineer) is that it's more important to know why things work the way they do than simply how they work, because if you know the why, you can derive the how. Because of the explanations, I'll be able to get a lot more out of the build than if you'd just thrown the build at me.
This was exactly what I needed. Thank you very much.
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1 minute ago, Gamlain said:
I was going to suggest a Archery/Empathy corrupter or Empathy/archery defender but now I sort of wanna try it.
This is a worrying sign, isn't it.
It's a given that almost anything with "Empathy" involved is not going to be a good solo.
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3 hours ago, Bill Z Bubba said:
But on a troller, Kin + Spirit Ward + Enflame make my earth pet a flaming bag of poop that kicks ass.
Oh, my goodness. You created Sergeant Schlock!
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5 hours ago, Gulbasaur said:
I'd actually argue that Kinetics is one of the harder sets to solo with because so little of it benefits you. You've got a heal, some damage buffs and a recharge boost without the endurance boost to back it up until much later. You've got a weak recharge debuff, a weak damage debuff, if your heal misses you get no healing. You have to stay in midrange, which means melee in all practical terms, so you have to deal with the increased damage.
It's a long road to 32 before you hit Fulcrum Shift.
I can attest to this. One of my friends had a Kin and, well... they really struggled soloing. So we ended up duo'ing that character to 50 alongside my Dark/Dark scrapper, who needed exactly the kind of help a Kin can provide. It turned out to be a duo made in heaven.
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As a relatively new player, I don't have enough stored Empyrean Merits for this to negatively affect me in any way.
As a player who took frequent breaks from Live in order to not burn out, though, I have to note that this is pretty harsh for anyone who comes back and discovers they have a massive stock of Empyrean Merits they can no longer trade in.
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10 minutes ago, Nemu said:
I'm not pig-headed, I can see your point, but I also think the majority of teams you will get on even if this was implemented won't care.
If in the case it becomes an issue - Give the toggle a 15 minute cooldown 😁
Realistically it can be a 24 hour cooldown because I think the majority people that want to toggle it on won't ever toggle it off. Then you can just make an excuse that your toggle is still on cooldown! Hey, fat finger happens! Problem solved. And if you don't dig the team, play a mission then excuse yourself.
I still think a better option for KB -> KD slotting (i.e. one where the set actually makes sense) is a better solution, though.
10 minutes ago, Nemu said:Separate topic: I saw the build you posted. I can teach you to be a better builder and a better blaster, if you are open to what I have to say.
Skylancer is fairly concept-limited, so she doesn't really represent the best I can do in terms of a performance build, but I'm always open to feedback. Feel free to respond on that thread.
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So, in anticipation of the Page 4 sound stacking fix, which will enable me to start actually playing in teams again, I've decided it's time for me to work up a proper build for my favorite concept character. That said, I'm much better at building Scrappers than Blasters, so I could use a little help.
Being as she is a concept character, I have limited flexibility with regard to her power selections. Force Mastery and Flight are required by her concept. Hasten is there for obvious reasons, but isn't actually required by concept. Similarly, the Fighting Pool and Leadership are there just to help her get to the Ranged soft-cap; they fit with her concept, but aren't required for it. You'll also notice I'm focused very heavily on the Ranged side of the build; she's named Skylancer, not Groundpounder. This is not to say that I'm opposed to taking a little more melee, if it can be fit in within the build goals, but my primary focus is ranged.
As for Incarnate powers, honestly, I'm not really sure which options are best for a Blaster. The only ones I'm sure of are Clarion (for status protection) and Robotic Drones (for concept reasons). The rest are up in the air. I defaulted to Musculature Alpha and Assault Hybrid because more damage is always good, and... honestly, I'm guessing with regard to Interface. I use Degenerative on all my Scrappers, but that's because they solo a lot. I want this character to be ABLE to solo, but it's not going to be her primary focus, so I'm not sure which Interface works best, given that.
Obviously, the primary build goal here is soft-capped range, with a secondary goal being as much Smash/Lethal resist as I can get. Beyond that, recharge, accuracy, and damage.
This Hero build was built using Mids Reborn 3.2.17
https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsRebornClick this DataLink to open the build!
Skylancer (ver 2): Level 50 Science Blaster
Primary Power Set: Energy Blast
Secondary Power Set: Energy Manipulation
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Force MasteryHero Profile:
Level 1: Power Bolt -- Thn-Acc/Dmg(A), Thn-Dmg/EndRdx(3), Thn-Dmg/Rchg(3), Thn-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(5), Thn-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(5), Thn-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(7)
Level 1: Power Thrust -- Acc-I(A)
Level 2: Power Blast -- SprDfnBrr-Acc/Dmg(A), SprDfnBrr-Dmg/Rchg(7), SprDfnBrr-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(9), SprDfnBrr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(9), SprDfnBrr-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(11), SprDfnBrr-Rchg/+Status Protect(11)
Level 4: Energy Torrent -- Artl-Acc/Dam(A), Artl-Dam/End(13), Artl-Dam/Rech(13), Artl-Acc/Dam/Rech(15), Artl-Acc/Rech/Rng(15), Artl-End/Rech/Rng(17)
Level 6: Build Up -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(17)
Level 8: Sniper Blast -- SprBlsWrt-Acc/Dmg(A), SprBlsWrt-Dmg/Rchg(19), SprBlsWrt-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(19), SprBlsWrt-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(21), SprBlsWrt-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(21), SprBlsWrt-Rchg/Dmg%(23)
Level 10: Power Burst -- SprWntBit-Acc/Dmg(A), SprWntBit-Dmg/Rchg(23), SprWntBit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(25), SprWntBit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(25), SprWntBit-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg(27), SprWntBit-Rchg/SlowProc(27)
Level 12: Aim -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(29)
Level 14: Fly -- Flight-I(A)
Level 16: Energize -- NmnCnv-Heal/EndRdx(A), NmnCnv-EndRdx/Rchg(37), NmnCnv-Heal/Rchg(39), NmnCnv-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(39), NmnCnv-Heal(39), NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(40)
Level 18: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(29)
Level 20: Hover -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def(31)
Level 22: Kick -- Acc-I(A)
Level 24: Tough -- StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), RctArm-ResDam(31), RctArm-ResDam/EndRdx(31), GldArm-3defTpProc(46)
Level 26: Explosive Blast -- Artl-Acc/Dam(A), Artl-Dam/End(33), Artl-Dam/Rech(33), Artl-Acc/Dam/Rech(33), Artl-Acc/Rech/Rng(34), Artl-End/Rech/Rng(34)
Level 28: Weave -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(34), ShlWal-Def(36), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(36)
Level 30: Stun -- Mk'Bit-Acc/Dmg(A), Mk'Bit-Dmg/EndRdx(36), Mk'Bit-Dmg/Rchg(37), Mk'Bit-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(37), Mk'Bit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(50), Mk'Bit-Dam%(50)
Level 32: Nova -- OvrFrc-Acc/Dmg(A), OvrFrc-End/Rech(40), OvrFrc-Acc/Dmg/End(40), OvrFrc-Dmg/End/Rech(43), OvrFrc-Acc/Dmg/End/Rech(43), OvrFrc-Dam/KB(43)
Level 35: Personal Force Field -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 38: Evasive Maneuvers -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 41: Temp Invulnerability -- UnbGrd-Max HP%(A), UnbGrd-ResDam(42), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(42), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(42)
Level 44: Force of Nature -- Ags-Psi/Status(A), Ags-ResDam(45), Ags-ResDam/EndRdx(45), Ags-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(45)
Level 47: Maneuvers -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), Rct-ResDam%(48), Rct-Def(48), Rct-Def/EndRdx(48)
Level 49: Assault -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 1: Defiance
Level 1: Brawl -- Acc-I(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Heal-I(A)
Level 1: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 1: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 1: Health -- Prv-Absorb%(A), Pnc-Heal/+End(46), Mrc-Rcvry+(50)
Level 1: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A), PrfShf-EndMod(46)
Level 49: Quick Form
Level 14: Afterburner
Level 50: Freedom Phalanx Reserve
Level 50: Task Force Commander
Level 50: Portal Jockey
Level 50: The Atlas Medallion
Level 50: Clarion Core Epiphany
Level 50: Musculature Core Paragon
Level 50: Ion Core Final Judgement
Level 50: Paralytic Radial Flawless Interface
Level 50: Robotic Drones Radial Superior Ally
Level 50: Assault Core Embodiment
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7 minutes ago, Nemu said:
I doubt you have played with him but I'm certain most here have posted knee jerk reactions to his comments the way people would swarm in on anyone that said healer back in the day. I have teamed with him. He doesn't treat people like shit - Misguided in some of his opinions yes, but far from a dickhead. His teams ran fine, and I've been on other teams where the leader had specific ways he wanted to run the team but hey, it's his team. There are occasions where the team didn't do what the team leader wanted and instead of kicking people, he just excused himself from the team like a mature person would. I'm totally ok with that. If I didn't agree with the leadership I can form my own team. Being afraid that you are going to get kicked off a team is just a sign that you are not willing to form your own teams. That's completely on you because you have the power to do so any time and you can also set the terms on how you want your team to play. From what I see in game, this game can use more people forming teams than people waiting to join them.
I'm not ok with you just making a blanket assumption that this person is a dickhead and that if this change takes place then your experience with the game is going to be innundated with dickheads that will kick you off the team. Most people that play this game are decent people and it bothers me that you'd just attribute the worst onto them and use that as an example to shut down any compromise/suggestion.
I don't know the person in question, and don't even know who the person in question is, so my viewpoint isn't based on any one specific person.
My viewpoint is based on some of the experiences I had as an Energy Blaster in teams on Live back in the day.
As I've said before, there were many occasions where I had people in my team throw a fit the moment they realized I was Energy Blast. Thankfully, in most of those cases it wasn't the Team Leader, but occasionally it was. I got pretty good at talking those people into giving me a chance on their team, and never once did I have a complaint from anyone once the party got rolling and they realized I knew what I was doing (even when I did make mistakes, as I sometimes did, because I'm not perfect). But I can promise you some of those team leaders, if a KB -> KD toggle had existed, would absolutely have demanded that I turn it on rather than trust that I knew how to use my powers to the team's benefit.
And this comes back to my main reason for not wanting such a toggle. I don't want to turn off knockback on all my powers. Knockback is a survival tool for an Energy Blaster. If a dangerous melee enemy gets in my face and I don't have enough headroom to fly away from him (or if he can fly), I only have two answers: Stun (which has a fairly long cooldown) or knock him across the freakin' room. So I really don't want to give up the option to knock him across the freakin' room if I need to!
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17 minutes ago, Luminara said:
Not too long ago, there was a relatively new player prancing around the forums, rather proudly boasting of having kicked people off of teams for... not playing defenders the way he/she believed they "should" be played, not playing tanks the way he/she believed they "should" be played, et cetera. This person treated teammates like employees, and was the kind of boss no-one wants to work for.
That's why we can't just compromise. There's no argument to be made, no discussion to be had, because there is no way on Earth that micro-managing, anal-retentive dickheads should be given control over other players' decisions, and that is exactly what this entails. No-one can force another player to stop in the middle of a story arc or *F, whip up a build in Mids', perform a respec and slot "appropriate" enhancements... but you can bet your banana split that the instant a KB->KD toggle becomes a reality, everyone with a stick up their ass and a swollen ego will leap at the opportunity to impose their will on others.
We are not going to spoon-feed people like the one I'm not naming more opportunities to treat others like shit. Not on my watch.
That's an angle on this I hadn't even thought of - and I should have, given some of my past experiences.
The moment you put a KB -> KD toggle in, some team leaders will start demanding players use it. And will start kicking players who don't.
So, yeah, I was already opposed to this idea, but now I'm even moreso.
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19 minutes ago, Supertanker said:
Maybe the "Chance for Knockdown " IOs (Kinetic Combat, Avalanche, Ragnarok) could be changed to Chance for Knockdown/KB to KD like Overwhelming Force.
That would certainly help, and having a high-performance set like Ragnarok with a KB to KD would certainly remove a lot of cause for complaint about slotting KB to KD.
Of course, Ragnarok is also unique, but Kinetic Combat isn't. And off the top of my head, I can't think of any set that really needs more than 3 KB -> KD's (Energy Blast might need 3, for an energy blaster who doesn't use Hover)
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Something I wanted to add to this thread. Basically, I'm quoting myself from the KB -> KD toggle thread here, but it elucidates better than what I've previously said why I think adding a new set with damage-set enhancement and a KB -> KD is the right solution here.
"Truth be told, it's not even really because of the loss in performance from Sudden Acceleration on a practical purpose. I mean, I don't like it from a practical perspective, but that's not the main reason. Mostly, it's that the self-defeating design of the Sudden Acceleration set drives me a little bit nuts on principle. Why do we have a set that has not one, not two, not three, but five Knockback enhancement components in it, and then one piece that converts KB -> KD, nullifying the effects of all of that Knockback enhancement. It's... kind of a ridiculous design, to be blunt. And it drives the engineer in me up a wall. So if I seem very passionate about it, that's a large part of why."
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5 minutes ago, Rudra said:
Or, we could come up with a new non-unique damage set similar to Overwhelming Force, but with weaker elements for being a non-unique.
As you know, this is my preferred solution to the problem - it's the solution that I proposed, in fact.
Truth be told, it's not even really because of the loss in performance from Sudden Acceleration on a practical purpose. I mean, I don't like it from a practical perspective, but that's not the main reason. Mostly, it's that the self-defeating design of the Sudden Acceleration set drives me a little bit nuts on principle. Why do we have a set that has not one, not two, not three, but five Knockback enhancement components in it, and then one piece that converts KB -> KD, nullifying the effects of all of that Knockback enhancement. It's... kind of a ridiculous design, to be blunt. And it drives the engineer in me up a wall. So if I seem very passionate about it, that's a large part of why.
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1 hour ago, TheZag said:
I get what you mean. But I dont think there is much dispute that most knockback powers become more powerful if they had knockdown for free. So something has to give somewhere. Currently we spend a slot. If that slot was given back in the form of a toggle or null option then somewhere else should lose performance to compensate for the free buff.
I'd dispute that a little bit. It's certainly true in some cases, but it's not universal.
For single-target knockback powers, KB vs. KD honestly makes very little difference, especially for a Blaster who is just going to follow up the KB attack with more ranged attacks, so unless I have stupidly knocked the target out of my range (and even if I do make such a blunder, I have Boost Range for that), it isn't going to survive any longer after being KB'd than it would have after being KD'd. To twist an anime meme, he is already dead. Or, as I tell my teams, "If I KB a single target, I'm claiming that target and I'm going to finish it, so you can ignore it." This is the reason I see no need to slot KB -> KD in my single target powers, and in fact don't want to (for reasons I'll come back to shortly).
For an AoE power with directional knockback (Energy Torrent, Explosive Blast, etc.), you can achieve the same purpose as the KB -> KD IO simply by hovering above the spawn and blasting downwards. Even if you don't take Hover, you can accomplish the same thing by jumping over the spawn and hitting your KB power while you are in the air above it (though this requires a good sense of timing and is easy to screw up, so it requires skill). Or, you can just very carefully use your KB to knock targets at the perimeter of the spawn into the center (though this is more effective with Torrent than Explosive Blast, because Explosive Blast hits a pretty large area). What the KB -> KD IO gives you here is convenience, in that you don't have to bother doing that. And possibly lowers the skill floor a little bit, since you don't have to bother managing your knockback. Personally, I do take Hover, which is why the new build I am working on will not be slotting KB -> KD in either Torrent (where I never did slot it to begin with) or Explosive Blast.
EDIT: I forgot the other method of managing Energy Torrent and Explosive Blast's knockback, and that's to tell your team in advance, "Ok, I'm going to KB the spawn into that corner over there, so the tank should stand over there to be ready to pick them up." Because KB into a corner can actually help concentrate a spawn rather than scattering it. This of course requires a team that is willing to take the time to plan a little bit.
The one case where you are undoubtedly correct in team play is Nova. Because Nova has uncontrollable, omnidirectional Knockback.
But the biggest reason I dispute your statement is because, in solo play, KB -> KD is not a straight power boost in any case. In fact, it can be argued that slotting KB -> KD is a detriment to a soloing Energy Blaster.
Every blast and manipulation powerset provides some kind of damage mitigation. Even Fire has an immobilize and a fear (IIRC, my Fire blaster on HC is a lowbie and I don't remember that much about my one from Live) in its secondary. In most cases, this takes the form of slows, immobilizes, holds, and other means of keeping the enemy off the fragile Blaster. Note that most Blasters (especially those of us who build for Ranged defense) don't fear the enemy on the other side of the room. We do fear the one that is in our face!
For Energy/Energy, you get only two forms of mitigation, and only ONE form in your primary. In your secondary, you have some Disorient, though only one reliable Disorient (Stun) in a power that does minimal damage. The vast majority of an Energy/Energy blaster's mitigation comes from KNOCKBACK. And slotting KB -> KD results in getting significantly less mitigation from those powers. Thus, KB -> KD is not a straight power improvement for an Energy Blaster. It is a tradeoff of offense vs. mitigation. And since KB really doesn't reduce a soloing Energy Blaster's damage output very much (if at all), this is largely a net loss for the Energy Blaster.
This is why we don't like slotting KB -> KD, why we tend to resent it, and only do it grudgingly because it helps our teammates for us to do so. And this is why we don't like paying an enhancement tax for it.
Again, I'm still opposed to the toggle idea. Because it is getting something for nothing, in a sense, but mostly because I don't want to remove KB from all my powers, only some (one, in fact) of them. Though if you gave me the option to toggle KB to KD for only Nova, I would happily take it, but I'm not asking for that.
But I do think the idea that KB -> KD is a power boost for the Blaster is not nearly so cut-and-dried as people want to argue that it is.
EDIT: One thing to add is that the ultimate solution to this problem for the Energy Blaster is to have two builds, one for solo play and one for team play, and to slot KB -> KD in Nova (and possibly in Torrent and Explosive Blast) in the team build and not slot it in the Solo build. This, however, requires wealth that not every player has (I personally can't afford one complete IO build for all my characters yet, much less two!), and so isn't always an option.
EDIT 2: Just for comparison's sake, I will add a situation where KB -> KD is absolutely an advantage, and a huge one - and that's scrapper Claws. Shockwave is an OK power with KB. But with KD, it becomes completely awesome. I don't resent slotting KB -> KD on my Claws scrapper at all, it's absolutely to my advantage to do so!
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6 minutes ago, TheZag said:
Damage tests have already been done that show slotting for KB > KD will increase clear speed (lower mission clear times) even with the 'slot tax'. I say give the people their KB > KD but toggling it on will reduce their damage appropriately to keep the original unslotted for KD mission clear times. And if they dont like this solution then they just wanted more free power to begin with and never cared about the actual knockback.
Even as someone who is opposed to the toggle idea (for multiple reasons I've already stated), I think you are missing their point a little bit.
A lot of players don't actually want to slot KB -> KD, and only do so because we're trying to be good teammates.
That's certainly the case for me with Nova. When I am soloing, it is actually preferable to have Nova KB, because it buys me breathing room for the crash. But in a team, KB in Nova scattering the enemies is both annoying and detrimental to the team survival. So I slot KB -> KD for everyone else's benefit, not my own.
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Just now, Erratic1 said:
People complain about Bio being clicky (I disagree, but people do), and this sounds like the land of clicking.
Eh, not really. You aren't constantly changing forms in Staff. You just pick whichever form is appropriate to the fight you're in and stay in that one. Usually this is Body, but the others do have uses.
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4 minutes ago, Bill Z Bubba said:
Scrappers don't get the extra defense. For some stupid reason.
Thirding on staff/bio. 3 forms and 3 adaptations or just go +body/offensive for max +damage.
Ah, you're right, I forgot about that. Still, MA/Nin is thematic and they're both good sets, so they should play well together.
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Hmm... OK, I'll take a shot at this.
Claws/SR - Claws is very recharge-hungry, and so Quickness is a good asset to have. Also, this is just one of my personal favorite combinations to play. Claws has lots of tools in its bag of tricks, and /SR's largely set-and-forget nature lets you make the most of them.
Energy Melee/Energy Aura - Yes, this is potentially an overpowering combination, but the two sets work so well together I can't help but recommend it. It's thematic, and the heal in Energy Aura helps offset the self-damage from Energy Transfer. Also, Energy Melee is another set that needs its recharge, and Energy Aura provides that. My Energy Melee/Energy Aura has quickly become my single favorite character to play.
Katana/Dark Armor - Katana adds some defense to go with DA's resistances, but DA isn't so dependent on the additional mitigation as to require you to nuke your DPS for it. I have a friend who mains Katana/Dark Armor and loves it.
Staff/Bio - Staff is a lot of fun, but it needs all the offensive help it can get. Bio gives you that.
Martial Arts/Ninjitsu - it's thematic, and the extra defense from Storm Kick (I think it's Storm Kick, anyway) will be helpful when leveling.
War Mace/Shield Defense - Again, there's thematic synergy here, and it should be an overall strong combination
Dark Melee/Invulnerability - Siphon Life should give you a nice survival tool on top of Inv's overall durability, and the -To Hit on Dark Melee should play well with /Inv as well.
DB/Rad - DB is one of the more versatile primaries. I honestly don't know much about Rad, having never played it, but I understand it's overall pretty strong.
I haven't played most of the also-ran sets, so I'll pass on those as I can't give an informed opinion.
My global is @Skylancer. I hope this was helpful.
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20 minutes ago, Wavicle said:
I don't think it's a question of technology. I think it's a question of the devs being convinced that 8 seconds actually is too long.
I think you're right, even though I think it is too long.
It's hard for me to make too strong of a statement because the only character I play who would really be affected by this is my Rad/Rad... so I have no idea how being without their toggles for 8 seconds impacts the performance of other sets. What I do know is that with no toggles running, the life expectancy in combat of my Rad/Rad even solo is very short. I've several times been shocked by just how fragile she is when her toggles drop. Even having one toggle up - either Radiation Infection or Enervating Field - makes a huge difference in her survivability. So going 8 seconds (plus however long I'm mezzed) without any of my toggles feels like a death sentence.
But I have no idea if it's like that for other sets with offensive toggles or not. Rad is kind of a unique set.
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20 minutes ago, BurtHutt said:
You are 100% correct when you say this isn't a democracy. However, anyone who feels listening to the players isn't important is delusional. I appreciate the Devs and understand this is a volunteer situation. However, I do donate $5 almost every month (except when the window closes before I get there) but I am not getting much play or enjoyment from the game anymore. I will continue to donate the 5 as it isn't huge and every little bit helps.
Where am I going with this? If players get tired of the game direction and content addition then the donations may not make the minimum required amount for the Dev team. This is could be a big deal. This is when people need to realize that listening to your 'customers' is important when you're reliant on them. So, no, it isn't a democracy but it is pretty close (in a way).
You want to know what is in this patch that players want? Ok, let's talk about that.
1). The sound stacking fix. Even if that was the only thing in this entire page, I would be freakin' ecstatic. And I know I'm not the only one, because there have been several threads on this forums (one of which was started by me a while back, in fact) on this subject.
2). Weapons displaying on the character outside of combat. This has been wanted since the game launched on Live! And based on the feedback thread for it, the community seems to be pretty enthusiastic about it, too.
3). Toggle suppression. Sure, there's some argument about the timer involved, but toggle suppression is something that's been asked about since Live, too. Especially for Kheldians, as it's apparently game-changing for them (I don't play one, but I'll take their word for it), and frankly Kheldians need some love.
4). Moving AE out of Atlas and Mercy. I've seen this suggested several times on the forums, for lots of different reasons but probably the biggest one is because AE tanks the performance of both zones.
5). Hard Mode ITF. Not a big thing for me, but I know a lot of players have been asking for new Hard Mode content, and the ITF is one of the most popular Task Forces in the game, so it was an excellent choice.
6). Advanced AE Custom Enemy Power Selection - More control over the power that custom enemies in AE have is something that people who create non-Farm AE missions have been asking for since AE first released on Live.
7). Walk Customization - roleplayers have been asking for this since Walk was first introduced on Live!
Just because the changes that have been implemented aren't ones that you ask for, doesn't mean that people haven't been asking for them.
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5 hours ago, Myrmidon said:
Kheldian toggle suppression is what we want more than the rest of this entire patch, however, we are willing to entertain your theories.
We? Is that the royal we? Because I definitely want the sound-stacking fix more than this entire patch. I want to be able to enjoy teaming!
Being able to display weapons on my character outside of combat is pretty nice, too.
That said, I do understand that the toggle suppression is a big thing for Kheld players (never played one myself) and that they really want it.
Perhaps if it's determined that it's working well for Kheldians, but needs more tweaking for everyone else, it could still be implemented for Khelds now and then re-introduced for everyone else later?
Though, honestly, as opposed as I am to implementing it without reducing the timer at least some, I won't be complaining that much even if it goes in as is, because of the other stuff I want so badly that is in this patch. It would probably just mean I wouldn't play my Rad Defender anymore.
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Can we get another KB -> KD IO in a set that *doesn't* enhance Knockback, please?
in Suggestions & Feedback
Posted · Edited by Stormwalker
man, my typing sucks tonight
That's perfectly fine. The whole reason I wanted a new set rather than to modify Sudden Acceleration to begin with was that I wanted to increase the number of available options rather than take away an option that previously existed (even if I didn't think it was a terribly good option, I always try to allow for the fact that someone else out there might be fond of it, and might be put out by having it changed) in favor of a new one. Therefore, there's no reason our differing points of view can't coexist.
I did already modify my initial post (yesterday, in fact) to state at the beginning that this is a request that is a "this would be nice to have" and not a "this is desperately needed" type of request, after all. I think at least that most of us can agree that more options are "nice to have", whether we think they're desperately needed or not.
(Also, I do recognize that it's not so much a problem in a team. But for players like me who don't have the inf to have separate builds for solo and for team, our build we team with has to also be able to solo effectively, and that's where it becomes an issue)