Stalkers Hide should be made Inherent/Ability to skip t1 powers from Secondary

[Naraka]

4 hours ago, Zeraphia said:

I actually don't think this is a terrible or unwarranted idea. Granted, I think the dev time to do this and replace it and balance the sets so one set isn't getting too generous a "buff" from this would not be "worth it." However, I do see the argument that you are forced to pick the same power across every single armor set for Stalkers, no variation being unpleasant. I'm not necessarily supporting or against this (I highly doubt that one extra power in their secondary will make Stalkers "broken.") 

In Hide's defense, it may be "the same" for every Stalker when you pick it, but it also modifies all your primary attacks so every time you get an attack, you're kind of getting a unique effect to combine with hide.  Getting your first AoE or finally getting BU or combining BU and AS  or BU and an AoE all with Hide is what gives Hide the variation you're saying it lacks.

[blayzemaster]

I also vaguely see the rationale in this; at the moment it basically is an inherent because its a t0 that everyone does actually use and is a defining feature of the class. I do think it would be a bit too tricky to consider with balancing things though and likely take a lot of resoruces.

 

Also, if making it inherent would mean no power customisation, it's a hard no from me

[tidge]

I vote no (specifically for Stalkers, which appears to be a red herring) for many reasons. If 'Inherent' It would have to be made a toggle power, otherwise the 'escort' missions would be dead ends for the solo player. As is, the Stalker T1 Hide is a perfect place to slot a Defense Global IO, which is pretty awesome. Between having a T1 power that Hides a toon, takes Defense IOs, and contributes to the playstyle of the AT... why would any Stalker ever skip Hide...

 

As for the general point about certain T1 secondary powers being unloved (or unlovable)... I agree in principle, but for me: it isn't a significant number of them, and my feeling about such powers are a matter of my taste. I don't think I'll ever grow to love secondary T1 single-target immobilizes, but other players don't share my opinions and I can accept that.

[Zeraphia]

On 5/15/2020 at 9:34 AM, tidge said:

As for the general point about certain T1 secondary powers being unloved (or unlovable)... I agree in principle, but for me: it isn't a significant number of them, and my feeling about such powers are a matter of my taste. I don't think I'll ever grow to love secondary T1 single-target immobilizes, but other players don't share my opinions and I can accept that.

I've investigated the use of these seemingly "useless" T1 immobolizes in the Blaster secondaries, and I've come to find they're actually exceptionally useful in a number of situations and actually contribute to DPS pretty usefully in a number of scenarios.

This is totally off-topic from the thread but I think you may want to re-investigate your initial thought of them. For Controllers/Dominators even there are reasons to actually take them:

1. They can be a significant DPS source... How significant? By their damage per activation, they can often be higher than both your T1 and T2 blast sets, they also typically accept procs better than them because of the slightly longer recharge, although they still are up fast enough to work very well in a rotation with other fast casts. Ring of Fire from Fire manipulation actually proved to be a net gain on my high end Fire/Fire Blaster for pylon times.

2. They freeze your enemy in a location, if you get your ranged defense high (like 35%) you never have to enter melee again, you also don't have to deal with chasing down anything anymore, which is a HUGE positive defensively and offensively. 

Con:

1. They are DoTs, but they end up dealing more damage against a hard target.

2. On a basic SO build, they aren't going to make the chains work with their recharges sometimes (depends a lot) but this is a very murky area to tackle.

 

Any ST immob can always take a bare minimum of 3 damage procs (Apoc, Glad, and Trap of the Hunter) that will add up. It also works well with contamination. So for a set like Dark on Dark Controllers, it may VERY well be worth the power pick, on a set like Fire Control? Maybe not. It IS situational, but on the Blaster secondaries, it very often IS worth it ESPECIALLY when soloing hard content.

[tidge]

2 hours ago, Zeraphia said:

Any ST immob can always take a bare minimum of 3 damage procs (Apoc, Glad, and Trap of the Hunter) that will add up. It also works well with contamination. So for a set like Dark on Dark Controllers, it may VERY well be worth the power pick, on a set like Fire Control? Maybe not. It IS situational, but on the Blaster secondaries, it very often IS worth it ESPECIALLY when soloing hard content.

I appreciate the defense of the T1 secondary immobilizes, but it will be rather extreme circumstances in which I will consider dropping extra slots into a T1 single-target secondary set immobilize just because it can take multiple %Damage procs. Every character I've played so far has had a better place to put those slots (by level 7). If I need the immobilize for 'hard content' I think boosted Accuracy (or Immobilize) is probably the better investment, because the hard content isn't falling to proc %damage by itself. Surely a Blaster has a better place to put a Very Rare %Damage proc like Apocalypse.