Hydra MM

[Communistpenguin]

How about a Hydra MM primary. However, the hook for this set, is as each hydra minion is defeated, it summons 2 of a lower tier Hyrda pet. Resummoning the original pet kills them. So the Tier 3 pet would be a Man o' War. If he is defeated, he summons 2 Proteans. If the proteans are defeated, they summon 2 spawns. If the spawns are defeated, they summon 2 of the tiny hydra that are in the DFB trial. So for the set:

 

Spit:  (Ranged) Toxic, Damage over Time, Foe -Fly

Call Spawn: Summons 1-3 Spawns

Spew:  (Ranged) Toxic, Damage over Time, Foe -Fly

Many Heads of Hydra: Enable your Hydra to summon weaker versions of themselves upon defeat

Tentacle Spray: (Ranged Cone) Toxic, Damage over Time, Foe -Fly

Call Protean: Summons 1-2 Proteans

Summon Tentacles: Summons 8 temporary Hydra tentacles to fight for you

Call Man O' War: Summons 1 Man O' War

Revenge of the Fallen: Your hydra are granted a small pbaoe toxic and -res attack on their death

 

For maximum fun have ALL the hydra summon more hydra after their death. For example, if you have a full summon of all minions you would have 1 Man O' War, 2 Protean, and 3 Spawn. Now lets say your Man o' War dies. It then summons 2 additional protean, so you now have 4 protean and 3 spawn. Now lets say that all 4 of your protean die, well now you have 11 Spawn. Now if all of your spawn die, then you have 22 of the tiny hydra from the DFB trial. This is probably way overpowered, btu it would be lots of fun. 

 

For a more balanced set, do not allow the death summoned minions to spawn additional minions. 

 

The sets biggest strength would be the ability to survive a alpha aoe, since even if all your minions die, you still get new ones AND you debuff and damage any mobs around them. 

 

It would also pair thematically well with poison.

Edited April 16, 2022 by Communistpenguin

[Rudra]

So... you want a MM set that summons minions instead of lieutenants?! And why the downgrade upon defeat? As fast as MM pet summons recharge these days, wouldn't it behoove the MM to just resummon the pet rather than have weaker pets? Interesting theme, but pass on the mechanics.

[Communistpenguin]

32 minutes ago, Rudra said:

So... you want a MM set that summons minions instead of lieutenants?! And why the downgrade upon defeat? As fast as MM pet summons recharge these days, wouldn't it behoove the MM to just resummon the pet rather than have weaker pets? Interesting theme, but pass on the mechanics.

Im using minion as a generic term of a thing that you control. Not specifically in regards to a game mechanic. As to why have them summon more hydra upon their death, havent you run into a situation where your minons get killed off extremely quickly? This would give you a little breathing room. Instead of having all your mobs killed, you would just get a bunch more of slightly weaker minions, allowing you to resummon at your leisure. 

[Rudra]

I've been in several situations where my minions get killed off quickly. Particularly the tier 1 pets. Never so fast that I couldn't just summon more after a second or so though. My tier 1 pets have a less than 2 second recharge. And though they drop like flies in some situations, I keep summoning them as fast as they drop.

 

Edit: The tier 3 pet usually can't be killed as long as I can spam my heals, so its recharge is not a consideration, but its base recharge is only 15 seconds before all the recharge reduction bonuses I have to use my heal affect it. The tier 2 pets are a little more robust than the tier 1s, but even they have a less than 5 second recharge and my MMs can survive some rather insane fights long enough to summon more tier 2 pets. So no, never been in a situation where having a pet that drops to 0 and becomes two weaker pets would ever be useful compared to just summoning replacements at full strength.

Edited April 16, 2022 by Rudra

[Communistpenguin]

Ive had plenty of fights where my minions get wiped out extremely fast. Also, having that ability doesnt exactly hurt you, I mean, even if you never have your minions killed, would having a bunch of hydra as a mm be worse than say Mercs or Ninja? Plus having 2 lesser summons happen upon death really works thematically imo. 

[Rudra]

Here's a question: how would the multiplying upon defeat Hydra affect Bodyguard Mode?

 

Edit: Also, since you are referring to existing monsters in the game, which range from minion strength to boss strength, how would you balance them out against the all lieutenant strength pets of other MMs? Minions for how quickly they would die and boss for how powerful it would be in comparison.

Edited April 17, 2022 by Rudra

[TheZag]

I can see some potential here if on death they spawned an uncontrollable henchman.  Similar to posse from thugs that you dont directly control but you get 1 if a t1 dies, 2 from t2 and 3 from t3.  They shouldnt last very long though and there should be a cap on how many can be active at once.  I dont think having them die and spawn into your next lower henchmen would work since nothing will happen if the next lower tier is still all alive.

[Communistpenguin]

11 hours ago, TheZag said:

I can see some potential here if on death they spawned an uncontrollable henchman.  Similar to posse from thugs that you dont directly control but you get 1 if a t1 dies, 2 from t2 and 3 from t3.  They shouldnt last very long though and there should be a cap on how many can be active at once.  I dont think having them die and spawn into your next lower henchmen would work since nothing will happen if the next lower tier is still all alive.

If we went with the uncontrollable henchmen route, I would say have every hydra spawn 2 more hydra of a lower tier rather than just the original summons. Especially if they don't last very long. This would also solve the body guard mode problem Rudra brought up. I would then Amend my original suggestion, and say that the additional spawns NOT be killed by resummoning. So "The Many Heads of Hydra" combines with "Revenge of the fallen" and fast recharge times for resummons could make this set a nice spam/debuff set.

 

If the death spawns go away after awhile on their own, I wouldn't worry about a cap. You could probably design a softcap based on resummon time of the original henchmen. Though I could be wrong. 

 

As for Henchmen strength, I am not a numbers guy. I would assume any actual attack values/hitpoints/defense etc would get hammered out to be balanced with the other MM sets. Though with the theme of the set being disposable henchman, I would say they should not be tanks.