Water-Themed Power Set Suite

[megaericzero]

Here's something I wanted to suggest: the gamut of remaining water-themed power sets, save for henchmen. We're ignoring the Manipulation, Assault, and Mastery categories because they'd all basically be children of these sets.

 

Why are you suggesting four power sets at once?

In large part so that we can give each set one or two overarching themes without stepping on each other's toes. For instance, Sonic Manipulation has a power called Sound Barrier whose name would proliferate perfectly as the smashing-lethal shield to a "Sonic Aura" or "Sonic Armor" armor set... except that the actual effects it was given are not that of a smashing-lethal shield so now if we ever get a sonic armor its physical shield will have to use a different name. (Yes, I do actually think obsess about things like this.)

 

If anyone reads the thread and thinks "hey, you should focus on quality over quantity", I did actually. I've been tweaking each of these back and forth for about six months. They've sort of reached as good as they're going to get just banging around in my own head without actually talking to other people about it (hence this thread). They're by no means perfect but I do think they're a decent springboard.

 

As far as the themes, at a glance I'd go with...

Water Control: the flow of water

Water Affinity: small bodies of water and things dissolved in that water

Water Melee: water pressure and release

Liquid Armor: properties of water (and/or other chemicals)

 

The themes aren't meant to be absolute; just give us a theme to play towards with most of the sets' powers rather than each set looking like "I asked chatGPT for water-related terms and just picked random ones." There'll still be some outliers in each set.

 

Why do a lot of your power names overlap or downright sound like ones from the Eco-friendly Powerset Recycling Thread?

I mean... all-in-all I'd like to say it's because of simultaneous invention. Rooting the powers in real-world concepts and terminology will do that. There's still plenty of room that I may have been "inspired" by the thread, consciously or unconsciously. I tried to make what I thought were sets that distilled the aforementioned themes, whether they overlap with sets suggested in that thread or not. My bad if I did steal anyone's work. I will admit Aqua Strike down in Water Melee is directly copied in name at least.

 

Now onto the power sets. I'll hide the detailed power info in spoilers boxes since the whole post is already a huge block of text and so people who just want to scan the power tables at a glance can.

 

Water Control (Controllers, Dominators)

1.		Water Trap	(Ranged) Foe Moderate Damage over Time (Smashing, Cold), Immobilize, -Jump, -Movement, -Recharge
2.		Water Prison	(Ranged) Foe Moderate Damage (Smashing, Cold), Hold, -Movement, -Fly, -Recharge
3.		Flood	(Ranged AOE) Foe Minor Damage over Time (Cold), Immobilize, -Movement, -Jump, -Recharge
4.		Deluge	(Location AOE) Foe -Movement, -Fly, -Jump, -Defense, Chance to Confuse
5.		Rapids	[Toggle] (PBAOE) Foe Chance to Knockdown
6.		Decompression	(Ranged AOE) Foe Minor Damage (Smashing), Disorient
7.		Riptide	(Location AOE) Foe Minor Damage over Time (Smashing, Cold), Draw-in
8.		Waterfall	(Ranged AOE) Foe Minor Damage over Time (Smashing, Cold), Hold, -Movement, -Recharge
9.		Undine	(Location) Summon Pet (Undine)

 

Undine

	Resistance	[Auto] Self +Resistance (Lethal, Cold, Negative), +Protection (Hold, Immobilize)
	Drench	(Melee Cone) Foe Moderate Damage Over Time (Cold), -Defense
	Dehydrate	(Ranged) Foe Moderate Damage (Smashing, Cold), Minor Damage over Time (Cold), -Movement, -Recharge, -Defense; Self Heal over Time
	Water Prison	(Ranged) Foe Moderate Damage (Smashing, Cold), Hold, -Movement, -Fly, -Recharge

 

Power details and random thoughts on Water Control:

  Reveal hidden contents

 Water Trap (name credit to Rudra)
(Ranged) Foe Moderate Damage over Time (Smashing, Cold), Immobilize, -Jump, -Movement, -Recharge
Creates a sinkhole by washing away the ground underneath a targeted foe. The sinkhole causes minor smashing and cold damage over time as the affected foe's legs are pulled in. Stronger foes may be able to resist the immobilization but will still have a hard time walking, reducing their movement speed and recharge rate. The mud in the sinkhole will also prevent foes from simply jumping out of it.
Damage: Moderate
Recharge: Fast

 Water Prison
(Ranged) Foe Moderate Damage (Smashing, Cold), Hold, -Movement, -Fly, -Recharge
You trap your foe in a solid bubble of water. This power deals moderate smashing and cold damage as the target is deprived of oxygen and held in place, unabel to attack or move, and suffers from reduced movement speed and recharge rate.
Damage: Moderate
Recharge: Moderate

(Hopefully the engine can handle taking a bubble a-la forcefields and rendering it with a much shinier, rippled surface texture.)

 

 Flood
(Ranged AOE) Foe Minor Damage over Time (Cold), Immobilize, -Movement, -Jump, -Recharge
Creates a rapid torrent of water around a targeted foe. Enemies in the area will be immobilized and take a minor amount of cold damage over time as they struggle to keep their balance. Stronger foes may be able to move around despite the current but will do so with reduced movement speed and recharge rate.
Damage: Minor
Recharge: Moderate

 

 Deluge
(Location AOE) Foe -Movement, -Fly, -Jump, -Defense, Chance to Confuse
Creates a heavy downpour at a targeted location. All enemies in the affected area will have reduced movement speed and defense as the rain impedes their mobility. Flying enemies will be grounded by the rain and foes will be unable to jump due to the slick footing. Some enemies may even briefly lose track of who is friend and who is foe, causing them to attack each other.
Recharge: Slow

 

 Rapids
[Toggle] (PBAOE) Foe Chance to Knockdown
While this power is active, you create a pool of strong and chaotic currents around you. Enemies that enter the pool will have a small chance to be knocked over. This chance is minimal but periodically recurring for as long as they stay in the rapids.
Recharge: Slow

 

 Decompression
(Ranged AOE) Foe Minor Damage (Smashing), Disorient
You rapidly reduce the pressure around a group of foes. The sudden, intense change causes decompression sickness, dealing minor smashing damage and disorienting the affected targets for a time.
Damage: Minor
Recharge: Slow

 

 Riptide
(Location AOE) Foe Minor Damage over Time (Smashing, Cold), Draw-in
You create a powerful current at a targeted location that draws in enemies and deals minor smashing and cold damage over time. The riptide only lasts for a very short time but is incredibly hard for most foes to resist.
Damage: Minor
Recharge: Long

 

 Waterfall
(Ranged AOE) Foe Minor Damage over Time (Smashing, Cold), Hold, -Movement, -Recharge
Creates a powerful waterfall around a group of foes. The sheer weight of the water bearing down on them holds them in place as well as reducing their movement speed and recharge rates while also dealing minor smashing and cold damage over time.
Damage: Minor
Recharge: Very Long

(For this power in particular, I recommend foes do the "drop to all fours" animation used in cutscenes.)

 

 Undine
(Location) Summon Pet (Undine)
You create a powerful entity of animated water at a targeted location. The undine possesses several water powers to attack any nearby foes and is difficult for enemies to pin down. It can be healed and buffed like any teammate. Type "/release_pets" in the chat window to release all your pets.
Recharge: Very Long

(In terms of appearance, maybe an invisible human model with the Slime and Wake auras?)

 

Water Control sets itself apart with its small but constant aura of knockdown and being able to use Riptide to cluster enemies around a targeted spot rather than an anchor target, in addition to multiple powers that debuff movement speed and an AOE immobilize that is TAOE instead of a cone. If it's not overpowered, I could see reducing the recharge on Riptide so it can be used more often, giving the set a special niche of being able to drag foes around at will.

 

Water Affinity (Controllers, Defenders, Masterminds, Corruptors)

1.		Hot Spring	(PBAOE) Ally/Self Heal
2.		Seafoam	(Ranged Cone) Foe -Movement, -Resistance, -Fly, -Jump
3.		Mineral Bath	(Ranged) Ally Heal
4.		Humidity	[Toggle] (Ranged AOE) Foe -Resistance
5.		Cleanse	(Ranged) Ally +Protection (Confuse, Disorient, Fear, Hold, Immobilize, Sleep), +Perception
6.		Breakwater	[Toggle] (PBAOE) Ally/Self +Resistance (All but Toxic), +Protection (Disorient, Hold, Immobilize)
7.		Halocline	(Ranged AOE) Foe Sleep, -Defense
8.		Tide Pools	(Location AOE) Ally/Self +Regeneration, +Endurance Discount
9.		Tsunami	(Ranged Cone) Foe Knockback, Disorient, -Defense, -Resistance, -Movement, -Recharge

 

Power details and random thoughts on Water Affinity:

  Reveal hidden contents

 Hot Spring
(PBAOE) Ally/Self Heal
You can create a warm spring around you that heals the wounds of you and your allies.
Recharge: Moderate

 

 Seafoam
(Ranged Cone) Foe -Movement, -Resistance, -Fly, -Jump
Spreads a large patch of seafoam in a cone in front of you. The foam clings to enemies, slowing their movement and reducing their damage resistance. Affected targets cannot jump or fly for a time as well.
Recharge: Slow

 

 Mineral Bath
(Ranged) Ally Heal
Heals a single, targeted ally by bathing them in mineral-rich water. You cannot use this power to heal yourself.
Recharge: Fast

 

 Humidity
[Toggle] (Ranged AOE) Foe -Resistance
Creates an area of high humitity around a targeted ally that oxidizes enemy defenses, reducing affected foes' damage resistance. This area will remain in effect for as long as you keep the power active and moves with the ally you have it anchored to. (Note that aggro for the aura is directed to you, not the ally it's anchored to.)
Recharge: Moderate

 

 Cleanse
(Ranged) Ally +Protection (Confuse, Disorient, Fear, Hold, Immobilize, Sleep), +Perception
By cleansing an ally with pristine water, you can free them from any confuse, disorient, fear, hold, immobilize, and sleep effects leave them resistant to such effects for a good while as well as increasing their perception. The mez protection will improve with multiple applications and as you advance in level.
Recharge: Fast

 

 Breakwater
[Toggle] (PBAOE) Ally/Self +Resistance (All but Toxic), +Protection (Disorient, Hold, Immobilize)
While active, you project a field that reduces the force of incoming attacks. This creates an area of calm water around you that increases the damage resistance of you and your allies against all types of damage except toxic. The serenity within this area even protects against psionic damage. Additionally, you and your allies will be protected from disorient, immobilize, and hold effects.
Recharge: Slow

 

 Halocline
(Ranged AOE) Foe Sleep, -Defense
You create a stark difference in salinity in the area around a targeted foe. Any foes inside of the area will be trapped by the difference in pressure, preventing them from moving or attacking. The containment is fragile, however, and enemies will break free if attacked or otherwise damaged. Even if enemies are freed, their defense will still be hindered by the salt stuck to their bodies.
Recharge: Slow

 

 Tidepools
(Location AOE) Ally/Self +Regeneration, +Endurance Discount
You can create up to three tide pools at locations of your choosing. Each pool boosts the regeneration rate of you and any allies while standing in them as well as providing a discount to the endurance cost of all powers. These bonuses stack so you can choose to pile them all on one spot for a larger boost, spread them across a larger area to cover more allies in a league, or meter them out to keep their effects going over a longer period of time.
Recharge: Very Long

 

Tsunami
(Ranged Cone) Foe Knockback, Disorient, -Defense, -Resistance, -Movement, -Recharge
You unleash a massive tidal wave to wash over your foes, knocking them back and disorienting them as the water sweeps them off of their feet. Foes caught in the wave will also suffer from reduced defense, resistance, movement speed, and recharge rate for a good while.
Recharge: Very Long

 

This set is a mish-mash of Sonic Resonance and Empathy with a dash of other stuff thrown in. Notably, Breakwater offers resistance to all but Toxic instead of all but Psionic, as many buffs in the game like doing the latter. Halocline is basically ranged Salt Crystals (or damage-less Flash Freeze). Tidepools is the set's unique power. It's essentially a substitute for the two RAs (though goes about endurance differently) but, more importantly, behaves a bit like how the old devs described their rough idea for the Genesis slot in the AMAs. That being (for one the branches) to be able to make multiple buff patches.

 

Water Melee (Scrappers, Tankers, Brutes, Stalkers)

This first power table will be the Scrapper one.

1.		Aqua Strike	(Melee) Foe Moderate Damage (Smashing, Cold), Chance for Disorient; Self Build (Water Pressure)
2.		Piston Punch	(Melee) Foe High Damage (Smashing, Cold), Chance to Knockdown; Self Build (Water Pressure)
3.		Drench	(Melee Cone) Foe Moderate Damage Over Time (Cold), -Defense; Self Build (Water Pressure)
4.		Build Pressure	Self +Damage, +To Hit, Build (Water Pressure)
5.		Jet Kick	(Ranged, scales w/ Water Pressure) Foe Moderate Damage (Smashing, Cold), Chance to Knockdown; Self Teleport, Consume (Water Pressure)
6.		Confront	self-explanatory
7.		Water Vortex	(PBAOE) Foe Moderate Damage (Cold), Draw-in; Self Build (Water Pressure)
8.		Pressure Cutter	(Melee) Foe Extreme Damage (Lethal, Cold); Self Damage (scales w/ Water Pressure), Consume (Water Pressure)
9.		Hydraulic Press	(Melee) Foe Superior Damage (Smashing, Cold), Hold (scales w/ Water Pressure); Self Consume (Water Pressure)

 

Here's the other archetypes' power  tables with their differences highlighted.

	Tankers	Brutes	Stalkers
1.	Aqua Strike	Aqua Strike	Aqua Strike
2.	Piston Punch	Piston Punch	Piston Punch
3.	Drench	Drench	Drench
4.	Taunt	Build Pressure	Assassin's Jet
5.	Tidal Kick	Tidal Kick	Build Up
6.	Build Pressure	Taunt	Placate
7.	Water Vortex	Water Vortex	Tidal Kick
8.	Pressure Cutter	Pressure Cutter	Pressure Cutter
9.	Hydraulic Press	Hydraulic Press	Hydraulic Press

In the case of Stalkers I looked at sets like Street Justice and noticed they still have to trade for normal Build Up if it's not just a thematic rename, even though things like Combat Readiness are "Build Up but better" because they play to the set gimmick. Ah well.

 

Power details and random thoughts on Water Melee:

  Reveal hidden contents

 Aqua Strike
(Melee) Foe Moderate Damage (Smashing, Cold), Chance for Disorient; Self Build (Water Pressure)
You strike your foe with water, dealing moderate smashing and cold damage and potentially stunning them for a few seconds. This power builds water pressure.
Damage: Moderate
Recharge: Moderate

 

 Piston Punch
(Melee) Foe High Damage (Smashing, Cold), Chance to Knockdown; Self Build (Water Pressure)
You strike your enemy with a punch boosted by a burst of water on impact, dealing high damage and potentially knocking down your opponent. This power builds water pressure.
Damage: High
Recharge: Moderate

 

 Drench
(Melee Cone) Foe Moderate Damage Over Time (Cold), -Defense; Self Build (Water Pressure)
You drench enemies in a cone in front of you, causing moderate cold damage over time and lowering their overall defense for a while. This power builds water pressure.
Damage: Minor
Recharge: Fast

(I would name it Soak so it doesn't overlap with Drenching Aura in Liquid Armor (see below) but I feel Soak is better reserved for some kind of self-only power if we need more powers somewhere like the Mastery or Manipulation sets.)

 

 Build Pressure
Self +Damage, +To Hit, Build (Water Pressure)
Greatly increases the amount of damage you deal for a few seconds as well as slightly increasing your chance to hit. Using this power also grants you three stacks of water pressure.
Recharge: Long

 Jet Kick
(Ranged, scales w/ Water Pressure) Foe Moderate Damage (Smashing, Cold), Chance to Knockdown; Self Teleport, Consume (Water Pressure)
Performs a diving kick that damages your target and has a strong chance to knock them over. This power consumes water pressure to increase its own range, allowing you to strike from farther away. (Default range is 20ft distance; each stack of water pressure adds 20ft, up to a maximum range is 80ft. Teleport doesn't occur if used in melee range.)
Damage: Moderate
Recharge: Slow

 

 Water Vortex
(PBAOE) Foe Moderate Damage (Cold), Draw-in; Self Build (Water Pressure)
You create a vortex of water around you that draws in and moderately damages nearby foes. This power builds water pressure.
Damage: Moderate
Recharge: Slow

 

 Pressure Cutter
(Melee) Foe Extreme Damage (Lethal, Cold); Self Damage (scales w/ Water Pressure), Consume (Water Pressure)
You focus your water pressure into a very precise strike. Pressure Cutter deals extreme damage in a very short timeframe but causes recoil damage from the rapid build up and release. This recoil is offset by the amount of water pressure you already have built-up; at maximum pressure, this power deals no self damage.
Damage: Special
Recharge: Long

(See thoughts at the end of this section about animation time in relation to Energy Transfer.)

 

 Hydraulic Press
(Melee) Foe Superior Damage (Smashing, Cold), Hold (scales w/ Water Pressure); Self Consume (Water Pressure)
Channels your water pressure into a slow but devastating strike, dealing extreme damage and briefly holding your opponent. Stronger foes may be able to resist the hold effect. This power consumes all stacks of water pressure to increase both the magnitude and duration of its hold.
Damage: Superior
Recharge: Long

 

 Confront (self explanatory)

 Build Up (self explanatory)

 Assassin's Jet (self explanatory)

 Placate (self explanatory)

 Taunt (self explanatory)

 

This is the most derivative set in the bunch but it's also the one I have the most to say about. If it looks like Energy Melee 3.0 that's because it basically is. That said, there are some key differences and on-brand theming. Normally I'm not one for gimmicks, let alone yet another builder-spender, but it fit for this set so I worked it in. There was specific focus to not up any power's damage directly.

 

The set has Water Vortex which is very much Battle Axe's new Axe Cyclone. Jet Kick would be the set's flavor power. The intent is to let you use it to reposition mid-fight or to jump to the next group of enemies if you end a scuffle with leftover pressure. As for Hydraulic Press, it's very much Total Focus; the animation fits too well for the name. Having its pressure mechanic to increase both the magnitude and duration of its hold was meant to give the set some versatility, making this the power to spend your pressure on if you're fighting a boss, instead of using it on Jet Kick.

 

And that brings us to Pressure Cutter. It is Energy Transfer - the name was also just too good to not pair with the pressure mechanic name. To set it apart (and neither make things too powerful nor encroach on Energy Transfer's special traits), I would give PC a static cast time somewhere between ET's fast and slow animations with the pressure gimmick relieving the self-damage instead of changing its speed.

 

One last note on this set: of all the names in this post that may or may not have been "appropriated' from Alchemystic's thread, Aqua Strike is directly plagiarized. I couldn't think of a better name; Water Punch sounds dumb.

 

Liquid Armor (Scrappers, Tankers, Brutes, Stalkers, Sentinels)

The reason this one's called Liquid Armor instead of Water Armor or Hydro Armor is so it can also cover as Chemical Armor or Acid Armor.

 

This is the Scrapper/Tanker/Brute power table.

1.		Drenching Aura	[Toggle] (PBAOE) Foe Minor Damage over Time (Cold), Taunt
2.		Fluid Shield	[Toggle] Self +Resistance (Smashing, Lethal), +Protection (Knockback)
3.		Rehydrate	Self Heal, +Resistance (Toxic)
4.		Solvent Armor	[Toggle] Self +Protection (Disorient, Hold, Immobilize, Sleep), +Resistance (Toxic)
5.		Hydrophobic Coating	[Auto] Self +Resistance (Cold, Negative, Recharge)
6.		Thermocline Armor	[Toggle] Self +Resistance (Heat, Cold, Energy, Negative, Movement, Recharge)
7.		Hydrodynamic Body	[Auto] Self +Movement, +Recharge, +Resistance (Movement, Immobilize)
8.		Storm Drain	(PBAOE) Foe Minor Damage (Cold), -Endurance; Self +Endurance (per foe)
9.		Overflow	Self +Resistance (All), +Defense (All), +Resistance (Mez); [Delayed] Self -Health, -Endurance, -Recovery

 

Here's the Stalker table with only the differences highlighted.

1.		Hide	self-explanatory
2.		Fluid Shield	same
3.		Rehydrate	same
4.		Solvent Armor	same
5.		Hydrophobic Coating	same
6.		Thermocline Armor	same
7.		Hydrodynamic Body	same
8.		Storm Drain	same
9.		Fluid State	Self +Defense (All), +Resistance (Defense, Mez), +Recovery, +Movement, +Phase (Special); [Delayed] Self -Endurance, -Recovery

 

I haven't played Sentinels enough to internalize how their versions of armor sets differ. Sorry, Sentinels.

I guess drop Drenching Aura/Hide, shift everything up, and tack Hydrophobic Coating/Ink Burst somewhere?

 

Power details and random thoughts on Liquid Armor:

  Reveal hidden contents

 Drenching Aura
[Toggle] (PBAOE) Foe Minor Damage over Time (Cold), Taunt
While active, you emit a constant aura of liquid that drenches foes, chilling them for minor cold damage over time and drawing their attention to you.

Damage: Minor
Recharge: Fast

 

 Fluid Shield
[Toggle] Self +Resistance (Smashing, Lethal), +Protection (Knockback)
You coat your body in a thick layer of liquid for self-defense. The liquid causes hydrodynamic braking, greatly reducing the amount of damage you take from smashing and lethal attacks. The layer of fluid also has some weight to it, protecting you from knockback effects.
Recharge: Very Fast

 

 Rehydrate
Self Heal, +Resistance (Toxic)
You can take a moment to rehydrate your own body, healing yourself. This also allows your body to flush some toxins out of your system, increasing your resistance to toxic damage for a time.
Recharge: Long

 

 Solvent Armor
[Toggle] Self +Protection (Disorient, Hold, Immobilize, Sleep), +Resistance (Toxic)
While this power is active, you coat yourself in a solvent that breaks down even the toughest materials. This makes you hard to pin down, leaving your nearly immune to disorient, hold, immobilization, and sleep effects as well as resistant to toxic damage.
Recharge: Very Fast

 

 Hydrophobic Coating
[Auto] Self +Resistance (Cold, Negative, Recharge)
Your surface is coated in a thin layer of water-repellant fluid that protects you from cold damage, negative damage, and recharge reductions. This power is always on and costs no endurance.

 

 Thermocline Armor
[Toggle] Self +Resistance (Heat, Cold, Energy, Negative, Movement, Recharge)
While this power is active, you coat yourself in a layer of thermally-dense fluid that insulates you from extreme temperatures. As long as this power is active, you have increased resistance to heat, cold, energy, and negative energy damage as well as slow effects.
Recharge: Very Fast

 

 Hydrodynamic Body
[Auto] Self +Movement, +Recharge, +Resistance (Movement, Immobilize)
Your body is optimized for movement in fluid and air, and experiences little to no drag. This affords you a permanent increase to your movement speed and recharge rate as well as protection from impediments to your movement. This power is always on and costs no endurance.

 

 Storm Drain
(PBAOE) Foe Minor Damage (Cold), -Endurance; Self +Endurance (per foe)
You can drain some water from all nearby foes in order to replenish yourself, sucking some endurance from each enemy hit and adding it to your own. The more foes affected, the more endurance is gained. Foes will suffer minor cold damage as their body is desiccated by the sudden water loss.

 

 Overflow
Self +Resistance (All), +Defense (All), +Resistance (Mez); [Delayed] Self -Health, -Endurance, -Recovery
You can push your liquid armor to the limit, letting out extreme amounts of fluid from your body. The extra fluid provides additional protection, greatly increasing your damage resistance and even defense for a time as well as accelerating how quickly mez effects wear off. After a time, however, your body becomes severely dehydrated, draining you of most of your health and all of your endurance and leaving you unable to recover endurance for a brief time.
Recharge: Very Long

 

 Hide (self-explanatory)

 

 Ink Burst (removed)
(PBAOE) Foe Placate, -Tohit
You are able to expel a dark, inky substance in self-defense. Nearby enemies will be temporarily blinded to your presence, allowing you to reposition or retreat. Affected foes will suffer from reduced to-hit chances for a time.
Recharge: Very Long

 

 Fluid State (credit to ZorkNemesis)
Self +Defense (All), +Resistance (Defense, Mez), +Recovery, +Movement, +Phase (Special); [Delayed] Self -Endurance, -Recovery

You transform your body into pure liquid. In this state, you have incredible defense, increased recovery, and are highly resistant to both defense debuffs and mez effects. Additionally, your amorphous form grants you increased movement speed as well as the ability to pass through both friend and foe alike. Once you return to normal, however, your body becomes severely dehydrated, draining you of all your endurance and leaving you unable to recover endurance for a brief time.

Recharge: Very Long

 

I wasn't going for anything stylish and unique about the tier 9 for this set. It's your average "overdo the protection then nearly drop dead when it crashes" type. While Water Melee was the most uninspired in terms of copying another set, this one is the most uninspired in terms of powers. The whole set is just "yup, these are solid armor powers" but nothing unique. Which is to say, it's all bland - watered down, if you will. Ha ha. Ha. Sorry.

I don't think it's a bad set but it could use some love from someone more creative to give it a unique flair.

 

And uh... I'm really bad at ending essays. These are just my thoughts on more water-related power sets. I'm looking forward to hearing from you guys.

 

Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.

Edited April 12, 2024 by megaericzero

[Rudra]

Water Control: Sinkhole: I don't think that name fits for a water effect personally. Sinkholes, at least to me, are more of a ground effect than a water one, though they can be caused by water. Maybe Water Trap?

Water Control: Flood: Should probably be a KB or Repel effect. While I know of floods trapping people, the flood itself tends to carry things/people away.

 

Liquid Armor: Storm Drain: I'm sorry, I just keep thinking of gutters and sidewalk drains here. Maybe even arroyos. Maybe Dessicate?

Liquid Armor: Ink Burst: And now I've got squid on the brain.... I don't know, maybe Misdirecting Mist, Eye Splash, or something else more water-y?

 

Sorry that I only have feedback on the names. I'm still puzzling out the effects, but for the most part, I guess it looks fine.

[Saiyajinzoningen]

so much creativity and passion here

+1 Op

[ZorkNemesis]

I often considered ideas for a Water Armor and a couple powers that came through my head included an offensive power called Vortex which was intended to be a knockdown and draw foes in like Axe Cyclone or the Singularity when used (I see you put that in the Melee set instead).  The other idea was calling the T9 Fluid State which, in addition to whatever bonuses it provided, could also temporarily disable collision like Speed Phase to give the impression that your body has become water or whatever liquid you're made of.  I also had other thoughts, such as the status toggle being something like Soothing Currents where it would provide some Regen in additon to status protection and a Bubble Shield of some kind.  I was hoping also to make it a bit more offensive oriented for variety (hence Vortex) but was a little stumped on ideas there.

 

Edited April 12, 2024 by ZorkNemesis

[Videra]

Very Interesting!

I will say that, for this hypothetical, the secondary effects on Water Affinity aren't particularly stand-out. A slow recharge T7 that only does -defense is painfully mediocre as compared to a power like Benumb, in cold domination - which does (-DMG, -END, -REGEN, -SPC). I'd also replace the T3 entirely and change the T8.

A single-target heal is simply not a useful power in modern CoH. Take Nature Affinity's Wild Growth as an example of a solid T3:  PBAOE (+RES [ALL], +Regen,] 90s duration, easily made perma.

Tidepools has a neat idea, and I like it, but I think altering it so that it's an initial +Rec & +End similar to Heat Loss in Cold would be a good idea. You could keep the functionality you imagined, there's an interaction with things like Healing Beacon in Traps or Lifegiving Spores in Nature where-in it will pulse out the Panacea +HP/End proc routinely - integrating that into a power could be fun.

Otherwise, I generally like your write-up. Make Tsunami KD in lieu of KB, alter humidity so that it's a ground patch with a couple secondary debuffs like Sleet and Freezing Rain. Cleanse is the only other thing I really would change - but that's more due to the game not really having a UI or style of gameplay that's friendly to snappy 'decursing', to use ancient terminology.

Support is sadly very binary in terms of what is good these days, but I do admire your creativity and the time you put into this write-up.

Edited April 12, 2024 by Videra

[megaericzero]

Good feedback and ideas. I've incorporated a couple into the OP.

 

Here I thought I'd get more responses to the armor and melee sets given they're less adventurous (read: copy-pasted) but I suppose when you stick so closely to an existing template, it already comes with the benefits and baggage of the thing you based it on so there's not much that needs to be said.

 

@Rudra: yeah, the idea with Sinkhole is you washed the ground out beneath the foe to create it; I've renamed it. For Flood, there wasn't a good term for "knee-deep/waist-deep water" and I didn't want it to just be "Bigger Sinkhole" so fell back on flood. With Ink Burst, I thought to have Liquid Armor also have a minor tertiary theme of your character being some kind of water creature (hence Hydrodynamic Body) but it's too much in retrospect. Plus the power was filler until I added Hydrophobic Coating; I just kept it for Stalkers since it seemed like a fitting power (it is a Smoke Flash expy). I've removed it and put Hydrophobic Coating in its place.

 

As for Storm Drain, the PBAOE scaling endurance drain powers (Power Sink, Energy Absorption, Energy Drain) seem - to me at least - to be about creating a conceptual low-point of energy so that electricity/heat/energy flows to you via osmosis. With that in mind, the visual I had was one of those street drains that's been flooded over and just-recently unblocked, creating a whirlpool. (see visual) I've also given my thoughts in Alchemystic's powerset-recycling thread that there's a fuzzy line between jokingly punning and genuis wordplay, so calling it Storm Drain to go with Energy Drain and Power Sink seemed fitting both as wordplay and because you are conceptually becoming a drain for the endurance to flow into.

 

 

@ZorkNemesis: I love the Fluid State idea and have incorporated it as Stalkers' t9 with a focus on defense and the no-collision effect to contrast with Scraps/Tanks/Brutes' stand-your-ground t9 Overflow. I'm glad we had the same idea with Vortex; it reassures me that the name, theme, and effect together are a good match.

 

@Videra: Good points. I'm more out-of-touch with support sets as I mostly solo. What would you suggest to replace the t8 in Water Affinity?

Edited April 14, 2024 by megaericzero

[ThatGuyCDude]

I think Liquid Armor should have a more significant gap in Energy protection [being electroconductive], in exchange for Psychic protection instead (Doppler Drops interfere with and deflect psionic interference.  Speaking of which... that's a cooler name than Solvent Armor: a dewpoint fog that protects against mez and psychic attack).  The Tier 9 crash power is kinda blah too... what if it was an intangibility power like WarShades have, where you become untouchable but unable to attack on and off in say 5-to-15-second waves while the power is active?  Like your body loses and gains solidity/fluidity while focusing on the power?

There's more to look into here with temperature control, too... liquids--especially water--are resistant to both gaining and losing heat, so perhaps there needs to be more fire protection in there?  Fluid shield could give some small fire and cold defense instead of knockback protection, for instance.

Thermocline bothers me too... especially the protection from slow effects.  When you think about moving in water, everything has a resonance to it and slow motion is the natural state: you've already got a speed-up power later in the set, so I don't think the slow protection is a good call (you're double-dipping).  Might be another place to consider Psychic defense instead?  Playing with the slow liquid/fast liquid theme, maybe one of the powers could have a move speed boost too?  Hydrodynamic Body?  Come to think of it, a teleport-to-target would fit the theme better, perhaps as a rider to Storm Drain: the character liquefies and then reforms in the middle of a pack up to 60 ft away, stealing Endurance from them as they emerge.

[Rudra]

  On 4/14/2024 at 3:08 AM, ThatGuyCDude said:

I think Liquid Armor should have a more significant gap in Energy protection [being electroconductive]

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The electroconductivity of water depends on the minerals present (or not present) in the water. It is the minerals in the water that conducts the electricity. Pure water does not carry electrical currents very well.

[megaericzero]

Great points, @ThatGuyCDude.

 

More energy protection sounds good; psionics I'm not sure on but could probably work in. There were a couple different things I was trying to do so the set would stand out from other armors.

 

 

I was avoiding making heat/cold resistance this set's specialty because then it becomes room-temperature Ice Armor. That said, Thermocline Armor was meant to be the thermal density property at work. The slow resistance wasn't that you move fast in liquid but rather that the liquid was insulating you from the slow-down that most cold powers inflict. As for movement, Hydrodynamic Body already does buff that. It's even listed as +Movement; I didn't write it out as +Speed or +Run/Jump/Fly.

 

We already have multiple haze-type powers - Arctic Fog, Steamy Mist, and Shadow Fall; granted they're all in support sets. For liquid armor, I wanted to have the character absolutely drenched, pouring out fluids like they're a fountain (or at least a recent victim of a Gatorade dunk).

 

The mez protection being themed as dissolving whatever's mezzing you was both because the set is doing double-duty as Chemical Armor (hence it's not called Water Armor directly and the only power describing water is Storm Drain, which refers to you taking someone else's) and because of water's nickname - the universal solvent.

 

The tier 9 definitely leaves something to be desired, given it's a carbon copy of many other sets' t9. Which warshade power are you referring to that behaves like that (or is it an original take on their existing intangibility power)?

 

And as for a teleport attack, that's already in the melee set via Jet Kick. It would seem redundant since the melee and armor set are already a thematic match; being able to double-up on that feels like a benefit of purposely mix-and-matching themes instead of doubling down (eg: Electrical Melee and Shield Defense being able to do it). Unless we wanted to make that the liquid-themed close-combat's specialty... 🤔

 

[ThatGuyCDude]

  On 4/14/2024 at 4:15 AM, megaericzero said:

Great points, @ThatGuyCDude.

 

More energy protection sounds good; psionics I'm not sure on but could probably work in. There were a couple different things I was trying to do so the set would stand out from other armors.

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I was actually advocating for LESS Energy protection, as a gap in the armor like other armor sets have gaps.  While Rudra's point about distilled and rain water is relevant, having wet or drenched skin reduces its electrical resistance.  It's also a common video game trope that lightning beats water.
 

  On 4/14/2024 at 4:15 AM, megaericzero said:

The tier 9 definitely leaves something to be desired, given it's a carbon copy of many other sets' t9. Which warshade power are you referring to that behaves like that (or is it an original take on their existing intangibility power)?

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The power I'm talking about is Nebulous Form from Umbral Aura, it sets intangibility in thirty-second intervals on the WarShade.  I was actually picturing it playing out like the Master Illusionist Boss from the Carnival of Shadows faction [specifically the power Phase Shift], where the character periodically shifts in and out of intangibility thereby ignoring (auto-evading) hits.  It's not a 'resist everything then crash' power, but that's why I pitched it: to set the armor apart from others already available.

[megaericzero]

My bad. I misread the part about energy. A weakness to energy/electricity is plausible.

 

The phase shift sounds interesting. Alternating intervals of being unable to affect foes probably won't go over well with people, though. I also have reservations about changing it into a Hibernate clone for the same risk of inviting comparisons to Ice Armor. Maybe turning it into a crash-lite t9 like Strength of Will and keeping the no-collision Zork suggested (assuming you could separate that from normal intangibility)?