Primitive weapons as power sets: Feasibility?

[Scarlet Shocker]

I was watching a youtube about boomerangs and it occurred to me it might make a very good weapon for ranged and melee weapon sets.

 

Similarly an atl-atl would be a good ranged weapon and also might provide some melee ability using the launcher as a club.

 

I like the thought of these, but I don't know how practicable it would be to create sets. There'd be a lot of new animations, and I don't know if we have the capability to do that yet but that's a serious consideration.

 

Also while it is great to get more power sets, is a ranged damage set the highest priority? I'm not sure that it is.

 

Also in a game where technology and magic feature heavily, is a power set that effectively involves "throwing a lump of wood" really in keeping with the game? (Explosive boomerangs?)

 

I like the thought but there's a nagging doubt in the back of my mind that it could be made to work effectively.

[catsi563]

Well boomerang would be a neat power set and is very comic booky see captains boomerang and Boomerang from marvel as examples
 

the basics are already in the game i means its an energy blast at baseline and one with a lot of aoe as it bounces off multiple opponents and thanks to trick arrow you have all you need for the trick boomerangs so there you go

 

the atyl atyl is functionally archery with a twist of throwing the arrow with a stick

 

now whips would be awesome and i know whips and chains have been on the wish list for a lot of people 😈 evil cackle*

[Worm_Kalpa]

For boomerangs, I can see them working as an alternate animation for the various shuriken powers, like those in Martial Assault or Weapon Mastery.  The character animation would remain the same while a boomerang replaces the shuriken.  A boomerang dealing lethal damage instead of smashing is a very minor quibble, but that also applies to the various elemental weapon options and the customization is nice.

 

For primitive weapons in general, I believe they could best be handled by a power pool.  The advantages of a power pool over a powerset is that it's open to all characters, there's some flexibility in what mechanical niches the powers can occupy, and each weapon can have one or two powers  instead of trying come up with nine powers.  The unfinished Utility Belt power pool is an example and even has bolas.  I can see a javelin or any similar throwing polearm weapon in this hypothetical power pool being a single-target attack and it can use the animation of the already-existing Pilum power that some enemies have.  Boomerang can be a ranged cone or a chain, even though that's not how they work in real life and is how they are sometimes portrayed in media.  But it would be fun.

[Scarlet Shocker]

5 hours ago, Worm_Kalpa said:

For boomerangs, I can see them working as an alternate animation for the various shuriken powers, like those in Martial Assault or Weapon Mastery.  The character animation would remain the same while a boomerang replaces the shuriken.  A boomerang dealing lethal damage instead of smashing is a very minor quibble, but that also applies to the various elemental weapon options and the customization is nice.

 

For primitive weapons in general, I believe they could best be handled by a power pool.  The advantages of a power pool over a powerset is that it's open to all characters, there's some flexibility in what mechanical niches the powers can occupy, and each weapon can have one or two powers  instead of trying come up with nine powers.  The unfinished Utility Belt power pool is an example and even has bolas.  I can see a javelin or any similar throwing polearm weapon in this hypothetical power pool being a single-target attack and it can use the animation of the already-existing Pilum power that some enemies have.  Boomerang can be a ranged cone or a chain, even though that's not how they work in real life and is how they are sometimes portrayed in media.  But it would be fun.

 

I like the thought of it being a power pool or maybe an APP even. I'd not considered that but it could work.

 

I think pool powers tend to have other abilities, like travel or boost to de/buffs but as an APP Boomerang could have a lot of potential, maybe adding Stun as a secondary effect?

[Techwright]

22 hours ago, Scarlet Shocker said:

Similarly an atl-atl would be a good ranged weapon and also might provide some melee ability

 

It's spelled "AT-AT", and yes it's a good ranged weapon and an even more terrifying melee weapon.

 

😉

 

 

 

22 hours ago, Scarlet Shocker said:

Also in a game where technology and magic feature heavily, is a power set that effectively involves "throwing a lump of wood" really in keeping with the game? (Explosive boomerangs?)

 

Okay, back on track, keep in mind that there's also "Natural" as an origin, and primitive weaponry would dovetail nicely with that.  Keep in mind that bows and arrows can be made of sticks and stones, and I'm guessing some in game have been interpreted that way.

 

Boomerangs need not be wood.  I myself have thrown some made of synthetic materials (some sort of rubberized plastic...thingy), and the DC character of Captain Boomerang has used some with metal and synthetics and yes, explosive ones. 

 

Are you after primitive weaponry that does double duty as both ranged and melee?  I'd think a blow gun, given the right kind of tube would qualify.  Dart for range, Gun tube for club melee.

 

 

[catsi563]

And to add to it consider the basics that in the game where magic and technology are present

 

you have heroes running around swinging their fists and in other cases a stick at people

 

staff fighting a long stick

 

mace a stick with a lump of metal on top of it

 

battle axe a stick with a Sharp lump of metal on top of it

 

sword broad or katana a very sharp pointy stick made out of metal

 

archery using a stick with a string to shoot smaller pointy sticks 

 

so essentially in a game with advanced science and super sorcery the out come of a battle can come down to how well someone swings their stick at people

 

[Scarlet Shocker]

3 hours ago, Techwright said:

 

It's spelled "AT-AT", and yes it's a good ranged weapon and an even more terrifying melee weapon.

 

😉

 

 

 

 

Okay, back on track, keep in mind that there's also "Natural" as an origin, and primitive weaponry would dovetail nicely with that.  Keep in mind that bows and arrows can be made of sticks and stones, and I'm guessing some in game have been interpreted that way.

 

Boomerangs need not be wood.  I myself have thrown some made of synthetic materials (some sort of rubberized plastic...thingy), and the DC character of Captain Boomerang has used some with metal and synthetics and yes, explosive ones. 

 

Are you after primitive weaponry that does double duty as both ranged and melee?  I'd think a blow gun, given the right kind of tube would qualify.  Dart for range, Gun tube for club melee.

 

 

 

 

I'm not old enough to remember when that movie was good.

 

I think most primitive weapons have dual function as a missile weapon and club... other than clubs themselves which once thrown away tend to display sub par performance subsequently.

 

Ultimately most weapons are about delivering significant amounts of kinetic energy to an opponent before they can do it to you but I think a ranged "prim weapon set" might have all the above as part of the set - just with different models and animations as appropriate.

 

I genuinely hadn't considered blow guns as a weapon so thanks for that suggestion and I agree all origin types can be accommodated. Natural is simply great skill in utility, whereas Science and Tech give  options for targeting and different ordnance in payload. Mutant can be great aim and/or strength and magic can do anything you bloody like mate it's magic.

 

 

[Techwright]

2 hours ago, Scarlet Shocker said:

 

 

I'm not old enough to remember when that movie was good.

 

I think most primitive weapons have dual function as a missile weapon and club... other than clubs themselves which once thrown away tend to display sub par performance subsequently.

 

Ultimately most weapons are about delivering significant amounts of kinetic energy to an opponent before they can do it to you but I think a ranged "prim weapon set" might have all the above as part of the set - just with different models and animations as appropriate.

 

I genuinely hadn't considered blow guns as a weapon so thanks for that suggestion and I agree all origin types can be accommodated. Natural is simply great skill in utility, whereas Science and Tech give  options for targeting and different ordnance in payload. Mutant can be great aim and/or strength and magic can do anything you bloody like mate it's magic.

 

 

 

First, that top line is too funny.

 

Second, if you think about it, Bolases can be both range and mele - throwing them for range, whipping them around while holding tight the cord for melee thrashing.

[Scarlet Shocker]

40 minutes ago, Techwright said:

 

First, that top line is too funny.

 

Second, if you think about it, Bolases can be both range and mele - throwing them for range, whipping them around while holding tight the cord for melee thrashing.

 

Wow... I'd forgotten them too. I also realized I omitted slings, which is an important primitive weapon too. It also has a biblical reference as some might recall... as does the jawbone of an ass. The latter one is probably less doable and it would be very unfair to deprive @Snarky of the power of speech! 🤣

[pawstruck]

I utterly refuse to believe any claim that a boomerang is, or ever has been, an effective weapon.

[Scarlet Shocker]

6 hours ago, pawstruck said:

I utterly refuse to believe any claim that a boomerang is, or ever has been, an effective weapon.

 

I suspect you're trolling us but if you're being serious I have no words 🪃

[High_Beam]

1 hour ago, Scarlet Shocker said:

I suspect you're trolling us but if you're being serious I have no words 🪃

Now Captain Boomerang, totally ineffective.

[Techwright]

5 minutes ago, Scarlet Shocker said:

 

Wow... I'd forgotten them too. I also realized I omitted slings, which is an important primitive weapon too. It also has a biblical reference as some might recall... as does the jawbone of an ass. The latter one is probably less doable and it would be very unfair to deprive @Snarky of the power of speech! 🤣

 

Well, I'd been shooting for things that could do double-duty, but yeah, in pure melee or ranged there's a whole lot of primitive weapons:  gunstock war clubs, ball war clubs (or their more savage spiked version), macuahuitls with sharper-than-steel obsidian teeth, similar shark-toothed weapons found in Polynesian and Maori cultures like the Mata-Kautete, Rabbitsticks: a throwing weapon a bit like a non-returning boomerang, etc.

[pawstruck]

7 hours ago, Scarlet Shocker said:

 

I suspect you're trolling us but if you're being serious I have no words 🪃

 

Is joking called trolling now? Kids these days.

 

Ok, I'll be serious: These ideas for primitive weapons are as bad, or worse, than a certain Captain who can only throw his stupid shield at supervillains and giant monsters.

 

Sure, you could say "it's magic," or "it has specific atomic properties," or whatever, but where does it stop? A guy who can throw magical rocks? hock radioactive loogies? blow laser-infused kisses? Eventually, disbelief cannot be further suspended.

 

(Btw, I'm aware we have shields in the game and yes I think they're silly.)

 

 

 

 

 

......boomerangs still suck more.

[ZemX]

2 hours ago, pawstruck said:

Sure, you could say "it's magic," or "it has specific atomic properties," or whatever, but where does it stop? A guy who can throw magical rocks? hock radioactive loogies? blow laser-infused kisses? Eventually, disbelief cannot be further suspended.

 

Boomerangs aren't dumber than archery or street fighting.  It's hardly just shield defense that is silly from a practical standpoint.  This is a game where you can dodge a mental attack because you've got super.... reflexes?

 

But I get it.  This is one of the reasons I've never made a "natural" origin human hero.  Because this is a game, game balance dictates that some normal human with street fighting can go toe-to-toe with a super strength super hero because... they've trained a lot?  Yeah, okay.   If I'm going to punch someone or slice at them with a sword, I'm not a normal human and that's not a normal steel sword either.  I have standards.

[Jiro Ito]

On 8/4/2024 at 8:26 AM, Scarlet Shocker said:

I was watching a youtube about boomerangs and it occurred to me it might make a very good weapon for ranged and melee weapon sets.

 

Similarly an atl-atl would be a good ranged weapon and also might provide some melee ability using the launcher as a club.

 

I like the thought of these, but I don't know how practicable it would be to create sets. There'd be a lot of new animations, and I don't know if we have the capability to do that yet but that's a serious consideration.

 

Also while it is great to get more power sets, is a ranged damage set the highest priority? I'm not sure that it is.

 

Also in a game where technology and magic feature heavily, is a power set that effectively involves "throwing a lump of wood" really in keeping with the game? (Explosive boomerangs?)

 

I like the thought but there's a nagging doubt in the back of my mind that it could be made to work effectively.

 

We already have animations in the game for the "for fun" frisbee power from the START vendor where you both throw and catch a frisbee.  All you would need to do* is swap in a boomerang e voila.

 

 

*I have no idea how easy the swap is, coding-wise.

[Scarlet Shocker]

18 hours ago, pawstruck said:

 

Is joking called trolling now? Kids these days.

 

Ok, I'll be serious: These ideas for primitive weapons are as bad, or worse, than a certain Captain who can only throw his stupid shield at supervillains and giant monsters.

 

Sure, you could say "it's magic," or "it has specific atomic properties," or whatever, but where does it stop? A guy who can throw magical rocks? hock radioactive loogies? blow laser-infused kisses? Eventually, disbelief cannot be further suspended.

 

(Btw, I'm aware we have shields in the game and yes I think they're silly.)

 

 

 

 

 

......boomerangs still suck more.

 

I appreciate it's "the internet" and you can lose a lot with text but that didn't strike me as a joke or even vaguely amusing but maybe our senses of humour are unaligned.

 

But I think it's worth reiterating that just because a power set exists you are not obliged to play it, and others may well enjoy what you don't.