The Holy Trinity ISN'T, because of defender and other debuff/buff abilities

[Psylenz0511]

Defender powerset defining abilities inmho are listed below. I reposted this here from another post because of my post that got the thread locked.

 

There are powerset defining powers in defenders that I value more than others:

 

 

Empathy > Fortitude

Forcefield > dispersion bubble

Rad emission > choking cloud

Electric affinity > Faraday cage

Sonic > disruption field (the cosmic tutu)

Thermal > name slips my mind the big AoE debuff not melt armor <<< HEAT EXHAUSTION

Traps > forcefield generator

Dark > Howling Twilight/Dark Servant tied

TA > EMP Arrow

edit: Poison PbAoe Debuff aura.

Cold > Heat Loss

... remind me the rest.

 

I hope I dont get flagged for cross posting!

Edited June 24 by Psylenz0511

[Psyonico]

I really feel like with any support set, you can’t narrow it down to 1 power

 

to illustrate this point, here’s your list, but annotated

 

3 hours ago, Psylenz0511 said:

Empathy > Fortitude (Adrenaline Boost is far better at making a teammate god like)

Forcefield > dispersion bubble (force field is so much more than just giving your team defense.  5 powers in the set grant no defense whatsoever)

Rad emission > choking cloud (Radiation Infection, Enervating field, and Lingering Radiation do far more to neuter a group than a high end cost mag 2 hold toggle with an accuracy check)

Electric affinity > Faraday cage (Galvanic Sentinel does about the same damage mitigation as Faraday Cage, but your chain powers are far more important)

Sonic > disruption field (the cosmic tutu) (it’s a high end cost version of Enervating Field without the -damage and you have to have an ally to cast it on)

Thermal > name slips my mind the big AoE debuff not melt armor <<< HEAT EXHAUSTION (Heat Exhaustion is a ST debuff that is really only important in AV/GM fights.  The two shields are more important most of the time and then there’s Forge)

Traps > forcefield generator (Acid mortar can put out more -resist than disruption field, Poison Trap is the strongest -regen debuff in a support set (possibly in the game) Temporal Bomb is just… amazing)

Dark > Howling Twilight/Dark Servant tied

TA > EMP Arrow (I play a lot of TA, EMP is probably the 2nd most skippable power, after glue arrow, but the whole set combined is what makes it as good as it is)

edit: Poison PbAoe Debuff aura. (The OG poison AT, MMs, don’t even get Venomous Gas)

Cold > Heat Loss (Sleet and the two shields would like a word with you)

 

[archgemini24]

Kinetics -> Fulcrum Shift (Speed Boost is an Honorable Mention, but distinctly second).

[Psylenz0511]

1 hour ago, archgemini24 said:

Kinetics -> Fulcrum Shift (Speed Boost is an Honorable Mention, but distinctly second).

Agreed

[Psylenz0511]

6 hours ago, Psyonico said:

I really feel like with any support set, you can’t narrow it down to 1 power

 

to illustrate this point, here’s your list, but annotated

 

Error in edit see next post

Edited June 25 by Psylenz0511

[Psylenz0511]

6 hours ago, Psyonico said:

I really feel like with any support set, you can’t narrow it down to 1 power

 

to illustrate this point, here’s your list, but annotated

 

6 hours ago, Psyonico said:

 

 

I guess I should define what I mean by powerset defining powers. In my opinion, it is the power that sitting with other great powers are unique in application and or features.

Obviously I am going to value certain features more than other players. Ice shields are like forcefield shields are like sonic shields are like... etc.

 

I agree 100% with Adrenaline Boost. The tier 9 in Pain which is similar to Empathy is the p;owerset defining buff for Pain as well. Mea culpa, but Fortitude for sure for lowbie empaths 

 

I agree dispersion is much more than defense, it's MEZZ PROTECTION aoe style for the group inside the dispersion.

 

Choking cloud: you are including usage of the Lockdown +Hold Mag proc? The Choking cloud gets most of the lieutenants, too.

 

Faraday cage is more than resist damage, It has mezz protection, KD protection, end drain protection. I will die on this hill for Faraday Cage

 

Sonic's disruption field does need an ally; in this it is unique in its application. The sonic does not want his anchor to ever expire.

 

Indeed I did mean Melt Armor, Targeted AoE -def -res. This power can be up close to every other group with a high recharge build.

 

TA EMP Arrow has one of if not highest -regen bursts in the game AOE on the spawn, delivered by a ranged attack. I also have a sick affection for glue arrow although it operates much like tar patch and caltrops.

 

Venomous Gas is uber; that  is all.

 

Heat loss is like no other AoE buff where is boosts allies' recovery and endurance while debilitating targetted foe spawns' resistance ,

 

I hope this clear's up my position and opinion.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Psyonico]

3 hours ago, Psylenz0511 said:

I hope this clear's up my position and opinion

My argument is not that other powers define the set better, my argument is that no one power defines a support set.

[Psylenz0511]

2 hours ago, Psyonico said:

My argument is not that other powers define the set better, my argument is that no one power defines a support set.

 

I understand your point better now.

 

In the case of rad emission why I like choking cloud so much is that it gives you timie to set up Lingering radiation, enervating field, and radiation infection without getting waxed by melee attacks. EM Pulse is my second activation after teleporting to the middle of the spawn, when its available. the safest place in combat is next to the EF/RI toggle anchors.

 

I should note, I do know how to let the tank take aggro. I play a lot on all-defender or defender/corruptor heavy teams.

[Uun]

7 hours ago, Psylenz0511 said:

Choking cloud: you are including usage of the Lockdown +Hold Mag proc? The Choking cloud gets most of the lieutenants, too.

You don't need the proc to hold lieutenants (although it will allow you to hold bosses). Every 2s Choking Cloud has a 50% chance of a mag 2 hold and an 80% chance of a mag 1 hold. After a few ticks, the mag 2 and mag 1 holds will stack, especially if you slot for hold duration. 

 

Note, Nature has an almost identical power, Entangling Aura. I'm not sure I would call it set defining, since Wild Growth, Wild Bastion and Overgrowth are all so good.

[Doomguide2005]

On 6/25/2025 at 12:55 PM, Uun said:

You don't need the proc to hold lieutenants (although it will allow you to hold bosses). Every 2s Choking Cloud has a 50% chance of a mag 2 hold and an 80% chance of a mag 1 hold. After a few ticks, the mag 2 and mag 1 holds will stack, especially if you slot for hold duration. 

 

Note, Nature has an almost identical power, Entangling Aura. I'm not sure I would call it set defining, since Wild Growth, Wild Bastion and Overgrowth are all so good.

This
And I believe it also is auto hit, i.e. no accuracy required.  Typically, I frankkenslot with endred/hold IO's usually 3 of them 

Edit:  I also think the Holy Trinity does exist and works fine.  The powerful buffs, debuffs and mez effects simply make it not the only viable option for game play.

 

Edited Thursday at 07:25 PM by Doomguide2005

[Uun]

28 minutes ago, Doomguide2005 said:

And I believe it also is auto hit, i.e. no accuracy required.  Typically, I frankkenslot with endred/hold IO's usually 3 of them 

Correct. Although it's likely overkill, I usually +5 them.

[Doomguide2005]

1 hour ago, Uun said:

Correct. Although it's likely overkill, I usually +5 them.

No such thing right

[MonteCarla]

I totally agree that the Holy Trinity isn't. 🙂

 

I'm not so sure you can pin down a single key power for each powerset though. Its often the synergy between powers that makes the set work.

e.g
Force Fields is great because Dispersion AND Deflection & Insulation Shield put teammates close to the softcap.

Thermal is great because the Resistance Shields AND the heals work together to keep your team alive - healing allies who leak HP more slowly due to Resistance buffs is much easier.
AND both sets provide -Res debuffs, which are probably the most important debuffs in the game.

 

And its not like players have to choose only one power. I do believe most sets have a couple of fairly obvious skippables, though.

I love Choking Cloud - I didn't realise it was autohit! Way cool! 🙂

  

[Psylenz0511]

On 6/26/2025 at 3:20 PM, Doomguide2005 said:

This
And I believe it also is auto hit, i.e. no accuracy required.  Typically, I frankkenslot with endred/hold IO's usually 3 of them 

Edit:  I also think the Holy Trinity does exist and works fine.  The powerful buffs, debuffs and mez effects simply make it not the only viable option for game play.

 

Oh I acknowledge the existence of a team grouping: warrior healer dps. I just question the holiness of such an arrangement.