Gobbledigook

Certainly 🙂

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They were mostly fine and still are. A decent ATO would have been good as many agreed, even me. Tweaks were mentioned but Brutes tended to want the old glory days back. Don't get me wrong the Tanker buff was OTT and should have been tweaked but not like this. Two wrongs aren't making a right here. They got it wrong before and they got it wrong yet again. Brute players should have been more constructive and vocal about Brute improvements, which still sit in an awkward position,(i'd still pick a Scrapper/Stalker), and less damning of another AT which had vastly improved and become actual fun.

How about ranged cones that some Tankers get but all ranged classes get? Do they hit just 5 also?

They certainly won't be now.

Exactly. Hopefully the moaning threads will stop now even though they didn't get any real Brute improvements. It will be doubtful if they get any now.

Procs, buffs/debuffs, Range/AoE , certain sets and target caps add to basic damage scales, of which defenders are agreed, near the bottom. Defenders get a solo buff and 16/10 target caps just to clarify. I am not saying defenders are the best but they are not shabby either for what they bring. Procs are easier to leverage on certain sets and can unbalance them easily. It is not just the AT's fault. At least Brutes should be happy now and no buffs/ATO work needed for them as it could create imbalance. I will protest it if they do.

I guess you need to be there. Primary helps a bunch. Hmmm don't defenders/corrs/blasters get more anyway than melee lol?

Other clear time and pylon tests were done also and you will find a corruptor will destroy any Tanker/Brute in clearing both of them it seems lol. No one seems bothered about that, but lets pick on Tankers instead. My defender will clear a Pylon as fast as my tankers and easily kept up clearing maps pre nerf. Extremely survivable and buffs/heals the whole team and is ranged also....priceless. So what are they looking at nerfing next? Brutes?! lol. I won't object 🤣 Perhaps i should show some Corruptor clear times and get them nerfed and hopefully @Snarky will be happy another main is nerfed 😛

If they ever get around to giving the Brutes a decent ATO which they need, this could change even more. Brute ATO probably should have been done before Tanker nerf.

I probably won't stomach playing my Tanker if they become a shadow of their former selves. Tweaks good, heavy handed nerfs bad. Brutes complaints have fallen on deaf ears for years, do i want the same treatment? NO. I play corruptors more and more now and they are just easier. Good single and AoE damage (better than Tanker damage by a lot), Ranged which is just easier, buff the whole team and themselves and they don't have the pressure of Tanking for a team.

It depends on who uses and abuses it also.

It is one of the more annoying powers that have been introduced by the developers in their infinite wisdom.

Certain sets do give that 800 hp boost over the Scrapper and also the higher mitigation cap, but yes not a huge difference in some cases. As i said i would certainly back a Brute buff/rework/something defining. I am a more bring Brutes up a little and Tankers down only a little kind of guy rather than just smack big nerfs on the Tanker. Scrappers wreck hard targets and do well generally, mainly hampered by lack of taunt. Stalkers ummmm uuhhhhh? dunno lol.

I think most Brutes tend to build their mitigations to be more like Tankers and Tankers just have it easier doing this. But a Brute could proc and still have better survival than Scrappers. No one expects Brutes to main Tank if there is a Tanker around, but a Tanker is probably expected to and have taunt. I would be very happy for Brutes to get a nice buff/small rework to improve their role though.

Yes i understand that and agree mostly. But They are less specialist AoE melee in this update than they are on live and if you want AoE you do not bring a Tanker to end game for that, you will bring corruptors and blasters. I understand the damage buff they got and needed but the extra AoE was not needed, but i guess that is just a matter of opinion. Higher mitigations and health, easier to build and slot procs and extra taunt would have been enough for me. The developers wanted it but did the Tanker players? I do not remember anyone asking for it. Seems heavy handed and clumsy so far. A lot more testing is needed imo. Will wait and see.

Why does the Tanker need to be AoE melee focused? Is it not enough that they have the highest health and mitigations? Introducing the extra AoE/target caps to Tankers caused so many problems and upset to other AT's (Brutes mostly 🤣) and it probably should not have gone ahead. The damage scalar raise was enough. It seems you are at a loss as what to do with Brutes and you won't even give them a decent ATO. But don't dick with Tankers who needed very little but got too much. I've played Tankers for years and do not need them to become AoE melee specialists, especially the way this update is going about it. We do not need or want badly thought out changes to the class we have loved and played for many years. Spend your time on giving the Brute a more defined role instead of dicking with an AT that needs very little to work really well. I am afraid this will all fall on deaf ears though as that seems to be the developer stance nowadays.

Would it not be better to hold off on the Tanker changes until more thorough testing has been done? The rest of this update seems close to ready and could be implemented soon, but i think the Tanker changes are far from ready. Perhaps leave the Tanker changes on the test servers so people can test it for a few weeks and introduce it in the near future as a small update.. We do need not an over nerf trying to undo the over buffs from the past. Best to get it right now rather than pissing players off.

Are Tankers to become less fun so they are more comparable to Brutes, who tbh need some love and a better ATO?

And that is at 75% fury, 85% is easily achievable in a mob.

I can stay at around 85% quite easily. Drops off as you move to next mob but not by much depending on how far they are, soon ramps back up though. It is probably easier to do solo though.

I will just play my corruptor more. Very tough for a ranged class, i do not need to stand in a group like a Tanker does. Very fast rotating nukes and clear speeds, probably better than my Tankers on live. Buffs the whole team also lol. But lets pick on Tankers as they have higher mitigation values and lets forget about what other AT's can do and bring. In a team we are usually buffed well beyond what is needed to survive and it is more about damage. The Tanker higher mitigation values only really matter soloing hard content or maybe extreme content, but many just spam barrier for that. I want to feel heroic on my Tanker and not just a waste of space. I just hope they don't over nerf them.

Wouldn't that depend on the content or do you mean AE? Harder targets will be tougher for the Tanker and easier for the Brute. Trash is just trash and goes down well with either, especially with a team helping out. I never found Fury hard to maintain with just 1 target. This is not a Brute vs Tanker comparison thread and i don't want to derail it any further.

If you can constantly have 11+targets they may but less damage on a boss or lower target cap. Brutes can get above 75% fury with lots of targets nearby also. As weaker targets drop and harder targets are left the Brute will pull ahead. You can't just go off of one test with one power used.

No they are just hitting more targets with an AoE (dragontail only). Less targets and Brute wins. If the math is even correct.