dtj714

Uh, that’s exactly the argument. Look at Jimmy’s post and the other posts in this thread. They’ve taken a pool power that was a “waste” and made it into the go-to power for inter-zone travel, for everybody. That’s inherently contradictory.

The rationale goes like this - LRTP sucks so we’re going to remove it from the TP pool, but we don’t really want to remove altogether so we’re going to put it in as an accolade for those that really like/want it (see Jimmy’s post in the general travel thread). With what they’ve done now, that rationale evaporates. I’m not saying others shouldn’t have fast travel - they can and do with all the other improvements made. But if you improve a power in line with its exact purpose and function, then it’s overall fit within the game should remain, not be turned on it’s head.

Take a look at the new version of the accolade - they’ve done with it exactly what should be done with the pool power (with the exception of the recharge, which should stay as it is in a set power). In doing so, they’ve undercut both sides of the rationale for the “out of the pool/in as an accolade” change. Jimmy, you’ve proven that LRTP can be vastly improved within it’s explicit scope and purpose. Respect the intent and vision of the original devs in this instance and leave it in the pool. All the improvements/additions you’ve made to Base travel should be sufficient for general travel enhancement, especially when you can port to Base every 30 seconds with a “free” day job.

Once again, there is a power you can get for free that lets you TP to Base every 30 seconds..what more do you want?

Look a little more carefully and you’ll see why (hint - it’s exploitable in various ways). And with the other changes made, you pretty much can get to your base whenever (the day job alone has a 30 second recharge...)

You’ve now made the accolade into the great inter-zone travel power that should be reserved to the Teleportation Pool (with the exception of the recharge, which should remain 5 minutes and be affected by global). Both ends of the rationale for this change have disappeared - i.e., it sucks as a pool power, but we’re going to leave it in as an accolade for those who really like/want it. No, it now fits and is appropriate as the top power in a travel power pool (and to those who say “but it’s not just the power it’s a pool and 2 prior picks - if you’re already in the pool for the two prior powers that’s a non-issue), and the accolade is universally desired and useful - it’s not just a bow to posterity. So leave LRTP to the Teleporters, and let everyone else use the enhanced/increased Base and other options (which is what everyone was already doing, except they where using the base code to do it instantly and anytime). All the other changes are a “fair trade” for removal of the command - everybody doesn’t need LRTP too.

Sorry if it’s already been addressed in the prior 22 pages, but why are the recharges on Mission Transporter and Team Transporter not being reduced to 10 minutes too? Also, based on all the proposed changes, it seems like the most efficient combo is: 1. If it’s reachable by Tram/Tunnel, then Ouro port -> Ouro -> Talos -> Tram/Tunnel to destination (could also get Talos accolade and go there direct). 2. If not reachable by Tram/Tunnel, then Base port -> Base -> beacon to destination. 3. Always log out so you’re building Base Teleport charges. This requires only 3 powers and limited base building. Everything else seems superfluous?

My god, what a freakin mess. Why don’t you just give everyone a teleport power that can take them anywhere a base could take them on a five minute timer? I mean, that’s sort of the result, isn’t it?

Ok, let's actually look at the alternatives - 1. Mission Transporter - 30 min cd, must have a mission door. 2. Base Transporter - 30 min cd, must have a base with infrastructure for all other destinations. 3. Team Transporter - 30 min cd, must have a mission door. 4. Pocket D Transporter - 30 min cd, connects to 4 zones? 5. Ouro Portal - This is the closest thing, same base recharge of 5 mins, but the process is drop portal, take portal to Ouro, take Ouro portal to Talos (with a few exceptions), get to Tram or Tunnel, take Tram or Tunnel to destination. These are the permanent, "power" options, AFAIK. There are of course also LFG queue, transport to new contact, the Wentworth power(s), and Base Transporter Day Job, but those also have limitations. LRTP is the only way to go from anywhere in a zone directly to another zone, with no other BS, every 5 minutes (or less). Maybe I'm completely clueless though, so show me otherwise... And yes, a big part of my issue is the accolade. The explanation goes "LRTP is a useless power, so we are taking it out of its (namesake) pool, but it's useful/desired enough that we're actually going to improve it and put it in as an accolade, and lock it behind a ton of badges." I mean, wtf? If it's useless, then take it out. If it's worth improving and keeping, then do that. But this take with one hand and give with the other, makes no sense to me. Developing the accolade cannot have been a small effort. Personally, I'd be fine if they improved it and did it both ways. Want to take it as the third pick in a pool you already have and like? Go for it. Want to hunt hundreds of badges instead? Go for it...

Ok, my bad on the “no interest” thing. So let me ask you this - as a TP fan, would you think LRTP was crap if it went to the all the destinations currently on the accolade power, plus Perez, Boomtown, TV, Crey’s (no idea why those are skipped), Eden and Zulu (maybe via unlocks), and had its activation time cut in half (which I think is a big part of the problem because yes, by the time 12 seconds go by, you can be there by some other multi-step process)? All the other “supplemental” travel options are or where gated behind something - Vet or Market, long recharges, limited uses, etc. Much of that has been reduced or eliminated, but they still could have made LRTP useful or at least improved. Isn’t this the first time they have actually removed a power from a set, pool or otherwise?

Why do people with no interest in the pool keep wanting to assert their value judgments? I like the pool and it’s powers, I don’t like Speed or Leaping. But I’m not calling those pools “lesser than”. Each of those is a multi-step work-around or has it’s own limitations. LRTP - one button and I’m there, every two minutes. Enhanced as it is for the accolade, it covers the bulk of the hero zones, the big coop zones, and the cross-over Praetoria zones (and should include more).

It was put into the game by the original devs in Issue 21 - it’s not like we talking about some relic of the early game. The only thing that makes it seem awful is all the travel options added to this private server (making the destinations paltry, something that obviously could have been easily enhanced). With the base code hack removed, it would have been the closest thing without tricking out a base (or hunting down hundreds of badges). Some people are into base-building and badge hunting, others aren’t.

This. The writing is on the wall...they’re gonna do what they’re gonna do. But the fact that these changes have generated so much discussion shows the breakdown in the usual community/dev feedback relationship. They should have simply removed the base code command as a known hack/exploit, and then asked for input on the state of travel without it, since that should have been the “baseline” - now things are conflated. Yes, lots of people would still be whining, but it’s pretty easy to justify removing a known hack/exploit (even though they left it in game for a year - just admit the mistake and move forward).

If they put it in the accolade, they could have simply added it to LRTP, which is why I included the new destinations. But, to answer your question directly, getting just the old destinations is still 106 badges. That’s the equivalent of the fourth “badge badge” (Pathfinder) in and of itself.

Don’t think it’s already been put out there, so here are the numbers - Unlocking the hero zones, coop zones, First Ward and Night Ward (everything a hero could/would get I’m guessing) for the accolade power requires...147 badges. For non-badge hunters, that’s a bit much. If you insist on this implementation, then you should at least give those who already took LRTP the accolade automatically. The fact that they would also have an “extra” power pick should be your opportunity cost for removing a pool power put in the game with Issue 21 and providing a substitute of an entirely different nature. Speaking of which, since not everyone may like/want the new powers/pool, you should give all those affected a free respec, instead of just swapping out the powers...

Wait, is that what these powers are for? MM pets? That’s just silly, the basic powers should effect MM pets...

Sorry, but just thought of this. Why are you taking out LRTP, and not the real useless/unused power - Team Teleport? I mean seriously, you think reducing the endurance cost is going to make a difference? Combine the target ports, put in combat port, drop team port, leave LR as the T4 (and improve it with lots more destinations, one way or another), and put in...whatever, as the T5. And while you’re at it, get rid of Group Fly and find a new T5 for that pool, cuz, ya know, that’s a useless travel power too...

So you acknowledge that it could be improved in multiple ways, but it's still being removed...and the changes you reference, were those done (will be done) with the pool power, or the accolade power just put in...? That's subjective (I thought this game was about customization and freedom of choice), and every top pool power requires two prior picks (if you're in the TP pool you're going to want Recall and TP) so... But that's essentially what you are doing - taking it away from those who wanted (want) it, on the justification that you're giving it to everybody, which as far as I can tell, nobody asked for. And again, opportunity cost? One takes a power pick, while the other requires unlocks for every zone for every toon. Couldn't you leave it to the player(s) to make the judgment about which they'd rather do? Yes, inter-zone travel is easy. Yes, I could take a power (that not everyone else has access to) that makes it even easier. No, you should not take away the later due to the former, especially when the "solution" just exacerbates what was supposedly the underlying problem (and furthermore, the substitution is something of an entirely different nature - ie. Fold Space, a mob herding tool...).

By the way, if LRTP is pointless and a “waste”, then how is the accolade power any less so? You’re going to do all those unlocks so you can get to a handful of zones that you can easily get to through the plethora of other travel methods already available? Instead of making something useful we just leave it useless (and harder to get) but give it to everyone? Makes no sense...

Based on the feedback thus far, this will be happening a lot, since, as you point out, many people see it as useful to their particular role/tactics. That, and/or a lot of people are going to have a redundant T5 power rendered useless (or less useful) by someone else having it. Plus, how many other power casts are going to be wasted by this? Start up your long-cast nuke then..YOINK mobs are gone. Getting into position for a mire, then YOINK mobs are gone. Lay down your trap, etc. in one spot, then YOINK mobs are someplace else. I’m telling you, when you use this power (or use it in close coordination with someone) you may love it, but when someone else is using it without you knowing how/when (as in the vast majority of groups), you’re going to hate it. Multiple people being able to insta-port groups of mobs around is not a good thing... It would be simple to fix LRTP. Just give it more initial destinations, and let it be used for ANY zone (not otherwise prohibited) with an unlock system (but much simpler) like the accolade power. Obviously the way they have the accolade power proves it can be done. The accolade power (or P2W as it should be) needs to stay limited and have a longish recharge so it and LRTP aren’t redundant.

Could you update with a summary of what HC has done thus far (so we don’t have to wade through all the patch notes...)?

Been more focused on the Teleportation Pool thread, so sorry if these suggestions have already been made, but there is cross-over: LRTP and the Accolade Power - Change the accolade power to a P2W power (same as Base Transport, Mission Transport, and Team Transport) called Zone Transport. Give it all the destinations of the current accolade power without requiring any unlocks, and a long recharge (same as Mission Transport). For the pool power, give it the new destinations of the current accolade power to start, plus make it usable for ANY zone (not otherwise restricted) by visiting the zone once or getting a (single) unlock badge in that zone. Voila, 'porters can keep their (now useful) LRTP, while others can get a slimmed-down, less frequently useable version without having to do a crap-ton of unlocks on every toon. Everybody wins. Alternatively, why not get rid of all the current teleport and transport powers and just let everybody teleport anywhere anytime? I mean, its headed in that direction...

Ok, third (and final) take - The New Teleportation Pool: Teleport Target - As on beta. Functionally replaces Shadow Recall. Combat Teleport - As on beta. Functionally replaces Dwarf Step (both versions) and Starless Step. Teleport - As on beta. Functionally replaces Shadow Step. Group Teleport (renamed to distinguish from the P2W power) - An in-zone, group-wide door port on a moderate (5 minute?) cooldown. Long Range Teleport - Give it all new destinations on the current accolade power to start. Plus, make it so that ANY zone (not otherwise prohibited) can be added by simply visiting the zone, or getting an unlock badge within the zone (as opposed to getting all exploration badges). Voila, LRTP is suddenly good again! Other considerations/changes: Accolade LRTP - Change this to a P2W power (same as Mission Teleport, Base Teleport, Team Teleport ) called Zone Teleport. Give it all the zones of the current accolade power without requiring any unlocks, and a long recharge (same as Mission Teleport). Now people can have a slimmed-down, less frequently usable version of LRTP without having to do a crap-ton of unlocks on every toon. Everybody wins. Fold Space - Look, I get how a lot of people like this power. But it has potential problems, and is NOT an appropriate substitution for the T5 power in the Teleportation pool. If I take Teleportation, then I expect to have an uber-teleport as the capstone, not some mob herding tool. Frankly, from a functional standpoint, it's a better fit for the Presence pool, where it should replace Unrelenting (a self buff/rez that is not in line with the general nature and rest of the powers of that pool).

If this power has such broad appeal, then it’s going to be like a cat chasing a light - the mobs are over here! No, over there! No, over...

Right. So we’re going to create a T5 pool power that’s only useful for aggro magnets...