WindDemon21

I haven't tested that yet, almost too afraid cause i know it's nice on melee, but if it turns into what the blaster version lists for, it's going to suck so bad :/.

I woudln't even mind if say maybe, it went from 500% to 400% total, as long as it's still between the bots, but it should not be in the MM attacks especially with their end costs.

Been busy with other changes, but gotta say not a fan of the -regen moved to the attacks, wish it would still be in the bots, even if spread out among them to equal the same amount. Going to be very end costly to try to keep that regen on with all 3 attacks, otherwise it's a -regen nerf too.

I mean, that entirely depends how you play with it. With kb-kd, and no repel then, and lessened chance of knockdown (unless ARE they making it the same kd chance then and not nerfed chance with this change?) Cause otherwise, the kd chance with a kb-kd in repulsion field is fairly poor, especially with the radius of the kb aura (not repel) So it would suck to lose both the repel, and then only have a small radius of kd with much less chance to do that kd. Again depends how you use it, but that's what sucks most about this change. You can't use repulsion AS the small radius kd if you want, AND have the aoe repel from force bubble. So you kinda get screwed either way. Kinda making it really only valualabe WITHOUT the kb-kd, either as a keep away power, or to use like hurricane to position the mobs.

Which is still a loss lol. A radius loss.

*chants* PULL IN PULL IN PULL IN *chants* XD Also, as a tier 9, for that ALL it's doing as well TBQFH it's not enough, is too late, and recharge is too long for that being all it does. As mentioned, pulsing absorb would be best to add to the power, maybe some -damage/-speed, that and maybe add the pull in but i woudln't hold my breath on the pull in with it's big radius. But absorb, -speed, and -damage definitely. (I'd say, at minimum though the absorb, and the -speed). The -speed, cause with repulsion field, it's easier/better for that slow in a field that you can "kiss" with the repel versus the slow in the repel, only working when you're actively on them with it. It's good for protection to have the -speed in repulsion field, but better for field control to have it in the location power. So absorb, and -speed (like quicksand/tar patch levels) at minimum should be added.

Ok huzzah! but sad it's not this one lol. I'd eye up again all pets in game should be your level as well. That purple patch is just too harsh end game. And yeah, given curent issues anyway, I'd honestly not bat an eye at any pet that's lower than your level being OVERPOWERED when at your level, they simply won't suck AS MUCH lol. I can't imagine any pet being too strong just by the level bump (or even whole sets of them ie MM's. Like you could honestly roll it out to test, and see that nothing more needed nerfed as a result I could guarantee) Edit: of course now the ever-present batltle, of wanting to play with the new goodies, but also wanting to wait till MMs are fixed in general lol.

Ughhh :/. If we're so sure of that, is there an eta then of when this is hitting live then that i missed? I feel like these beta discussion just started last week. Seems awful for a whole page to go live.

That was with the numbers tested, I just simplified the actual damage per tic for the explanation. Again, it was expressing how at BEST its still al ittle under value, and at worst, which is the most common, it's far less.

So maybe, as is with some -speed, and absorb added, maybe -damage (depending on values of those of course, with the proccing absorb being the big useful addition, and -speed being of a good value, could even do without the -damage, but even if it was like 10%, would still be a nice little addtion to help)

Knowing how those -special powers work and how many things it actually affects in useful situations though, no not really lol. Why it needs something more like I suggested above. That -special/resistance can be nice to have there sure, but it's not enough on it's own, especially not at those values. I could maybe see the absorb going there as well if not in dispersion bubble. Give it a good spot to slot some heal sets for recharge too.

I know that there are lots of other changes needed down the line for MMs, but on top of making the upgrades a pbaoe power instead of a targetted aoe, how hard would it be to bump all pets in the game to your same level, cause that's always been one of the first steps to fixing MMs (and all pets like imps/gremlins too). I feel like regardless of individual MM set changes, this is the standard first step that should be easy to understand and implement (outside of coding, can't recall on that).

As I've said, basically, even with build up, let's say you jump in, a patch drops mid-jump, and when you land you use build up. That means that there is approximately 4.5s where NO patch is on the mobs, wasting 4.5 seconds of that build up in regards to the patch. That also means, that it's only boosting, the other 5.5 seconds, of HALF it's damage, as it only reaches standard damage after 2 patches. So in this scenario, a damage aura and it at best case scenario of jumping in using build up as soon as you land, and you get the first damage aura tic, and a first IG patch lays down. For ease of discussion, will say each "standard" damage is 10 per proc for the damage aura, and ie would be 5 for the patch: Damage toggle: 100% base + 100% enhanced + 100% from build up: Means over those 10 seconds, thats 150 damage. (10 x 300% x 5 tics) IG: patch casts right as you use build up: 15 x 5tics = 75 for first patch, second patch at 5s, casts = 15 (5s) + 15 (7s) + 15 (9s) = 45. Total damage = 120. This means at BEST case scenario, it's doing 80% damage compared to if it was a regular damage aura. However, that is at the 100% best case. In most play, when moving around, even if just for the start of a fight, it's going to be even less of a value. Even looking at the same fight, not using build up, only this time, both the regular aura, and patch, starts .5s before jumping, no build up: Toggle: 20 damage, ticcing at 1.5s, 3.5, 5.5, 7.5, 9.5s = 200 damage IG: First patch at 4.5s: 10 damage at 4.5s, 6.5 8.5 = 60 damage Second patch at 9.5s = 20 damage This means, in the worst case over those first 10 seconds it's only 40% of the damage versus if it was a standard toggle in those first 10 seconds. So obviously, let's say you jump in in the worst scenario, and stay for 20s, that 40% would be closer to 60% and so forth, but again, that depends if the fight stays there that entire time and doens't move. This is also just figuring, you jump in, and stay there the whole time and don't move. ANY time you move around the battlefield, it only gets worse from there. So at best, 80% of the damage it should do, at worst (of still standing there) 40% of the damage it should do, and at WORST WORST even given maybe the one patch tics a few others where you were, maybe, roundabout guess 25% value? Now as you sit there longer, of course it starts going up in percent, but you always will have lost that first 10 seconds of effectiveness too so it will never be at full damage compared to standard damage toggle. You may *think* it's fine for yourself but the numbers do not lie in actual combat. And at average most gameplay it's only doing about maybe 50-75% damage of what it should do. Also note further testing, any damage boosts, be it build up, fury, or inspirations, wear off after the first 2 tics of the patches, so the value from that is even less yet again. THIS POWER IS NOT OK AS IS ON BETA.

Cause its not slow, its only lowering the speed BOOSTS of the enemies. Which again, is really, kinda poor for most things. This power needs more oomph as I've stated above.

Regarding what I said, again don't forget about how it interacts with build up too, but just the sheer discontinuity of how little it does in any fight that you aren't just standing in one place the entire time. This alone makes it pretty bad as I've recently mentioned without at least offering better damage in the long run and other stuff. Since they can now differentiate which patch gets the proc, I'd say at least a start to fixing that may be also to at least have it proc a patch every 2 seconds (proc every 5th patch) and have it do 20% instead of 50% damage). Same damage output but actually matters more often, and would contaminate more. (def debuff could go down a little given more patches). In any regard though, in most normal gameplay, it's still much worse than a standard damage toggle. Dont forget, even if you're standing there post 10 seconds, that you'll have always missed that initial 5-10s worth of lost damage, so that should always be calculated, and that's even in it's best case scenario of like a long duration AV fight. Again, in most standard play, its pretty horrid by comparison when you move around a fight.

But that's what I just pointed out. It doesn't do more EVER, until both patches are layed down. and always does less when build up and other buffs are involved. So at BEST it's equal to damage auras after standing there for a minimum of 5 seconds, to a maximum of 10 seconds. This is NOT fine as is without being compensated elsewhere.(and that tiny defense debuff is not it btw). The power easily needs that 50% damage increase.

Except, in most normal play, this never actually factors into it's whole use. And As I just showed again, in most instances ALWAYS means it's less damage until after 5 seconds minimum. Very good, actually means very bad without those extra proc bonuses. Also note, that as a pet as well, this means that it will not get the tanker radius increase either, that other damage toggles get, so yet another drawback of the power. It also means, it's not going to crit on scrappers, which is a HUGE drawback on them, and means on brutes, that the damage it does will decrease over time too as the fury on the patch wears off. The power, in general in almost all play, is bad. Without giving it other advantages of doing more damage when staying there for a long duratoin by giving it 50% more damage than it does now (ie 75% damge per patch versus 50% per patch of a standard toggle), then the power is honestly still pretty crappy compared to just being a regular damage toggle. I'd easily say increase it's damage by 50%, for it to even start being as valuable as a standard damage toggle.

For example, lets say you jump in a mob, and it procced a patch ,mid-jump. That means, there is NO damage, for 5 seconds, and then only HALF damage for 5 more seconds. This means for those ten seconds, you're literally only getting 25% of a standard damage toggle's damage. If you pop build up as you jump in the mob, this means that you're doing even LESS than 25% damage versus a standard damage toggle. Losing that extra proc function, takes out a whole long of it's damage/utility. This is why it needs something extra to benefit the power more, versus instead just changing it to be an actual damage toggle.

Ok so again then, every other patch that's created it procs. Number Six did just say "not every time a patch is dropped". So then, it will proc every OTHER patch that is dropped, but again, only when that patch is dropped, not mid-patch. Also regarding other issue that I mentioned above right before Number Six's response. As it lays patches, instead of staying on you, this still leaves lots of influx where, there are times where the patch is not on the mobs as you move around, and certainly, that it's only at half damage with just one patch instead and you have to stand there for 5 seconds just to get it to EQUAL a standard damage aura. This also means as mentioned earlier, that buffs like build up do not get it's full extent on the patches based on when the patches proc. With this procability function being reduced, the power still seems to lack oomph compared to other damage toggles. So could we please get a compensation for, especially it being a melee damage toggle that should be better than an armor one, via either each patch doing 75% instead of 50% of a standard damage toggle, so you get benefit when sitting in one place for longer, versus much less when you move around, and/or at least guaranteeing it puts contamination on the targets.

OK, so it can proc, mid patch? does that mean it'l proc on both patches? lets say at the 7s mark for example. edit: I can't begin to understand how it could proc mid patch? maybe a lasting "buff" that occurs every 10s so it gets carried over to the patches?

So it still lays a patch down every 5s? Details on the change list its only doing that every 10s per proc. Since it lays patches I don't how it can differentiate not proccing when a patch is laid down (ie procs only fire every other patch?) unless a patch is ONLY layed down every 10s. If that's the case where it's only every 10s, then it's only doing half the damage of any other standard damage aura, and is an even more pain to use cause it'll never patch where/when you want it to.

I would say this should easily have their base rech time lowered. While difficult, both gang war and hell on earth can be perma'd, there is no reason this power shouldn't have the same ability. I also feel even those powers don't do quite enough to not warrant a better base recharge for how squishy those pets are and how little damage they do. Id easily say to please fix all 3 to have lower base recharges/better perma-bility.

Yeah no, -strength means it lowers their powers effects, not an actual debuff. And since most enemies only have minimal powers that actually boost their stuff, its quite mundane in normal play. From where it is now I'd like to see: Repulsion Field: -speed added to it's 25ft radius portion. I didn't check activation time, but would like it 1s or less to cast it. If kb-kd is added, maybe instead of removing the repel, change it to the pull-in like singularity has. So it's either, keep away, or come to me and knock down! But having repel completely gone if you want it's knockback to be knockdown is very bad if losing force bubble too since you can't have both powers at your command. Force bolt: -regen added for AVs. KB mag changed to .67 so its inherent knockdown, but if people want knockback, they can slot it to still have it do that. PFF: faster cast time, able to attack while it's on, but if you do, you lose a lot of the defense until x amount of time after not attacking kinda like how stealth crits work etc. or generally changed altogether to something else. As it stands now, even with current changes i'd still kinda want to skip both force bolt AND pff unless PFF could give an always on benefit, and force bolt, i may want, but would easily want to put off till like 49 for AVs. Detention Field: changed altogether, either into a ST hold, or new power altogether LIke I mentioned a debuff location power ala hami goo esque debuffs. If remaining as a ST power, have it be a hold, with a reworking of intangible altogether. Maybe something like, one one cast, it makes them intangible, but if stacked, it removes the intangible and becomes a hold. That way you can still use it as an intangible for those RARE uses on some tfs, and if you want it as a hold, you're safe till it's stacked or wears off. Repulsion bomb: radius normalized/increased. at least 15ft for all, maybe upped to 20ft for all since it's now more of a debuff than attack, bring up it's higher stun chance back, 10% is basically nothing and the stun sets aren't that great anyway, esp if its only enhancing a pitiftul 10% low mag low duration stun. Disperion bubble: Add absorb tics, 20% DDR added defender value. Deflection/Insulation shields: Add DDR, 25% each defender value. Force bubble. Honestly returned as it was with -speed added. But with the suggestions I made for repulsion field above, having a big area location debuff works, but add actually USEFUL debuff for most mobs. -damage for sure, -speed, -resistance, -defense (just a little to help, and give better slotting/io options, as a longer rech location power, achilles heel proc won't at all factor to it) It should also be a targetted location power, not cast at your location (unless macro'd to do so) but it should be able to cast at range, ie ON the mob, esp with the way new repulsion field is currently working. If as this location power it could instead of on repulsion, get the pull in like sing to the center, that would also be ultimately awesome and make it well worth losing the big area repulsion of current force bubble.

Ew, yeah should work for you too.

As I read, that was all -SPECIAL, or may be resitance to debuffs TO those, but it's not actual debuff. So reduces their powers that GRANT those bonuses which is very few and far between for usefulness. I could be wrong would have to check again but I'm pretty sure.