WindDemon21

For example, lets say you jump in a mob, and it procced a patch ,mid-jump. That means, there is NO damage, for 5 seconds, and then only HALF damage for 5 more seconds. This means for those ten seconds, you're literally only getting 25% of a standard damage toggle's damage. If you pop build up as you jump in the mob, this means that you're doing even LESS than 25% damage versus a standard damage toggle. Losing that extra proc function, takes out a whole long of it's damage/utility. This is why it needs something extra to benefit the power more, versus instead just changing it to be an actual damage toggle.

Ok so again then, every other patch that's created it procs. Number Six did just say "not every time a patch is dropped". So then, it will proc every OTHER patch that is dropped, but again, only when that patch is dropped, not mid-patch. Also regarding other issue that I mentioned above right before Number Six's response. As it lays patches, instead of staying on you, this still leaves lots of influx where, there are times where the patch is not on the mobs as you move around, and certainly, that it's only at half damage with just one patch instead and you have to stand there for 5 seconds just to get it to EQUAL a standard damage aura. This also means as mentioned earlier, that buffs like build up do not get it's full extent on the patches based on when the patches proc. With this procability function being reduced, the power still seems to lack oomph compared to other damage toggles. So could we please get a compensation for, especially it being a melee damage toggle that should be better than an armor one, via either each patch doing 75% instead of 50% of a standard damage toggle, so you get benefit when sitting in one place for longer, versus much less when you move around, and/or at least guaranteeing it puts contamination on the targets.

OK, so it can proc, mid patch? does that mean it'l proc on both patches? lets say at the 7s mark for example. edit: I can't begin to understand how it could proc mid patch? maybe a lasting "buff" that occurs every 10s so it gets carried over to the patches?

So it still lays a patch down every 5s? Details on the change list its only doing that every 10s per proc. Since it lays patches I don't how it can differentiate not proccing when a patch is laid down (ie procs only fire every other patch?) unless a patch is ONLY layed down every 10s. If that's the case where it's only every 10s, then it's only doing half the damage of any other standard damage aura, and is an even more pain to use cause it'll never patch where/when you want it to.

I would say this should easily have their base rech time lowered. While difficult, both gang war and hell on earth can be perma'd, there is no reason this power shouldn't have the same ability. I also feel even those powers don't do quite enough to not warrant a better base recharge for how squishy those pets are and how little damage they do. Id easily say to please fix all 3 to have lower base recharges/better perma-bility.

Yeah no, -strength means it lowers their powers effects, not an actual debuff. And since most enemies only have minimal powers that actually boost their stuff, its quite mundane in normal play. From where it is now I'd like to see: Repulsion Field: -speed added to it's 25ft radius portion. I didn't check activation time, but would like it 1s or less to cast it. If kb-kd is added, maybe instead of removing the repel, change it to the pull-in like singularity has. So it's either, keep away, or come to me and knock down! But having repel completely gone if you want it's knockback to be knockdown is very bad if losing force bubble too since you can't have both powers at your command. Force bolt: -regen added for AVs. KB mag changed to .67 so its inherent knockdown, but if people want knockback, they can slot it to still have it do that. PFF: faster cast time, able to attack while it's on, but if you do, you lose a lot of the defense until x amount of time after not attacking kinda like how stealth crits work etc. or generally changed altogether to something else. As it stands now, even with current changes i'd still kinda want to skip both force bolt AND pff unless PFF could give an always on benefit, and force bolt, i may want, but would easily want to put off till like 49 for AVs. Detention Field: changed altogether, either into a ST hold, or new power altogether LIke I mentioned a debuff location power ala hami goo esque debuffs. If remaining as a ST power, have it be a hold, with a reworking of intangible altogether. Maybe something like, one one cast, it makes them intangible, but if stacked, it removes the intangible and becomes a hold. That way you can still use it as an intangible for those RARE uses on some tfs, and if you want it as a hold, you're safe till it's stacked or wears off. Repulsion bomb: radius normalized/increased. at least 15ft for all, maybe upped to 20ft for all since it's now more of a debuff than attack, bring up it's higher stun chance back, 10% is basically nothing and the stun sets aren't that great anyway, esp if its only enhancing a pitiftul 10% low mag low duration stun. Disperion bubble: Add absorb tics, 20% DDR added defender value. Deflection/Insulation shields: Add DDR, 25% each defender value. Force bubble. Honestly returned as it was with -speed added. But with the suggestions I made for repulsion field above, having a big area location debuff works, but add actually USEFUL debuff for most mobs. -damage for sure, -speed, -resistance, -defense (just a little to help, and give better slotting/io options, as a longer rech location power, achilles heel proc won't at all factor to it) It should also be a targetted location power, not cast at your location (unless macro'd to do so) but it should be able to cast at range, ie ON the mob, esp with the way new repulsion field is currently working. If as this location power it could instead of on repulsion, get the pull in like sing to the center, that would also be ultimately awesome and make it well worth losing the big area repulsion of current force bubble.

Ew, yeah should work for you too.

As I read, that was all -SPECIAL, or may be resitance to debuffs TO those, but it's not actual debuff. So reduces their powers that GRANT those bonuses which is very few and far between for usefulness. I could be wrong would have to check again but I'm pretty sure.

Ok so as it stands now it's back to 10 targets, but still only procs a patch every 10 seconds instead of every 5? Do the patches now last 20 seconds (bad in lots of play versus other suggestions below) or was the damage doubled? Because again, the damage is already half of any other damage aura on one patch alone. Which is already absurd cause even with 2 it should do MORE damage than an aura since it's a melee sets damage toggle. Personally, its already an annoying issue that you have to wait for 5 seconds just to equal the damage of other toggle auras by double stacking the patches, let alone the annoyance of it when you move around in a mob and lose it. At this point again, unless it becomes advantageous to have it as patches like it is on live, please just change it to work like any other standard damage toggle (which should again be I think 25% more damage since in a melee set, or maybe same damage as other auras, but guarantee contamination on all targets hit which btw, this change also means it'll contaminate less often without these other fixes I'm mentioning) As a patch power too, don't forget it means it'll miss lots of buffs like build up when used unless you always somehow time build up RIGHT before a patch is layed down. Another detriment to it being a patch power without the advantages it currently has on live.

Maybe, guess wording, punctuation, and the like is causing most of this confusion. Regardless, if a new player picks the tier 2 it's still not much to get to level 2 to pick up the tier 1. And while its been 18 years I do remember no matter what wanting to get to level 2 at least when trying a game out to see what it's like, so I don't think it would cause any new player to quit before reaching level 2.

You said you agreed with parabola, who said they thought it would be bad for inexperienced players who would pick the tier 2 instead of the tier 1 and feel they were waiting too long to attack again. You then said they could address it early (ie meaning respec or leveling to 2) Im glad you agree on the change but think you were confused on what parabola said lol. As I gather parabola stated they were against it for *new* players. But I mean, that's still so low and addressed by level 2 anyhow, I think all that would be needed is a help text stating it being the *suggested* first option for a new player.

Well if they kept the +5 powers would mean you'd have your tier 7 secondary and tier 8 primary for synapse. Would help a little for it.

Well the sets are much worse too but at least cleave or Pendulum being taoe wouldn't be the worst but not both. And yes its because specifically that its centered around the target IF the radius isn’t big enough. Which when they're centered around you, which they would be especially with cyclone, the radius would need to be about 10ft to hit those on the other side of you from your target as well. I can make a diagram when I'm home if needed but yes it's mostly cause they have too small of a radius. And since the aoe at that point is that they're getting hit by the Shockwave and not the actual physical weapon, there is no reason it couldn't be 10ft radius thematically as well.

It does if you're blinded. The sets are worse too. But thr main issue is the RADIUS. If it was 10ft it wouldn't be as bad, but 7, and esp 6 is WAY worse because they dont gather around your target, they gather around you. Even the pull in of cyclone does around you and not the target. Consistently why I've abandoned stj on scrappers time and time again.

Exactly even more reason they should have more kb protection than most. Wish while they're at it they'd finally fix the energizes down to 60s base rech as well. 2 minutes is and has always been too long for them esp with the buffs lasting only 30s. Takes everything in the build to get close to perma-ing them and the heal/regen values still aren't that superior.

While you're at it, make sure it's changed to a pbaoe power like it's animation suggests.

Exactly, and why is it still the god awful targeted aoe and not pbaoe like it should and like it's animation is as well. As to the pull-in seeming buggy, ive noticed testing sing with my grav/storm, that the pull-in does not work when the enemy is knocked down, and waits for them to be standing to start pulling again. Which is odd, cause repel, which is just the same but opposite direction, does not have this problem. Would be nice if that was fixed for both.

So they still take it. No one is forcing you to skip the tier 1, but we WERE forced to TAKE the tier 1 before. More options are always better. Still wishing we can choose the first 3 tiers from the primary at level 1 and pools opened at 2. Would also help solve other issues I mentioned ealier, such as mind/grav control, blap builds etc.

I'd be all for that, they just seem to be really withholding when it comes to "multi-selection" options. Actually isn't PB on sents the only case for this? I'd honestly like to see this be the case for all knockback powers in the game having instead an knockdown version you can choose and not having to waste a slot on a kb-kd.

It also needs to be noted, that each IG patch does HALF of a standard aoe toggle's damage. So it's really a quadruple nerf. Cause IG's damage, only equaled a standard aoe toggle's damage when you would get 2 patches of it going at the same time by standing in place for 10 seconds. It also loses damage buffs as it sits there, most notably, that of fury. This whole thing is just ridiculously dumb that they're even nerfing the power. It's nice procced, but pretty much WAY crappier than a standard damage aura without them in about every regard. If they don't revert this nerf, I'm just straight up going to request they just make it a standard damage aura.

Definitely not. One of the best parts about repulsion field is it's ability to keep them away from you, without being too wide that you have to be super careful about how you are entering the mob and flinging them where you don't want them. And if you kb-kd it, the proccing isn't so great anyway to warrant that. What it does need to alleviate both, is just grant it a 25ft (same as dispersion) slow radius with a good bit of slow. That way, they aren't getting to you as fast, and when they do they get flung. Pff, still kinda really does need changed, or at least tweaked. Bar none it needs it's cast time reduced to like .5s. But I wouldn't be against it changing 100% altogether. Same goes for detention field. I gather it might have the slightest use for like, what two incarnate tfs? But other than that the power has always been crud. It should be swapped to a hold at least, or ditched altogether for the big hami-like bubble that I suggested, which is also kinda what they're trying to make force bubble. Instead, swap detention field for the location debuff of -damage/-resist/-speed/-rech/-regen (if not added to force bolt), basically our version of the hami goo. Regarding PFF, again, reduce the cast time, but maybe make it a low end toggle that works like stealth, where if you don't attack for x amount of time, you get re-invincibled. And force bolt, it's ok, but the knockback should still be changed to knockdown. Some might like it, but TOO much of a vast majority of us hate the power with it's knockback, especially if trying to use it for the debuff now, and NEEDING to put a kd-kb in it gets super annoying for it's base use). It would also make sense to have some -regen added to it for AVs as well if it's not added to the new "hami bubble" location power suggested above. Force bubble, again, please keep it as is, maybe add a slow aura to it's radius, Dispersion bubble, good change, but adding proccing absorb would REALLY go far to boost the power especially if that absorb can linger it's 15 seconds when people exit it)

Or stacking like getting multiple earthquakes on you etc. I think a big point here, is that, I wouldn't consider even .00001% chance that fire/dark/elec armor having kb protection would go anywhere near making them even the slightest bit OP from their current form. Just negates some annoyance but that's it, certainly nothing to keep fearing of making the sets OP. That said, PLEASE still fix all versions of consume per my post earlier. 3 minutes base is ridiculous dumb. Should be 60s and extend the recovery to be more on the first target and last at least 30s (with the 60s base rech) Every other similar power is 60, and is autohit to boot. The pitiful damage that consume does does not need to factor into ruining it's base use for end gain. (and the end/-rec resistance, those other sets get that too so I don't want to hear anyone try to argue that)

That change made it aoe, but not pbaoe. The upgrades are already aoe, but they are TARGETTED aoe. So you can only cast the upgrades when you're targetting a pet, which is horridly annoying to do when you're waiting for them to get up. target them mid battle, wait for them to not be intangible for the buff to be cast etc. With it as a pbaoe buff where you don't have to target the pets, you could then cast the aoe upgrades without needing to target the pet which would make getting them up MUCH smoother. (since they're still kinda stupidly not just auto into the pets and not even need taken as a power...)

Then it should be in the EPIC as fire breath, but not as a craptastic power in the melee where the set REALLY needs combustion in it's place. After abandoning 3 fire scraps over the course of the game due to the lack of aoe, and for how terrible breath is for aoe, this is not where they need to be "thematic" at the cost of actual play for the set. And the set has five other single targets, it doesn't need breath changed into a kinda more ST oriented attack only for AVs. Swap it to combustion, and done. If theme is still part of their need and needs to be melee, they can make a tank, but on non-tanks, it NEEDS swapped for combustion. Also, as combustion is kinda like, you know, an explosion, it should also really have a kd effect too, which would also help fire melee's lack of mitigation as well (all version should be like this including blasters and dominators). Faster casting combustion with knockdown instead of breath of fire in ANY iteration of it that the devs would do? yes please. While on this thread too: Scorch should really have it's cast time lowered to .67 or .83s. It's 1s cast time especially compared to the rest of the sets ST attacks, just kinda makes it really pathetic especially as it has no other useful value (upping to 4s rech is more than fine to average out it's dps too).

Breath of fire needs replaced with combustion on non tanks. There is no question on this IMHO. The additional debuffs on some attacks are nice, but I never thought damage was lacking on it's ST but some tweaks were needed. That said, it's the lack of any type of supportive help where I'd find it needed the most improvement outside of combustion swapping for breath.