Mercs procs

[Xandyr]

Looks like Mercs can take a LOT of procs. I plan on slotting the Achilles Heel :Chance for Resist Debuff in each of my pets. Would it be beneficial to slot Soldiers with as many procs as possible?

 What procs would work best in each pet tier?

 By the way, I'm playing a Mercs/Thermal and always team with friends.

[Redlynne]

Achilles' Heel procs do not stack ... instead they "overwrite" each other, in effect resetting the duration with each proc.

That's because it's not the Caster casting the debuff onto the $Target (which could stack from multiple sources), but rather the Caster is causing the $Target to cast the debuff onto the $Target and since the effect does not stack from same caster (the $Target onto the $Target) you can't multiply the effectiveness of the Achilles' Heel proc beyond having 1 proc at a time on the $Target.

 

Which is one way of answering your question as to whether or not that slotting would be beneficial to Soldiers.

Magic 8 Ball says ... Maybe? ... since it kinda sorta depends on a lot of other factors.

[Xandyr]

So I guess the biggest bang for the buck, as far as the Achilles Heel proc goes, is to just have 1 slotted into Soldiers. 3 soldiers using attacks , you would think, would almost guarantee the proc to fire consistently.

 Also, would it be best to have 1 or 2 procs in Soldiers, or as many as you can fit? 

[StrikerFox]

This is currently how I have Mercs set up:

 

Soldiers: Lady Grey, Shield Breaker, Overwhelming Force, Soulbound
Spec Ops: Achilles', Lady Grey, Shield Breaker
Commando: Explosive Strike

 

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There's other procs that can be slotted but doesn't seem worth it. Spec Ops can slot hold, accurate -tohit and immobilize procs but use them infrequently because of their long recharge (Tear Gas 180s, Flash Bang 120s and Web Grenade 30s).

 

Soldiers can slot KB IOs but only a single power by the Medic can trigger it (Frag Grenade 16s).

 

Lady Grey and Shield Breaker are ok on the Commando but I opted for better pet survivability and went with Edict and Call to Arms. The Explosive Strike proc triggered more often, increasing his dps by about 12% per pylon run. LG/SB procs increased dps by about 8% each when tested against a pylon. I imagine they would do worse vs a group rather than a single target.

 

 

Here's a video, SNBR is scrolled through at the end that shows the dps numbers of various powers and procs. Any line with the word "bonus" is damage done by a proc.

 

 

 

[Redlynne]

A better answer would be to look at what powers the different Pets use ... figure out which powers have a Defense Debuff component to them (because powers that don't won't proc Achilles' Heel) and then turn around and use that knowledge to make a judgement call on which tier of Pet(s) is best to put the Achilles' Heel proc into.  It's not that putting it into multiple tiers is "bad" per se so much as that you'll see diminishing returns on investment.

 

Definitely agree with @StrikerFox that putting the Overwhelming Force proc (for 20% chance of Knockdown on every attack!) and the Soulbound Allegiance proc (Build Up for 10s!) is best put into the tier 1 Pets of ANY Mastermind primary simply for the increased volume of fire/attacks that the tier 1 Pets will make in aggregate, representing a much higher chance to proc more often (and therefore more effectively).

 

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1j6MiqD6aMXagyq6b-FNwbgOOBikjbU42-NYNQWeBksM/edit#gid=345433519

[Coyote]

1 hour ago, Redlynne said:

the Soulbound Allegiance proc (Build Up for 10s!) is best put into the tier 1 Pets of ANY Mastermind

 

I'm not sure that this is right. Yes, Soulbound will trigger more on Tier 1 pets, but it will boost a lower base damage, thus it may not actually boost your overall DPS by more. Now, I think that it adds ToHit, which IS more useful in the lower Tier pets... but I think that you get the most increase if you put it into your highest-DPS tier, whichever that is. For example, Grave Knights for Necros.

 

Another consideration is aggro... I think I'd put it into Bruiser for a Thugs/Pain, since he'll have single-target buffs up and I want the aggro on him. He's a high-DPS tier anyhow, but boosting his damage will pull aggro away from the crazy Arsonist.

[StrikerFox]

Made a new video on Beta. I was probably misremembering Lady Grey/Shield Breaker in Commando. Looks like they combine to add about 8% damage. Not 8% per proc. Would probably turn out even worst vs a group since Buckshot, M30 Grenade, and LRM Rocket all trigger Explosive Strike.

 

 

Notice how the Mercs stay perfectly in place. They're not running in to bust their knuckles on metal. This update is going to be epic for MMs. Mercs alone, 207s for 313 dps.

Edited January 13, 2020 by StrikerFox

[StrikerFox]

1 hour ago, Coyote said:

 

I'm not sure that this is right. Yes, Soulbound will trigger more on Tier 1 pets, but it will boost a lower base damage, thus it may not actually boost your overall DPS by more. Now, I think that it adds ToHit, which IS more useful in the lower Tier pets... but I think that you get the most increase if you put it into your highest-DPS tier, whichever that is. For example, Grave Knights for Necros.

 

Another consideration is aggro... I think I'd put it into Bruiser for a Thugs/Pain, since he'll have single-target buffs up and I want the aggro on him. He's a high-DPS tier anyhow, but boosting his damage will pull aggro away from the crazy Arsonist.

I think Redlynne is right about Soulbound. Just did a test with no procs (Including Soulbound) slotted in any Necro pet. Ended up losing aggro but for a solid 3ish minutes, the dps meter shows zombies were ahead in dps with 14.8k, Grave Knights were at 12.5k and Lich with 3.8k. Soulbound would probably amplify each tier pet damage by a pretty even amount over time. 

 

So if it was slotted in Zombies, their total might have been 20k; if it was slotted in Grave Knights, their total might have been 17.7k. Maybe a lot less on Lich since he has several debuff powers instead of damaging attacks. He probably would have been at 6k. Of course if we can't keep T1 pets alive, Soulbound would likely work better on T2 pets.

 

I didn't include any damage procs because they are not affected by Build Up and would just skew their dps numbers (Though -damage resist debuffs do help procs do more damage). Left Achilles' slotted because it would help all pets. Of course I made a video.

 

https://youtu.be/OrIIiAFsr_U

[Coyote]

Sure, that's fine... if Zombies do more damage than Grave Knights as a base before Soulbound, then certainly they should get Soulbound. I was saying that IF another tier does more damage than the tier 1s (before damage procs, because damage procs won't be affected by Soulbound), then putting it in the other tier may be more helpful.

And, also, if it's close... then the Tier 1s should get it, because the ToHit bonus will help them more than Tier 2 and 3s.

 

Basically, if you have a MM set where the Tier 1s are clearly outclassed in damage by the Tier 2s or 3s (not sure if there is any where this is the case, though, as the utility henchmen are usually put into Tier 2 or 3 so that you start off with a DPS tier), then it should be put into that higher damage tier. But if Tier 1 is tops or close to tops, then it should get it.

[BGSacho]

10 hours ago, StrikerFox said:

I think Redlynne is right about Soulbound. Just did a test with no procs (Including Soulbound) slotted in any Necro pet. Ended up losing aggro but for a solid 3ish minutes, the dps meter shows zombies were ahead in dps with 14.8k, Grave Knights were at 12.5k and Lich with 3.8k. Soulbound would probably amplify each tier pet damage by a pretty even amount over time. 

 

So if it was slotted in Zombies, their total might have been 20k; if it was slotted in Grave Knights, their total might have been 17.7k. Maybe a lot less on Lich since he has several debuff powers instead of damaging attacks. He probably would have been at 6k. Of course if we can't keep T1 pets alive, Soulbound would likely work better on T2 pets.

 

I didn't include any damage procs because they are not affected by Build Up and would just skew their dps numbers (Though -damage resist debuffs do help procs do more damage). Left Achilles' slotted because it would help all pets. Of course I made a video.

 

https://youtu.be/OrIIiAFsr_U

It's weird that the GKs are performing so poorly - do you happen to have a combat log for that fight? Taking their theoretical DPS into account, the GKs should output about 50% more dps on the pylon than the zombies. You have degen interface, which is maybe slightly more damage for the zombies, but the results shouldn't be this disproportionate.

The problem with SA on T1s is twofold:

1) The effect scales down. It's 60%-80%-100% depending on the pet tier.
2) The purple patch is brutal on T1 dps. even if they do more damage to +0s, they'll be quickly outpaced by T2s(and maybe even a good T3) vs higher levels

As long as your pet has enough skills to rotate through, it will maintain almost constant SA uptime - this doesn't depend on the number of pets. All of this means that SA is probably best placed in T2 or T3 pets, depending on the AT. 
 

[StrikerFox]

40 minutes ago, BGSacho said:

do you happen to have a combat log for that fight? 
 

Yes, here's the log:

 

https://www.scribd.com/document/442790547/chatlog-2020-01-12

 

Is starts at page 215, around 2020-01-12 22:18:38. Or let me know if there's a better website to upload it to. Just picked the first one found with Google.

chatlog 2020-01-12a.txt

Edited January 13, 2020 by StrikerFox

[BGSacho]

You can upload text files on the forum actually, they should be small enough(maybe if you zip them). Or you can paste it into https://pastebin.com/

Unfortunately it looks like scribd mangled the log file and added extra line breaks, which would make it complicated to parse. 😞

Edited January 13, 2020 by BGSacho

[BGSacho]

Here's what I get for the log. I start the log the moment your zombies hit, and end it the moment the first zombie dies.

 

Total: Damage[31230.32] Time[168.0] DPS[185.89]:
Grave Knight: Damage[12683.13 / 75.49 dps / 40.6%]
                 Disembowel: [ 2324.20 /  13.83 dps /   18.3%] Uses[16]
              Head Splitter: [ 1989.10 /  11.84 dps /   15.7%] Uses[10]
                       Hack: [ 1986.45 /  11.82 dps /   15.7%] Uses[16]
                      Slash: [ 1938.00 /  11.54 dps /   15.3%] Uses[26]
                      Gloom: [ 1531.96 /   9.12 dps /   12.1%] Uses[0]
     Degenerative Interface: [ 1443.76 /   8.59 dps /   11.4%] Uses[0]
                 Dark Blast: [ 1189.16 /   7.08 dps /    9.4%] Uses[20]
                Siphon Life: [  280.50 /   1.67 dps /    2.2%] Uses[4]
Lich: Damage[3776.85 / 22.48 dps / 12.1%]
                 Dark Blast: [ 1704.96 /  10.15 dps /   45.1%] Uses[26]
     Degenerative Interface: [  908.91 /   5.41 dps /   24.1%] Uses[0]
                 Life Drain: [  549.84 /   3.27 dps /   14.6%] Uses[8]
        Tenebrous Tentacles: [  494.43 /   2.94 dps /   13.1%] Uses[8]
                    Torrent: [  118.71 /   0.71 dps /    3.1%] Uses[9]
Zombie: Damage[14770.34 / 87.92 dps / 47.3%]
               Zombie Brawl: [ 6214.27 /  36.99 dps /   42.1%] Uses[89]
     Degenerative Interface: [ 2666.59 /  15.87 dps /   18.1%] Uses[0]
               Zombie Vomit: [ 2604.94 /  15.51 dps /   17.6%] Uses[29]
           Projectile Vomit: [ 2369.19 /  14.10 dps /   16.0%] Uses[33]
                Siphon Life: [  915.35 /   5.45 dps /    6.2%] Uses[15]

The "uses" are not necessarily correct - since your logs don't have HITS and MISSES, I had to hack my parser to treat every damage instance as a skill use, so naturally the dots appear very inflated. My parser also doesn't distinguish between direct and dot damage, unfortunately. The rest should be correct.

As expected, degen deals more damage for zombies than GKs, but I didn't expect how significant the difference would be(almost x2!). I wonder if this is due to degen ticks proccing off of each rng dot tick of vomit? This is further corroborated by the Lich having more than half of the procs that the GKs have, and he has two dots I think(Tentacles and Torrent). Still, GKs have gloom...

Due to having rng dots, it's hard co calculate how many uses of Zombie/Projectile Vomit there were, but the damages speak for themselves. These skills have the same cd as Head Splitter, but the combined damage of 3 vomits is supposed to match the damage of 1 head splitter. After some fiddling with my parser I found out that the vomit uses were roughly 30 each, or 10 per zombie...double that of the head splitter uses per GK. One of those Head Splitters isn't even a use, it's a crit. Also, 5 head splitters(14s cd) over the course of 170 seconds? It's clear that the GKs are having trouble using up all their attacks, but even then, the dps is so low...

It just feels like the GKs didn't use as many skills as they should, but that's not necessarily the case. The zombies brawled 30 times each, if you add Slash + Blast together you get about 23 uses each for the GKs, but they also have many more skills. The vomits were used 10 times per zombie, You have 8 disembowels, 5 head splitters, 7 glooms and 8 hacks per GK - not really out of line.

I can't explain the damage discrepancy without digging deeper into this.

Edited January 13, 2020 by BGSacho

[BGSacho]

Comparing the uses of each skill to the theoretical maximum uses per minute it's supposed to have gives me:

	ArcT	Theory APM	DPA	Uses	Actual APM	APM Eff.	Action Time
Zombies							86.06
Zombie Brawl	0.924	12.19	31.42	30	10.00	82.03%	27.72
Projectile Vomit	1.584	4.42	19.12	10	3.33	75.41%	15.84
Zombie Vomit	2.904	4.03	13.19	11	3.67	90.98%	31.94
Life Drain	2.112	1.87	11.85	5	1.67	89.13%	10.56
GKs							101.24
Hack	1.98	6.01	25.33	8	2.67	44.37%	15.84
Slash	1.584	10.74	19.31	13	4.33	40.35%	20.59
Dark Blast	1.188	11.57	21.06	10	3.33	28.81%	11.88
Disembowel	3.036	4.6	19.75	8	2.67	57.97%	24.29
Gloom	1.32	6.44	33.39	7	2.33	36.23%	9.24
Head Splitter	3.036	3.52	30.12	5	1.67	47.35%	15.18
Siphon Life	2.112	1.87	14.48	2	0.67	35.65%	4.22

The GKs have a lot more attacks - using them all is impossible, they have a fill%(how much time their attacks would take if used on cooldown with perfect sequencing) of 130%, the zombies have a fill% of ~55%, so it's normal to expect some dip in skill usage, but not this much.

It seems that a high fill% is not very useful to pets at all - the zombies get decent values, but only at 55% fill, whereas the GKs struggle to use up their skills way too much. Even with a plethora of skills, the total time spent casting one("action time") is 86 for zombies and 101 for GKs - a tiny increase considering they should basically always have a skill up.

It's possible that the GKs got really unlucky and missed a bunch of their high cast time, high cd skills, but I can't know if that is the case. I rewatched the video and they seem to be making attacks at a fairly decent pace, but the numbers here show that they're not really using their stuff.

Edited January 13, 2020 by BGSacho

[StrikerFox]

Gave it another try using Unknown Magi's trick of slotting/unslotting Soulbound across all Necro pets so that they all have a chance to BU. Removed Degenerative Radial Interface and Achilles'.

 

Two runs. First one only lasted 2:00 mins before losing aggro. Second run lasted only 1:30 mins. T1 pets were ahead at the end of both attempts though not as much as earlier tries.

 

 

 

 

 

 

chatlog 2020-01-13.txt

[BGSacho]

First fight:
 

Total: Damage[13607.63] Time[93.0] DPS[146.32]:
Grave Knight: Damage[5607.59 / 60.30 dps / 41.2%]
                       Hack: [ 1077.51 /  11.59 dps /   19.2%] Uses[9]
                      Slash: [ 1039.52 /  11.18 dps /   18.5%] Uses[16]
                 Disembowel: [ 1037.86 /  11.16 dps /   18.5%] Uses[8]
              Head Splitter: [  828.80 /   8.91 dps /   14.8%] Uses[5]
                      Gloom: [  711.14 /   7.65 dps /   12.7%] Uses[8]
                 Dark Blast: [  657.76 /   7.07 dps /   11.7%] Uses[12]
                Siphon Life: [  255.00 /   2.74 dps /    4.5%] Uses[4]
Lich: Damage[1560.15 / 16.78 dps / 11.5%]
                 Dark Blast: [  904.47 /   9.73 dps /   58.0%] Uses[13]
                 Life Drain: [  314.11 /   3.38 dps /   20.1%] Uses[4]
        Tenebrous Tentacles: [  272.78 /   2.93 dps /   17.5%] Uses[5]
                    Torrent: [   68.79 /   0.74 dps /    4.4%] Uses[5]
Zombie: Damage[6439.89 / 69.25 dps / 47.3%]
               Zombie Brawl: [ 3177.08 /  34.16 dps /   49.3%] Uses[43]
               Zombie Vomit: [ 1617.13 /  17.39 dps /   25.1%] Uses[17]
           Projectile Vomit: [ 1141.77 /  12.28 dps /   17.7%] Uses[18]
                Siphon Life: [  503.91 /   5.42 dps /    7.8%] Uses[9]

	ArcT	Theory APM	DPA	Uses	Actual APM	APM Eff.	Action Time
Zombies							46.20
Zombie Brawl	0.924	12.19	31.42	14	9.33	76.57%	12.94
Projectile Vomit	1.584	4.42	19.12	6	4.00	90.50%	9.50
Zombie Vomit	2.904	4.03	13.19	6	4.00	99.26%	17.42
Life Drain	2.112	1.87	11.85	3	2.00	106.95%	6.34
GKs							57.42
Hack	1.98	6.01	25.33	5	3.33	55.46%	9.90
Slash	1.584	10.74	19.31	8	5.33	49.66%	12.67
Dark Blast	1.188	11.57	21.06	6	4.00	34.57%	7.13
Disembowel	3.036	4.6	19.75	4	2.67	57.97%	12.14
Gloom	1.32	6.44	33.39	4	2.67	41.41%	5.28
Head Splitter	3.036	3.52	30.12	2	1.33	37.88%	6.07
Siphon Life	2.112	1.87	14.48	2	1.33	71.30%	4.22

 

2nd fight:

 

Total: Damage[21030.07] Time[124.0] DPS[169.60]:
Grave Knight: Damage[8685.59 / 70.05 dps / 41.3%]
                       Hack: [ 1568.25 /  12.65 dps /   18.1%] Uses[14]
                 Disembowel: [ 1537.66 /  12.40 dps /   17.7%] Uses[12]
                      Gloom: [ 1376.40 /  11.10 dps /   15.8%] Uses[15]
                      Slash: [ 1211.25 /   9.77 dps /   13.9%] Uses[19]
              Head Splitter: [  994.56 /   8.02 dps /   11.5%] Uses[6]
     Degenerative Interface: [  929.77 /   7.50 dps /   10.7%] Uses[0]
                 Dark Blast: [  709.91 /   5.73 dps /    8.2%] Uses[13]
                Siphon Life: [  357.79 /   2.89 dps /    4.1%] Uses[5]
Lich: Damage[2714.90 / 21.89 dps / 12.9%]
                 Dark Blast: [ 1145.18 /   9.24 dps /   42.2%] Uses[16]
                 Life Drain: [  530.36 /   4.28 dps /   19.5%] Uses[7]
        Tenebrous Tentacles: [  486.32 /   3.92 dps /   17.9%] Uses[6]
     Degenerative Interface: [  479.36 /   3.87 dps /   17.7%] Uses[0]
                    Torrent: [   73.68 /   0.59 dps /    2.7%] Uses[4]
Zombie: Damage[9629.58 / 77.66 dps / 45.8%]
               Zombie Brawl: [ 4069.02 /  32.81 dps /   42.3%] Uses[60]
               Zombie Vomit: [ 1886.09 /  15.21 dps /   19.6%] Uses[20]
     Degenerative Interface: [ 1642.43 /  13.25 dps /   17.1%] Uses[0]
           Projectile Vomit: [ 1424.11 /  11.48 dps /   14.8%] Uses[21]
                Siphon Life: [  607.93 /   4.90 dps /    6.3%] Uses[11]

	ArcT	Theory APM	DPA	Uses	Actual APM	APM Eff.	Action Time
Zombies							58.34
Zombie Brawl	0.924	12.19	31.42	20	9.68	79.39%	18.48
Projectile Vomit	1.584	4.42	19.12	7	3.39	76.63%	11.09
Zombie Vomit	2.904	4.03	13.19	7	3.39	84.05%	20.33
Life Drain	2.112	1.87	11.85	4	1.94	103.50%	8.45
GKs							77.35
Hack	1.98	6.01	25.33	7	3.39	56.36%	13.86
Slash	1.584	10.74	19.31	9	4.35	40.55%	14.26
Dark Blast	1.188	11.57	21.06	6	2.90	25.09%	7.13
Disembowel	3.036	4.6	19.75	6	2.90	63.11%	18.22
Gloom	1.32	6.44	33.39	8	3.87	60.11%	10.56
Head Splitter	3.036	3.52	30.12	3	1.45	41.24%	9.11
Siphon Life	2.112	1.87	14.48	2	0.97	51.75%	4.22

 

You can see a clear preference for DSB in all three runs - unfortunately it's one of the weakest DPA attacks. Also, you can see that even though the GKs should have plenty of attacks off cooldown to use, they seem to have lots of idle time. Unfortunately it might be the case that in practical usage, the GKs don't do as much DPS as expected.

A parallel to the GKs is the Hellfire Gargoyle - I know it has a comparable fill%, so its theoretically high dps is never really reached, however with this new finding even what I thought was a conservative look at its dps might not be enough - I might have to reevaluate its effectiveness.

Don't worry though, I re-evaluated Mercs as well and they still suck. They have high fill%, so they suffer from the same problem. 😀

Edited January 13, 2020 by BGSacho

[Redlynne]

2 hours ago, BGSacho said:

Don't worry though, I re-evaluated Mercs as well and they still suck. They have high fill%, so they suffer from the same problem. 😀

Ninjas? 

[BGSacho]

All the ninja pets have a fill% of > 100%, actually closer to 150%, so they'll never use all their attacks effectively. As for how they do in practice, I'm gonna have to actually get off my butt and test them for real, to see what kinds of attacks they favor.

For the Genin, it doesn't matter *too* much - almost all their attacks are DPA 19, except for storm kick(27), and even after "scaling them down" they're still the top dps T1 pet.

For Jounin, it can be a big deal, sting of the wasp/gambler's cut/poison dart do a lot less DPA than Soaring Dragon and most importantly, Golden Dragonfly. If they underuse Golden Dragonfly(like GKs underuse Head Splitter), then that would lower their dps. Needs testing

The Oni's attacks are a bit more balanced, the worst one in terms of DPA(fire sword hack) can be a problem though.

Edited January 14, 2020 by BGSacho

[StrikerFox]

 

chatlog 2020-01-13a.txt

[Redlynne]

So ... Ninjas "kick ads" ... if they can stay alive ... is what you're demonstrating, right?

[StrikerFox]

59 minutes ago, Redlynne said:

So ... Ninjas "kick ads" ... if they can stay alive ... is what you're demonstrating, right?

Haha! Yeah, well we all knew that. I'm hoping BGSacho throws the info into his parse program and shares the data.

[BGSacho]

Gladly. The Caltrops appear as a separate unit, even though they're placed by the Jounin.

 

Total: Damage[32839.80] Time[70.0] DPS[469.14]:
Caltrops: Damage[395.42 / 5.65 dps / 1.2%]
                   Caltrops: [  310.91 /   4.44 dps /   78.6%] Uses[0]
     Degenerative Interface: [   84.51 /   1.21 dps /   21.4%] Uses[0]
Genin: Damage[13780.99 / 196.87 dps / 42.0%]
                  Doublehit: [ 3536.09 /  50.52 dps /   25.7%] Uses[0]
                   Shuriken: [ 2528.90 /  36.13 dps /   18.4%] Uses[32]
                 Storm Kick: [ 1886.59 /  26.95 dps /   13.7%] Uses[14]
               Thunder Kick: [ 1774.91 /  25.36 dps /   12.9%] Uses[21]
                 Crane Kick: [ 1623.73 /  23.20 dps /   11.8%] Uses[11]
     Degenerative Interface: [ 1310.90 /  18.73 dps /    9.5%] Uses[0]
           Explosive Strike: [  576.31 /   8.23 dps /    4.2%] Uses[0]
         Exploding Shuriken: [  543.56 /   7.77 dps /    3.9%] Uses[6]
Jounin: Damage[14084.64 / 201.21 dps / 42.9%]
                  Doublehit: [ 2483.67 /  35.48 dps /   17.6%] Uses[0]
          Sting of the Wasp: [ 2071.64 /  29.59 dps /   14.7%] Uses[13]
              Gambler's Cut: [ 1787.77 /  25.54 dps /   12.7%] Uses[15]
             Soaring Dragon: [ 1728.35 /  24.69 dps /   12.3%] Uses[7]
         Touch of Lady Grey: [ 1716.82 /  24.53 dps /   12.2%] Uses[0]
           Golden Dragonfly: [ 1575.74 /  22.51 dps /   11.2%] Uses[6]
             Shield Breaker: [ 1287.62 /  18.39 dps /    9.1%] Uses[0]
     Degenerative Interface: [ 1179.50 /  16.85 dps /    8.4%] Uses[0]
                Poison Dart: [  253.53 /   3.62 dps /    1.8%] Uses[3]
Oni: Damage[4256.40 / 60.81 dps / 13.0%]
                  Doublehit: [ 1253.23 /  17.90 dps /   29.4%] Uses[0]
               Ring of Fire: [  978.53 /  13.98 dps /   23.0%] Uses[9]
                       Char: [  633.42 /   9.05 dps /   14.9%] Uses[7]
     Degenerative Interface: [  481.09 /   6.87 dps /   11.3%] Uses[0]
                Fire Breath: [  331.80 /   4.74 dps /    7.8%] Uses[2]
         Trap of the Hunter: [  258.27 /   3.69 dps /    6.1%] Uses[0]
            Fire Sword Hack: [  166.50 /   2.38 dps /    3.9%] Uses[1]
           Fire Sword Slash: [  153.56 /   2.19 dps /    3.6%] Uses[2]
Rain of Fire: Damage[322.35 / 4.60 dps / 1.0%]
                 RainofFire: [  322.35 /   4.60 dps /  100.0%] Uses[1]

Here we have a clear demo of Hybrid Radial Assault and what it does for MM dps. I think the results speak for themselves.

	ArcT	Theory APM	DPA	Uses	Actual APM	APM Eff.	Action Time
Genin							40.00
Thunder Kick	1.32	13.89	18.95	7	6.00	43.20%	9.24
Shuriken	1.32	11.28	14.74	5	4.29	37.99%	6.60
Shuriken	1.32	8.2	19.46	5	4.29	52.26%	6.60
Storm Kick	1.188	8.35	27.8	5	4.29	51.33%	5.94
Exploding Shuriken	1.32	3.46	18.95	2	1.71	49.55%	2.64
Crane Kick	2.244	5.86	18.29	4	3.43	58.51%	8.98
Jounin							44.48
Sting of the Wasp	1.848	8.76	19.2	6.5	5.57	63.60%	12.01
Gambler's Cut	1.584	13.09	16.22	7.5	6.43	49.11%	11.88
Caltrops	1.32	1.92	96.88	2	1.71	89.29%	2.64
Soaring Dragon	2.244	5.34	24.53	3.5	3.00	56.18%	7.85
Poison Dart	2.244	9.61	16.72	1.5	1.29	13.38%	3.37
Golden Dragonfly	2.244	4.21	31.08	3	2.57	61.08%	6.73
Oni							36.04
Fire Sword Slash	1.848	12.38	21.04	2	1.71	13.85%	3.70
Fire Sword Hack	3.168	6.54	17.75	1	0.86	13.11%	3.17
Ring of Fire	1.32	11.28	25.49	9	7.71	68.39%	11.88
Fire Breath	2.904	3.17	18.48	2	1.71	54.08%	5.81
Char	1.32	6.44	25.49	7	6.00	93.17%	9.24
Rain of Fire	2.244	0.96	56.56	1	0.86	89.29%	2.24

 

As you can see, the pets end up with roughly 60-70% of time spent attacking, close to what the zombies/gks were experiencing. The Oni seems to have a very efficient Char/Ring of Fire chain which allows him to get good value of those(and those skills are a decent DPA). The Jounin do pretty well, considering the embarassment that the GKs were. The shorter attack animations seem to help them get their good attacks in.

What's probably most interesting is that, despite all the damage buffs(multiple procs, crits from placate/smoke flash), the Genin STILL manage to match the Jounin in dps, although the situation here is much closer than with Necro. Doublehit does help here, if you get rid of it the Jounin edge closer, but this wouldn't have been my guess - I would have guessed that the Jounin would do at least 20-30% more DPS.

[StrikerFox]

4 hours ago, BGSacho said:

What's probably most interesting is that, despite all the damage buffs(multiple procs, crits from placate/smoke flash), the Genin STILL manage to match the Jounin in dps, although the situation here is much closer than with Necro. Doublehit does help here, if you get rid of it the Jounin edge closer, but this wouldn't have been my guess - I would have guessed that the Jounin would do at least 20-30% more DPS.

Thanks for plugging that into your parse program. I had Soulbound equipped into Genin. Jounins probably would have been 20-30% higher. I'll try a proc/Hybrid-less Jounin/Genin run. Or try Impeded Swiftness proc on Jounin, to see how often it activates on Caltrops. And maybe a hold proc on the Oni. He's using Char and RoF a lot more than I thought he would.

 

Or maybe not. All my test builds are gone with this new update. Will try it on the weekend when I have more time.

Edited January 16, 2020 by StrikerFox

[Redlynne]

4 hours ago, BGSacho said:

The Caltrops appear as a separate unit, even though they're placed by the Jounin.

You might as well not even consider Caltrops at all because of their weird anchor behavior.  The Caltrops that Jounin throw will only persist as long as the $Target they cast the Caltrops against remains undefeated.  Defeat the $Target and the Caltrops vanish/expire.

[Xandyr]

This may be a dumb question,  but I'm Mercs/Thermal. If I put an Achilles Heel:-resist into Soldiers, will that stack with Melt Armor? 

Edited January 17, 2020 by Xandyr