So...what's this I hear about changes to TW?

[marcussmythe]

Just now, Neiska said:

Well, going by this logic then we need to have a look at pools such as leadership, combat jumping, and speed. Because those would fall under the exact same logic. Nearly every build takes those 3 pools, leaving the majority of other pools largely untouched. This isnt 100% the case, but I would bet an entire box of coco that this is the case. "ya know, this is fun. But i wish i had taken combat jump/leadership to get my defenses capped, or to be mule-spots for more luck of the gamblers." I mean, its kind of the same thing isnt it? Such a clear superior choice that 95% of people do it leaving no real "choice" right?

And in a perfect world, we should look at those pools.  Fighting, Leadership, Speed, Leaping or Flight.  Pick 3-4 seems to be a handy default.  And I wish it were otherwise.

 

However..

1.)  I can change my power pool choices without rerolling/totally replacing the character.

2.)  Power Pool impacts, while potentially large, are not on the scale of 'Regen vs Bioarmor' or 'Axe vs Titan Weapons'

3.)  Buffing SOME of the extra gold plating off the gold-platedest things in the game will probably annoy a LOT less people than radically changing peoples Hasten

     (Caveat to above - At this point in CoH, Id also be comfortable with replacing Hasten in the Speed Pool with $somethingelse, and giving everyone a 'Hasten' autopower that              provides +RCHG, scaling from 0 at lvl 1 to current hasten values at lvl 50)

[Neiska]

@marcussmythe - all very fine points, and I agree. You can change pools without rerolling (a good thing!). Power pool impacts, well, i think it depends on the AT in question. But they are on a different scale yes. 

 

Far as manditory def pools, i wish there were more places to get them in everyones powersets. That would make the defense/lotg mules less manditory. 

 

But back on the TW topic. My main point was that TW (i believe?) is only the 100% superior choice for Scrappers, and are not the best choice for brutes and tankers. (the "best" choice really depends on what activity you want to do I suspect.) And an overall nerf to the TW powerset wholesale might bring scrappers back to "even" with everyone else, but I fear it would make TW sub par for the brutes and tankers, which "might" put TW into the "axe" catagory for those later ATs.

 

Which is why I wonder if they can just change the mechanics on an AT by AT basis, but thats a question for much smarter heads than mine.

 

You did bring up a great point though. Would it even be possible for Homecoming to add in a sort of "change 1 powerset" sort of mechanic? Sort of like the respec token but just for a primary or secondary instead of just a relevel?

[drbuzzard]

As I like flight, it's pretty rare I take combat jumping (I like flight a lot). Leadership is a massive endurance hog, so I take it on well below half of my builds. I don't do speed pool unless I see that perma hasten is necessary to a build. 

 

What you're saying may be true to people who just hunt up builds on here and never make them themselves, but in general 'nearly every build' is pure hyperbole. Heck, the game would be so much easier if everyone took leadership (not that it is hard, but still, more boosts makes it easier). 

 

Heck, I'm rather shocked you didn't rant about the evils of fighting pool. I'd say that's more common that leadership for optimized builds. 

[marcussmythe]

6 minutes ago, Neiska said:

But back on the TW topic. My main point was that TW (i believe?) is only the 100% superior choice for Scrappers, and are not the best choice for brutes and tankers. (the "best" choice really depends on what activity you want to do I suspect.) 

TW will still be the highest damage set on each AT by about the same ratio.  Assuming you took your melee offense set to do damage, this makes it the best choice.

If you arent concerned with damage, TW is at best an OK choice - it has an okay defense buff and some knockdown, which is nice.  But if you arent concerned about damage, you arent talking about TW.

[Coyote]

34 minutes ago, marcussmythe said:

If you arent concerned with damage, TW is at best an OK choice - it has an okay defense buff and some knockdown, which is nice.  But if you arent concerned about damage, you arent talking about TW.

 

I don't know... it has 3 AoE with 66-75% chance to knockdown. That's a LOT of mob dribbling, plus Force Feedback in 3 attacks. Then the 4th attack is also an AoE with +Defense... BESIDES the damage, I took TW with a /Regen Brute so that the knockdown and +Defense help give Regen a chance to activate heals and just to regenerate damage while mobs are getting up. And against Bosses, sets with a 100% Hold or Stun may bounce off the Mag 4 required (though Holds can slot a Chance to Hold proc), while TW has a 100% Knockdown which helps with damage reduction against a single target. TW seems to me to be not only an outlier in terms of damage, but also to be one of the better defensive/utility sets... not necessarily the best, but clearly good enough on that account to consider it a strength. It specializes in AoE KD, so if that's what you want, it definitely delivers.

[marcussmythe]

7 minutes ago, Coyote said:

 

I don't know... it has 3 AoE with 66-75% chance to knockdown. That's a LOT of mob dribbling, plus Force Feedback in 3 attacks. Then the 4th attack is also an AoE with +Defense... BESIDES the damage, I took TW with a /Regen Brute so that the knockdown and +Defense help give Regen a chance to activate heals and just to regenerate damage while mobs are getting up. And against Bosses, sets with a 100% Hold or Stun may bounce off the Mag 4 required (though Holds can slot a Chance to Hold proc), while TW has a 100% Knockdown which helps with damage reduction against a single target. TW seems to me to be not only an outlier in terms of damage, but also to be one of the better defensive/utility sets... not necessarily the best, but clearly good enough on that account to consider it a strength. It specializes in AoE KD, so if that's what you want, it definitely delivers.

Hey, I was trying to take SOME of the heat off of TW.  🙂

 

"In addition to being the best single target and really really good AOE this set is also noteworthy for having really really good mitigation" probably isn't helping our case if we want the set to not be beaten to a pulp by the devs. 🙂

[Twisted Toon]

It seems to me that the Titan Weapon and Bio-armor combination has a similar synergy that Fire and Kinetics had/has on Controllers.

Makes it really difficult to balance TW with other sets on the same AT, let alone different ATs.